If slab says 9.8, does it matter what grade the actual comic actually is? What are we buying, anyway? The comic or the grade? 5 5

[Gambold Vintage]

>NOW slabbed comics are all about greed. <

For some, sure. But blanket condemnations tend to be faulty, and I'd argue that for others, slabbed comics are not about greed.  Maybe they want to preserve their comics better than bags and boards. Maybe they see them as investments, like rare coins, and thus need to be graded, certified, and registered.  

I know there is a whole aspect to slabbing that involves modern comics and chasing 9.8s or better.  That's not something I do or even understand very well. I personally collect GA and BA horror.  Most of my GA horror is slabbed, and not by me. It's just the way most desirable or mid to high grade issues are available. I have slabbed some of my raw copies, particularly the EC lines, because I want to preserve them better and yes, enhance their eventual sales value. But I'm hardly rubbing my hands together and dreaming of bags of gold here.  I'm not going to quit my day job or buy a boat because my 1950s horror comics are going to bring in the big bucks. Slabbing will help them sell, when I finally (sob) have to sell them. 

[Dr. Balls]

On 1/1/2024 at 6:21 PM, Chip Cataldo said:

...and this is why nothing will happen. CGC makes money hand over fist. This "scandal" won't stop that, so there's no incentive to do anything at all. 

Many months ago they were "caught" SELLING GRADES (twice) and nothing happened. 

Why would this be any different? 

I'm sorry for the confusion. They will continue to do nothing, and it will chisel away at their bottom line. Not overnight, but over time. You can't keep putting out poor product and survive, no matter how big the audience is. Yes, the sell lots of slabs. Yes, they make lots of money. But what isn't known is how many customers are lost to the cost of incompetence and shored up by the increase in pricing and expansion of services. Just because they made 20% more last year doesn't mean that they created 20% more customers.

They are too big to see how all the problem parts are eroding the brand philosophy as a whole. Sure, we're just a corner of the internet and no one watches YouTube videos - but that's for now. This level of gross negligence doesn't get better, it gets worse. I mean, this slab swapping issue is a perfect example. The problems CGC is having now are worse than the problem they had before this one. It will continue on in that fashion, each problem worse than the previous - because they never address it, because they care more about bonus checks, paid vacations, stock options, pleasing executives and Board members (not this Board) than they care about a graded comic book.

[Gambold Vintage]

>because they care more about bonus checks, paid vacations, stock options, pleasing executives and Board members (not this Board) than they care about a graded comic book.<

I'm curious how you know this.  I mean, do you know anyone who works there? Or who is on the Board or the leadership team? The CGC site has zero information about any of that - no names, no titles, nothing.  They do have the graders, and one of them apparently is the President of the company.  

https://www.cgccomics.com/grading/cgc-graders/

I'm just spitballing here, but I doubt that crowd of graders is getting "stock options."  I don't think CGC is a public company. 

 

Edited January 2 by Gambold Vintage

[Readcomix]

On 1/1/2024 at 6:41 PM, D2 said:

A question you would be asking many of the regular lurkers on here…

And the audience you could direct the question at gets A LOT broader if you switch out “hate slabbed” to “prefer unslabbed.” Heck, there’s even a sizable “like both” contingent, which I’m probably in.

[Readcomix]

On 1/1/2024 at 2:43 PM, Gambold Vintage said:

Yeah, I'm not trying to minimize this controversy, but it has got me thinking.  I personally buy pre-code horror, only in slabs.  Almost all of these are mid-grade so I'm not that concerned that I have a scammed slab. But what does it matter, really? I have a Haunt of Fear #14 that's graded a 6.5...if the seller had slipped a 5.5 or even a 5.0 in there could I tell the difference? Not really, and I doubt anyone who bought it from me could either. It says 6.5. Who is going to argue it?

This lead to my own sullen realization that I'm not really buying a comic...I'm buying a grade certificate. The comic itself could be in just about any condition, short of an obvious mess or a pristine treasure.  It made me think that maybe the good old days had it right: five conditions, G, VG, F, VF and NM.  It is pretty easy to tell the difference between those...then we got crazy in the hobby and now we have 25 or whatever grades and microscopic levels in the NM category. 

 

 

Now you’re talking…but even as slabs go, if you’re hunting a particular mid-grade PCH book and have targeted a specific grade for your budget (say it’s a 5.5 for the sake of discussion), if you’re at a show and there’s two 5.5 examples of the same book, aren’t you going back and forth and hemming and hawing over which visible flaws bother least, notes on the slab, grader notes if any, etc? Even within “buying the grade” aren’t you trying your best to “buy the book?”

I’m assuming that’s how 99% of the boardies on here who might buy a mid-grade graded pch book would roll. I’m sure some would be quicker than others and some would put themselves through an exquisite, exhaustive analysis, but I think most would move along a similar decision path.

[William-James88]

Your buying a slabbed comic, no more no less. Not all 9.8s are created equal, and if you find an issue that makes it not as nice as others, then so will others when it comes time to sell, so keep that in mind.

 

[Ken Aldred]

Buy the book, not the grade.

Always been the rule if you’ve any concern about presentation vs grade.

Same subjectivity as always.

Rookie confusion, perhaps? We’ve all gone through that stage.

[Lightning55]

On 1/1/2024 at 10:10 PM, William-James88 said:

Your buying a slabbed comic, no more no less. Not all 9.8s are created equal, and if you find an issue that makes it not as nice as others, then so will others when it comes time to sell, so keep that in mind.

 

Agree 100% with this.

When you go to sell your books, or your loved ones sell them, you want to get the best price. You can lose potential buyers because they notice flaws on that 9.8, flaws that cause them to not invest their money in what they consider a substandard 9.8.

In most markets, as the pool of potential buyers decreases, so does the price, typically. But you could get lucky and find a buyer, and you only need one. One who also buys the grade on the label only. 

[namisgr]

I'm buying the comic book.  Many are like that.  The numerical and page quality grades are very helpful guides, but I would never buy a book without seeing any scans of it, and my buying decisions depend on issues of eye appeal and quality of both cover and interior paper preservation that the CGC label doesn't fully reflect.

Edited January 3 by namisgr

[alexgross.com]

the best example of this is 9.8 vs 9.9. good luck seeing any difference with the naked eye. 9.9s are the most blatant case of a money grab for nothing more than an ultra rare label, not an ultra rare book. 

[pickycollector]

On 1/1/2024 at 10:38 PM, Ken Aldred said:

Buy the book, not the grade.

This. Period.

Do this and you will greatly reduce disappointment when buying a CGC book.

[pickycollector]

Looks like I did not visit the General section very often these past few weeks, just started to read about the asm 252/IH 181 scandal  

Edited January 3 by pickycollector

[lizards2]

On 1/1/2024 at 3:41 PM, D2 said:

On 1/1/2024 at 3:05 PM, Gambold Vintage said:

Is it a weird question to ask why are you posting on a CGC forum if you hate slabbing comics?

A question you would be asking many of the regular lurkers on here…

 

[lizards2]

I crack out all of my keepers, because you never know what is inside, until you crack it out and grade it yourself. Quite a few you can be sure without cracking them out though..., those stay in the slab.

[MyNameIsLegion]

On 1/2/2024 at 11:31 PM, lizards2 said:

I crack out all of my keepers, because you never know what is inside, until you crack it out and grade it yourself. Quite a few you can be sure without cracking them out though..., those stay in the slab.

unless it's missing the CF, MVS, MJ Insert, had rusted staples, tape, and the interior paper is brown and flakey like Mrs. Smith's Pie Crust.  You just don't know do you? You don't have the benefit of inspecting the interior BEFORE you make the purchase.  I"m kinda sick of this smug "buy the book, not the grade" mantra.  Can't do that if you can't see it. That WAS the point of CGC. That ship has long sailed and been set on fire, by the market, and CGC themselves. They are a commodities broker, not a third party grading service.   At this point, I'll take MCS over CGC. 

[lostboys]

Honestly, I only started with graded books to make it less of a burden on my kids when they inherit them after I pass.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Phill the Governor]

The number on the slab preys on our OCD. The amount of books I've seen that are 9.4, 9.6 and 9.8 that all look the same solidifies my feelings. Not to mention books VERY often receive damage in the slab via shaken comic syndrome, loose encapsulation, etc. So at the end of the day, it's an exercise in futility. You hope the 9.8 was graded a 9.8, and STAYS a 9.8 even when still slabbed.

The grading should go 9.0, 9.5 and 10.0 like normal grading should, but the system is set up to exploit and profit off the absolute high end. The real issue is shaken comic syndrome. Far more high grade books get damaged in slabs than books get swapped out.

[jimbo_7071]

On 1/1/2024 at 12:55 PM, Chip Cataldo said:

I love comics, not plastic...unless she's cute.

Your girlfriend wants my number.

[MyNameIsLegion]

On 1/3/2024 at 7:22 AM, Phill the Governor said:

The number on the slab preys on our OCD. The amount of books I've seen that are 9.4, 9.6 and 9.8 that all look the same solidifies my feelings. Not to mention books VERY often receive damage in the slab via shaken comic syndrome, loose encapsulation, etc. So at the end of the day, it's an exercise in futility. You hope the 9.8 was graded a 9.8, and STAYS a 9.8 even when still slabbed.

The grading should go 9.0, 9.5 and 10.0 like normal grading should, but the system is set up to exploit and profit off the absolute high end. The real issue is shaken comic syndrome. Far more high grade books get damaged in slabs than books get swapped out.

that's probably true- some hourly wage slave took that 9.8 and 9.4'ed it in the sleeving and slabbing process.  You should probably subtract .2 off any book after it's slabbed. Older, more fragile books probably suffer a half grade hit in the slabbing process. It was always a leap of faith sending off a book to some "authority" to bless it with a grade. Now that we've sobered up and know that Santa isn't real what is the real value of the service and the grade? Does the census really mean much? Does it make sense to pay a premium for the highest graded copy of any book? Was it really three books in the census in three different grades over time? 

Edited January 3 by MyNameIsLegion

[Mystafo]

On 1/2/2024 at 11:31 PM, lizards2 said:

those stay in the slab.

Flat on their backs, in my case.  It's that insufferable movement within the inner well that irks me most (well, besides the whole 'replaced book' scenario).  Hard to avoid without excess pressure, I realize but I ain't scared to jailbreak dat muva if I see it sliding..

Edited January 3 by Mystafo