I think Comic book shows are broken 2 2

[kimik]

Give it a bit of time and the overpriced sellers will be forced to adjust downwards. My guess is they bought during the 2021 and into 2022 peak and do not want to book that large of a loss. Eventually they will have do it, and if they are good they will take the hit, recycle the money into new stock, and make enough to cover that loss.

[comicstock]

Give it a bit of time and the overpriced sellers will be forced to adjust downwards.

The dealers who have already adjusted are the ones making the money now.

[Buzzetta]

On 8/27/2024 at 11:23 AM, Robot Man said:

I would also echo high prices on keys at cons. Mostly wall books. Maybe due to high booth prices, maybe due to the cost and availability of replacement books and maybe just some greed.

I still love cons though. I. Usually scan the wall. Maybe “tire kick” a few wall books to judge a dealer’s pricing, then hit the boxes. That is where the deals usually are. For those too picky or lazy to do a little digging. I also look for that “one guy” usually on the outskirts of the room. The smaller guy nobody knows. Often deals can be found from that guy.

There are no deals on the pretty keys. They are just too hard to replace. Set your sights a little lower if you want to go home happy…

The problem with that, is I feel like I am buying something for bragging rights to myself that "found something" and that takes away from a book I really want. 

Am I getting what I want or am I getting something to justify going to the con? 

Once I found myself doing the latter I started to walk away from going to as many cons. 

NYCC is the only one I still go to at this point because at least on Thursday and Friday I stop by after work, I burn the Saturday and need a day off from NYC, and MAYBE go in on a Sunday.  Most shopping at this point is done online. 

[batman_fan]

I love comic book shows.  My favorite thing to do is go to a dead booth and start digging through the boxes and start to build a big pile.  Within a few minutes 10+ people will come running over to see what they are missing out on.  Good times, good times.

[Neo "The One"]

I've been on both sides of this equation.  I did a show monthly as a vendor right after Covid.  Things were good for about a year. Then I consistently started losing money at shows.  I always would price my slabs (which would be 95% of the books I brought - very little raw books) at last sold / lowest currently available prices on ebay.  Then the great bubble burst, and prices went in the toilet.  Eventually I could not compete and stopped doing the shows altogether.  I've moved on to card shows.  I don't want to rip anyone off, but don't want to consistently lose money either.  *Note - I have mostly pressed and signed books so the cost is not just the table, book and slab, but the signatures which really adds up).  I hate bringing raws because of the wear and tear on the books lugging them back and forth and customer handling.  I prefer buying online.  For some reason at shows I always feel like I'm getting ripped off as a customer.  (Childhood trauma! ;)

[Neo "The One"]

On 8/26/2024 at 7:21 PM, revat said:

Firstly, I recognize that as a dealer (or really any comic collector) you cant turn a great profit on every book you sell, in fact sometimes you probably take a loss.

HOWEVER, there are also sometimes very reasonable justifications for seemingly fantasy pricing.  Here's a very plausible scenario:

1.  In 2021 you bought two raw copies same grade of a big wall key, like xmen 1 at 70%-80%, for $4,000 per, so a total of $8,000.  You price both for $6,000, and are lucky to sell one right away at a convention for near $6,000, like $5,700. That's great.

2.  You keep the other one priced at $6K and on the wall for the next three years, it doesn't sell, and the price has steadily dropped to now being worth about $4k slabbed.

3.  Now offers are coming in at $3K.  You could look at it one of the following ways:

    a.  You could sell it for $3K - you perceive that as a loss of $1K off of your initial purchase price, and you lose a big wall book, and the chance to sell to some sucker for at least $4.5K (hopefully).

    b.  You could sell for $3K - you still gained $700 on the original purchase price of the two books, and you get cash in hand today to either pay some bills or turnover new inventory.  But you also lost one of your bigger wall books, and you kinda love owning an Xmen 1.

   c.  You could hold until a dummy comes and overpays, or the price cycles back up, you're not in a hurry and it looks great on your wall and you love owning an xmen 1.  

 

Now of course as the buyer you don't know or care about any of the above, but that is not such an unreasonable or implausible circumstance IMO for a dealer, especially if they don't rely on comic sales as their main source of income.

 

So this is interesting.  I have certainly done dollar cost averaging.  Paid $1000 for a book lets say around 2021.   That book went back down to around $400 a year ago.  I bought my 2nd copy, (same grade) and then tried to get $700 for either.  Very difficult.  I ended up selling one at $600, so my loss is not that great at this point.  Another book was selling for around $1800 during the height (autographed).  I ended up selling it for $500 and then had sellers remorse.  I was able to buy the same grade signed (nicer sig imo) for $400.  It's tough out there!

[revat]

On 8/27/2024 at 1:03 PM, Neo "The One" said:

So this is interesting.  I have certainly done dollar cost averaging.  Paid $1000 for a book lets say around 2021.   That book went back down to around $400 a year ago.  I bought my 2nd copy, (same grade) and then tried to get $700 for either.  Very difficult.  I ended up selling one at $600, so my loss is not that great at this point.  Another book was selling for around $1800 during the height (autographed).  I ended up selling it for $500 and then had sellers remorse.  I was able to buy the same grade signed (nicer sig imo) for $400.  It's tough out there!

Its a wild world out there, with reason and logic that varies significantly from each person and each situation and each book.  And that's before you get to the crazy or stupid or woefully out of touch.  That's why I tend to not get bothered by any of it, I don't know you or your situation.  As long as nobody is lying to anybody, buy or don't buy or sell or don't sell at whatever price you want.  Doesn't mean you can't/shouldn't press for a better deal if you want one, but if it doesn't happen just let it go (I guess maybe make a note not to buy/sell to a person anymore if you feel like they're not operating in good faith or never have the prices you want), no need to get mad.

[Buzzetta]

On 8/27/2024 at 11:49 AM, kimik said:

Give it a bit of time and the overpriced sellers will be forced to adjust downwards. My guess is they bought during the 2021 and into 2022 peak and do not want to book that large of a loss. Eventually they will have do it, and if they are good they will take the hit, recycle the money into new stock, and make enough to cover that loss.

That's not always true.  There is a dealer that I know of that does not care if you buy his stuff or not.  Maybe he deals in comics... maybe art... maybe both.... those who know, know.  He may have cashed in a few things in the last couple of years and has the money to live off of.  Want the item?  Buy it at his price.  Don't want it?  Don't buy it.  It doesn't matter if it sells or not since they have some money to burn.  He is just in the game for the fun of it. 

[Buzzetta]

Saturdays are for my prettier half.  But if I go, I will make sure that at least one other day is for @greggy 

[Cman429]

I don’t even bother with buying comics at shows. Their prices are strictly for impulse buyers or filthy casuals who don’t know any better. Toy dealers are getting almost as bad. I respect the hustle but I belong to comic con review groups on FB and don’t want to hear dealers whining about “a bad show” when they had walls of merchandise at pandemic prices. 

[shadroch]

On 8/26/2024 at 6:56 PM, MAY1979 said:

Agreed. However, in 2024 why would someone with knowledge of the hobby, who's not in the throes of withdrawal and needs a quick fix, ever sell to a dealer? Consign sure, sell nopes!

Cash flow.  Dealers might pay twenty cents on the dollar, but that assumes you paid a dollar for it.  What if you paid a nickel and are getting twenty cents on the dollar?  It makes a little more sense, and then you must factor in your time and convenience. 

[Buzzetta]

On 8/27/2024 at 8:39 PM, Poutine said:

Toy dealer at the local show puts up displays of originals but gives people who don't know any better cheaper knock offs.

Slimy 

Oh sheet - seen that before.  

Okay... so anyone doing shopping at NYCC... all I am going to say is this.... be VERY careful when buying Masterpiece Transformers and certain other toy lines.  There was a time period when they were the most knocked off bootlegs being produced.

There are guides that review the subtle nuances so you do not pay the Dealer Closeout of a 20% off the retail of say $125 on average with what you think is a genuine article when you are really looking at something that would cost you $30 on AliExpress with free shipping.   if you do inspect it to make sure it is genuine, make sure that as @Poutine said, the item you looked at and inspected is the item you are taking home and the switch is not pulled giving you the knock off in the bag. 

Here is what a "seeker" should cost.  Skywarp is currently on BBTS at retail for $200

Here is a listing for the knock off item on AliExpress.  I promise you the box will look very similar and some of you won't be able to determine those differences unless it is pointed out for you.   Note that for the advertisement they use the Hasbro / Tomy Takara images. 

 

Edited August 28 by Buzzetta

[kimik]

On 8/27/2024 at 6:28 PM, Cman429 said:

I don’t even bother with buying comics at shows. Their prices are strictly for impulse buyers or filthy casuals who don’t know any better. Toy dealers are getting almost as bad. I respect the hustle but I belong to comic con review groups on FB and don’t want to hear dealers whining about “a bad show” when they had walls of merchandise at pandemic prices. 

There are still plenty of us who are reasonable sellers at shows that grade and price accurately. Just focus on us instead of everyone else.

To be honest, I like the fact that other sellers behave that way. It means more money for me in the end.

[DougC]

Sometimes when I can't find a book I want at a convention I just buy a random book to take home and place next to the books I already have. You need to assert dominance and show those Millie the Model books they are replaceable if they don't value up, if it works in corporate it has to work for comics too!

I also collect low end trash so there is almost never an instance when I can't find a new copy of Fish Police to add to the collection.

[joeypost]

I simplify things greatly. I will let a dealer know what I’m willing to pay for the books I pulled. If they areOK with it we have a deal, if they aren’t then I walk away. Some times as I’m walking around the show, especially late in the show, they will approach me and ask if the deal is still on the table. Either way I leave the show happy.

[Neo "The One"]

On 8/27/2024 at 8:28 PM, Cman429 said:

I don’t even bother with buying comics at shows. Their prices are strictly for impulse buyers or filthy casuals who don’t know any better. Toy dealers are getting almost as bad. I respect the hustle but I belong to comic con review groups on FB and don’t want to hear dealers whining about “a bad show” when they had walls of merchandise at pandemic prices. 

I stopped selling comics at shows for this very reason.  It is a side hustle and to lose money at (many) multiple shows in a row made no sense.  I haven't done a toy show in about a year (that show was great).  I price to sell, but that doesn't mean people are buying.  Lets face it - during Covid the gov was pumping money into the economy.  Once things got tight (inflation) disposable income went down.  People choose toilet paper over comic paper.  (Unless you are weird).  Supply goes up, demand goes down, and so do the prices.  If you bought books cheap and can sell them cheap - great!  I think my biggest weakness is having mostly graded books.  The price is pretty much the price (if you can get the same book, same grade same signature on ebay - that's what I need to price it at to sell it).  But if I'm taking a loss, or not even selling books at that price then it is stupid.  Raw books are more of a gray area.  Most guys try to get NM prices (IMO) even if the book is not NM.  This is where you have more room to wiggle.  No grading or signature fees (+shipping).  You may be able to negotiate on condition of the book.  *Funny side note.  Had a New Mutants 98 signed by Rob Liefeld CGC SS 9.8.  I had it "on the wall" and priced at $300 (2 - 3 months ago).  Guy was set to buy it and then hesitated. He started asking is this original -  I told him it was a facsimile edition with a real signature by the artist / creator Rob Liefeld.  He was still a little confused.  So... I looked up FMV at the time after the show.  NM 98 1st print 9.8 (unsigned) was $1800 (last sold ebay).  So people are nuts.  This guy thought he was getting an $1800 + book for $300.  I mean c'mon.  Honestly he just liked the book, but had no idea on value.  This is another issue.

[Robot Man]

On 8/27/2024 at 12:00 PM, Buzzetta said:

The problem with that, is I feel like I am buying something for bragging rights to myself that "found something" and that takes away from a book I really want. 

Am I getting what I want or am I getting something to justify going to the con? 

Once I found myself doing the latter I started to walk away from going to as many cons. 

NYCC is the only one I still go to at this point because at least on Thursday and Friday I stop by after work, I burn the Saturday and need a day off from NYC, and MAYBE go in on a Sunday.  Most shopping at this point is done online. 

Nothing keeps me from buying a book I want other than the price. I have, on occasion, overpaid a bit on any given day for something special.

I don’t necessarily look for just keys or pretty hot covers. These are usually overpriced wall books.

I always hit the boxes. In many cases there are very cool books overlooked by the lazy. Maybe ones that a dealer missed in marking up the hot stuff. Books that have might gotton hot since they were originally priced.

I love the hunt and the thrill of discovery. Maybe something I never noticed. Never a “consolation prize” but something off most people’s radar or a book I really like.

This only happens at a show and one of several reasons I look forward to them. 

[october]

On 8/26/2024 at 11:14 PM, Buzzetta said:

 

 

Never understood business models predicated on finding rich suckers.

Spotlight 6 in 9.8 is "worth" $35,000. Sure buddy. 

[WolverineX]

That's a terrible look for Shortboxed.  No one is going to buy that book.  

 

 

Edited August 28 by WolverineX

[Ed Hanes]

On 8/28/2024 at 11:39 AM, WolverineX said:

That's a terrible look for Shortboxed.  No one is going to buy that book.  

 

 

AF 15 at 6.0 has never even sold for more than 100K according to GPA ...I guess if you gotta have it right now

But if I had money to blow like that, I would buy it then take it out of the slab right there ...don't ask me why..I am rich and eccentric and very impulsive

Edited August 28 by Ed Hanes