UPS Arrived At My LCS Earlier Than Santa - ASM #545 & Others

[Kevin Boyd]

Did everyone also forget Peter Parker revealing he is Spider-man?

 

It was one of the conditions MJ demanded from Mephistio as part of the deal.

[DrWatson]

Why do they continue to do this stuff if they are only going to "undo" it later?

[Kevin Boyd]

I stopped buying the ASM title regularly around the time of "Sins Past" and I haven't regretted the decision. Buying for the sake of keeping the collection complete is something I don't do for any title.

[Kevin Boyd]

Why do they continue to do this stuff if they are only going to "undo" it later?

 

Quesada's tenure as Marvel EIC has always been about making rash and flashy short term changes. They don't tend to consider the ramifications of the stories they decide to tell... and backtrack whenever they feel like it.

[Excelsior!-migration]

Did everyone also forget Peter Parker revealing he is Spider-man?

 

It was one of the conditions MJ demanded from Mephistio as part of the deal.

 

Well, that is something at least. Marvel rights one wrong and then goes on and make another mistake by ending MJ and Peters marriage (that way). I guess Mephistio (sp) has Beyonder level powers now. Making everyone on Earth forget who Spider-man is IS an increadible feat. Didn't know the minds of people like Dr. Strange could be manipulated that easily.

[Ty_]

ARGH!!!

 

In my anger at the story I totally missed the fact that Peter is wearing a web-shooter ( but this was caught and/or discussed here, here and here)

 

So let us get this straight, does Mephisto wipe out all of JMS' run and storylines since (including Sins Past and The Other) or does Mephisto wipe out every single story since about ASM issue #259?

 

Who thought that this was a good idea? And how fast will the new EIC retcon OMD?

[Kevin Boyd]

Every story since ASM 259 is now potentially "different" or did not happen - actually - this appears to go back much further than ASM 259 - I would say it might go back as far as to the around the time just after Gwen's death when MJ and Peter began their first relationship as more than just friends - as evidenced by Flash and Harry being roommates still (and no Liz Allen or Norman Jr.).

 

I mentioned the death of the prehistoric butterfly - the removal of that element (Peter and MJ's love for one another) has caused all of the elements to move along in completely different patterns.

 

I don't think they (the Marvel writers and editors) have any idea whatsoever what doing that means - about what's in or what's out.

 

As a friend reminded me, Alan Moore said something along the lines that if you think those stories never happened - you are wrong, they are in your collection or on your shelf - you can read them anytime.

 

But the character that is currently appearing in ASM doesn't recall any of it the way it was presented. He doesn't have the history you recall that he had.

 

What Mephisto appears to have done is not change people's memories of what happened - he has seemingly altered the timeline. At a specific junction something did not happen and Peter and MJ did not reunite their love. Quesada has hit the reset button.

 

The only comparable situation would be the post-Crisis Man of Steel Superman, which went from telling a story of his early days to the present, and it took years for DC to fill in the blanks as to what happened to Superman between Man of Steel 6 and Superman Vol. 2 #1. Every so often they would do a recap showing the revised history of a pivotal event, such as his team-ups with the JLA.

 

Problem with this Spider-Man story (well, one of many problems) is that we don't know the point at which the history changed.

[Mac Man]

Kevin, I would be careful asking intelligent questions. Based on the level of thought Marvel put into this decision, I don't think they'll be prepared to give you any other sort of response... aside from sending Mephisto after you to make you forget what you were asking.

[The Brain]

Below is a link from Comic Book Resources "One More Day" interview with

 

Joe Quesada. The link is part one of five parts, and may answer some of the

 

questions asked here.

 

 

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=12664

[Mac Man]

Thanks for pointing this article out Brain. My only concern is in JQ's turning aside that group of people who want a real Peter in favor of his fresh and new version that will grow crowds of new fans, he is essentially killing off a large percentage of his current crowd. Now, maybe I'm missing something here, but new people typically get spooked when many of the regulars suddenly up and leave.

 

It's late so maybe I'm over-simplifying this, but this just does not seem the way to go. If you want to keep Peter fresh and new... helllooooo Ultimate Spider-Man! Leave ASM the hell alone.

[piper]

[Fan4Fan]

The easiest way to drive away long-term readers is to undermine the stories in the comics they've read. It's another excuse to walk away. Taking what you have and telling a good story is always the way to keep your readership. Taking what you had and throwing it out the window isn't.

 

This also comes as no surprise from Mr. Quesada.

 

Back at the start of his boards (joequesada.com... off-line for several months now) and now lost to the sands of time, he and I frequently got into it about the importance of continuity and a character's history.

 

I said continuity and a character's history were an important part of what the character is today, and he was more for the 'Law and Order' (TV show) approach where any issue could be read in any order and it would not diminish the reader's enjoyment.

 

I believe I then said something about Marvel giving its readers something akin to DC's Silver Age... and it kind of went from there...

 

I wonder how this will impact the trade/hardcover collections of Spider-Man back issues since much of them apparently don't matter any more... and if this was even thought about.

 

 

[The Brain]

Below is a link from Comic Book Resources "One More Day" interview with

 

Joe Quesada. The link is part one of five parts, and may answer some of the

 

questions asked here.

 

 

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=12664

 

 

Part two is now 'on-line'. posted below is the link.

 

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=12673

 

 

[Catalyst Comics]

It appears to have went back around ASM #140ish or so.

 

 

Every story since ASM 259 is now potentially "different" or did not happen - actually - this appears to go back much further than ASM 259 - I would say it might go back as far as to the around the time just after Gwen's death when MJ and Peter began their first relationship as more than just friends - as evidenced by Flash and Harry being roommates still (and no Liz Allen or Norman Jr.).

 

I mentioned the death of the prehistoric butterfly - the removal of that element (Peter and MJ's love for one another) has caused all of the elements to move along in completely different patterns.

 

I don't think they (the Marvel writers and editors) have any idea whatsoever what doing that means - about what's in or what's out.

 

As a friend reminded me, Alan Moore said something along the lines that if you think those stories never happened - you are wrong, they are in your collection or on your shelf - you can read them anytime.

 

But the character that is currently appearing in ASM doesn't recall any of it the way it was presented. He doesn't have the history you recall that he had.

 

What Mephisto appears to have done is not change people's memories of what happened - he has seemingly altered the timeline. At a specific junction something did not happen and Peter and MJ did not reunite their love. Quesada has hit the reset button.

 

The only comparable situation would be the post-Crisis Man of Steel Superman, which went from telling a story of his early days to the present, and it took years for DC to fill in the blanks as to what happened to Superman between Man of Steel 6 and Superman Vol. 2 #1. Every so often they would do a recap showing the revised history of a pivotal event, such as his team-ups with the JLA.

 

Problem with this Spider-Man story (well, one of many problems) is that we don't know the point at which the history changed.

[Excelsior!-migration]

Below is a link from Comic Book Resources "One More Day" interview with

 

Joe Quesada. The link is part one of five parts, and may answer some of the

 

questions asked here.

 

 

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=12664

 

 

Part two is now 'on-line'. posted below is the link.

 

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=12673

 

 

I like how JQ says he and JMS really wanted to bring back Gwen, but were overruled. Well, we can at the very least hope Gwen doing the nasty with Norman Osborn is erased in this OMD storyline. And their children too.

[Fan4Fan]

Below is a link from Comic Book Resources "One More Day" interview with

 

Joe Quesada. The link is part one of five parts, and may answer some of the

 

questions asked here.

 

 

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=12664

 

 

Part two is now 'on-line'. posted below is the link.

 

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=12673

 

 

I like how JQ says he and JMS really wanted to bring back Gwen, but were overruled. Well, we can at the very least hope Gwen doing the nasty with Norman Osborn is erased in this OMD storyline. And their children too.

 

Well, it was Mephisto they made a deal with so you know that he's gonna be playing unfair... so, the kids will be some of the new villains taunting Spider-Man.

 

First, the daughter will pretend to be Gwen (remember the clock has rolled back to the 140-ish time or so), then the brother will show up and they'll get all Ultimate Quicksilver/Scarlet Witch with each other, and Marvel will go from there.

 

... I hope...

 

 

[Mac Man]

I just don't know how they can go back to 140 with everything else that has taken place AND how this will translate across the Marvel Universe. If it was a character like...Night Thrasher or Kangaroo, sure, what the heck. I just don't know how that's going to work out.

[Fan4Fan]

On the up side, we can now have a Spider-Girl/Spider-Man cross-over event because the continuity is so whacked that it won't make any difference!

 

[awe4one]

I just don't know how they can go back to 140 with everything else that has taken place AND how this will translate across the Marvel Universe. If it was a character like...Night Thrasher or Kangaroo, sure, what the heck. I just don't know how that's going to work out.

 

It doesn't matter as they'll just ignore any continuity problems as they occur. Maintaining continuity across the Marvel line has been non-existent for at least a decade...

 

Jim

[The Brain]

Below is a link from Comic Book Resources "One More Day" interview with

 

Joe Quesada. The link is part one of five parts, and may answer some of the

 

questions asked here.

 

 

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=12664

 

 

Part two is now 'on-line'. posted below is the link.

 

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=12673

 

 

The link below is part three of the "One More Day" interview.

 

If you have read parts 1 & 2 part 3 tell of what might have been a much more

 

'intense' change.

 

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=12681