ASM #252 CGC 9.8 Record Sale - something fishy going on? - Holder Tampering Incident confirmed by CGC 50 50

[The_Investor]

On 12/26/2023 at 4:05 PM, Genuine Article Comics said:

So what does this all mean for collectors?  Blind allegiance and loyalty to the company? Angry posts and videos that amount to words only and no action? Jumping ship to the only real choice in 3rdPG? 

The reality is, nothing will come of this. Nothing at all. Collectors will complain and moan, all the while still sending CGC books for grading and CGC smiles at you and gives you the finger. Another scandal arises and it's rinse and repeat from collectors ad nauseam.

This thread will do nothing toward sparking any tangible change because it will do nothing to negatively impact revenues which is the only thing corporations respond to.

Someone here should contact one of the big media companies and make sure they cover this scam. The legacy media will contact CGC for further info considering this could be a scam on a larger scale most people think. Make sure the Media outlet is not owned by Blackstone considering they want to reshape the world in their image...lol

Edited December 27, 2023 by The_Investor

[Point Five]

On 12/27/2023 at 1:08 PM, Steven Valdez said:

On 12/27/2023 at 1:07 PM, drotto said:

Not sure about that, but I bet it crosses over to the slabs for cards and maybe coins. So this does go beyond comics.

 

And that's where the headlines are going to come in.

Sure, that's possible. But haven't card and coin slabbing already had multiple scandals as well?  

 

[Bo1983]

On 12/27/2023 at 1:01 PM, MatterEaterLad said:

CGC will be fine. They'll take a small hit to their reputation and maybe their bottom line. Unfortunately, most of those submitting won't even know about this scandal. There are so many CGC fan communities that will be insulated from this. I got the ban hammer from the CGC fan page on Facebook for just mentioning this scandal. And that's a group with 37,000 members, that the mods there are keeping in the dark.

Me to

[Ride the Tiger]

On 12/27/2023 at 12:05 PM, jsilverjanet said:

they have done it before - anything deemed negative on social media will ban you from their groups

i forgot what the last thing CGC did that cause a few people to come to the boards and mentioned they had been banned etc

I remember saying back in 2021 that book values would eventually halt and go back down. I  had alot of people angry at me and just left the group. Not sure why those groups are so uptight about everything. 

[Mephisto]

On 12/27/2023 at 1:14 PM, The_Investor said:

Someone here should contact one of the big media companies and make sure they cover this scam. The legacy media will contact CGC for further info considering this could be a scam on a larger scale most people think. Make sure the Media outlet is not owned by Blackrock considering they want to reshape the world in their image...lol

Blackstone owns CGC not Blackrock. 

No one will care as mentioned. 20 years ago it was a submitter trimming and aging the edges of a Golden Age Batman book and getting a blue label. Then it was Ewert. 

Sports cards have numerous examples of cards from all the grading companies encapsulating cards with issues including trimming and bleaching and not much is done about it even with many of the issues being traced back to a handful of subitters/sellers. At best maybe an FBI investigation that doesn't amount to much. The first PSA card ever graded was trimmed and not noted as such...

Edited December 27, 2023 by Mephisto

[thehumantorch]

On 12/27/2023 at 8:04 AM, agamoto said:

Great video... RIck from immaculate has demonstrated that some heat applied to the ball joints on the bottom of the case allow for the "tamper proof" pillars can be popped off w/o a problem. 

CGC, you need a new case design, right now. 

And he's essentially just heating the corners of the case with a hairdryer and prying away at the slab in his garage.  Imagine if he had better tools, more practice, and took his time.

Suddenly I'm looking at my slabs and wondering how many are fabrications.

[Bo1983]

On 12/27/2023 at 12:14 PM, AbsoluteCarnage said:

If someone uncovers a high value / high grade early SA key book that is indeed a Purple book in as blue label that's gonna set things off. 

If I was one of those people I’d be cracking out my book right now!

[Bo1983]

On 12/27/2023 at 1:05 PM, agamoto said:

Just sitting here thinking... 

The silence from Gem-Mint and ComicTom is deafening. 

Comic Tom finally said something on his last video at the end but it very short!

[thehumantorch]

On 12/27/2023 at 8:19 AM, MAR1979 said:

better only be a little bit and don't spill the bottle on yourself !

Xylene (C₈H₁₀) is a colorless, flammable liquid with a sweet odor. Exposure to xylene can irritate the eyes, nose, skin, and throat. Xylene can also cause headaches, dizziness, confusion, loss of muscle coordination, and in high doses, death

Sounds like the cookies I baked

[William-James88]

On 12/27/2023 at 12:32 PM, Steven Valdez said:

It's not something I used to worry about. I thought CGC was at least basically competent and secure.

CGC missing that something is missing (or mislabelling something) is a common error among people who opened up their purchased slabbed books. They have never been 100% competent. If you didn't worry about it before, no use worrying about it now. Just don't open your purchased slabs.

Edited December 27, 2023 by William-James88

[MAR1979]

On 12/27/2023 at 1:27 PM, thehumantorch said:

And he's essentially just heating the corners of the case with a hairdryer and prying away at the slab in his garage.  Imagine if he had better tools, more practice, and took his time.

Suddenly I'm looking at my slabs and wondering how many are fabrications.

Photo images taken by CGC should be a preventative mechanism for swapping BUT they have only been adding them to public Certification's DB since this summer and with the near blinding brightness levels of the pics I feel they are essentially useless. Meaning the level of brightness obscures much detail and fine detail.

Edited December 27, 2023 by MAR1979

[paqart]

On 12/27/2023 at 12:34 PM, Point Five said:

With all that said, it may be safest to switch to buying CGC .5 slabs for the time being. No chance that a lower grade copy has been substituted!

Don't let my screen name throw you, this is a really good idea.

 

That is exactly what I was thinking. Not.5's, but lower grades.

[William-James88]

On 12/27/2023 at 1:14 PM, The_Investor said:

Someone here should contact one of the big media companies and make sure they cover this scam. The legacy media will contact CGC for further info considering this could be a scam on a larger scale most people think. Make sure the Media outlet is not owned by Blackrock considering they want to reshape the world in their image...lol

Why would this be picked up as a news story when worse issues haven't? This is just the latest oopsie from a grading company which made thousands of oopsies, just like any other grading company has.

[The_Investor]

On 12/27/2023 at 1:24 PM, Mephisto said:

Blackstone owns CGC not Blackrock. 

No one will care as mentioned. 20 years ago it was a submitter trimming and aging the edges of a Golden Age Batman book and getting a blue label. Then it was Ewert. 

Sports cards have numerous examples of cards from all the grading companies encapsulating cards with issues including trimming and bleaching and not much is done about it even with many of the issues being traced back to a handful of subitters/sellers. At best maybe an FBI investigation that doesn't amount to much. The first PSA card ever graded was trimmed and not noted as such...

You are correct, my mistake, I'll go correct it now. Thanks!

[apoptosis]

I just got back from vacation and super surprised CGC  hasn't said something.    I get that they might still be investigating and  don't want to tip hand until they are sure they got everything, but common doesn't take much to say "We know about this and are  currently investigating, we will update when we are done".

I have been trying to get myself up to date, do we know who this guy is yet?  I know CGC has a  bigger problem to deal with, but I want to know  who this  guy is and a list of  every comic that has passed through his hands.   I mean someone  bought these comics, no one has come forward and said "I bought X and it came from this guy"?

[MAR1979]

On 12/27/2023 at 1:14 PM, The_Investor said:

Someone here should contact one of the big media companies and make sure they cover this scam. The legacy media will contact CGC for further info considering this could be a scam on a larger scale most people think. Make sure the Media outlet is not owned by Blackrock considering they want to reshape the world in their image...lol

I also get that mixed up, CGC is Blackstone

Edited December 27, 2023 by MAR1979

[BrianR]

Has anyone looked at SA keys that tend to have pinups missing Like FF 5 first Dr. Doom to see if any of those look off?

[MAR1979]

On 12/27/2023 at 1:24 PM, Mephisto said:

The first PSA card ever graded was trimmed and not noted as such...

Still not noted in PSA's DB, even though the admission and proof thereof are USA Public Record from the Maestro's conviction since 2015.

https://www.psacard.com/cert/0000001
https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndil/pr/former-owner-mastro-auctions-sentenced-20-months-federal-prison-shill-bidding-scam

Edited December 27, 2023 by MAR1979

[Stefan_W]

On 12/27/2023 at 1:47 PM, apoptosis said:

I just got back from vacation and super surprised CGC  hasn't said something.    I get that they might still be investigating and  don't want to tip hand until they are sure they got everything, but common doesn't take much to say "We know about this and are  currently investigating, we will update when we are done".

I have been trying to get myself up to date, do we know who this guy is yet?  I know CGC has a  bigger problem to deal with, but I want to know  who this  guy is and a list of  every comic that has passed through his hands.   I mean someone  bought these comics, no one has come forward and said "I bought X and it came from this guy"?

People have come forward. 

I expect CGC to make a statement once they are done with figuring out what happened and how. There is a continual call for a statement from some people on this board, which is understandable, but a large company like CGC is not going to lead with "I dunno" when they communicate with their customers. A statement will happen at some point, and given it looks as though they are investigating first I expect it to have a bit of detail to it. 

I mentioned early on in this thread that it would be nice to have a list of slab numbers that have potentially been compromised. I doubt it will go this far considering the liability $$$ implications but who knows. It will likely depend on how the insurance coverage is set up. 

[The_Investor]

On 12/27/2023 at 1:42 PM, William-James88 said:

Why would this be picked up as a news story when worse issues haven't? This is just the latest oopsie from a grading company which made thousands of oopsies, just like any other grading company has.

You make a good point. Then again, it should be reported considering this could amount to a ton of money going back longer than most of us might want to believe. What if we discover it's many more sellers than originally thought of?