the pursuit of nostalgia vs. living in the present 6 6

[COI]

On 8/7/2023 at 1:08 AM, factory sealed said:

 

These core memories and moments are so very special to all of us. I am just curious; especially for folks with OCD type personalities such as myself, how do you balance your own pursuits of nostalgic bliss and collecting goals vs. an appreciation for living and enjoying in the present moment. 

I had a rough childhood, so that helps keeps things in perspective for me. I miss certain things about the past, particularly the pre-internet past, and I have fond memories, but I also remember all the things that weren't so perfect and are far better for me now.

As a culture, I think we've become a little too nostalgia obsessed. It's a trick our minds play on us. Things were not necessarily better, we were just in a state of mind where our day to day life was filled with novelty, and we were therefore more amenable to being seduced or enchanted by relatively simple and mundane things. As we get older, the patterns repeat and novelty becomes harder and harder to come by. I think it's some form of arrested development that keeps certain people stuck in a loop of trying to recapture that novelty and sense of wonder from the same source material that generated it when they were kids, not realizing that it wasn't the material itself but more the plasticity of their mind that allowed them to absorb that material in a specific way.  No amount of money spent on newsprint and plastic will help chase down that dragon. If you find yourself lamenting that comics, movies, music, video games, or whatever, aren't as good today as they were back in 'your day', consider that it's your mindset biasing you and remember that you're probably not the target audience for whatever it is that you're claiming sucks nowadays. Because 30 years from now, the next generation will be lamenting the exact same thing using the same flawed reasoning.

I'm not a psychologist and can't prove any of what I just said, so maybe I'm overstating things, but that's my intuition. That's not to say there isn't a healthy way to engage in nostalgia based hobbies, but doing it as a way to escape the present - and in doing so missing opportunities to have a good time now and make memories for the future - probably isn't the best thing.  So to answer your question about balance, reminding myself of all of these things keeps me in check.

[MyNameIsLegion]

On 8/9/2023 at 1:19 AM, COI said:

I had a rough childhood, so that helps keeps things in perspective for me. I miss certain things about the past, particularly the pre-internet past, and I have fond memories, but I also remember all the things that weren't so perfect and are far better for me now.

As a culture, I think we've become a little too nostalgia obsessed. It's a trick our minds play on us. Things were not necessarily better, we were just in a state of mind where our day to day life was filled with novelty, and we were therefore more amenable to being seduced or enchanted by relatively simple and mundane things. As we get older, the patterns repeat and novelty becomes harder and harder to come by. I think it's some form of arrested development that keeps certain people stuck in a loop of trying to recapture that novelty and sense of wonder from the same source material that generated it when they were kids, not realizing that it wasn't the material itself but more the plasticity of their mind that allowed them to absorb that material in a specific way.  No amount of money spent on newsprint and plastic will help chase down that dragon. If you find yourself lamenting that comics, movies, music, video games, or whatever, aren't as good today as they were back in 'your day', consider that it's your mindset biasing you and remember that you're probably not the target audience for whatever it is that you're claiming sucks nowadays. Because 30 years from now, the next generation will be lamenting the exact same thing using the same flawed reasoning.

I'm not a psychologist and can't prove any of what I just said, so maybe I'm overstating things, but that's my intuition. That's not to say there isn't a healthy way to engage in nostalgia based hobbies, but doing it as a way to escape the present - and in doing so missing opportunities to have a good time now and make memories for the future - probably isn't the best thing.  So to answer your question about balance, reminding myself of all of these things keeps me in check.

this is a great post!  Very poignant, and extendable to outside of just collecting. I've spent the last several years as parents, in-laws and grandparents have entered  nursing homes or died tasked with winding down their affairs and clearing out their houses stuffed with things they could not let go of, or didn't have the strength or will to deal with. I've been faced with the same quandary of letting their things go, things that were familiar to me my entire life. Pieces of furniture like the china cabinet that occupied a corner of my grandmothers dining room and a corner of my mind since what seems like the beginning of time.  I've spent waaaaay too much time needlessly, carefully, thoughtfully editing it down, looking at it, thinking about it, sorting it (what to keep, who tho give it to, what to sell, what to donate, what to trash- I shoulda donated or trashed a far greater % with much less thought) I've reduced the life of a 97 year old woman in what could fit in a 10 foot u-haul. She kept all her mother stuff, who kept a lot of her mother's stuff, and so on. 150 years of....stuff. I'm carrying, needlessly, the emotional burden of some of this stuff solely out of a sense of duty. Meanwhile, life goes on, or it should, but here I am looking backwards. It's made me acutely aware of all the stuff I've accumulated, deliberately, in my collecting. That stuff takes up a huge amount of space and time and sometimes money (much less so now than before). 

 

Edited August 9, 2023 by MyNameIsLegion

[MyNameIsLegion]

On 8/7/2023 at 12:02 PM, Cat said:

I'm really conscious of stamps. I don't want what I collect to be the next stamps. Except for Transformers. I'm too into that to care. All that'd mean for me would be cheaper prices and a complete collection a lot sooner, albeit no new releases, no new media. So still horrible. 

It's stamps we have to beware of. 

I found my grandmother stamp collection in the late 70's and was really into that for a few years- pre-dating comics really and there was even a stamp club in elementary run by a teacher who was not much younger than my grandmother. Stamps crashed hard and forever in the early 80's. Now I have all that stamp stuff, have since picked up ridiculously cheap stamp albums here and there, and honestly, most of that I could just dump in the recycling bin now. I just gave away a rusty train set from my grandparents house to the neighbor who is 13 years older than me- he seemed excited by it- great, he's a later boomer. 

this thread is really about (mostly) Gen-X  (sorry boomers, you guys are busy destroying social security and medicare on your way out ) hitting the introspective wall of the dawn of getting "old"  Gen -X is unique in that we were the last generation that grew up without the internet, remembers before cable/streaming/cell phones/game consoles/Spotify/bluetooth/wifi/etc.  Honestly, if I could just have everything digitized that I own (that's not already digitized) in a format that I own (not subscribed, they can always take it away) that's has triple redundant back-up and is backwards compatible with everything going forward- I could get rid of 50% of the stuff in this house. Paper, Photos, Books, Comics, CD, LP, DVD, Blu-Ray, etc.  Even random objects that hold memories and nostalgia. If I could have a 360 degree scan of them, like you can get with some shopping sites for things, I could preserve the memory of that toy, or grandpa's pipe, mom's favorite cookie jar, whatever- and not have to store the physical object somewhere.  When we cleared out my parents house, due to my dad's 50 years or smoking and living in a house without AC, a great many things were not salvageable whatsoever.  As I was throwing them in the rented dumpster, I just took a quick photo of it with my iphone, to remember things that I had forgotten/had not seen in 40 years. 

[Ken Aldred]

On 8/9/2023 at 7:19 AM, COI said:

I think it's some form of arrested development that keeps certain people stuck in a loop of trying to recapture that novelty and sense of wonder from the same source material that generated it when they were kids, not realizing that it wasn't the material itself but more the plasticity of their mind that allowed them to absorb that material in a specific way.  No amount of money spent on newsprint and plastic will help chase down that dragon.

I didn’t want to go too dark and unload too much about my experiences, but when something devastating happens and it disrupts your sense of direction and progression, it’s only natural to grab hold of whatever helped you keep afloat most consistently, through other traumas on previous occasions. Comics and music in particular were always there for me as distractions.  

The problem is, of course, that holding onto the flotsam too tightly and for too long can impede recovery and development.  For some of us, that issue, via nostalgia, might arrest the process for decades.

Definitely agree.

Edited August 9, 2023 by Ken Aldred

[themagicrobot]

This thread is taking a sad but poignant turn sideways from how it started. I don't have any solutions. We all have to live our lives to the best of our ability. It is people that matter and it is a fact of life that most people accumulate stuff. My mother passed away recently, having reached a great age and was still collecting more stuff into her 90s. I currently have the sad task of clearing her house. She wasn't a hoarder, in that crazy-people TV sense. She was very tidy but never threw anything away. Cupboards heaving with stuff. She was too old to play tennis or golf anymore but hey, that stuff had cost money and couldn't be put in the trash. When four wardrobes were full she stood a tidy rail in front of them and bought more clothes. Her passion was flower arranging and I have disposed of 750 Floral Art and Gardening books and then later found another 200 books and many hundreds of magazines on the subject in the loft. Everything I touch in the house reminds me of her but 99% of it has to go. Meanwhile I have been in the process of moving house in slow motion for a few years. Stuff went into storage whilst I moved in with my mother to care for her. My "new" house stood empty whilst I had building work done. I have decided most of that stuff in storage can be sold/disposed of. Why did I spend months packing it all up?  If I don't open the boxes again I won't miss the stuff after all this time. It looks like I will end up with a manageable 3000 comics (many of which I'd like to read one more time) rather than ten times that amount. It is a good feeling getting rid of possessions that have become a burden to me and would in the future become a burden to others. You can't take it with you to the next world if there is one. I'm still not quite as free as 1977 though when I moved into a flat with my entire life contained in the back of the car, a suitcase, a box of LPs, a record player, a tape recorder and maybe 100 comics and magazines.

 

[Ken Aldred]

On 8/9/2023 at 11:01 AM, themagicrobot said:

This thread is taking a sad but poignant turn sideways from how it started

Nostalgia refers to aching and pain, so it isn’t always going to stimulate warm, cosy and shining bright memories.

 

Edited August 9, 2023 by Ken Aldred

[Ken Aldred]

I always think of this Twilight Zone episode, about the malleability and fallibility of human memory, and the pitfalls…

Horace Ford is a 38-year-old toy designer whose life is dominated by blissfully happy memories of his childhood. His colleagues, wife, and mother have all become increasingly frustrated with his obsession.

One day, he decides to revisit his childhood neighborhood. Ford discovers, to his amazement, that it has not changed. He recognizes the boys he played with in his childhood—who have not aged. Frightened, he returns to his apartment, but he visits his old neighborhood again on each of the next several nights. Each night the same scene plays out and he stays slightly longer, before returning to his apartment.

On his last visit, he hears his old friends complaining that he did not invite them to his birthday party. He tries to talk to them, and suddenly turns into a boy again. His friends bully and assault him, as Horace realizes that his childhood was not as pleasant as he would nostalgically recall. After his wife finds him, he "grows up"—returning to his own time period and age group with a new-found appreciation for life as an adult.

[Ken Aldred]

On 8/9/2023 at 11:01 AM, themagicrobot said:

This thread is taking a sad but poignant turn sideways from how it started. I don't have any solutions. We all have to live our lives to the best of our ability. It is people that matter and it is a fact of life that most people accumulate stuff. My mother passed away recently, having reached a great age and was still collecting more stuff into her 90s. I currently have the sad task of clearing her house. She wasn't a hoarder, in that crazy-people TV sense. She was very tidy but never threw anything away. Cupboards heaving with stuff. She was too old to play tennis or golf anymore but hey, that stuff had cost money and couldn't be put in the trash. When four wardrobes were full she stood a tidy rail in front of them and bought more clothes. Her passion was flower arranging and I have disposed of 750 Floral Art and Gardening books and then later found another 200 books and many hundreds of magazines on the subject in the loft. Everything I touch in the house reminds me of her but 99% of it has to go. Meanwhile I have been in the process of moving house in slow motion for a few years. Stuff went into storage whilst I moved in with my mother to care for her. My "new" house stood empty whilst I had building work done. I have decided most of that stuff in storage can be sold/disposed of. Why did I spend months packing it all up?  If I don't open the boxes again I won't miss the stuff after all this time. It looks like I will end up with a manageable 3000 comics (many of which I'd like to read one more time) rather than ten times that amount. It is a good feeling getting rid of possessions that have become a burden to me and would in the future become a burden to others. You can't take it with you to the next world if there is one. I'm still not quite as free as 1977 though when I moved into a flat with my entire life contained in the back of the car, a suitcase, a box of LPs, a record player, a tape recorder and maybe 100 comics and magazines.

 

I recently started a declutter, looked through a large part of my collection, and realised that I’m in a very different place now. I wish I’d been diagnosed with OCD, Aspergers and ADD much, much earlier in life and could’ve been less impulsive and more focused.

I suspect my neurodivergent social behaviour and being a tubby kid would still have led to persistent marginalisation and abuse, and I would’ve still sought refuge away from that in becoming a science fiction film, comics and music nerd, but with at least with some Ritalin added to the dynamic there would have been greater control over my comics buying.  So, I can’t really wallow in remorse about my physical comics collection, as it was going to happen to some degree anyway.

I have moved on, though. A greater understanding of the wounds hidden under the nostalgia, caution about continuing to plaster over those, and the safer, much less cluttered, if more sterile environment of the digital world. Certainly, if you have autism, then that detachment feels very comfortable and natural, and I’m extremely content with it.

 

Edited August 9, 2023 by Ken Aldred

[themagicrobot]

I’m glad you’re in a better place now Ken. Your writings have made me analyse my past probably for the first time. I see now that my comic collecting over the last 40 years happened in fits and starts. When I was in a relationship comics and stuff fell very much into the background. When I was single again I needed to fill the void and keep busy and comics became an escape. I went through a  period of buying other peoples collections. Crazy because it wasn’t like I was a dealer selling any on.

Ironically it was Covid and concentrating on caring for my mother in her last couple of years that turned my life around

Edited August 10, 2023 by themagicrobot

[lostboys]

Damn...this thread went off the tracks.

 

Nostalgia is no different than eating a good burger or getting laid. 

There is nothing negative about it.

We are all gonna die...every last one of us.

We already spend most of the prime of our lives working jobs for money because we have no better options.

So with the little "you" time you do get, do whatever makes you happy and avoid looking for the dark corners of everything that seems bright.

 

[Cman429]

Or, as brilliantly yet succinctly stated in the best comic movie ever, The Crow, “Victims, aren’t we all?”

[themagicrobot]

Things are currently pretty good. I'm semi retired now and pic 1 shows a storeroom at my place of work. Pic 2 shows all the "comics" I currently have at home. I have as long as it takes to carefully go through my stuff and decide what stays with me and what goes.

 

Oh and a Roswell Pinup included for no logical reason that I can think of apart from it being Summer and I'm going to the beach at the weekend..

 

[Mystafo]

On 8/7/2023 at 4:31 PM, Dr. Balls said:

I have two modes of living: enjoying elements of the past and thinking about the future. The present does nothing for me. Sure, it's probably unhealthy or boring or uneventful - and I'm sure a great many feel that living this way would not be preferable. 

Just today, we had free time to go to the thrift stores and bought things for the house like old planters, an old waffle maker (that we'll use) and a antique nightstand - the reason we buy these nostalgic things is because the quality of new items is so poor, we simply don't justify spending money on it. I'd rather pay $10 for a 50 year old galvanized steel planter that is 2-3X thicker in gauge than a brand new one for the same price that's thin-walled.

This week, we watched four episodes from the first season of Love Boat. It's surprisingly well-written, simple and not filled with heavy-handed virtue signaling and poor writing. Two weeks ago, I had to give up watching Secret Invasion after four episodes because it was so badly done.

I buy comic art from the 90's and older because the craftmanship is different and more interesting. I'd rather buy a piece with erased pencils on the board than something that has been drawn, photocopied and then inked over. Not that there is anything wrong with newer comic art - I just prefer the older works.

I just got into an "internet argument" today over AI with a person who thinks that using AI to create a comic book is the same as people taking photographs. Spoiler alert: it ain't.

My long, rambling point? I use what is going on in the present to help me plan for the future or reminisce about the past. It goes much farther than nostalgia - the past contains things we cannot get in the present such as: craftsmanship, tolerance, quality, and inspiration. Just by random coincidence, in the past 24 hours I was shown - in practically ever aspect of life - that our society was more unique, innovative, creative and useful 40 years ago than it is right now at this very moment - despite all the "enlightenment" we have from being "interconnected on the information superhighway". Nostalgic bliss is now a way of life, and millions of people are living it that way - that's why it's so popular. I'm not the only person who feels this way about our society as a whole.

Feel free to blast me for being negative or a "boomer" (born in 1973) - I wouldn't blame you. I totally can see why after reading what I wrote, but that's just how I feel about "the present". The present stinks.

I....I like you, human.

[SeniorSurfer]

Some really astounding point have been raised here - all worthy of reflection and self-examination.  To your question though:  How do you balance your own pursuits of nostalgic bliss and collecting goals vs. an appreciation for living and enjoying in the present moment?  The answer is in the question.  Balance.

Bradbury (and others before and after him) note that "too much of anything isn't good for anyone."  If you have the good fortune to have had a great, memorable childhood then there's nothing wrong about looking upon it with fondness whenever.  Maybe you'll be reminded by the snatch of an old song heard in a TV commercial, maybe the whiff of some newsprint... these can happen anytime and are not compartmentalized like daily responsibilities (though they can be if you decide to, say, dedicate a couple of hours on Saturday morning to read some old FF stories just because you set that time aside).  These moments just need the opposing balance on the scale of the here-and-now obligations that allow Life to continue:  Family, work, household chores, parties, vacations, bureaucratic paperwork (taxes, insurance) and more are all things that demand moments of your time.  Tempering daily life with pleasant thoughts from the past can bring some relief, elation and even an involuntary smile.  In a "Mad Men" episode Don Draper first defines nostalgia, then describes the as-yet unnamed Kodak product that he has been contracted to promote via an ad campaign:  "It’s a twinge in your heart far more powerful than memory alone. This device isn’t a spaceship, it’s a time machine.  It goes backwards, forwards, takes us to a place where we ache to go again. It’s not called the wheel. It’s called the carousel. It lets us travel the way a child travels. Round and around, and back home again, to a place where we know we are loved."

SOBERING SIDE NOTE TANGENTIALLY RELATED TO THE ORIGINAL QUESTION:  So you can stop reading here to not get dosed with reality.  It's been my experience that every generation's young believe their youthful world - again assuming an enjoyable childhood - was the best of times with the best of everything.  For example, we've all heard some say these new immersive virtual reality games are the greatest, while in the same room you'll have some guys say they don't hold a candle to Diablo II.  Meanwhile other folks in that room are firm board game enthusiasts, while leaning thoughtfully in the corner are some old guys that say those others are all indoor weaklings and going out to play stickball was where the adventure lay.  Music, movies, cars... insert any changeable memory.  None of it is wrong and differences of opinion will always continue.  I do however recall a Peter David piece where he addresses these same issues you may remember fondly (relating to comic books) and notes - and I'm paraphrasing here - that GA and SA generations look back fondly upon these stories but their memories play tricks with them since a re-read of the issues as an adult may leave you cringing.  They just might not be good as you remember, to say nothing about being plausible.  

I guess a level of cynicism and reasoning can manifest over time and that the general consensus is that someone being bombarded with gamma rays most certainly would meet with death, but I choose to think everyone on these boards knows what would really be the outcome. 

[Robot Man]

On 8/9/2023 at 3:05 AM, Ken Aldred said:

Nostalgia refers to aching and pain, so it isn’t always going to stimulate warm, cosy and shining bright memories.

 

I was lucky. I had a pretty normal and regular childhood. Times, now days, are  a lot darker and more stressful. The darker it gets, the more I try to go to my “happy place”. Find some light in your life. 

[marvelmaniac]

On 8/7/2023 at 12:46 PM, WolverineX said:

Are 30 or 20 year old's buying comics?  If not, we should be figuring out when to sell when the last comic collecting generation dies off

From everything I have read, Millennials are still buying/reading comic books, even though Boomers, like myself, are slowly fading into the sunset, Gen X is just hitting their prime, kids are growing up and moving out, due to this they will have additional, disposable income, does that translate to buying comics as they did as a kid? And if so, new or back issues?

I have a 25 year old Grandson, a 20 year old Grandson and three 14 year old Grandson's, none are interested in comic books, it is either playing sports, watching sports or video games and of course, do not forget...Girls.

See #13...

https://techjury.net/blog/comic-book-sales-statistics/

[WolverineX]

On 8/9/2023 at 12:02 PM, marvelmaniac said:

From everything I have read, Millennials are still buying/reading comic books, even though Boomers, like myself, are slowly fading into the sunset, Gen X is just hitting their prime, kids are growing up and moving out, due to this they will have additional, disposable income, does that translate to buying comics as they did as a kid? And if so, new or back issues?

I have a 25 year old Grandson, a 20 year old Grandson and three 14 year old Grandson's, none are interested in comic books, it is either playing sports, watching sports or video games and of course, do not forget...Girls.

See #13...

https://techjury.net/blog/comic-book-sales-statistics/

13. 13-29 year olds buy 57% of all comics.

(ICv2)

It also comes as no surprise that with stories aimed at the younger generation, they tend to buy more comics.

 

Is this real?

[themagicrobot]

Yes lets all live in the present whilst we can. 5 minutes ago I found this old pdf  https://themagicrobot.files.wordpress.com/2009/08/brian-augustyn.pdf  written by Brian Augustyne. It might be blurry just copying it as a screenshot but I hope it is readable if you don't want to click on the link. I know nothing else about him. The text page appeared in an old Trollords comic. I have just Googled and found he went on to edit/write at DC. He had a wife and two daughters. And he died 18 months ago at the age of 68.

 

Edited August 9, 2023 by themagicrobot

[D2]

How do I balance it?

 

I know this is going to sound funny to say, but the only thing that balances me, is vacation.

 

Bear with me.

 

I get lost in my daily life: work, family, friends, bills, internet, entertainment, chores, news, social media, interests, curiosities, obligations, plans, time...
In that shuffle, I gravitate to things that are familiar, those core books/reads/experiences that I know and love, while also trying the new. "The new" often fails, but I try to stay patient, knowing that 1 well rounded uncovered rock takes many flipped up flops.

What centres all of that, is when I am away, away from my life, from the noise of the daily world.

I am out in the world, separated from my phone that has no service, surrounded by friends, family, and new memories.

When I come back, I try my best to hold on to that life I had temporarily.

This is the reality where I am best balanced, because I am no longer obsessed with either the nostalgic or the present. I dip minimally in both. 

I think, my problem at least, is that I have too much noise in my life, too *much*. I need less. Then there is no pursuit at all.

That's where I am at today, at least.

[Gonzimodo]

On 8/9/2023 at 3:58 AM, MyNameIsLegion said:

this is a great post!  Very poignant, and extendable to outside of just collecting. I've spent the last several years as parents, in-laws and grandparents have entered  nursing homes or died tasked with winding down their affairs and clearing out their houses stuffed with things they could not let go of, or didn't have the strength or will to deal with. I've been faced with the same quandary of letting their things go, things that were familiar to me my entire life. Pieces of furniture like the china cabinet that occupied a corner of my grandmothers dining room and a corner of my mind since what seems like the beginning of time.  I've spent waaaaay too much time needlessly, carefully, thoughtfully editing it down, looking at it, thinking about it, sorting it (what to keep, who tho give it to, what to sell, what to donate, what to trash- I shoulda donated or trashed a far greater % with much less thought) I've reduced the life of a 97 year old woman in what could fit in a 10 foot u-haul. She kept all her mother stuff, who kept a lot of her mother's stuff, and so on. 150 years of....stuff. I'm carrying, needlessly, the emotional burden of some of this stuff solely out of a sense of duty. Meanwhile, life goes on, or it should, but here I am looking backwards. It's made me acutely aware of all the stuff I've accumulated, deliberately, in my collecting. That stuff takes up a huge amount of space and time and sometimes money (much less so now than before). 

 

It was very eye-opening to me when my grandmother died and my family went out to a storage unit to go through her stuff.  She had been in a nursing home for a couple years and put almost everything she owned into this unit.  I ended up taking her old folding card table, a small glass vase, and a funny coffee mug.  I don't remember if my siblings took anything at all, and I believe most of her stuff eventually went into the trash.  It was sad to see, because I know those things probably meant a lot to her at some point, and I felt like a vulture going through it, then discarding most of it.

I just don't want my stuff to be a burden to my family when I'm gone.  Assuming I'm still around, I'll be spending my retirement years converting as much as I can into cold, hard cash.