A List of Unrestored Action 1's and their Owners

[Yannis]

That was a very good point made by James! a big book will need to be restored in order to be kept "alive". I mean how many years can a comic survive in a cgc case?

[adamstrange]

That was a very good point made by James! a big book will need to be restored in order to be kept "alive". I mean how many years can a comic survive in a cgc case?

 

Properly stored (stable, cool and dark) an untouched comic can likely last a couple hundred years. It's hard to tell precisely because the cheap pulp used in comics, is, from what I recall, a relatively recent invention. Rusty staples or acidic glues (usually from tape) are the two lurking dangers that would seem to be the hardest to keep from causing an earlier demise.

[Yannis]

So what is an estimated life span of a CGc book with white pages , for example? Does CGC have estimates on something like this?

[adamstrange]

So what is an estimated life span of a CGc book with white pages , for example? Does CGC have estimates on something like this?

 

Nope. You need to look up research on paper artifacts to get more detailed discussion of lifespans and those aren't going to include discussion of CGC holders which are relatively recent and not used in the museum/library setting.

[Aman619]

I dont have any scientific evidence at my disposal. But, there are many many white paged GA books around today that are now 70 years old. And Id say that most of these book sat unprotected in piles (no bags, no mylars, no acid free boards etc etc) for the first 40 of those years. So now that they sit comforably protected in mylars and slabs, rarely taken out into fresh air, why shouldn't they still be off white to white in 50 more years?

[tth2]

The whole preservation thing is so overblown, the product of neurotic collectors` fears being stoked by the archival products industry. As you and adam indicate, lots of books have survived in perfectly good shape for over 70 years now, and for most of those years didn`t have the benefit of any archival materials.

 

Yes, there are exceptions like the infamous mold-infected Action #1, where an external organic agent may be accelerating the destruction process. But otherwise, sure our comics will all eventually crumble into dust, but odds are none of us, even the teen-agers on these Boards, will be alive at the time to care.

[G.A.tor]

The whole preservation thing is so overblown, the product of neurotic collectors` fears being stoked by the archival products industry. As you and adam indicate, lots of books have survived in perfectly good shape for over 70 years now, and for most of those years didn`t have the benefit of any archival materials.

 

Yes, there are exceptions like the infamous mold-infected Action #1, where an external organic agent may be accelerating the destruction process. But otherwise, sure our comics will all eventually crumble into dust, but odds are none of us, even the teen-agers on these Boards, will be alive at the time to care.

(thumbs u

[spoonerism]

Part of the reason these books survived is that they were in stacks, with the air essentially pressed out of them, away from damaging light, and with the environment around them in which to release the acids generated in the papers.

 

Standing up in a bag, a book has more air between pages to accelerate the chemical processes, with the acids being produced trapped in the bag with the book.

 

A slab is designed to be better than a bag and board, but it suffers from a lot of the same problems.

 

Strangely enough, the fact that we've taken these books out of the environments in which they've lasted 70 years or so and begun to put them in the light, bag them, handle them, et cetera, has accelerated their demise.

 

And especially on books with rusting staples and tape or glue -- leave those alone and the book is toast sooner rather than later.

[spoonerism]

The whole preservation thing is so overblown, the product of neurotic collectors` fears being stoked by the archival products industry. As you and adam indicate, lots of books have survived in perfectly good shape for over 70 years now, and for most of those years didn`t have the benefit of any archival materials.

 

Yes, there are exceptions like the infamous mold-infected Action #1, where an external organic agent may be accelerating the destruction process. But otherwise, sure our comics will all eventually crumble into dust, but odds are none of us, even the teen-agers on these Boards, will be alive at the time to care.

(thumbs u

 

I don't know about you, but I want my toddler son to be able to enjoy my books. And maybe his kids, too. This attitude is kind of like the one that says we can ignore global warming or continue to rack up debt. "It's not my problem! Let someone else figure it out!"

 

Maybe that comes a little too close to talking politics, though.

[adamstrange]

A slab is designed to be better than a bag and board

 

This has not, to my knowledge, been proven. And there are a variety of methods to "bag and board" -- some of which may yield an environment (for better or worse) that is quite similar to a slab.

[G.A.tor]

A slab is designed to be better than a bag and board

 

This has not, to my knowledge, been proven. And there are a variety of methods to "bag and board" -- some of which may yield an environment (for better or worse) that is quite similar to a slab.

I kind of like the carey technique!

[ft88]

 

Yes, there are exceptions like the infamous mold-infected Action #1

 

As much as this board made fun of that Action #1, I sure would like to own it right now. Unrestored with a pretty decent cover. You know... decent other than the mold and large piece missing. If you relook at that book it is a really nice copy otherwise.

[G.A.tor]

 

Yes, there are exceptions like the infamous mold-infected Action #1

 

As much as this board made fun of that Action #1, I sure would like to own it right now. Unrestored with a pretty decent cover. You know... decent other than the mold and large piece missing. If you relook at that book it is a really nice copy otherwise.

I think that wa filter81's copy for a while

[adamstrange]

Part of the reason these books survived is that they were in stacks, with the air essentially pressed out of them, away from damaging light, and with the environment around them in which to release the acids generated in the papers.

 

Standing up in a bag, a book has more air between pages to accelerate the chemical processes, with the acids being produced trapped in the bag with the book.

 

A slab is designed to be better than a bag and board, but it suffers from a lot of the same problems.

 

Strangely enough, the fact that we've taken these books out of the environments in which they've lasted 70 years or so and begun to put them in the light, bag them, handle them, et cetera, has accelerated their demise.

 

And especially on books with rusting staples and tape or glue -- leave those alone and the book is toast sooner rather than later.

 

There are vastly more GA non-pedigree books than pedigree books and these are are likely stored in much better locations now than they used to be. To cite one example, the Davis Crippen books that stayed with Crippen are in much worse shape than books that were taken/stolen from him in the early 90s.

 

Efforts to store the books in a cool, dark, stable environment are always good and likely to result in many lifetimes of enjoyment. Additional protection is offered by buffered backing boards or the different types of off-gas absorbing papers. A tiny percentage of books with progressive conditions (rust, tape etc) are candidates for extraordinary preservation measures but beyond that I wouldn't recommend action. Your mileage may vary and, happily, will be much cheaper than it was a few months ago.

[adamstrange]

A slab is designed to be better than a bag and board

 

This has not, to my knowledge, been proven. And there are a variety of methods to "bag and board" -- some of which may yield an environment (for better or worse) that is quite similar to a slab.

I kind of like the carey technique!

 

Me too (thumbs u

 

Though it's too much work when you have a lot of little books.

[G.A.tor]

A slab is designed to be better than a bag and board

 

This has not, to my knowledge, been proven. And there are a variety of methods to "bag and board" -- some of which may yield an environment (for better or worse) that is quite similar to a slab.

I kind of like the carey technique!

 

Me too (thumbs u

 

Though it's too much work when you have a lot of little books.

hopefully in march, I can see these "lot of little books"

[adamstrange]

A slab is designed to be better than a bag and board

 

This has not, to my knowledge, been proven. And there are a variety of methods to "bag and board" -- some of which may yield an environment (for better or worse) that is quite similar to a slab.

I kind of like the carey technique!

 

Me too (thumbs u

 

Though it's too much work when you have a lot of little books.

hopefully in march, I can see these "lot of little books"

 

Should be able to work it out.

[Ogami]

Part of the reason these books survived is that they were in stacks, with the air essentially pressed out of them, away from damaging light, and with the environment around them in which to release the acids generated in the papers.

 

Standing up in a bag, a book has more air between pages to accelerate the chemical processes, with the acids being produced trapped in the bag with the book.

 

A slab is designed to be better than a bag and board, but it suffers from a lot of the same problems.

 

Strangely enough, the fact that we've taken these books out of the environments in which they've lasted 70 years or so and begun to put them in the light, bag them, handle them, et cetera, has accelerated their demise.

 

And especially on books with rusting staples and tape or glue -- leave those alone and the book is toast sooner rather than later.

 

has this been verified statistically significant that books do better in stacks, than standing up?

[Ze-man]

So if you owned a 2.5-3.5 Action 1 unrestored and it was a good candidate for restoration, would you do it?

 

For the sake of the hobby NO. Going around restoring low grade Action 1 is a VERY bad idea.

 

Why, if I may ask?

 

I'd want to conserve the book, but conservation measures are considered "restoration" by the purple-label police anyway, so I'd probably just go all the way and get it fully restored.

 

If I want to own an Action 1 that I am going to flip in a few years, then sure, keep it unrestored -- who cares if that means it'll continue to eat away at itself, right?

 

It seems to me that the more future-friendly action (so to speak) would be to get it cleaned, deacidified, tears sealed, staples cleaned, et cetera. So that the book will last for another 100 years.

 

It sucks that the market will punish you for that, but if you're in it for the long haul, then it doesn't matter.

 

 

very valid points, but not all 2.5 to 3.5 "need" conserving...some would last in their present state every bit as long as a restored copy... that said, I too am not opposed to conservation/restoration, when it makes sense (thumbs u

 

Interesting conversation.

 

I agree that just because a book is low to mid grade does not automaticaly qualifiy it for conso/resto because for the most part people are not handling the books in the manner that led them to their current condition. But if a book has a badly split spine, major tears or blown staples/centerfolds I dont see why repairing these things should ruin the value of the book, when in essence it is upgrading the overall quality without really adding anything foreign to it (like piecefill or CT)

 

Well, I do understand why it ruins the value in todays market I just happen to disagree with it.

 

Case in point, I bought this book from Dale Roberts, and paid a decent price for it because it was a really nice book aside from the obvious. And since I plan on keeping this book for the long haul, and the staple bothered me I worked on it.

 

Replaced the rusted staple with same issue vintage staples,dry/wet cleaned the cover. Fixed the rust migrated paper area and supported the first few wraps that had also deteriorated. Applied minor CT to the staple area and bottom corners.

 

So while the book is now restored (and for all intentional purposes the value ruined), it is in better condition then it was before with minimal work being done. Yes I could have just swapped out the staples to prevent further damage and left off the CT, but to me it is almost worse to see new looking staples sitting next to rusted paper then to go ahead do what needs to be done even though most will look at it as tainted goods even though I can now pick it up and read it without fear of popping the top staple.

 

Take a look (and I realize now the after scans I took before I found suitable replacement staples)

 

 

 

 

So regarding working on a 2.5 Action #1, I think as Rick said, it depends on the book, and what it will do to the value. Even if it actually helps preserve the book for future generations it will kill the value (at least short term) unless the work done can bring up the grade enough to make it worth doing present day.

[EastCoastExchange-migratio]

I hate comic restoration in general. Every kind of it. If someone sold me a book with replaced staples and didn't disclose it would be on. I swear to God no doubt about it.