my last, last i tell you, attempted transaction with metropolis

[action1kid]

There are certain books that are so hot that I didnt even dare ask for a discount on them because I knew that book would have been gone even within that tiny window of negotiation time by someone who would have been happy to pay overguide for it and was really hot for the book. I feel I know what books are negotiable and what books are not [within my specialty] and if I dont consider that fact, I can lose the book. I dont really know how hot this particular book is but these are the thoughts that I think about when I really want a book.

[sacentaur]

You know, it is this type of nonsense that moved me further and further away from the comic book community.

 

Further away like ComicConnect for example? (same wolf, different sheep's clothing)

 

People have wondered why they never see me at shows anymore. Now you have your answer.

 

Stephen

 

What I wonder is how someone can forever rationalize away the most egregious business practices and unethical dealings, only to come to the conclusion that the problem isn't "me" it's "them".

 

STEVE

[Straw-Man]

You know, it is this type of nonsense that moved me further and further away from the comic book community.

 

Further away like ComicConnect for example? (same wolf, different sheep's clothing)

 

People have wondered why they never see me at shows anymore. Now you have your answer.

 

Stephen

 

What I wonder is how someone can forever rationalize away the most egregious business practices and unethical dealings, only to come to the conclusion that the problem isn't "me" it's "them".

 

STEVE

 

he moved so far away that he was responding to ricky's post within about a half hour!! i just proved mythbusters wrong--i indeed laughed 'til i was blue in the face!!!!

[MrBedrock]

Richard,

 

Now I have to pipe in.

 

Metropolis offers books at 75% off guide, 50% off guide, 25% off guide and 0% percent off guide. It depends on the book. In fact, we have have 65,000 GA, SA and BA books discounted off of guide. More discounted books than other dealers have books.

 

I will gladly buy a book a book for $1000 and price it at $1100. I do this because I know it is a book that will sell. Unfortunately, these books I cannot discount.

 

You take the opportunity to you use my discount on 1 book and choose to draw a conclusion about Vincent and myself. Seems kinda unfair. And incorrect.

 

Having found myself trying to buy books from you in the distant past, I do recall times when the discount you were able to offer me was 0%. Not 2%. 0%. Did I take it personally? No.

 

You know, it is this type of nonsense that moved me further and further away from the comic book community. People have wondered why they never see me at shows anymore. Now you have your answer.

 

Stephen

 

Stephen,

If this type of non-sense is what is driving you away from comics, then you should have never been here in the first place, considering the non-sense you are spouting in the above post. Steve, we all have books that we deep discount. We all have books that we discount very little. But you know that your books are always going to be better than mine. As you will surely be the first to say, your inventory is the best in the world. As you will surely be the first to say, you have the rarest books, the highest grades, the whitest pages, the fastest search engines, the coolest offices, the smartest staff, the best comic business. So when you and I compare what is discountable there will be differences. Here is the biggest difference. When I ask you for a discount on any book that is even remotely good, whether it is for one of my customers or for myself, I have to beg, plead and show a certain amount of deference to the almighty Metropolis and then be happy when I get a 2% discount. And, in all fairness, there was that one time many years ago when you did give me 5% off.

On the otherhand, at every show, Vincent goes through my inventory and pulls my very best stuff (which, admittedly, is small potatoes compared to the VAST inventory of you), things like Timelys, silver age keys, Actions under #20, Tecs under #38,...you know...all the books that you have pallets full of. He then hems and haws around waiting for me to give him a price. I had NEVER, NEVER, NEVER, qouted him a price that was less than 10% off. I always thought that was dealer courtesy. That has changed in the last couple of years as that COURTESY was never returned.

As for the instance of me giving you a 0% discount. Well, how do I give you a discount when I tell you I don't want to sell something and you say name your price! I can't believe you bring this up to support your argument. It is this kinda non-sense that makes me miss you Stephen!

[nochips]

I really hope you guys can work this out. It's a darn shame it came to this.

[Weird Paper]

You know, it is this type of nonsense that has moved me further and further away from the comic book community. People have wondered why they never see me at shows anymore. Now you have your answer.

 

You know, it's your spooning comic book. You know what you have in it. Sell it for what you want to sell it for (provided someone will buy it). We all know what we have in a book when we offer it for sale.

 

That being said, the above response seems very "I'm taking my ball and going home" of you. This response makes you sound like a whiny, petulant child. You've (arguably?) got the freaking best comics-for-sale inventory in the world. What you've done obviously works for you. If you feel the need to defend yourself here, don't do it in a way that makes you sound like a spoiled kid.

 

The comic book community is no different from any other "community" of people. There are going to be people who like you and those who don't. There are going to be people who've had good and not-so-good experiences with you. I'm just suggesting that, if you choose to deal with the negative issues in a public forum, you might want to maintain your professionalism.

[EastEnd]

I agree that a dealer is free to charge what they like and buyers are free to decide whether they want to pay that price or not. Apparently, there are quite a number of folks that are willing to pay Metro's high prices as evidenced by their success. If people didn't pay their prices then they'd either have to change their pricing strategy or whither away. Having said that, it does seem to me that a customer that's been loyal for seventeen years deserves a bit more special attention than $10 off on shipping for an aggressively priced $700+ book (the offer of an additional $15 discount came only after the customer reacted badly and also had a lot of sanctimony attached to it which in my book negates the meager goodwill it was trying to generate). It just makes good long-term business sense to keep your best customers happy and "feeling special."

 

I've been collecting for thirty years and spend quite a bit of money each year on funny books. I've bought exactly one book in my entire collecting life from Metro and only because I managed to get it at a pretty good discount. In my limited dealings with them, I've found them to be rigid on pricing and frankly a bit full of themselves which just turns me off. If they were the only player in town well maybe I might have to suck it up a bit. But there are so many venues for securing quality books these days that I'm quite happy avoiding them. Sounds like from these boards I'm not the only one. So the query for Metro is -- yes, you're doing fine... but how much better could you be doing if you were a bit more flexible with your pricing and a bit more humble in your approach?

[Norrin_Radd]

Interesting comments in this thread.

 

In a nutshell, Metro's pricing ruffles some feathers. As a result, Metro has to put up with some criticism. That's the price they pay.

[Catman-migration]

That being said, the above response seems very "I'm taking my ball and going home" of you. This response makes you sound like a whiny, petulant child. You've (arguably?) got the freaking best comics-for-sale inventory in the world. What you've done obviously works for you. If you feel the need to defend yourself here, don't do it in a way that makes you sound like a spoiled kid.

 

Metro (or any dealer) is not under any obligation to give discounts, though they are appreciated when given. Whining about not receiving a discount (or a good enough discount) in a public forum sounds a lot more childish.

 

I realize MrBedrock is defending his friend, but his posts (as well as some others) contain what sounds a lot like dealer (and collector?) envy toward Metro. If Metro can keep on bringing out the wide variety of hard to find books that they have been, I welcome it as a GA collector.

[Silver Surfer]

I'm not taking any sides and the only thing I would say further on this topic is that a direct call to Vinnie/Steven first would probably have been good idea before starting a thread on the topic.

[Paratrooper]

Metro (or any dealer) is not under any obligation to give discounts, though they are appreciated when given. Whining about not receiving a discount (or a good enough discount) in a public forum sounds a lot more childish.

 

And we are not under any obligation to buy from them. However, giving a critique of a business's selling practices is necessary to inform other comic collectors. These critiques are indeed necessary, for when a business spends thousands and thousands of dollars in advertisements (see the latests OSPG for Metro ads) the readers should get first hand experiences with these guys. And what really kills me, as posted earlier, buying from Heritage and selling it on their site not long after for 2x as much!

 

This is not a whining post, it's a post about about experiences with Metro. Most of which seem to be negative, and you know on these boards anything posted in a negative light is deemed whining.

 

I realize MrBedrock is defending his friend, but his posts (as well as some others) contain what sounds a lot like dealer (and collector?) envy toward Metro. If Metro can keep on bringing out the wide variety of hard to find books that they have been, I welcome it as a GA collector.

 

Let them gobble up all the choice collections out there and selling them for what they want. But I prefer collections to be put up on the open market where the price of the books are determined by collectors. Not by some greedy business that wants to set new GPA prices so that they can make more money.

[metropoliscomics]

Richard-

 

I am truly hurt…

 

 

Having said that lets take a look at several past purchases from Richard-

 

You bought a Batman 4, 5 and Sub-mariner 16 all in

VF/NM condition from me in 2004. Books I would usually

not discount. My sticker was $15,400- your price

$14,400.00.

 

Your next purchase was a low grade Batman 3 which I knocked $100.00 off.

 

Your next purchase was a Subby #24 in VF/NM stickered at $1200. I would normally not discount a decent Timely title and especially not a tough to find book like a Subby #24 in high grade. But once again I knocked $100 off the purchase price to show some type of reciprocation for the discounts you have given me over the years. You thanked me with a big smile on your face as you walked away from my booth. I remember this specifically because I was hoping you were going to be ok with that type of discount (even though my 1st inclination was to not discount it). Needless to say I was relieved and happy to see you smile.

 

Then there was a Marvel Mystery 8 you bought from me. A

book I would never drop a dime off of but knocked a

complimentary $100 off for you…

 

Anybody reading please note I am not leaving off one purchase he made since the 1st one mentioned above for $14,400.00.

 

Richard, I can understand you sticking up for your friend... but I

thought I was a friend too...

 

Do I always give you something off- no, its true. But by what I have shown above anybody can see that I have made a good faith effort which I thought was appreciated. I know after making sales to you you have smiled, shook my hand and said thank you. And in return I of course thanked you for your business….

 

Your last purchase was for two Jumbo Comics, #13 CGC 8.5 and an 18 CGC 9.2. You bought these while I was away on vacation in Italy from Frank. You were only given $50.00 off a $2500 invoice. You made comment about this purchase in what I thought was a very sarcastic tone in another post on the Forum. I thought we were friends and had a decent business relationship so I didn’t quite know what to make of it-now I do.

 

When you tell me you don't have room to discount a book I don't take it personally-even though it is. I accept your rationale that you will not give me any more of a discount than I give you- but please don’t say you have always been easy with me about pricing-you have never been easy to buy from. I have always had to pick and choose carefully at the Bedrock booth.

 

I have tried to work with you on price as evidenced above. I have given you the courtesy you mention me not giving you. The difference between us is this. You will go and sell the same books I am interested in at or below my offer price to another buyer- I don’t do that to you.

 

To everybody- I would rather have dealt with this privately with Richard. In fact we spoke not more than a week ago and had a very friendly conversation. These issues were never brought up to me when we spoke and I thought everything was fine. We laughed, joked and talked about life in general and business. I told him I looked forward to seeing him at the next show and we hung up. I thought everything was cool.

 

I would only ask the forum members who have read this post to give us a chance. Don’t be persuaded by the negative things you have read here. If you want to see how we treat our customers email me directly with an offer and let me see what I can do for you.

My email address is vincentz@metropoliscomics.com.

 

Sincerely,

 

Vincent

[sacentaur]

The comic book community is no different from any other "community" of people. There are going to be people who like you and those who don't. There are going to be people who've had good and not-so-good experiences with you.

 

This is a very insightful comment (well said, WP).

 

In any community, there are those who care and those who don't. There are those who look upon the status of the neighborhood as a whole, and those who don't want to see beyond their front lawn. There are those who truly care about the quality of life on their block (and are active in same), and those who are too timid or afraid to get involved (all the while peeking out from the window behind some curtains).

 

Again, there are much deeper issues at the core other than just a single offer refused on one book (which on face value doesn't seem to be that big of a deal, does it?). When fragile relationships develop over time as a result of constant greed, deception, and arrogance then than those relationships are likely to crumble, even if only from a piece of straw that broke the proverbial camel's back.

 

STEVE

[The Black Hand ®]

These well crafted PR responses are something else aren't they.

[garthgantu]

Ya think??

[showcase4]

......we are all in this hobby together, and it is a VERY small community (fortunately...or prices would be even higher ). These Boards can really influence a dealers business, and/or collector decision making. Maybe I'm in the minority, but I like just about everyone on both sides of the fence.....my fellow Forumites including Billy Parker and dealers large and small, including Metro.

 

When I have had problems in the past ( not with Metro -- just a general comment ), I have usually been able to reach an agreement ( as long as the other party is reasonable and cares to make things right ) thru communication. This entire thread / hobby / game really boils down to communication as much as it does the books themselves.

 

I guess my point is this thread reminds of the age old saying "why can't we all just get along?".............and I think we can. Communication and respect is the key....once those 2 aspects are in place as a "let's do business together" foundation, I have found that the grading and pricing of funny books all kinda works out on its own.

 

Steve

[Forbush-Man]

I absolutely love this thread.

[Catman-migration]

Metro (or any dealer) is not under any obligation to give discounts, though they are appreciated when given. Whining about not receiving a discount (or a good enough discount) in a public forum sounds a lot more childish.

 

And we are not under any obligation to buy from them. However, giving a critique of a business's selling practices is necessary to inform other comic collectors. These critiques are indeed necessary, for when a business spends thousands and thousands of dollars in advertisements (see the latests OSPG for Metro ads) the readers should get first hand experiences with these guys. And what really kills me, as posted earlier, buying from Heritage and selling it on their site not long after for 2x as much!

 

This is not a whining post, it's a post about about experiences with Metro. Most of which seem to be negative, and you know on these boards anything posted in a negative light is deemed whining.

 

I realize MrBedrock is defending his friend, but his posts (as well as some others) contain what sounds a lot like dealer (and collector?) envy toward Metro. If Metro can keep on bringing out the wide variety of hard to find books that they have been, I welcome it as a GA collector.

 

Let them gobble up all the choice collections out there and selling them for what they want. But I prefer collections to be put up on the open market where the price of the books are determined by collectors. Not by some greedy business that wants to set new GPA prices so that they can make more money.

 

I have no problem with critiquing dealers. In fact, I usually find such threads/posts very informative. However, this particular "critique" thread quickly turned into a whinefest and bashing of a particular dealer. I realize it's par for these boards, but I just felt I had to say something.

 

As for buying books at Heritage and selling for 2X or more, do you mean to tell me Metro is the only major dealer who does this, particularly if the book in question is rare? I think not.

 

As for the open market determining prices, I agree with you in principle -- it's basic supply and demand. The only way to truly get that for every book that comes to market (with that book's own unique set of defects and attributes) though is to have every book that comes on the market be sold at auction, not a fixed price. However, most dealers sell most of their stock for fixed prices, with the price based on several factors, including how much they have invested and what collectors are willing to pay. If someone is willing to pay a dealer's asking price for a book, for whatever reason, isn't that valid data for determining the price on the open market? Or is the data only valid if certain people agree with it?

[Catman-migration]

......we are all in this hobby together, and it is a VERY small community (fortunately...or prices would be even higher ). These Boards can really influence a dealers business, and/or collector decision making. Maybe I'm in the minority, but I like just about everyone on both sides of the fence.....my fellow Forumites including Billy Parker and dealers large and small, including Metro.

 

When I have had problems in the past ( not with Metro -- just a general comment ), I have usually been able to reach an agreement ( as long as the other party is reasonable and cares to make things right ) thru communication. This entire thread / hobby / game really boils down to communication as much as it does the books themselves.

 

I guess my point is this thread reminds of the age old saying "why can't we all just get along?".............and I think we can. Communication and respect is the key....once those 2 aspects are in place as a "let's do business together" foundation, I have found that the grading and pricing of funny books all kinda works out on its own.

 

Steve

 

 

Well said. Peace.

[Pirate]

Our servers in Virginia got hit by a hail storm today and the backups failed when all the power went out.

 

They are in the process of rebooting and will be back online shortly.