ASM #252 CGC 9.8 Record Sale - something fishy going on? - Holder Tampering Incident confirmed by CGC 50 50

[MyNameIsLegion]

On 1/4/2024 at 5:39 PM, darkstar said:

But what if he was able to swap books at home and wasn't entirely relying on CGC to do it via reholders or custom labels? He might have submitted a legit 9.8 raw, swapped the 9.8 label at home with a lesser copy and then re-submitted the raw 9.8 again for another 9.8 label and just kept the cycle going. Every cert # attached to this person's account is suspect. 

I’ve been saying this all day - but we keep getting sidetracked. The list of 350 is incomplete, it’s the edge of the rug this gets swept under. 

[EastEnd1]

On 1/4/2024 at 8:22 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

So lets I say you have a CGC 9.8 Amazing Spider-Man #300 (NOT on the scammer list).  That book is now worth less than it was before the scandal?

I think we have to wait and see how the upcoming major auctions do before the question can be answered, particularly with regard to the books that the scammer most preferred to doctor up.  Hopefully no decline, but that is not an evidence based answer right now.

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/4/2024 at 5:24 PM, gmasstermcd said:

I do have a CGC 9.8 Amazing Spider-Man #300 that is not on the list and yes it is not as valuable as it was before this scandal. Just like it is not as valuable now as it was before CGC removed information from their labels.

 

Okay I will buy you out of it at 50% of current GPA.

Before it goes to zero.

Fair then right?

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/4/2024 at 5:27 PM, EastEnd1 said:

I think we have to wait and see how the upcoming major auctions do before the question can be answered, particularly with regard to the books that the scammer most preferred to doctor up.  Hopefully no decline, but that is not an evidence based answer right now.

I am seeing the same garbage uhhhh I mean good books selling for the last two weeks on eBay as business as usual.

These mostly common books that everyone in their mother has a copy of will have zero impact on the hobby.

Action Comic's #1 or pre-code horror CGC are not dropping in value because of common copper age books, trust me on that.

Edited January 5 by NewWorldOrder

[ShaggyB]

On 1/4/2024 at 8:20 PM, gmasstermcd said:

I should be more specific the books themselves I don't think are devalued but the books in a CGC case are devalued. Percentage wise I don't know but I can say not quite enough to crack them out of their cases and keep them raw but it depends on how it's handled from here on out.

I wouldnt say that. I would say there is a chance that a subset of buyers are going to be temporarily impacted by this revelation and either not be willing to buy or want to pay less.

However over time thay will fade as the desire to have the book at a desired grade overtakes the current stigma associated with say that asm 300 cgc 9.8.

Its not as if the 9.8 copies are now easier to find, in fact the opposite has occurred as the pool has shrunk.

So short term there will be a possible decrease in interest on the part of buyers, but a 9.8 that isnt on the list and still passes the buy the book not the label test is still worth the same as it was and only gets more rare each year.

But if youd like to give me a great deal and pics, i might buy yours now

Edited January 5 by ShaggyB

[gmasstermcd]

On 1/4/2024 at 8:28 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

Okay I will buy you out of it at 50% of current GPA.

Before it goes to zero.

Fair then right?

Why would I sell you my personal collection? I am not a reseller as far as I am concerned books graded in CGC cases have lost value to me. When I look at it on the wall and am reminded of all the bad stuff that CGC has had happen that effects it's value. It's almost to the point that I want to crack them and keep them raw.

[EastEnd1]

On 1/4/2024 at 8:24 PM, MyNameIsLegion said:

I’ve been saying this all day - but we keep getting sidetracked. The list of 350 is incomplete, it’s the edge of the rug this gets swept under. 

Agreed, there is a noticeable lack of transparency when it comes to this issue.  It's a simple question really: was the scammer able to reseal holders without producing obvious defects?  I have to think CGC knows the answer to that question at this point. 

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/4/2024 at 5:31 PM, gmasstermcd said:

Why would I sell you my personal collection? I am not a reseller as far as I am concerned books graded in CGC cases have lost value to me. When I look at it on the wall and am reminded of all the bad stuff that CGC has had happen that effects it's value. It's almost to the point that I want to crack them and keep them raw.

I am offering you a lifeline to get out before the values of all comic books go to zero!!!!!!

50 or so ASM 194's, ASM 252's and ASM 300's has now showed the hobby what power they have.

Please take my money!  I am begging you!

[paqart]

On 1/3/2024 at 6:41 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

I doubt CGC is going to reimburse the purchase cost.  Most likely they will offer current going rate 

Legally speaking, I believe they would have to refund the purchase price because the money could have been spent differently.

[EastEnd1]

On 1/4/2024 at 8:31 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

I am seeing the same garbage uhhhh I mean good books selling for the last two weeks on eBay as business as usual.

These mostly common books that everyone in their mother has a copy of will have zero impact on the hobby.

Action Comic's #1 or pre-code horror CGC are not dropping in value because of common copper age books, trust me on that.

That's great news!  Now lets wait and see how the upcoming Heritage and Clink auctions work out.  

[ShaggyB]

On 1/4/2024 at 8:33 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

I am offering you a lifeline to get out before the values of all comic books go to zero!!!!!!

50 or so ASM 194's, ASM 252's and ASM 300's has now showed the hobby what power they have.

Please take my money!  I am begging you!

Figured thats where you were going with that line of questions

[gmasstermcd]

On 1/4/2024 at 8:33 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

I am offering you a lifeline to get out before the values of all comic books go to zero!!!!!!

50 or so ASM 194's, ASM 252's and ASM 300's has now showed the hobby what power they have.

Please take my money!  I am begging you!

Oh I see you think you are being smart or that you are making a witty joke based off the assumption of some people having an emotional reaction to this instance that doesn't conform to what you think is an acceptable reaction. Some of my books have plummeted in market value over the past few years but when I see my Green Lantern 76 that I had signed at a convention after talking with Neil Adams for about 15 minutes I value it higher than I could ever get by selling it. So now I have CGC books that have less value to me because the case they are in is from a company that I am losing faith in. I am sorry if that doesn't fit into your idea of how I should react.

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/4/2024 at 5:35 PM, ShaggyB said:

Figured thats where you were going with that line of questions

Correct.

The same people who think CGC books are now losing value wont be selling their own personal books for less.

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/4/2024 at 5:37 PM, gmasstermcd said:

Oh I see you think you are being smart or that you are making a witty joke based off the assumption of some people having an emotional reaction to this instance that doesn't conform to what you think is an acceptable reaction. Some of my books have plummeted in market value over the past few years but when I see my Green Lantern 76 that I had signed at a convention after talking with Neil Adams for about 15 minutes I value it higher than I could ever get by selling it. So now I have CGC books that have less value to me because the case they are in is from a company that I am losing faith in. I am sorry if that doesn't fit into your idea of how I should react.

But if you crack those books out of the CGC case do the values go back up because they are not in a CGC case?

[gmasstermcd]

On 1/4/2024 at 8:39 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

But if you crack those books out of the CGC case do the values go back up because they are not in a CGC case?

If I lose enough faith in CGC that I don't want to look at their slabs on my wall anymore than yes them being cracked out will increase their value to me.

[wombat]

On 1/4/2024 at 8:39 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

Correct.

The same people who think CGC books are now losing value wont be selling their own personal books for less.

In your head does this seem like you are making a good point? Just curious. 

[ShaggyB]

On 1/4/2024 at 8:37 PM, gmasstermcd said:

Oh I see you think you are being smart or that you are making a witty joke based off the assumption of some people having an emotional reaction to this instance that doesn't conform to what you think is an acceptable reaction. Some of my books have plummeted in market value over the past few years but when I see my Green Lantern 76 that I had signed at a convention after talking with Neil Adams for about 15 minutes I value it higher than I could ever get by selling it. So now I have CGC books that have less value to me because the case they are in is from a company that I am losing faith in. I am sorry if that doesn't fit into your idea of how I should react.

Look at it this way.

While your faith in cgc is shaken, the fact that the scammer was doing this to books you have at the grade level you have them at means they are more desirable as he was cheating people out of money who want what you legitimately have.

So again, short term it feels devalued and may be harder to cash out on today, but long term it retains and grows in value because it is highly sought after and it never really lost that value due to its age and rarety

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/4/2024 at 5:34 PM, EastEnd1 said:

That's great news!  Now lets wait and see how the upcoming Heritage and Clink auctions work out.  

IDK Action Comics #1 market value really depends on what happens with all these books on the list.

[MyNameIsLegion]

On 1/4/2024 at 7:39 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

But if you crack those books out of the CGC case do the values go back up because they are not in a CGC case?

Looks like Roy hacked this guys account  judging by the number of relentless irrelevant posts 

[pdags]

On 1/4/2024 at 8:40 PM, wombat said:

In your head does this seem like you are making a good point? Just curious.