Are recession fears inflated? Time for folks to double-down in GOLD ...aka GA comics! 2 2

[fifties]

On 8/11/2024 at 9:32 AM, tth2 said:

 

There's just something inherently wrong with a bunch of balding, graying, paunchy guys (and gals) playing rock music, even when their audience are also balding, graying and paunchy.  That's not rock 'n' roll.

It doesn't matter WHAT it is; they are playing to their audience, who enjoy it, and they enjoy doing it, so what's the problem?

[Robot Man]

On 8/11/2024 at 9:32 AM, tth2 said:

I know I'm in a minority, but I believe that rock music is inherently the music of youth.  It's always been that way from its inception.  Classical music was for old people.  Jazz/big band/tin pan alley were for middle-aged people.  There was never anything rebellious about those forms of music.  No tin pan alley singer ever protested the Korean War or the Vietnam War or raged against the inequities of the world.  Rock was always about rebellion by young people.

There's just something inherently wrong with a bunch of balding, graying, paunchy guys (and gals) playing rock music, even when their audience are also balding, graying and paunchy.  That's not rock 'n' roll.

The rebellious youth of today are called “swifties”…

I wonder how many of today’s artists will be around and still popular with young people in 50 years? 

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

On 8/11/2024 at 11:32 AM, tth2 said:

I know I'm in a minority, but I believe that rock music is inherently the music of youth.  It's always been that way from its inception.  Classical music was for old people.  Jazz/big band/tin pan alley were for middle-aged people.  There was never anything rebellious about those forms of music.  No tin pan alley singer ever protested the Korean War or the Vietnam War or raged against the inequities of the world.  Rock was always about rebellion by young people.

There's just something inherently wrong with a bunch of balding, graying, paunchy guys (and gals) playing rock music, even when their audience are also balding, graying and paunchy.  That's not rock 'n' roll.

No, it’s nostalgia. Tth, I recognize you as a heavyweight around here, so I only say this with the greatest respect, but . .  It’s not unlike the nostalgia that drives our comic INSANITY 

Edited August 11 by GreatCaesarsGhost

[tth2]

On 8/12/2024 at 6:19 AM, GreatCaesarsGhost said:

On 8/12/2024 at 12:32 AM, tth2 said:

I know I'm in a minority, but I believe that rock music is inherently the music of youth.  It's always been that way from its inception.  Classical music was for old people.  Jazz/big band/tin pan alley were for middle-aged people.  There was never anything rebellious about those forms of music.  No tin pan alley singer ever protested the Korean War or the Vietnam War or raged against the inequities of the world.  Rock was always about rebellion by young people.

There's just something inherently wrong with a bunch of balding, graying, paunchy guys (and gals) playing rock music, even when their audience are also balding, graying and paunchy.  That's not rock 'n' roll.

Expand  

No, it’s nostalgia. Tth, I recognize you as a heavyweight around here, so I only say this with the greatest respect, but . .  It’s not unlike the nostalgia that drives our comic INSANITY 

Yes, great point!

But, I satisfy my music nostalgia by listening to the music from when it was originally recorded, watching old concert footage by rock stars in their pomp, and collecting memorabilia from back in the day, just like I satisfy my comics nostalgia by reading and collecting old comics and OA. 

[tth2]

On 8/12/2024 at 5:54 AM, Robot Man said:

I wonder how many of today’s artists will be around and still popular with young people in 50 years?

Based on seeing Millennials and Gen Z-ers going nuts when they hear the songs that were popular in their youth (Rihanna, One Direction, Taylor Swift, etc.), I think they'll be exactly as nostalgic/enthusiastic for the music and performers of their youth as every generation before them was for theirs. 

[Readcomix]

On 8/11/2024 at 5:54 PM, Robot Man said:

The rebellious youth of today are called “swifties”…

I wonder how many of today’s artists will be around and still popular with young people in 50 years? 

Nah, she’s just today’s Madonna. No question pop is very big and transient today, Bob, but there are people under 70 producing great new rock n roll. Go see The Struts. Or Greta Van Fleet. 

[Telegan]

On 8/11/2024 at 10:17 PM, tth2 said:

Based on seeing Millennials and Gen Z-ers going nuts when they hear the songs that were popular in their youth (Rihanna, One Direction, Taylor Swift, etc.), I think they'll be exactly as nostalgic/enthusiastic for the music and performers of their youth as every generation before them was for theirs. 

I was just about to say the same thing.  They'll be on YouTube (or whatever it'll be called by then) and reminiscing about back in the good ol' days when they would listen to Drake, Taylor Swift, and ....... *gasp*, Creed.

Although, I do disagree with you in a previous post about jazz not being rebellious... jazz, jazz clubs, etc. for a while was considered rebellious and demonic music by lovers of classical and, in general, "a whole lot of people" back in the early 20th century.  There were several towns trying to ban jazz music, jazz halls, and any establishment that played the music.  It went through its own Wertham phase when people said it was going to corrupt the youth.  Maybe you mean rebellious referring to lyrics, in which case, nevermind, because I think jazz was considered evil because it was "wild" for the time and well, let's be real, originated and innovated by African Americans.  It was considered rebellious for the music alone - nevermind any lyrics.  There was a PBS documentary about the very topic a while back that I found interesting.

[thehumantorch]

On 8/11/2024 at 10:32 AM, tth2 said:

I know I'm in a minority, but I believe that rock music is inherently the music of youth.  It's always been that way from its inception.  Classical music was for old people.  Jazz/big band/tin pan alley were for middle-aged people.  There was never anything rebellious about those forms of music.  No tin pan alley singer ever protested the Korean War or the Vietnam War or raged against the inequities of the world.  Rock was always about rebellion by young people.

There's just something inherently wrong with a bunch of balding, graying, paunchy guys (and gals) playing rock music, even when their audience are also balding, graying and paunchy.  That's not rock 'n' roll.

I think you see rock music that way because you experienced it in your youth.  And I get that because I have similar experiences but if some rock and roll star geezer picks up a guitar and plays the hell out of it I have to accept that he is playing rock and roll and he is a musical god.

Generally music has evolved as music technology evolved; the introduction of electric guitars in the 1950s, the Yamaha and Moog synthesisers in the 1970s, electronic music in the 1990s and now digital music.  Musicians, usually young ones, adopt and experiment with new technologies and create new forms of music.

And if you search for pre rock and roll protest songs you'll find them.

 

[Cat-Man_America]

On 8/11/2024 at 9:41 AM, Robot Man said:

Maybe true in many cases. But there are exceptions. The Stones, McCartney and Clapton are notable exceptions. They can still bring it strong and continually sell out venues to fans of all ages.

I agree with you about certain exceptions, but they're increasingly rare.  I do believe that an artist should call it a day when they can't perform up to audience expectations, especially given the ticket prices these days. Amazingly, some artist's still have what it takes and can draw a mix of older and younger fans. Here's a surprising example of one British invasion rocker (76 years old) who's still got the vocal chops and energy to entertain his audience...

 

[jimbo_7071]

On 8/11/2024 at 11:17 PM, tth2 said:

Based on seeing Millennials and Gen Z-ers going nuts when they hear the songs that were popular in their youth (Rihanna, One Direction, Taylor Swift, etc.), I think they'll be exactly as nostalgic/enthusiastic for the music and performers of their youth as every generation before them was for theirs. 

True. And they'll have nostalgia for the pop-culture artifacts of their youth: soccer cards instead of baseball cards, pogs, Pokémon cards, i-pods, COVID masks, video games, Harry Potter toys and books, Paw Patrol Toys, Power Rangers dolls, Nike shoes, Lego sets, Shopkins, squishies—possibly graphic novels like the Dog Man and Captain Underpants books, but not saddle-stitched GA comic books.

(I'm hoping some of them will want to pay a lot for Kurt Halsey Frederiksen prints, because I still have a bunch of those—his stuff was immensely popular for about five years, maybe '04 through '09.)

Edited August 12 by jimbo_7071

[jimbo_7071]

On 8/10/2024 at 3:52 PM, adamstrange said:

Symphony Orchestras consistently complained in the 70s/80s that their patrons were primarily 50+ and they had to attract younger supporters.  What history has shown is that their supporters were always 50+ and remain 50+ because you have to get a point in life where you have sufficient income, time, desire for status, and more sophisticated taste to make you vulnerable to their pleas.

I'm sure that's very reassuring to some people, but it simply isn't the reality with comic books. I've been collecting GA since 1985 (so about a year after I started collecting new comic books). You did not see gray-haired guys at the comic shows unless they were there with their grandchildren. Even for the GA material, the buyers were kids and teens and guys in their 20s, 30s, and early 40s. (A few of the dealers were older guys.)

How old was @Mmehdy when he bought his Action 1? So much for the myth that GA collectors have always been old.

Edited August 12 by jimbo_7071

[Jayman]

On 8/12/2024 at 4:15 AM, Cat-Man_America said:

I agree with you about certain exceptions, but they're increasingly rare.  I do believe that an artist should call it a day when they can't perform up to audience expectations, especially given the ticket prices these days. Amazingly, some artist's still have what it takes and can draw a mix of older and younger fans. Here's a surprising example of one British invasion rocker (76 years old) who's still got the vocal chops and energy to entertain his audience...

 

That’s terrific! I was just playing these guys for my grandkids in the car yesterday. They are 7 and 10 now, but they requested Herman’s Hermits because they remembered I used to play them years ago while driving them to preschool. 

[tth2]

On 8/12/2024 at 5:45 PM, jimbo_7071 said:

I'm sure that's very reassuring to some people, but it simply isn't the reality with comic books. I've been collecting GA since 1985 (so about a year after I started collecting new comic books). You did not see gray-haired guys at the comic shows unless they were there with their grandchildren. Even for the GA material, the buyers were kids and teens and guys in their 20s, 30s, and early 40s. (A few of the dealers were older guys.)

How old was @Mmehdy when he bought his Action 1? So much for the myth that GA collectors have always been old.

The difference is that comic collecting is a relatively new hobby.  Comic collecting in its modern form, which I call "organized comic collecting", really only came into existence in the mid-1960s, and even that was very early days.  It only started becoming more mainstream in the 1970s with San Diego Comic Con and the publication of the Overstreet Guide.  So there wouldn't have been many old guys in the hobby in the 1970s or even 1980s.  It was still a new hobby for young people back then.

 

[sfcityduck]

My three favorite acts:

U2 - Their high period spanned from my start of HS to end of my higher education;

Beatles - Got deeply into their music, especially bootleg outtakes in college b/c I loved their creative process;

Bob Dylan - His older stuff has resonated more and more for me over the years causing me to rediscover music I would not listen to when it first came out.

I have seen them all play (well McCartney not Beatles) as over 50 year olds and enjoyed the experiences.

Also seen many other aged Rockers I have greatly enjoyed Springsteen, Plant, Who, Neil Young, Fogarty, Tears for Fears, Green Day, Eddie Van Halen with Simon & Garfunkel (of all things), etc. and have no regrets. 

It is all rock & roll to me.

So is Greta Van Fleet - but they are playing nostalgia songs also.

[sfcityduck]

On 8/12/2024 at 7:36 AM, tth2 said:

The difference is that comic collecting is a relatively new hobby.  Comic collecting in its modern form, which I call "organized comic collecting", really only came into existence in the mid-1960s, and even that was very early days.  It only started becoming more mainstream in the 1970s with San Diego Comic Con and the publication of the Overstreet Guide.  So there wouldn't have been many old guys in the hobby in the 1970s or even 1980s.  It was still a new hobby for young people back then.

 

Modern comic collecting definitely organized in the early 1960s with collector organizations, fanzines, adzines, conventions, etc. all happening.

And the organizers were old guy legends like Bails, Don and Maggie T, etc. who had been collecting since the forties. The guys who founded the first comic stores, became the first super collectors, first historians, were mainly older. Collecting was very well established before OPG. OPG was not even the first price guide. Overstreet himself was an old guy.

Edited August 12 by sfcityduck

[Point Five]

On 8/12/2024 at 10:41 AM, sfcityduck said:

Bob Dylan - His older stuff has resonated more and more for me over the years causing me to rediscover music I would not listen to when it first came out.

Dylan is the ultimate counter-example to the idea that all rockers in their 70s & 80s are just dishing out nostalgia. Sure, in the early '90s his voice sounded shot and his shows were kind of lackluster. But his shows took off like a rocket in the mid-90s, and he's been astonishingly prolific with high-quality studio albums from Time Out Of Mind (1997) to Rough and Rowdy Ways (2020), evolving into virtually a different artist entirely since his 60s/70s heyday. I honestly listen to his recent stuff more than the early stuff. Leonard Cohen is another good example of someone with a really vital late-stage revival.

Then there are some aged rockers I love to see just because they can deliver the goods in a big way, even today. They have fun and the crowd has fun and what on earth is wrong with that? John Fogerty is one obvious example.

 

[tth2]

On 8/12/2024 at 10:50 PM, sfcityduck said:

And the organizers were old guy legends like Bails, Don and Maggie T, etc. who had been collecting since the forties. The guys who founded the first comic stores, became the first super collectors, first historians, were mainly older. Collecting was very well established before OPG. OPG was not even the first price guide. Overstreet himself was an old guy.

Yes, but they were a small minority.  Look at the pics of the early SDCC's, it's mostly young guys.  When collecting first became mainstream in the 1970s, the demographics of the hobby definitely skewed young because there weren't a whole lot of people who'd been collecting long enough to have gray hair.

[vheflin]

Are sound levels still the same at these classic band concerts?

I wouldn't want to be deaf for a week, fun when you're 25 but not now.

I guess you could wear earplugs.

[Robot Man]

On 8/11/2024 at 8:17 PM, tth2 said:

Based on seeing Millennials and Gen Z-ers going nuts when they hear the songs that were popular in their youth (Rihanna, One Direction, Taylor Swift, etc.), I think they'll be exactly as nostalgic/enthusiastic for the music and performers of their youth as every generation before them was for theirs. 

I agree that trend will always continue. But how many young kids who were born before these artist’s heyday be fans? Will these artists still be releasing new music and touring to audiences of new and younger fans in 50 years?

I am always selling vinyl to today’s teenagers who are paying up for Zep, Hendrix, Stones, Ozzy and punk bands. They wear their shirts and are well versed fans. Talked to a 16 year old girl with a Velvet underground shirt on recently. She was rabid and well versed in them as well as the Stooges.

How many of todays superstars have the same following to people who were born after these artists do their final show? 

[jimjum12]

On 8/12/2024 at 10:56 AM, Point Five said:

Dylan is the ultimate counter-example to the idea that all rockers in their 70s & 80s are just dishing out nostalgia. Sure, in the early '90s his voice sounded shot and his shows were kind of lackluster. But his shows took off like a rocket in the mid-90s, and he's been astonishingly prolific with high-quality studio albums from Time Out Of Mind (1997) to Rough and Rowdy Ways (2020), evolving into virtually a different artist entirely since his 60s/70s heyday. I honestly listen to his recent stuff more than the early stuff. Leonard Cohen is another good example of someone with a really vital late-stage revival.

Then there are some aged rockers I love to see just because they can deliver the goods in a big way, even today. They have fun and the crowd has fun and what on earth is wrong with that? John Fogerty is one obvious example.

 

I watched this clip of an old guy, dressed like a banker in a 3 piece suit, walking into a bar. It seemed unexpected to the patrons when he walked up to the stage, picked up a guitar, and started shredding that bad boy. It was Robin Trower, looking like your grandpa. Some things, like Dylan, Simon and Garfunkel. Joni Mitchell. etc, retain their relevance like Bethoven and Wagner. I love seeing old school artists keep plugging away. The concert I regret attending more than any was Chicago, and Earth, Wind, and Fire. I know Kath has gone to the great Venue in the sky, but still  GOD BLESS ...

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

 

Edited August 12 by jimjum12