Is anyone else getting books back with warped inner wells? 25 25

[aszumilo]

On 9/4/2024 at 10:12 AM, Iconic1s said:

Well shoot!  All is forgiven!  Glad to see CGC is focusing their energy on the things that REALLY make a difference!

 

P.S.  What in the world in DSTRLY and when did their logo become “iconic?”  I’m so confused!

I wonder if these will also include the new “acceptable to a certain degree” warped inner well… color breaking bends included for FREE also!

It became Iconic when they realized they could make a buck off of it.

[GeeksAreMyPeeps]

On 9/4/2024 at 1:12 PM, Iconic1s said:

Well shoot!  All is forgiven!  Glad to see CGC is focusing their energy on the things that REALLY make a difference!

 

P.S.  What in the world in DSTRLY and when did their logo become “iconic?”  I’m so confused!

I wonder if these will also include the new “acceptable to a certain degree” warped inner well… color breaking bends included for FREE also!

They're a new publisher of creator-owned work. (Some fairly big names are pubclishing books through them.) Most, or perhaps all, of their books are large format, close to magazine sized. Not sure how their logo is "iconic"

[Stefan_W]

On 9/4/2024 at 1:44 PM, aszumilo said:

It became Iconic when they realized they could make a buck off of it.

Those labels are free. 

[aszumilo]

On 9/4/2024 at 10:58 AM, Stefan_W said:

Those labels are free. 

But, how many people will be sending books in to get graded / reholdered with those labels?  Warped inner wells / spine ticks are free right now as well and people still sending books in.

Edited September 4 by aszumilo

[BraveDave]

On 9/4/2024 at 1:18 PM, MAY1979 said:

So all pre-1975?

Yes. All 1971 or earlier. 

[MAY1979]

On 9/4/2024 at 4:24 PM, BraveDave said:

Yes. All 1971 or earlier. 

Then for that bending is the exception not the rule as it is for 1975-present.

Still nothing showing that post 1974 has changed.

 

[wiparker824]

On 9/4/2024 at 10:52 AM, GeeksAreMyPeeps said:

They're a new publisher of creator-owned work. (Some fairly big names are pubclishing books through them.) Most, or perhaps all, of their books are large format, close to magazine sized. Not sure how their logo is "iconic"

Yep. They’re also all 48+ pages, card stock. Can’t imagine these being susceptible to warping. I have a few, no desire to send them in for grading to test out that theory but I’d imagine the nature of these particular book’s format would lend itself to a lot of 9.8’s and even 9.9’s and 10.0’s that are completely flat. 

But also agree, no, they are not iconic. 

[DaveSFU]

UPDATE - CGC started finally sending back my 4 ME submissions (47 books).   Didnt do anything to them.   Said nothing is damaged, warped wells are normal.  Grades are within tolerance (multiple large bends on 9.8s remember).   They lied to me every step of the way and never let me talk to anyone beyond the mind numbing responses of the CS people i was dealing with.  Guess ill have to take further action now.  

The 11 books i sent in for Pressing/Regrading prior to learning about the warped wells (which they told me would shift to ME and never were) are about to grade.   Cant wait to see what they grade at now.   If they drop in grade then we know CGC is full of it.  

[AJsLongboxComics]

On 9/4/2024 at 7:52 PM, DaveSFU said:

UPDATE - CGC started finally sending back my 4 ME submissions (47 books).   Didnt do anything to them.   Said nothing is damaged, warped wells are normal.  Grades are within tolerance (multiple large bends on 9.8s remember).   They lied to me every step of the way and never let me talk to anyone beyond the mind numbing responses of the CS people i was dealing with.  Guess ill have to take further action now.  

The 11 books i sent in for Pressing/Regrading prior to learning about the warped wells (which they told me would shift to ME and never were) are about to grade.   Cant wait to see what they grade at now.   If they drop in grade then we know CGC is full of it.  

Yikes. This is unfathomable to me. 

[HotKey]

they have to be chomping at the bit over in newbie land. They couldn't pay for a better scandal from the top company just months before they start up.

This is likely going to be a future case study in business management classes of how to sink a ship. 

[Ninja0215]

It's September now...

 

My membership ends at the end of November.  If there isn't anything concrete on the resolution of this mater; my short time here will come to an end.  I don't want to be negative about this,  I did like submitting here but I'm not about to risk books at the expense of having the CGC name on them.  

 

I can see Dave has had no issues with his recent submissions which is amazing consider those are probably high profile/high grade books. I do hope that trend of zero issues continues.  We can only hope this quietly goes away.. 

[MAY1979]

On 9/5/2024 at 9:29 AM, Ninja0215 said:

 

I can see Dave has had no issues with his recent submissions which is amazing consider those are probably high profile/high grade books. I do hope that trend of zero issues continues.  We can only hope this quietly goes away.. 

Hi @Ninja0215, please go back page you will see I asked about @BraveDave's submissions, and then his response - I've quoted all below. Dave's subs were all PRE-1972 Silver and early Bronze submissions . The issue has been the exception with 1974 and earlier and The Rule (+remains the rule) with 1975-present.  

Thus there is no trend, nothing has changed! 

Giving up one hopes and dream are difficult, after nearly 25 years I have for CGC and have moved on to to other collecting interests. Not saying you need to do the same, but I do encourage you to give some thought about a new collecting and or business plan that is not 100% Sarasota related.  I am very curious to see how it plays out for the Cali folks and hope it works out better than they or anyone else expected.
  

On 9/4/2024 at 11:40 AM, BraveDave said:

Received back my books processed in August. No issues, all look good. Bronze and Silver Age books only, no moderns. Multiple tiers. Not sure if this means the issues were addressed but wanted to update with my experience.

 

On 9/4/2024 at 1:18 PM, MAY1979 said:

So all pre-1975?

On 9/4/2024 at 4:24 PM, BraveDave said:

Yes. All 1971 or earlier. 

 

Edited September 5 by MAY1979

[MAY1979]

On 9/5/2024 at 12:25 AM, AJsLongboxComics said:

Yikes. This is unfathomable to me. 

Same has happened to me this week + added damage on half my books during the slip-shod re-holdering.  If you read the last 25 or so pages of this topic, its same/BAU for everyone else except for an outlier book or two somehow coming back flat.   

My guess is CGC figures the "damaging you books is normal" message from their CS will be accepted by the sheep, IMHO it's now an even money chance that the Newport Beach folks service will catch on instead!

Edited September 5 by MAY1979

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

I will soon be sending in some comic books for grading, likely 25, to use the credit on my membership. Last year I hesitated to renew my membership but did so nonetheless. However, since I submit mostly moderns, primarily because I like the covers and wish to add it to my pc. I, unfortunately, expect the comic books to be returned to me damaged. Which, of course, begs the question, "Why am I submitting?" I have no simple answer for myself, the only one that, of course, cares about the comic books I submit.

Returning to membership, I will not renew again until CGC corrects this issue, if it does so. I may never renew ("Never say never."). It is to be expected that another problem, to not say "other problems", will arise. 

I have been planning, upon my retirement, to submit my original owner copies from the late Silver Age to the Modern Age for grading. Perhaps I will; perhaps not to CGC despite, if I correctly recall from this thread, vintage comic books not being placed in warped wells, at least for now.

[electricprune]

On 9/5/2024 at 10:32 AM, Tec-Tac-Toe said:

I will soon be sending in some comic books for grading, likely 25, to use the credit on my membership. Last year I hesitated to renew my membership but did so nonetheless. However, since I submit mostly moderns, primarily because I like the covers and wish to add it to my pc. I, unfortunately, expect the comic books to be returned to me damaged. Which, of course, begs the question, "Why am I submitting?" I have no simple answer for myself, the only one that, of course, cares about the comic books I submit.

Returning to membership, I will not renew again until CGC corrects this issue, if it does so. I may never renew ("Never say never."). It is to be expected that another problem, to not say "other problems", will arise. 

I have been planning, upon my retirement, to submit my original owner copies from the late Silver Age to the Modern Age for grading. Perhaps I will; perhaps not to CGC despite, if I correctly recall from this thread, vintage comic books not being placed in warped wells, at least for now.

Sorry that you have to use the credits on the current product. I wish I hadn’t.

[The Lions Den]

I've been following this thread very closely, and as a former employee of CGC it really does concern me. I do feel there are some things to be learned from this situation, however: 

1) Always inspect your books very closely before and after submitting. I also like to take pictures of them and keep my own detailed grading notes before sending them off into the void. I was shocked to see that some folks here admit to not inspecting their books closely after receiving them back from CGC. In my view, that's a serious oversight.  

2) It's true that CGC generally keeps their facilities very cool (after all, it is Florida). But the notion that the air conditioning adversely reacts with the heat produced from sealing the wells may be a bit of a stretch. If that were the case, this phenomenon likely would have reared its ugly head a long time ago. My guess is that it's a combination of factors, and in my experience, you can never rule out human error as a possibility.

3) One word: PLASTICS. Lord knows they're used for everything these days, but I can't say that I'm a huge fan. Mylar is one thing---simple, effective and still relatively affordable. I like all those things. What I don't like is complicated, ineffective and expensive. 

4) If we look back at the evolution of many companies, you really can see a direct correlation between volume, quality and production. Take from that what you will...and have a safe week.     

[Skytripa]

On 9/5/2024 at 10:20 AM, The Lions Den said:

I've been following this thread very closely, and as a former employee of CGC it really does concern me. I do feel there are some things to be learned from this situation, however: 

1) Always inspect your books very closely before and after submitting. I also like to take pictures of them and keep my own detailed grading notes before sending them off into the void. I was shocked to see that some folks here admit to not inspecting their books closely after receiving them back from CGC. In my view, that's a serious oversight.  

2) It's true that CGC generally keeps their facilities very cool (after all, it is Florida). But the notion that the air conditioning adversely reacts with the heat produced from sealing the wells may be a bit of a stretch. If that were the case, this phenomenon likely would have reared its ugly head a long time ago. My guess is that it's a combination of factors, and in my experience, you can never rule out human error as a possibility.

3) One word: PLASTICS. Lord knows they're used for everything these days, but I can't say that I'm a huge fan. Mylar is one thing---simple, effective and still relatively affordable. I like all those things. What I don't like is complicated, ineffective and expensive. 

4) If we look back at the evolution of many companies, you really can see a direct correlation between volume, quality and production. Take from that what you will...and have a safe week.     

Its funny you mention human error. I mentioned this previously and it kinda got shrugged off. There was even a video where a guy mentioned he didn't think it was human error because the person could just be retrained. If they don't know who it is or what it is how would they know to retrain.

[Stefan_W]

On 9/5/2024 at 11:27 AM, Skytripa said:

Its funny you mention human error. I mentioned this previously and it kinda got shrugged off. There was even a video where a guy mentioned he didn't think it was human error because the person could just be retrained. If they don't know who it is or what it is how would they know to retrain.

That was my video. If it is simply human error the problem would have been fixed long ago, at bare minimum once this thread started, by replacing or retraining the human causing the problem with nothing else required. 

[Iconic1s]

I think that CGC has changed their business model and we just didn't get the memo.

I do not think they care about (what was once) the typical collector anymore... the people that got them this far... people that send their books in for their PC (or to get the "CGC certification" to make the book more desirable to the market)... they DO NOT CARE ABOUT PEOPLE THAT BUY THE BOOK AND NOT THE LABEL.

THEY HAVE USED WHAT WAS ONCE THEIR GOOD REPUTATION TO MAKE THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS IS WHAT IS ON THE LABEL.  They smile while telling you the book THEY DAMAGED is still a 9.8!  They have lost their way!

New business model... generate a little hype periodically by bragging about some record sale on Heritage... maybe throw a 9.9 of a 50 year old book out there to create buzz once in awhile... even though anyone can see the only thing "9.9" about it is the label, and meanwhile they rest on their laurels (that our loyalty helped provide!).  Every once in awhile, make a new custom label that no one cared about in the first place, etc.

THEY DO NOT CARE IF THEY BEND OUR BOOKS, THEY DO NOT CARE IF THEY RUIN THEM... THEY DO NOT CARE IF THEY DISPLAY TERRIBLY (NEWTON RINGS, SCUFFED CASES) BECAUSE IN THEIR MINDS THE LABEL IS WHAT MATTERS TO THEM (AND THE MARKET), THEREFORE IT SHOULD BE ALL THAT MATTERS TO US.  Our busted up books are still 9.8's cause THEY SAY SO!!

It doesn't matter to them if the few collectors that are really upset about this stop submitting.  They will survive on the numerous retailers out there that are selling brand new pre-sales of "guaranteed 9.8, or even 9.9" of variant after variant of all this modern stuff that publishers are cranking out.  THEY ARE INDEED BUYING THE LABEL, NOT THE BOOK and probably don't even look at the condition of the book, and besides with the newer heavier paper being used, the book would probably survive a few heavy handed CGC employees anyways... P.S. they'll still get you to live with some scuffed up cases if you are lucky though.  They will also get by because the majority of the collecting community probably isn't even aware of this... many people will get their books back and say to themselves... "dang, I must have missed all those bends when I sent it in"... still got a good grade though!

Honestly, I can't think of a company right now that is as good as CGC at not only NOT living up to their "guarantee" but that also excels at letting customers down when there is a problem.

And then, right when you think they can't get any worse, they do... newton rings, acetategate, invisiblebookgate, swapgate, defamationgate, employeesstealingbooksgate , and now warpgate!  (I probably missed a few "gates")

Most respected... 

Certified... 

Guarantee... 

Edited September 5 by Iconic1s

[lollyclown]

On 9/5/2024 at 10:44 AM, Stefan_W said:

That was my video. If it is simply human error the problem would have been fixed long ago, at bare minimum once this thread started, by replacing or retraining the human causing the problem with nothing else required. 

Yeah, human error can happen, but this has been happening for months now and that goes well beyond the window of human error on any level. 100% agree with you.