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ASM #252 CGC 9.8 Record Sale - something fishy going on? - Holder Tampering Incident confirmed by CGC
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Started by spidermanbeyond,

9,029 posts in this topic

lostboys

lostboys

Posted
Posted
On 12/28/2023 at 12:25 PM, Iconic1s said:

I honestly didn’t take the part of the statement regarding processes as them adding anything “new” to any processes.

Knowing what we know about QC (there has been next to none… this isn’t speculation either).

IMO, the line “we have already made significant improvement to our processes” should have read…

”We’re gonna start doing the things again that we were supposed to have been doing all along, but which we neglected to do to decrease TAT’s so we could increase our profit margins.”

Does anyone actually think they revolutionized any new process to prevent this since this came to light last week?  

 

 

EXACTLY !

 

Either the scans implemented during the summer were a "fix" to this problem...

 

..Or theyre simply going to start doing what they SHOULD HAVE been doing all along...regrade any book coming in for a reholder, ME or custom label.

 

 

 

 

 

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Buzzetta

Buzzetta

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On 12/28/2023 at 1:01 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

I was being facetious 

Sometimes I cannot tell, I see it all the time with vintage Star Wars collecting. 

The counterfeiters were reproducing many of the, "Last 17" down to the date stamps on the legs.  After more reproductions came to light, some people were worried about their common figures like the Bespin Guards.

Sorry, no one is going through that effort to counterfeit the $15 figures. 

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wombat

wombat

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On 12/28/2023 at 1:03 PM, lostboys said:

 

 

EXACTLY !

 

Either the scans implemented during the summer were a "fix" to this problem...

 

..Or theyre simply going to start doing what they SHOULD HAVE been doing all along...regrade any book coming in for a reholder, ME or custom label.

 

 

 

 

 

This doesn't "fix" someone swapping out a lower grade book and then just selling it directly. 

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FigaroToe

FigaroToe

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Posted

I've read someone suggesting grader's notes on every single comic, which honestly would hopefully solve (or partially solve) this issue and win some good-will with the userbase. Even if they jacked up the price $5, I'd be totally ok with having some much more detailed notes on each submission.

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lostboys

lostboys

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On 12/28/2023 at 1:05 PM, wombat said:

This doesn't "fix" someone swapping out a lower grade book and then just selling it directly. 

Thats true but that scam wouldnt have CGC in the middle like the reholdering scam does.

 

Im pretty sure that all CGC is worried about.

 

China may be selling empty CGC cases and if thats true...what can CGC possibly do to stop that?

 

Thay can only control what is in front of them.

 

 

 

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Buzzetta

Buzzetta

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On 12/28/2023 at 12:56 PM, Dr. Balls said:

Why is it that CGC’s current problems are coming from these “variant” things going on? Mark Jewelers variants, Acetate variants…

Acetate variants were an anomaly where there was no precedent in grading and they seemed to want to appease these manufactured variant makers and the artists.   The Jewelers variant is an insert that someone tripped them up on.

They still have not really figured out how to stop the donor FF252 Tattooz to the ASM 238 Recipient book.  A lot of these inserts and replacements have probably been combined and they did not chase it or even know how to. 

No excuse on missing Hulk stamps though or things of that nature. 

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wombat

wombat

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On 12/28/2023 at 1:09 PM, lostboys said:

Thats true but that scam wouldnt have CGC in the middle like the reholdering scam does.

 

Im pretty sure that all CGC is worried about.

 

China may be selling empty CGC cases and if thats true...what can CGC possibly do to stop that?

 

Thay can only control what is in front of them.

 

 

 

Its their slabs. That are easily opened. And sealed back up again. You don't think that is an issue CGC should deal with? And do you think people should be OK with that?

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VintageComics

VintageComics

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On 12/28/2023 at 11:40 AM, SpiderParker said:

I am not sure if this video has been posted but anyone can literally defeat a CGC case with a heat gun and some patience.  This is a HUGE issue.  The whole design and sealing method needs fixed ASAP. 

Diagnostic tech thinking hat on now: 

Is there a reason he DOESN'T how a clear shot of the side he sealed "properly" because I can see that it doesn't look as original as he makes people believe it does, just from the quick flashes we get of that spine edge. There's a little 'sleight of hand' going on there. 

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VintageComics

VintageComics

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On 12/28/2023 at 1:08 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

IMG_9620.gif.9d2da91cbf60931f810636bd7aae2ffb.gif

People wanting specific details about law enforcement, etc are now just being ridiculous. You can never feed the mob enough. 

You're skinny in real life, though, you should get first rations. lol

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drotto

drotto

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On 12/28/2023 at 1:21 PM, VintageComics said:

Diagnostic tech thinking hat on now: 

Is there a reason he DOESN'T how a clear shot of the side he sealed "properly" because I can see that it doesn't look as original as he makes people believe it does, just from the quick flashes we get of that spine edge. There's a little 'sleight of hand' going on there. 

But his method is reasonable, and is likely enough to get past a cursory check done during a reholder submission, especially ifthey arw claiming damage to the case as the reason foe the submission.  That is all that matters.  Plus, this person has only done this to a few slabs. The scammer may have a completely different method, but has also has done this many times and refined their methods with practice. 

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jsilverjanet

jsilverjanet

Posted
Posted
On 12/28/2023 at 12:04 PM, Buzzetta said:

Sometimes I cannot tell, I see it all the time with vintage Star Wars collecting. 

The counterfeiters were reproducing many of the, "Last 17" down to the date stamps on the legs.  After more reproductions came to light, some people were worried about their common figures like the Bespin Guards.

Sorry, no one is going through that effort to counterfeit the $15 figures. 

isnt the reason people counterfeit $20 bills instead of $100 is because it's easier to get away with

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VintageComics

VintageComics

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 12/28/2023 at 1:25 PM, drotto said:
On 12/28/2023 at 1:21 PM, VintageComics said:

Diagnostic tech thinking hat on now: 

Is there a reason he DOESN'T how a clear shot of the side he sealed "properly" because I can see that it doesn't look as original as he makes people believe it does, just from the quick flashes we get of that spine edge. There's a little 'sleight of hand' going on there. 

But his method is reasonable, and is likely enough to get past a cursory check done during a reholder submission, especially ifthey arw claiming damage to the case as the reason foe the submission.  That is all that matters.  Plus, this person has only done this to a few slabs. The scammer may have a completely different method, but has also has done this many times and refined their methods with practice. 

Maybe. Maybe not.

But what struck me the most, and that NOBODY has questioned is why he never shows a clear shot of the "properly" sealed edge. 

Sleight of hand to get YouTube views is probably the answer. 

Edited by VintageComics
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wiparker824

wiparker824

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On 12/28/2023 at 11:25 AM, drotto said:

But his method is reasonable, and is likely enough to get past a cursory check done during a reholder submission, especially ifthey arw claiming damage to the case as the reason foe the submission.  That is all that matters.  Plus, this person has only done this to a few slabs. The scammer may have a completely different method, but has also has done this many times and refined their methods with practice. 

Exactly. The video shows the most important piece, the heat gun being used to seamlessly open one of the pins on the corners. Yes he messed up the other one, and may have been sloppy with the sealant putting it back. But the fact he could pop that corner pin seamlessly means someone who actually spent a lot of time perfecting this could get this down to a science. This is just a guy who was trying something in his garage for fun on a couple books. That alone is alarming. 

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