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Is anyone else getting books back with warped inner wells?
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Started by LordRahl,

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electricprune

electricprune

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There are several issues with any of us trying to replicate the bending that some of our books are going through to determine if the curvature of the inner well can cause the damage we are seeing.

1. We can’t put a book in a brand new, intact inner well.

2. We can’t reseal the inner well as CGC does, possibly introducing heat.

3. We can’t place that inner well into the slab shells.

4. We can’t put everything through the sealing process CGC uses for the slab and replicate any heat generated by that process.

5. We can’t then ship the slab that has just gone through all of these processes.

Unfortunately, we can just get some books that have been damaged, but have not been damaged at all according to CGC.

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Stefan_W

Stefan_W

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On 9/15/2024 at 1:24 PM, electricprune said:

There are several issues with any of us trying to replicate the bending that some of our books are going through to determine if the curvature of the inner well can cause the damage we are seeing.

1. We can’t put a book in a brand new, intact inner well.

2. We can’t reseal the inner well as CGC does, possibly introducing heat.

3. We can’t place that inner well into the slab shells.

4. We can’t put everything through the sealing process CGC uses for the slab and replicate any heat generated by that process.

5. We can’t then ship the slab that has just gone through all of these processes.

Unfortunately, we can just get some books that have been damaged, but have not been damaged at all according to CGC.

That is all true, and those are the acknowledged limitations of trying to reproduce damage by bending books at home. 

There are also equally important limitations to trying to prove damage was done using before and after photos. To illustrate this I used two scans of a Hulk 181 that I pressed for a crack and resub. Looks like CGC damaged the book based on the enlarged ticks I circled, right? Except that the ones where the ticks show more (i.e., the one where the red looks darker) were prior to me doing CPR and resubmitting it, while the one with what appear to be lessened ticks are in the official CGC scan of the book. Did I do that great a job in removing them? To some degree, but there may also be minute difference in resolution, lighting, angle, etc. that make it appear as though I am a miracle worker. I also did not color things in to change the hue of the red - that is all about the different scanners used in the images. 

I am sure some people have experienced damage to their books and those people need to be compensated. But if we are talking about limitations that make this process challenging we have to look at a more complete picture. This stuff is hard to parse together. Really hard. 

 

capture.jpg

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lollyclown

lollyclown

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Why is it so hard to parse together?

I have a book that was perfectly flat and had zero spine ticks. I sent it in to cgc and it came back, in May, with a bend in it. It did not immediately have spine ticks apparent. Over time the slight but steady pressure cause spine ticks that I can now see the did not exist before sending it in and having it put inside this well that causes a bend.

This is happening to quite a few people and there's a lot of photographic evidence of it. People are making this overly complicated to try to have some weird brain flex competition.

 

Modern book gets sent to cgc within the last year, has no spine ticks and is flat. 

Book comes back from cgc and is bent in the case  

Put in cgc easy bake oven for 20 days and voila, delicious spine ticks ready to serve!

Edited by lollyclown
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lollyclown

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On 9/15/2024 at 4:26 PM, Stefan_W said:

You are right, how foolish of me. In my example with the Hulk 181 CGC clearly must have fixed up my book while it was with them. 

Soooo...your single example...of a non-modern book, with dependency on lighting, a scan from cgc and a million other factors somehow proves something about something and somehow some people don't have something happening to something?

 

You're making it way too complicated, you are looking at something that doesn't even fit the scenario. How many photos are in this post now of people that had literally flat books that went in, came back with a bend and have spine ticks? I'm honestly not even sure what you were trying to prove here or if you are trying to say we are all imagining it and cgc caused very few problems? 

You're you're trying to prove... something by using an old already damaged book to refute damage to pristine modern books...

Edit to add- You got me talking like Brian Michael Bendis over here.

 

 

Edited by lollyclown
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spidermanbeyond

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I have not sent a submission since 2/2024 because of all the shenanigans at CGC.  Now, we have banana gate.  I just sent a submission 2 weeks ago and I am really worried about it now.

Come on CGC, you can do better:

 

Edited by spidermanbeyond
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MadGenius

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On 9/15/2024 at 7:36 PM, spidermanbeyond said:

I have not sent a submission since 2/2024 because of all the shenanigans at CGC.  Now, we have banana gate.  I just sent a submission 2 weeks ago and I am really worried about it now.

Come on CGC, you can do better:

 

Am I to assume these are books that were encapsulated after CGC's statement that the problem was "fixed" by switching to the larger/thicker inner well?

Has anyone received books encapsulated after the alleged fix?

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spidermanbeyond

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I understand that there are a lot of dealers who dependent on CGC for weekly inventory for sale but we have given CGC too much power and they continue to take their customers for granted because we have let them.  CGC used to be a great company but now constantly damaging books and worse trying to deny responsibility.

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Calm-Mix

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On 9/15/2024 at 8:15 PM, MadGenius said:

Am I to assume these are books that were encapsulated after CGC's statement that the problem was "fixed" by switching to the larger/thicker inner well?

Has anyone received books encapsulated after the alleged fix?

I was just going to ask the same thing. I have quite a few customers who jumped ship and are using another grading company but I have a few hold outs. I as well as them, hope CGC fixes the problem and hopes they fix the comics they damaged. I sent out a few small orders to CGC last week just to test the waters and see if they actually fixed the problem. fingers and toes are crossed. Meanwhile they have some ME bananas of mine there to evaluate. I hate this because now I feel like I'm part of the problem but its starting to clog the system.

 

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