Flipping, a mortal sin?

[RockMyAmadeus]

No one...not McMiles nor anyone else...is above having their positions challenged. Unless...could it be....is McMiles....a SACRED COW?

Oh good Lord, can we dial the drama down just a tad? MCMiles is nothing but a stand up guy and as far as I know there are no sacred cows on this message board. You can disagree with whomever you like. However, there are plenty of individuals who deserve respect... and MCMiles is one of them.

 

BTW... it's MCMiles. Only his buddies can call him McMiles.

 

Oh, relax. I was giving Jive grief, not MCMiles (my apologies for lazily not capitalizing the "C".) I was in no way attempting to disrespect MCMiles in any way.

I'll relax when you relax, oh Grand Pooh-bah of the Verbose.

 

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

 

That's because your points have ZERO merit. You have several successful comic sellers, with decades of combined experience, telling you your theories don't translate well into reality, and yet its them who are wrong?

 

Go home little boy. Its past your bed time.

 

1. Paying "9.6 GPA" or close to it, for a RAW book that a seller states is in 9.6 condition, and you think is in 9.6 (or better) condition, but comes back from CGC as a 9.2, or with missed resto, or has a flaw you both missed, is a great way to lose money. Potentially lots of it.

 

Go ahead. Disprove that. By all means.

 

Don't just sit there and act like an internet toughguy slinging 4th grade insults, Jive...disprove what I just said...if you can.

 

And here I thought you were one of the decent guys. Oops.

 

 

Again, you're going right up until the edge, but aren't daring to step over. I get that. You don't want to be the guy who pays a massive premium for a book and CGC doesn't agree with you. And you're right, its a huge gamble. So is submitting ANY book to CGC that has never been there (or heck, even some books that have), or dealing with someone through the mail you've never dealt with before, or any one of thousands of risks we as comic collectors have to face every day when dealing with top dollar books (slab damage, postal incompetence, bad packaging, some schmoe listing a comparable book on eBay at a BIN half of what you just paid, etc. etc.)

 

The point I'm making is that if you do buy and sell enough, you're skills and savy will be good enough to overcome the occasional blunder. There is nothing wrong with using GPA as a pricing mechanism on any book, raw or graded. Its the only "real-time" pricing source in the entire industry. But with anything, you have to use it judiciously, and only in certain in situations.

 

Have I used it to price raw books? Not as a seller, but certainly as a buyer. Its the best tool out there. And when it comes to Gold, Andy is 100% right. I've paid well over GPA on some books when raw, and to be honest, if I was selling a particularily tough book raw...I would quote GPA if it was the only pricing reference around with which to justify a premium asking price.

 

 

That's a much better answer than telling me to "go to bed little boy."

 

And I agree with you 100%.

 

But the exceptions still stand: buying from people you know and trust "at GPA" is different than buying from strangers, and rare, high grade books simply don't apply, because there's so little data to work with in the first place.

 

Both exceptions account for a FRACTION of the sales of comics in any given time period.

 

Consider the insult part of your initiation....you're only a Boardie once everyone has taken an unfair shot at you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[DrWatson]

Scenario #2 - Some dealers need a little time to setup. If a dealer tells you to come back in a 1/2 hour before you can look through the wall boxes or new stuff than you have to rely on the dealer to prevent another one from going before you. If the dealer jumps you while you are waiting than you probably need to say something to the seller on why he can look and you can't. Harley and I have fought over this one.

I would pay to see that.

 

Anyway, I like dealer passes so I can get in early and walk by other people waiting in line. I really don't care about being the first to look at any particular books. I enjoy helping set up and working behind the booth. It's the least I can do in exchange for the privileged. I really enjoy selling books more than digging through boxes. Don't get me wrong, I like to go looking for books to fill the holes in my runs and spend time with my friends, but I'm not trucking three long boxes of books back home to grade either.

 

If I feel that I haven't helped out enough, then I will typically buy a book or two from whomever got me the pass.

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

Is it still a risk? Yup.

 

And no one is disputing that. We're just saying the Law of Averages works in your favor if you know what you're doing.

 

I'm not disputing that, either.

 

It looks, then, like we're all in complete agreement. Why are we arguing?

 

 

I don't know about you, but all the explosions and gratuitous violence in Transformers 2 has made me orney tonight.

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

Scenario #2 - Some dealers need a little time to setup. If a dealer tells you to come back in a 1/2 hour before you can look through the wall boxes or new stuff than you have to rely on the dealer to prevent another one from going before you. If the dealer jumps you while you are waiting than you probably need to say something to the seller on why he can look and you can't. Harley and I have fought over this one.

I would pay to see that.

 

While my first instinct is to wager on Bob, Harley reminds me of Wan-Fu from Samurai Showdown. I'd half expect him to hurl a flaming curved sword at Bob if the two ever got into it...

[Comicopolis]

Is it still a risk? Yup.

 

And no one is disputing that. We're just saying the Law of Averages works in your favor if you know what you're doing.

 

I'm not disputing that, either.

 

It looks, then, like we're all in complete agreement. Why are we arguing?

 

 

I don't know about you, but all the explosions and gratuitous violence in Transformers 2 has made me orney tonight.

 

And how did the lovely Megan make you feel

[DrWatson]

Scenario #2 - Some dealers need a little time to setup. If a dealer tells you to come back in a 1/2 hour before you can look through the wall boxes or new stuff than you have to rely on the dealer to prevent another one from going before you. If the dealer jumps you while you are waiting than you probably need to say something to the seller on why he can look and you can't. Harley and I have fought over this one.

I would pay to see that.

 

While my first instinct is to wager on Bob, Harley reminds me of Wan-Fu from Samurai Showdown. I'd half expect him to hurly a flaming curved sword at Bob if the two ever got into it...

Don't let him fool you. Harley's a quick little guy. I've seen him go through Dale's boxes in record time.

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

Is it still a risk? Yup.

 

And no one is disputing that. We're just saying the Law of Averages works in your favor if you know what you're doing.

 

I'm not disputing that, either.

 

It looks, then, like we're all in complete agreement. Why are we arguing?

 

 

I don't know about you, but all the explosions and gratuitous violence in Transformers 2 has made me orney tonight.

 

And how did the lovely Megan make you feel

 

Old.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Is it still a risk? Yup.

 

And no one is disputing that. We're just saying the Law of Averages works in your favor if you know what you're doing.

 

I'm not disputing that, either.

 

It looks, then, like we're all in complete agreement. Why are we arguing?

 

 

I don't know about you, but all the explosions and gratuitous violence in Transformers 2 has made me orney tonight.

 

Wait, wait...'orney?

 

Or "ornery"....?

 

Cause Boozad might take offense at the former...

 

[ciorac]

 

That's because your points have ZERO merit. You have several successful comic sellers, with decades of combined experience, telling you your theories don't translate well into reality, and yet its them who are wrong?

 

Go home little boy. Its past your bed time.

 

1. Paying "9.6 GPA" or close to it, for a RAW book that a seller states is in 9.6 condition, and you think is in 9.6 (or better) condition, but comes back from CGC as a 9.2, or with missed resto, or has a flaw you both missed, is a great way to lose money. Potentially lots of it.

 

Go ahead. Disprove that. By all means.

 

Don't just sit there and act like an internet toughguy slinging 4th grade insults, Jive...disprove what I just said...if you can.

 

And here I thought you were one of the decent guys. Oops.

 

 

Again, you're going right up until the edge, but aren't daring to step over. I get that. You don't want to be the guy who pays a massive premium for a book and CGC doesn't agree with you. And you're right, its a huge gamble. So is submitting ANY book to CGC that has never been there (or heck, even some books that have), or dealing with someone through the mail you've never dealt with before, or any one of thousands of risks we as comic collectors have to face every day when dealing with top dollar books (slab damage, postal incompetence, bad packaging, some schmoe listing a comparable book on eBay at a BIN half of what you just paid, etc. etc.)

 

The point I'm making is that if you do buy and sell enough, you're skills and savy will be good enough to overcome the occasional blunder. There is nothing wrong with using GPA as a pricing mechanism on any book, raw or graded. Its the only "real-time" pricing source in the entire industry. But with anything, you have to use it judiciously, and only in certain in situations.

 

Have I used it to price raw books? Not as a seller, but certainly as a buyer. Its the best tool out there. And when it comes to Gold, Andy is 100% right. I've paid well over GPA on some books when raw, and to be honest, if I was selling a particularily tough book raw...I would quote GPA if it was the only pricing reference around with which to justify a premium asking price.

 

 

Words to live by. Jive was just elevated to sacred cow status in my book.

[RockMyAmadeus]

.....but we're not talking about rare books.....for rare books, the "rules"...such as they are....go out the window....

 

sigh....

[joeypost]

 

That's because your points have ZERO merit. You have several successful comic sellers, with decades of combined experience, telling you your theories don't translate well into reality, and yet its them who are wrong?

 

Go home little boy. Its past your bed time.

 

1. Paying "9.6 GPA" or close to it, for a RAW book that a seller states is in 9.6 condition, and you think is in 9.6 (or better) condition, but comes back from CGC as a 9.2, or with missed resto, or has a flaw you both missed, is a great way to lose money. Potentially lots of it.

 

Go ahead. Disprove that. By all means.

 

Don't just sit there and act like an internet toughguy slinging 4th grade insults, Jive...disprove what I just said...if you can.

 

And here I thought you were one of the decent guys. Oops.

 

 

Again, you're going right up until the edge, but aren't daring to step over. I get that. You don't want to be the guy who pays a massive premium for a book and CGC doesn't agree with you. And you're right, its a huge gamble. So is submitting ANY book to CGC that has never been there (or heck, even some books that have), or dealing with someone through the mail you've never dealt with before, or any one of thousands of risks we as comic collectors have to face every day when dealing with top dollar books (slab damage, postal incompetence, bad packaging, some schmoe listing a comparable book on eBay at a BIN half of what you just paid, etc. etc.)

 

The point I'm making is that if you do buy and sell enough, you're skills and savy will be good enough to overcome the occasional blunder. There is nothing wrong with using GPA as a pricing mechanism on any book, raw or graded. Its the only "real-time" pricing source in the entire industry. But with anything, you have to use it judiciously, and only in certain in situations.

 

Have I used it to price raw books? Not as a seller, but certainly as a buyer. Its the best tool out there. And when it comes to Gold, Andy is 100% right. I've paid well over GPA on some books when raw, and to be honest, if I was selling a particularily tough book raw...I would quote GPA if it was the only pricing reference around with which to justify a premium asking price.

 

 

That's a much better answer than telling me to "go to bed little boy."

 

And I agree with you 100%.

 

But the exceptions still stand: buying from people you know and trust "at GPA" is different than buying from strangers, and rare, high grade books simply don't apply, because there's so little data to work with in the first place.

 

Both exceptions account for a FRACTION of the sales of comics in any given time period.

 

I very rarely buy from strangers. Most of my purchases now are at the shows and from dealers I know, or dealers who have other dealers vouche for them.

[DrWatson]

 

That's because your points have ZERO merit. You have several successful comic sellers, with decades of combined experience, telling you your theories don't translate well into reality, and yet its them who are wrong?

 

Go home little boy. Its past your bed time.

 

1. Paying "9.6 GPA" or close to it, for a RAW book that a seller states is in 9.6 condition, and you think is in 9.6 (or better) condition, but comes back from CGC as a 9.2, or with missed resto, or has a flaw you both missed, is a great way to lose money. Potentially lots of it.

 

Go ahead. Disprove that. By all means.

 

Don't just sit there and act like an internet toughguy slinging 4th grade insults, Jive...disprove what I just said...if you can.

 

And here I thought you were one of the decent guys. Oops.

 

 

Again, you're going right up until the edge, but aren't daring to step over. I get that. You don't want to be the guy who pays a massive premium for a book and CGC doesn't agree with you. And you're right, its a huge gamble. So is submitting ANY book to CGC that has never been there (or heck, even some books that have), or dealing with someone through the mail you've never dealt with before, or any one of thousands of risks we as comic collectors have to face every day when dealing with top dollar books (slab damage, postal incompetence, bad packaging, some schmoe listing a comparable book on eBay at a BIN half of what you just paid, etc. etc.)

 

The point I'm making is that if you do buy and sell enough, you're skills and savy will be good enough to overcome the occasional blunder. There is nothing wrong with using GPA as a pricing mechanism on any book, raw or graded. Its the only "real-time" pricing source in the entire industry. But with anything, you have to use it judiciously, and only in certain in situations.

 

Have I used it to price raw books? Not as a seller, but certainly as a buyer. Its the best tool out there. And when it comes to Gold, Andy is 100% right. I've paid well over GPA on some books when raw, and to be honest, if I was selling a particularily tough book raw...I would quote GPA if it was the only pricing reference around with which to justify a premium asking price.

 

 

Words to live by. Jive was just elevated to sacred cow status in my book.

There are no sacred cows, cio@rac

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

 

That's because your points have ZERO merit. You have several successful comic sellers, with decades of combined experience, telling you your theories don't translate well into reality, and yet its them who are wrong?

 

Go home little boy. Its past your bed time.

 

1. Paying "9.6 GPA" or close to it, for a RAW book that a seller states is in 9.6 condition, and you think is in 9.6 (or better) condition, but comes back from CGC as a 9.2, or with missed resto, or has a flaw you both missed, is a great way to lose money. Potentially lots of it.

 

Go ahead. Disprove that. By all means.

 

Don't just sit there and act like an internet toughguy slinging 4th grade insults, Jive...disprove what I just said...if you can.

 

And here I thought you were one of the decent guys. Oops.

 

 

Again, you're going right up until the edge, but aren't daring to step over. I get that. You don't want to be the guy who pays a massive premium for a book and CGC doesn't agree with you. And you're right, its a huge gamble. So is submitting ANY book to CGC that has never been there (or heck, even some books that have), or dealing with someone through the mail you've never dealt with before, or any one of thousands of risks we as comic collectors have to face every day when dealing with top dollar books (slab damage, postal incompetence, bad packaging, some schmoe listing a comparable book on eBay at a BIN half of what you just paid, etc. etc.)

 

The point I'm making is that if you do buy and sell enough, you're skills and savy will be good enough to overcome the occasional blunder. There is nothing wrong with using GPA as a pricing mechanism on any book, raw or graded. Its the only "real-time" pricing source in the entire industry. But with anything, you have to use it judiciously, and only in certain in situations.

 

Have I used it to price raw books? Not as a seller, but certainly as a buyer. Its the best tool out there. And when it comes to Gold, Andy is 100% right. I've paid well over GPA on some books when raw, and to be honest, if I was selling a particularily tough book raw...I would quote GPA if it was the only pricing reference around with which to justify a premium asking price.

 

 

Words to live by. Jive was just elevated to sacred cow status in my book.

 

 

[RockMyAmadeus]

I very rarely buy from strangers. Most of my purchases now are at the shows and from dealers I know, or dealers who have other dealers vouche for them.

 

And...again...you're just one guy. You account for a fraction of the comic transactions taking place in a given time period.

 

I'm just not talking about INDIVIDUAL experiences, or what works for you personally. Believe it or not, there is a vast comic buying world that has never heard of the CGC message boards....

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

That's because your points have ZERO merit. You have several successful comic sellers, with decades of combined experience, telling you your theories don't translate well into reality, and yet its them who are wrong?

 

Go home little boy. Its past your bed time.

 

1. Paying "9.6 GPA" or close to it, for a RAW book that a seller states is in 9.6 condition, and you think is in 9.6 (or better) condition, but comes back from CGC as a 9.2, or with missed resto, or has a flaw you both missed, is a great way to lose money. Potentially lots of it.

 

Go ahead. Disprove that. By all means.

 

Don't just sit there and act like an internet toughguy slinging 4th grade insults, Jive...disprove what I just said...if you can.

 

And here I thought you were one of the decent guys. Oops.

 

 

Again, you're going right up until the edge, but aren't daring to step over. I get that. You don't want to be the guy who pays a massive premium for a book and CGC doesn't agree with you. And you're right, its a huge gamble. So is submitting ANY book to CGC that has never been there (or heck, even some books that have), or dealing with someone through the mail you've never dealt with before, or any one of thousands of risks we as comic collectors have to face every day when dealing with top dollar books (slab damage, postal incompetence, bad packaging, some schmoe listing a comparable book on eBay at a BIN half of what you just paid, etc. etc.)

 

The point I'm making is that if you do buy and sell enough, you're skills and savy will be good enough to overcome the occasional blunder. There is nothing wrong with using GPA as a pricing mechanism on any book, raw or graded. Its the only "real-time" pricing source in the entire industry. But with anything, you have to use it judiciously, and only in certain in situations.

 

Have I used it to price raw books? Not as a seller, but certainly as a buyer. Its the best tool out there. And when it comes to Gold, Andy is 100% right. I've paid well over GPA on some books when raw, and to be honest, if I was selling a particularily tough book raw...I would quote GPA if it was the only pricing reference around with which to justify a premium asking price.

 

 

Words to live by. Jive was just elevated to sacred cow status in my book.

 

 

 

there's no gold chain.

[DrWatson]

 

Words to live by. Jive was just elevated to sacred cow status in my book.

 

 

JiveBovineMoFo

[G.A.tor]

No one...not McMiles nor anyone else...is above having their positions challenged. Unless...could it be....is McMiles....a SACRED COW?

Oh good Lord, can we dial the drama down just a tad? MCMiles is nothing but a stand up guy and as far as I know there are no sacred cows on this message board. You can disagree with whomever you like. However, there are plenty of individuals who deserve respect... and MCMiles is one of them.

 

BTW... it's MCMiles. Only his buddies can call him McMiles.

and he loves it when folks call him that

I'm gonna start calling you Smokey.

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

I very rarely buy from strangers. Most of my purchases now are at the shows and from dealers I know, or dealers who have other dealers vouche for them.

 

And...again...you're just one guy. You account for a fraction of the comic transactions taking place in a given time period.

 

I'm just not talking about INDIVIDUAL experiences, or what works for you personally. Believe it or not, there is a vast comic buying world that has never heard of the CGC message boards....

 

Okay, but what exactly are you arguing here? With no further insults hurled your way, what specifically is the stance that you are taking (and please list your exceptions again and how they apply).

[RockMyAmadeus]

So, if I say I stepped in cow dung....I will finally be correct about something, eh...?