OT, a cautious tale for art collectors re Michael Golden

[chromium]

Wouldn't Scoop be interested in running this story ? Would at least warn a few thousand hobbyists about this...

[sterlingcomics]

I know I for one will now refuse to purchase anything with Golden's name on it. I just got the Modern Masters book and wish I hadn't. This guy doesn't need any support from his fans obviously.

 

This is just horrible.

 

Kudos to John Byrne for stepping up and offering Jerry some art worth his 500.00 for absolutely nothing. Now that was a class act.

I don't know jack about artist personalities in general, but I do know Mr. Byrne has a "charming" personality that has PO'd other collectors as well, as documented on these boards. He's not perfect either, but this was a good gesture.

[comix4fun]

 

They called this a "document" and assigned a $0 value to it.

 

Just wanted to call your attention to that.

 

C

 

Not to get into minutiae and legalize but a document requires writing and there are words on the paper; just because it has a picture of a superhero doesn't make it art. Words help it qualify as a document. And value of this stuff is very flexible, a value of $0 isn't out of line.

 

Robert

 

 

Identifying it as a "document" and not as "merchandise" is what I am talking about.

 

In this context it is business transaction for a merchandise, for a set price.

 

It was merchandise, for a $537 fee, not a document for $0 fee.

 

The words on the paper matter little, as most panel pages and covers have words all over them....none of them are documents, especially when they change hands for money in a business transaction.

 

If the sender valued it at $0 why was Gerry asked to pay $537 for it?

 

C

 

 

[joe_collector]

I don't know jack about artist personalities in general, but I do know Mr. Byrne has a "charming" personality that has PO'd other collectors as well, as documented on these boards. He's not perfect either, but this was a good gesture.

 

There is a HUGE difference between being a bit of a online and willfully trying to rip off a group of customers to the tune of $500 a shot.

[Thomas]

 

They called this a "document" and assigned a $0 value to it.

 

Just wanted to call your attention to that.

 

C

 

Not to get into minutiae and legalize but a document requires writing and there are words on the paper; just because it has a picture of a superhero doesn't make it art. Words help it qualify as a document. And value of this stuff is very flexible, a value of $0 isn't out of line.

 

Robert

 

 

Identifying it as a "document" and not as "merchandise" is what I am talking about.

 

In this context it is business transaction for a merchandise, for a set price.

 

It was merchandise, for a $537 fee, not a document for $0 fee.

 

The words on the paper matter little, as most panel pages and covers have words all over them....none of them are documents, especially when they change hands for money in a business transaction.

 

If the sender valued it at $0 why was Gerry asked to pay $537 for it?

 

C

 

 

Chris I think what Robert is saying is that it's really all flexible depending upon many criteria in each and every transaction. I can see both sides of both of your arguments very clearly and I'm not taking one side or the other, I'm a fence sitter on this one.

 

One thing I thought of though is that maybe this piece has no value as it's clearly not what Gerry paid for right?

[Michael (OML)]

This really is unfortunate. Gerry idolized Michael Golden's artwork and was so excited. And then, to receive a piece of art that is not what you wanted and has a spelling error. This situation is very sad. I really wish Michael and his representative would have behaved better.

 

Some of you know that I too am waiting on a commission which should arrive by Tuesday. Having seen Gerry's, I am very nervous about what I am going to receive.

 

M

 

 

[otherworldsj33]

That is really not a good thing Mr. Golden did. Just a real lack of maturity, and professionalism. I saw him yesterday at the con at his table. Now I am glad I did not buy anything from him. But I did get 2 Matt Wagner pages, who was sharing a booth with him.

[Comicdey]

What a POS......he has provided you Mr. Turnbull....

 

Did you have any say in the way he was to present the commission...did you see a preliminary...did he provide any sort of service....ack.....

 

You deserve your money back in full....and Michael Golden deserves the paper for his fireplace.

[Dr_Strange]

ive just heard that hes done the same to 2 of my friends, both of their art has "patience is a virtue" on it. . . .

[Thomas]

ive just heard that hes done the same to 2 of my friends, both of their art has "patience is a virtue" on it. . . .

 

Out of curiosity did he spell 'virtue' incorrectly on theirs as well?

 

Nevermind, I just saw Michael's post to the list. He's spelled 'virtue' correctly on his.

[TupennyConan]

I know I for one will now refuse to purchase anything with Golden's name on it. I just got the Modern Masters book and wish I hadn't. This guy doesn't need any support from his fans obviously.

 

This is just horrible.

 

Kudos to John Byrne for stepping up and offering Jerry some art worth his 500.00 for absolutely nothing. Now that was a class act.

 

Before your post I didn't see any other reference to JB performing this classy act of charity. Is this information to be found on JB's page? Personally, I'd ask JB to draw Dr Strange sending Golden's 24 inch long pony tail into Dormammu's Dark Dimension.

 

What a shame. I too am a fan of MG's art. This raises the age old question of art criticism: is knowledge and/or appreciation of the artist integral to one's understanding/appreciation of the art? In this circumstance, we can answer the question as "no" because both clearly suck independently of each other. Best wishes art collector!!

 

 

[KingOfRulers]

 

Before your post I didn't see any other reference to JB performing this classy act of charity. Is this information to be found on JB's page? Personally, I'd ask JB to draw Dr Strange sending Golden's 24 inch long pony tail into Dormammu's Dark Dimension.

 

 

 

Didn't you talk to Golden for a while at a show? Did he seem okay there?

[TupennyConan]

It was FX (what a terrible show). He didn't have much to say...typical taciturn comic artist. The nice looking lady sitting next to him did all of the talking: "How did you become a fan of M's?", "What comic by M do you like to read?" My answer was pretty much the Micronauts (awe inspiring stuff). Now that I think about it more, I should have asked for her email. I assumed they were married but it is more likely she was the agent mentioned in this thread.

 

I also had breakfast next to him in Charlotte. He was within arm's reach. We both ate alone, drank coffee & read the paper. While I had met him before, I didn't realize it was he until afterwards. So, we didn't speak.

 

His pony tail is very long.

His agent and/or wife is kinda hot.

[OldGuy]

Wouldn't Scoop be interested in running this story ? Would at least warn a few thousand hobbyists about this...

 

Scoop isn't in the business of publishing "news" that can help protect collectors.

[Aloha]

I had a similar nasty experience with Golden and Renee' at SuperCon this year. Basically, I was on the sketch list for a $100 comission (you had to pay in advance) and was around #15 on the list. When I discovered that he was only doing pencils and that the quality of the commissions were really sub par for the first few drawings, I went up to Renee' to politely ask to cancel my commission as Michael was only done with about 6 drawings and would not be able to finish my comission at the con. Renee' just went off the hook and started yelling and screaming at me. Berating me at how I was "unprofessional" and other derogatory insults. I tried to calmly explain that I did not want to wait a few weeks or months for Golden to finish my commission and that I would like a refund so that I could spend my money on other things instead of tying it up. She continued to verbally abuse me and I took it because I wanted my money back. Finally she told me to ask Golden who was sitting right next to her and listening to all this. He grudgingly agreed to refund my money but was not a good sport about it. As I left the booth, Renee' continued to hurl insults at me very loudly and agressively.

 

I had wanted to share this story with other fans, but I felt a bit embaressed, like maybe it was my fault. However, I'm glad this thread was started. I don't think it's right that an artist should get mad at you if you cancel a con sketch when he won't even be able to get started on it until he's back home. And it's certainly not me who was unprofessional as Renee' believes. I'm just a collector.

 

Others may have their own opinions about Golden and Renee', but my advice is to get the word out that they are not nice people to deal with so that other fans do not get abused in this fashion.

[Messier3499]

What a loser. Good thing there are so many great artsists who are also great people. -- His 'response' (on comicart-l) was a joke.

[the blob]

But, from Golden's point of view, he DID sit there on "his own time" after "real" deadlines and knock out a tight little number, giving it his full attention once he put pen to parper....and dares people to understand the whole picture by putting themselves in HIS shoes.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Is he still doing comics or is he a commercial illustrator now?

 

If comics, how much could he possibly be getting paid per page with the typical book having a 25K print-run?

 

I'd bet a shiny nickle that he is getting paid vastly more per hour for this commission work than for his "real" work (given $175 for a 5 minute sketch, $500 for I guess maybe a 20 minute drawing if he hadn't tried the lettering nonsense. seriously, what do has-beens get paid per page nowadays? and believe me, the editors won't accept this sort crapola.

 

And were he not such a total person_who_is_obnoxiously_self-impressed, he could probably make a nice side living doing commission work on the side. Seriously, 6 or 7 of these a month in a country with free healthcare and cheap real estate like canada is like a yearly wage for many. I hope this pretty much turns the world off to sending him any money, but then again, not everyone is toodling on the internet to find out.

 

You have this guy, who, admittedly, was a semi-star for a couple of years in the hobby, sure, soaking people for $175-$500 for what we can mostly agree is an inappropriate level of attention to the work product, and then you have a guy like herb trimpe, who, sure, was not as good in their respective primes, but who worked on a lot of classic stuff over the years, struggling financially after getting booted unceremouniously by marvel and who, I hear, is a tremendously nice guy who gives out free sketches or really cheap ones at local shows, or a dave cockrum, wasn't he having a tough time financially before he died? next show i go to where trimpe is in attendance I will give him some hard earned cash to do some sketches if he is so inclined.

 

[the blob]

oh, my bad, i guess you're in canada, he's in Connecticut? Well, I guess doing 6 or 7 of these a month will pay the real estate taxes on his home then.

[TupennyConan]

I'm not too comfortable with this thread. The guy did one clunker and everyone wants to sharpen the pitchforks and light the torches.

[Hart1000]

I had a similar nasty experience with Golden and Renee' at SuperCon this year. Basically, I was on the sketch list for a $100 comission (you had to pay in advance) and was around #15 on the list. When I discovered that he was only doing pencils and that the quality of the commissions were really sub par for the first few drawings, I went up to Renee' to politely ask to cancel my commission as Michael was only done with about 6 drawings and would not be able to finish my comission at the con. Renee' just went off the hook and started yelling and screaming at me. Berating me at how I was "unprofessional" and other derogatory insults. I tried to calmly explain that I did not want to wait a few weeks or months for Golden to finish my commission and that I would like a refund so that I could spend my money on other things instead of tying it up. She continued to verbally abuse me and I took it because I wanted my money back. Finally she told me to ask Golden who was sitting right next to her and listening to all this. He grudgingly agreed to refund my money but was not a good sport about it. As I left the booth, Renee' continued to hurl insults at me very loudly and agressively.

 

I had wanted to share this story with other fans, but I felt a bit embaressed, like maybe it was my fault. However, I'm glad this thread was started. I don't think it's right that an artist should get mad at you if you cancel a con sketch when he won't even be able to get started on it until he's back home. And it's certainly not me who was unprofessional as Renee' believes. I'm just a collector.

 

Others may have their own opinions about Golden and Renee', but my advice is to get the word out that they are not nice people to deal with so that other fans do not get abused in this fashion.

 

Holy CR@P Aloha!!! That's down right mean what Renee did to you! Both she & Golden are showing their lack of character....not to metion their #%$@@^ attitude!!!

 

SHAME ON RENEE & MIKE!!!