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Iron Fist 14 cover up for sale at CAF

Started by markseifert,

145 posts in this topic

1407graymalkin

1407graymalkin

Posted
Posted
Someone else mentioned that they were in contact with Cockrum as to who he thought did the cover. I would really be interested to see what he says. I know the info coming from Byrne that Milgrom did the cover, but this seems inconsistent with the title at that time.

 

John Byrne's post about Al Milgrom notwithstanding, I tend to agree that this seems inconsistent with the title at that time.

 

I sent an email to Spencer Beck, who reps Al Milgrom, to see if he could verify the credits.

 

Has anyone tried reaching out to Dave Cockrum's people to get any input from him? I know that Iron Fist # 14 is listed on his web site as his work, but it certainly could be an error.

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pkveronese

pkveronese

Posted
Posted
Someone else mentioned that they were in contact with Cockrum as to who he thought did the cover. I would really be interested to see what he says. I know the info coming from Byrne that Milgrom did the cover, but this seems inconsistent with the title at that time.

 

John Byrne's post about Al Milgrom notwithstanding, I tend to agree that this seems inconsistent with the title at that time.

 

I sent an email to Spencer Beck, who reps Al Milgrom, to see if he could verify the credits.

 

Has anyone tried reaching out to Dave Cockrum's people to get any input from him? I know that Iron Fist # 14 is listed on his web site as his work, but it certainly could be an error.

 

Thanks for contacting Spencer - I didn't even think about doing that to verify Milgrom's end. This is a very interesting mystery - I look forward to getting some more information.

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Sal

Sal

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i never would have guessed in a million years that cover was by good ole Al, but as soon as i read that i could see it.

 

it's like Milgrom's Captain Marvel covers at the time. not terribly bad, not like they became later when he decided to use a giant fat brushstroke and stopped inking like he cared what the final product looked like

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pkveronese

pkveronese

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Has anyone else noticed that it has Al Milgroms name in pencil at the top of the page?

 

 

tonofbricks.gifforeheadslap.gifnews.gif

 

That doesn't mean he was fully responsible though. I can still see Cockrum's hand in this one. 893scratchchin-thumb.gif

 

I agree. Milgrom could still be the inker.

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1407graymalkin

1407graymalkin

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This is from Spencer Beck, Al Milgrom's rep, who emailed the man himself with my question. This is what he replied back with. I assume the "original" he's talking about is Cockrum's sketch since Bill Woo clearly has the actual cover.

 

 

"Yep. That's my cover--pencils and inks. I'm pretty sure it was based on a Cockrum cover sketch--but hard to recall thirty years later. I think I have the original...have to check.

Best--Al"

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1407graymalkin

1407graymalkin

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Well, that pretty much seals it... unfortunately. sorry.gif

 

Now, let the resale value plummet.... grin.gif

 

I think that the resale value is lower based on what we know now than if Cockrum was the artist, but probably not much that much lower.

 

Can anyone else think of key original art pages by less prominent artists that have commanded high prices?

 

For example, I bet the cover to Hulk #181 or G.I. Joe #1 would command huge money even though Herb Trimpe is not the biggest name in original art.

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blowout

blowout

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Well, that pretty much seals it... unfortunately. sorry.gif

 

Now, let the resale value plummet.... grin.gif

 

I think that the resale value is lower based on what we know now than if Cockrum was the artist, but probably not much that much lower.

 

Can anyone else think of key original art pages by less prominent artists that have commanded high prices?

 

For example, I bet the cover to Hulk #181 or G.I. Joe #1 would command huge money even though Herb Trimpe is not the biggest name in original art.

 

Sure, but Al Milgrom??? crazy.gif

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joe_collector

joe_collector

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For example, I bet the cover to Hulk #181 or G.I. Joe #1 would command huge money even though Herb Trimpe is not the biggest name in original art.

 

What connection does Hulk 181 have to Iron Fist 14?

 

The cover to Iron Fist 14 has long been attributed to Cockrum, and part of the previous value of the cover is due to Dave's work on the New X-Men and his role as a seminal Marvel and DC BA artist.

 

Now that Milgrom has been confirmed as the actual artist, that throws a big monkey wrench into future values.

 

In terms of Hulk 181, there was never any question of who drew it, so why would future valuation be affected? Everyone has known it's Trimpe for decades.

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comix4fun

comix4fun

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The cover to Iron Fist 14 has long been attributed to Cockrum, and part of the previous value of the cover is due to Dave's work on the New X-Men and his role as a seminal Marvel and DC BA artist.

 

Now that Milgrom has been confirmed as the actual artist, that throws a big monkey wrench into future values.

 

 

Do you really think that? I think the original poster mentioned Hulk 181 because it's significance in Marvel History outweighs who actually put pencil to paper. If the cover to 181 was put up for sale today, would it be effected by finding it was Kupperberg, or Milgrom or anyone else? Not likely. For a common cover maybe, but not that one.

 

As far back as I can remember people thought it was a Cockrum but no one knew for sure who did this cover. Nobody had a 100% dead firm positive attribution, thus no one I know could place any sort of premium on the piece based on Dave's involvement.

 

In my opinion...The vast majority of people looking to get this cover are looking to get it for the 1st appearance. For $30k you could get alot better Cockrum, thus the subject matter seems to effect the value pretty dramatically.

 

And people seemed to like the cover art to IF14 well enough before they knew it was Milgrom....why would those same people not like it now? The name? That seems a little silly. Either the art is good or bad, I don't think finding out the artist after the fact effects how good a piece is.

 

Chris Caira

 

PS...If anyone saw Al's inks over Starlin (I mean actually held the pages) on the Thanos mini-series they would not be disparaging him like they are now.

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joe_collector

joe_collector

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I think the original poster mentioned Hulk 181 because it's significance in Marvel History outweighs who actually put pencil to paper. If the cover to 181 was put up for sale today, would it be effected by finding it was Kupperberg, or Milgrom or anyone else?

 

We'll never know, but I will tell you that "common knowledge" has always been that Cockrum did the cover and I believe it's even listed on Comics.org as such. If you asked 20 BA collectors who drew the Iron Fist 14 cover, I'd be surprised if the vast majority didn't say Cockrum.

 

I'm a serious fan of the era, and even I would have said it was Cockrum who drew it.

 

To say the revelation that Al Milgrom is the definitive artist will not affect resale values is pretty short-sighted and to compare it to Hulk 181 is totally illogical. Sure, the Sabretooth intro still makes it a premium cover, but once you take the Cockrum/New X-Men fans out of the equation, something has to give.

 

Remember, we're talking about resale values, and Hulk 181 has always been a Trimpe cover, so it's value is sold based on the artist. If even one previous IF 14 buyer thought he was buying a Cockrum cover, then all sales figures are suspect.

 

Once the IF 14 cover has sold a few times with the "Milgrom" information as common knowledge, then we'll have a better idea on what its market value really is.

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1407graymalkin

1407graymalkin

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For example, I bet the cover to Hulk #181 or G.I. Joe #1 would command huge money even though Herb Trimpe is not the biggest name in original art.

 

What connection does Hulk 181 have to Iron Fist 14?

 

 

I was simply trying to cite an example of another piece of original art of massive historical significance that happens not to have come from a celebrated artist.

 

Certainly the value of the the piece is lower now that it is know that Milgrom is the artist than when Cockrum was thought to be the artist.

 

However, that doesn't mean that it's all of a sudden worthless.

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