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ASM #252 CGC 9.8 Record Sale - something fishy going on? - Holder Tampering Incident confirmed by CGC
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Started by spidermanbeyond,

9,031 posts in this topic

360flip

360flip

Posted
Posted
On 1/8/2024 at 10:35 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

I’m not sure this is one of the scammers submissions.  

I agree. I'm not sure how this fits. This 4351598 submission, 001-008, was Dec 7, 2023. Looks like everything was submitted raw. If this was zaneglor's submission, for the scam to work, he needs to submit twice. Once to get the 9.8 and then send in to reholder/custom label with the lower grade book. Has there been enough time to receive the slabs, sub out to lower grade, and resubmit? 

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u•A•g

u•A•g

Posted
Posted

First time posting in this forum. I've been following and reading ALOT of these posts. Some very informed people and some going above and beyond on the detective work. Hats off to all of you. I just recieved 2 books (mags) back from CGC just minutes ago.20240108_133547.thumb.jpg.26e1af0f7062faf9b29b3c33ba471051.jpgI submitted these myself. (Nobody is doing anything nefarious with an Indiana Jones mag) 🤣 But my concern is... even with all this going on. All the scrutiny cgc is getting at the moment.

COMPARE THE LABELS TO THE BOOKS...

I understand companies make mistakes. Things happen. This happens all the time. But right now. At this current time. How is this missed? Any other time. No big deal. Send it in to get swapped. But I'd think at the current state of things. This wouldn't be missed right now. I'd expect QC to be looking at everything with a fine tooth comb. 

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sledgehammer

sledgehammer

Posted
Posted
On 1/8/2024 at 12:45 PM, 360flip said:

I agree. I'm not sure how this fits. This 4351598 submission, 001-008, was Dec 7, 2023. Looks like everything was submitted raw. If this was zaneglor's submission, for the scam to work, he needs to submit twice. Once to get the 9.8 and then send in to reholder/custom label with the lower grade book. Has there been enough time to receive the slabs, sub out to lower grade, and resubmit? 

every one of these books, could now be slabs that lower graded copies could be inserted into. I don't get what the big deal is, in alerting CGC to review who it was, that made the submission. I can't recall anyone disputing, the fact that he was actually getting correct grades on books, to then be able to use those slabs for his swaps. When it seems to be a laundry list of the exact books, this is being done with, it doesn't seem like extra scrutiny would be a bad thing. 

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comicjel

comicjel

Posted
Posted

I have reviewed many of the cgc photos of books from the following submissions tied to the scammer:

4310701; 4324007; 4329914; 4341610; 4343218 and 4357311

All but 2 of the 34 total books are the usual suspects (ASM 238, ASM 252, ASM 300, New Mut 98, Marv SH 8, Hulk 340, X-Men 266)

Of those 32 books, 28 were graded 9.8 and 4 were graded 9.6

In theory, these would be the "real" 9.8 books, to be later removed and substituted with lower grade books in reholdering. 

I would expect these to be the best of the best examples of 9.8 books, since the scam needs these to successfully get graded 9.8 over and over.

Just my opinion, but many of those books do not look to be the best examples of 9.8 books for those titles.

 

 

 

 

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sledgehammer

sledgehammer

Posted
Posted
On 1/8/2024 at 1:29 PM, comicjel said:

I have reviewed many of the cgc photos of books from the following submissions tied to the scammer:

4310701; 4324007; 4329914; 4341610; 4343218 and 4357311

All but 2 of the 34 total books are the usual suspects (ASM 238, ASM 252, ASM 300, New Mut 98, Marv SH 8, Hulk 340, X-Men 266)

Of those 32 books, 28 were graded 9.8 and 4 were graded 9.6

In theory, these would be the "real" 9.8 books, to be later removed and substituted with lower grade books in reholdering. 

I would expect these to be the best of the best examples of 9.8 books, since the scam needs these to successfully get graded 9.8 over and over.

Just my opinion, but many of those books do not look to be the best examples of 9.8 books for those titles.

 

 

 

 

that sounds reasonable, but keep in mind that we have seen all of the books, in different submissions, also come back as 9.6. I don't know how certain he can be, that he is absolutely going to get a 9.8 back.

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sledgehammer

sledgehammer

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Posted

isn't there a constant stream of content, that CGC caused damage to somebody's 9.8? No one has any definitive proof, why scans of any book show what they show.

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comicjel

comicjel

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At least with those 6 submissions that I referenced, he hit it out of the park with the number of 9.8s he received (28) relative to the total submitted (32).  Especially with books that had a fair amount of soft corners and other visible flaws.

Don't get me wrong, I know only too well, that not all 9.6 and 9.8 are created equal - it just bugs me that the "master" 9.8 books that he used to make his scam operate were not "better" 9.8s - makes me wonder if there is not another aspect to this scam that we are missing.

Another thing that bugs me is why he stopped churning the ASM 194s (apologize if this was addressed earlier). 

 

 

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sledgehammer

sledgehammer

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Posted

I think things will be a lot clearer, once the extent of what this possible suspect might be able to accomplish, is better known. I feel pretty confident about that.

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topcat54

topcat54

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Posted

Here's an AMAZING SPIDERMAN 194 on the list seller is in BROOKLYN NY

https://www.ebay.com/itm/204582913705?hash=item2fa21786a9:g:bFAAAOSwDNVlfeNL&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA8Iwe6b3Xzy06UV2zKvk%2FnKdf7eIhpJJp1IPygWpxnw03z28pvYSPjo75atracR2kLn735npvFfaQb71OpDVL5jsHA1ux9QQAt7h6%2FFp2sVGAyOjCdRILA6GyfRhUcxw9CZW2hM%2Fkc1mnDi3HOUKOpMSOvcdjOAkmHFccXJob747g59RAvz%2Bhfc%2Ba63bLy26PwS9z91pv44Tan4bx%2FYpvahEezjEz6lNgxZ6R0uOMP8na36ltnkYPBCP6HXMSlIPggfz%2BWreoVx9wafjxZ0PHonEanf5OwqHowWqGjKrKFPnpiLNg9wvDtzwPnjS2Uo%2FUAg%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR4ie06qdYw

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wiparker824

wiparker824

Posted
Posted
On 1/8/2024 at 1:05 PM, topcat54 said:

Here's an AMAZING SPIDERMAN 194 on the list seller is in BROOKLYN NY

https://www.ebay.com/itm/204582913705?hash=item2fa21786a9:g:bFAAAOSwDNVlfeNL&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA8Iwe6b3Xzy06UV2zKvk%2FnKdf7eIhpJJp1IPygWpxnw03z28pvYSPjo75atracR2kLn735npvFfaQb71OpDVL5jsHA1ux9QQAt7h6%2FFp2sVGAyOjCdRILA6GyfRhUcxw9CZW2hM%2Fkc1mnDi3HOUKOpMSOvcdjOAkmHFccXJob747g59RAvz%2Bhfc%2Ba63bLy26PwS9z91pv44Tan4bx%2FYpvahEezjEz6lNgxZ6R0uOMP8na36ltnkYPBCP6HXMSlIPggfz%2BWreoVx9wafjxZ0PHonEanf5OwqHowWqGjKrKFPnpiLNg9wvDtzwPnjS2Uo%2FUAg%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR4ie06qdYw

Interesting… 001, and 002 from the submission are also ASM 194 9.8’s but those I see as sold on GPA in August 2021. This one I don’t see, very well could have been bought in private, or a site that doesn’t report. Either way they probably paid premium pandemic price if they also bought in summer of 2021 and already were thinking they were going to eat a loss selling now. Once they find out it’s on the blacklist… doh!

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sledgehammer

sledgehammer

Posted
Posted
On 1/8/2024 at 2:05 PM, topcat54 said:

Here's an AMAZING SPIDERMAN 194 on the list seller is in BROOKLYN NY

https://www.ebay.com/itm/204582913705?hash=item2fa21786a9:g:bFAAAOSwDNVlfeNL&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA8Iwe6b3Xzy06UV2zKvk%2FnKdf7eIhpJJp1IPygWpxnw03z28pvYSPjo75atracR2kLn735npvFfaQb71OpDVL5jsHA1ux9QQAt7h6%2FFp2sVGAyOjCdRILA6GyfRhUcxw9CZW2hM%2Fkc1mnDi3HOUKOpMSOvcdjOAkmHFccXJob747g59RAvz%2Bhfc%2Ba63bLy26PwS9z91pv44Tan4bx%2FYpvahEezjEz6lNgxZ6R0uOMP8na36ltnkYPBCP6HXMSlIPggfz%2BWreoVx9wafjxZ0PHonEanf5OwqHowWqGjKrKFPnpiLNg9wvDtzwPnjS2Uo%2FUAg%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR4ie06qdYw

Nice catch.

That's a lot of private listings in his seller feedback.

Been around since 1999.

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topcat54

topcat54

Posted
Posted

AMS # 300 on the list

https://www.ebay.com/itm/364568981547?hash=item54e201302b:g:NdsAAOSwwDBlSrIP&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA8JTpl4XGlkYB5g5OVBzSvC0FgRB%2BVr2TnUyHOprkUFzHn7AC9sCEx4JKyPSMtKPxEU0nPJ5T25%2BNONZHPMNaQNGAxlEtkcMPMMVPvliYqNoQfev%2B8w6uMvksdn14gYRhs%2F9OQMPDGPgJAxLnbvNInlEIPK8jziJiLE48JWS8Pk2EFP%2FveviZXECViD9PCIqY4RB2cP%2BpkqknNUesGq5d4If%2BulV4uwnsyjXg%2FvO4rdlVgO3UEShnigG%2B73P1vYj%2Fc7L4aaKsQhPuFbRiHAPACKSA2DKKgtGoA1df4WvFsDOLNaZ%2BMNrYvXue%2BcngSzdFPw%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR5aJlq2dYw

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migmtl76

migmtl76

Posted
Posted
On 1/8/2024 at 3:46 PM, sledgehammer said:

Nice catch.

That's a lot of private listings in his seller feedback.

Been around since 1999.

What is a private listing on eBay and can it be used to hide shady stuff going on ?

Excuse my ignorance haha

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topcat54

topcat54

Posted
Posted

Here is the Journey Into Mystery #85 CGC 8.0 SS 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/166385782772?hash=item26bd5d8ff4:g:SsYAAOSwlnZih2oT&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAABAIEFNrRfw%2BTKECAVCmt5yLLE1Gq%2BPSYC9yGiGjNVg8yP1WFifZqwEQciGZFQUzZR3psJOSH33FRe07udyFVFlcuKb1C31uX41iOAEX3OPrI09uU%2FQlWILc9XMRplnOHCyBi0GCFfjjkrJqpK1G8A64wRMrnIAKXJfKXf%2B03MpeCaFcJezkLrqUNXrBaTfTXFw6fJqtt%2B7gduvRv9ffubeqaQxGWItp1fTBOyv4Wlwneh11qnOZ1IvTXCetUVS2Yl2neOW2BC%2BAKzSer2THR9g%2BnydL39DvXt%2FZcx5UGuOTMN7xxRyIWkwEGhHvHXCxv4%2BBa4GJqtaTqXTtfYgyZVqxo%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR9D73K6dYw

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sledgehammer

sledgehammer

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 1/8/2024 at 3:05 PM, migmtl76 said:

What is a private listing on eBay and can it be used to hide shady stuff going on ?

Excuse my ignorance haha

Even though you can't see bidders names in a non-private auction anymore, at least you are able to look at their bid history over the previous 30 days.

I have nothing to do with sellers that do private listings. I never have.

Edited by sledgehammer
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sledgehammer

sledgehammer

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Posted

The lack of other items sold recently, and items available now, really make the ASM 194 look like an attempt to dump the book, even if by consignment.

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