And people wonder why folks get a little bit peeved...

[seanfingh]

 

What's the proper coherent response to "you're a dirtbag"? Does Emily Post cover that?

 

A deep bend at the waist, followed by a curt "Yo Mama," is recommended by one noted etiquette expert.

 

I didn't tell them the expert was you.

 

 

PS: (thumbs u

 

 

[Domo Arigato]

Restoration does not return a book to its original state. It only brings the appearance of the original state. Restoration brings a change in mass(as with adding pieces or trimming), or a change in the chemical composition of the book(adding pieces or color, or chemical cleaning). Pressing does neither of these things. Pressing can, in fact, bring a book to (or nearer to) its original state.

Nope, this is what restoration is. Restoration is treatment intended to return a comic book to a known or assumed state by adding non-original material. Detected restoration is always disclosed on the CGC certification label. Non-additive procedures, such as pressing, dry cleaning and tape removal, are not classified as restoration by CGC. Trimmed books are given an apparent grade, and, in accordance with CGC's policy, are encapsulated with CGC's restored label. Learn more about comic book restoration. Pressing is simply a flattening process. Doesn't do anything else.

 

This is the kind of mis-information that gets repeated over and over until people actually start believing it's true. And it's really starting to me off.

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp.

 

In controlled environments, conservators sometimes use humidification to flatten works. However, the method by which it occurs and on what kinds of paper are both very broad factors that are considered. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

-- Paper Conservator - Conservation Division - U.S. Library of Congress

 

 

 

This is from Classic Inc website...

 

We strive to make sure every technique is safe for the short and long term. Our pressing process does not involve disassembly, nor do we use abrasive materials like chemicals, or perform any work that would constitute restoration. No excessive pressure or heat is used in our work. You will not receive comics that appear to be "pancaked," or any other unfortunate side effect that usually occurs with improper pressing. The end result is undetectable, with each comic exhibiting a fresh, untouched feel and look.

 

 

Beyond this, a comic which is pressed properly and stored under proper conservation conditions(climate control and archival materials) will last practically forever.

Comics were stored in the 1930s and 1940s and even up into the 1950s with no climate control, no mylar, no care at all, and sometimes subjected to conditions which would never happen today and yet, they survived.

Argue this mis-information all you want, Dale...but you do NOT know more about paper preservation than the U.S. Library of Congress. A comic that has been properly pressed has still suffered some damage. An increase in heat or the addition of moisture can each individually accelerate paper aging and discoloration.

[Domo Arigato]

Restoration does not return a book to its original state. It only brings the appearance of the original state. Restoration brings a change in mass(as with adding pieces or trimming), or a change in the chemical composition of the book(adding pieces or color, or chemical cleaning). Pressing does neither of these things. Pressing can, in fact, bring a book to (or nearer to) its original state.

Nope, this is what restoration is. Restoration is treatment intended to return a comic book to a known or assumed state by adding non-original material. Detected restoration is always disclosed on the CGC certification label. Non-additive procedures, such as pressing, dry cleaning and tape removal, are not classified as restoration by CGC. Trimmed books are given an apparent grade, and, in accordance with CGC's policy, are encapsulated with CGC's restored label. Learn more about comic book restoration. Pressing is simply a flattening process. Doesn't do anything else.

 

This is the kind of mis-information that gets repeated over and over until people actually start believing it's true. And it's really starting to me off.

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp.

 

In controlled environments, conservators sometimes use humidification to flatten works. However, the method by which it occurs and on what kinds of paper are both very broad factors that are considered. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

-- Paper Conservator - Conservation Division - U.S. Library of Congress

 

This is from Classic Inc website...

 

We strive to make sure every technique is safe for the short and long term. Our pressing process does not involve disassembly, nor do we use abrasive materials like chemicals, or perform any work that would constitute restoration. No excessive pressure or heat is used in our work. You will not receive comics that appear to be "pancaked," or any other unfortunate side effect that usually occurs with improper pressing. The end result is undetectable, with each comic exhibiting a fresh, untouched feel and look.

Yes...that is a quote from a website that presses comic books for profit. The fact is...they do use heat and pressure...and I believe they also use moisture (water) if needed. And simply because a book does not appear to be "pancaked"...does not mean that it hasn't suffered any damage.

 

The U.S. Library of Congress (someone who doesn't press comics for profit) clearly stated:

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

 

I believe Classics Inc covers that......Try reading the entire post this time.

I did read the entire post. It doesn't take an "improper pressing" to do the damage. You are wrong. And the U.S. Library of Congress agrees with me.

[nearmint]

Restoration does not return a book to its original state. It only brings the appearance of the original state. Restoration brings a change in mass(as with adding pieces or trimming), or a change in the chemical composition of the book(adding pieces or color, or chemical cleaning). Pressing does neither of these things. Pressing can, in fact, bring a book to (or nearer to) its original state.

Nope, this is what restoration is. Restoration is treatment intended to return a comic book to a known or assumed state by adding non-original material. Detected restoration is always disclosed on the CGC certification label. Non-additive procedures, such as pressing, dry cleaning and tape removal, are not classified as restoration by CGC. Trimmed books are given an apparent grade, and, in accordance with CGC's policy, are encapsulated with CGC's restored label. Learn more about comic book restoration. Pressing is simply a flattening process. Doesn't do anything else.

 

This is the kind of mis-information that gets repeated over and over until people actually start believing it's true. And it's really starting to me off.

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp.

 

In controlled environments, conservators sometimes use humidification to flatten works. However, the method by which it occurs and on what kinds of paper are both very broad factors that are considered. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

-- Paper Conservator - Conservation Division - U.S. Library of Congress

 

This is from Classic Inc website...

 

We strive to make sure every technique is safe for the short and long term. Our pressing process does not involve disassembly, nor do we use abrasive materials like chemicals, or perform any work that would constitute restoration. No excessive pressure or heat is used in our work. You will not receive comics that appear to be "pancaked," or any other unfortunate side effect that usually occurs with improper pressing. The end result is undetectable, with each comic exhibiting a fresh, untouched feel and look.

Yes...that is a quote from a website that presses comic books for profit. The fact is...they do use heat and pressure...and I believe they also use moisture (water) if needed. And simply because a book does not appear to be "pancaked"...does not mean that it hasn't suffered any damage.

 

The U.S. Library of Congress (someone who doesn't press comics for profit) clearly stated:

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

 

I think increased heat would have to be defined, and compared to what, if any, heat is actually used for this argument to have any merit. Also, the paragraph you quote here talks about the perils of introducing moisture, but doesn't the very next paragraph in the full quote you posted earlier talk about conservators sometimes adding humidifiation to flatten works?

[MrBedrock]

PS: (thumbs u

 

We should start a posse.

[joeypost]

Restoration does not return a book to its original state. It only brings the appearance of the original state. Restoration brings a change in mass(as with adding pieces or trimming), or a change in the chemical composition of the book(adding pieces or color, or chemical cleaning). Pressing does neither of these things. Pressing can, in fact, bring a book to (or nearer to) its original state.

Nope, this is what restoration is. Restoration is treatment intended to return a comic book to a known or assumed state by adding non-original material. Detected restoration is always disclosed on the CGC certification label. Non-additive procedures, such as pressing, dry cleaning and tape removal, are not classified as restoration by CGC. Trimmed books are given an apparent grade, and, in accordance with CGC's policy, are encapsulated with CGC's restored label. Learn more about comic book restoration. Pressing is simply a flattening process. Doesn't do anything else.

 

This is the kind of mis-information that gets repeated over and over until people actually start believing it's true. And it's really starting to me off.

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp.

 

In controlled environments, conservators sometimes use humidification to flatten works. However, the method by which it occurs and on what kinds of paper are both very broad factors that are considered. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

-- Paper Conservator - Conservation Division - U.S. Library of Congress

 

 

 

This is from Classic Inc website...

 

We strive to make sure every technique is safe for the short and long term. Our pressing process does not involve disassembly, nor do we use abrasive materials like chemicals, or perform any work that would constitute restoration. No excessive pressure or heat is used in our work. You will not receive comics that appear to be "pancaked," or any other unfortunate side effect that usually occurs with improper pressing. The end result is undetectable, with each comic exhibiting a fresh, untouched feel and look.

 

 

Beyond this, a comic which is pressed properly and stored under proper conservation conditions(climate control and archival materials) will last practically forever.

Comics were stored in the 1930s and 1940s and even up into the 1950s with no climate control, no mylar, no care at all, and sometimes subjected to conditions which would never happen today and yet, they survived.

Argue this mis-information all you want, Dale...but you do NOT know more about paper preservation than the U.S. Library of Congress. A comic that has been properly pressed has still suffered some damage. An increase in heat or the addition of moisture can each individually accelerate paper aging and discoloration.

 

Ok, you win. The book will degrade in 480 years compared to 525.

[awe4one]

You are only going to see it the way you want to Jim, but your statement here is wrong. Even if there is some truth to it, do you really want to get in to a "they started it" pizzing match? As suspected, disclosure was never enough, and now the fact that pressing isn't going away has frustrated at least one person to the point of throwing out insults at a whole group of people. Arex started this thread based on one jerk's out of the blue comment. The same jerk has even come forward and said it again in this thread, and has stated that he will continue to be outspoken about it. You all should feel free to say anything negative about pressing "practice" you would like, but there is no reason to throw out blanket statements about pressers/pro-pressers - about people you don't even know. It's directly disrespectful, and yes, I'll take it personal.

 

Disclosure is enough. I've never said otheriwse, and apprecaite, those that do and bought from a number of them.

 

It's such a hot-button topic though, and I'm not sure the pressing crowd appreciates this, that some poeple will demoan anyone who sells pressed comics. It's going to happen and there nothing you can do. If you're comfortable with the practice then the criticism shouldn't hurt...if not then I can see where you'd have a problem...

 

Jim

 

It doesn't, never has. I've even always openly listened to the otherside of the debate.

 

I don't have a problem with critcism. I have a problem with disrespect.

 

I agree but then again you're engage in a practice that some in the collecting community fiercely dislikes. If you decide to go that way then you might as well expect some pushback.

 

If the feedback is personally directed at you then by all means kick their aZZZ, if not then take it as feedback and respond in kind coherently...

 

Jim

 

What's the proper coherent response to "you're a dirtbag"? Does Emily Post cover that?

 

"No I'm not and this is why...."

 

If the attack continues then have fun...

 

What's occurring is a contest and not a discussion...and I'm as guilty as anyone for engaging in them.

 

Jim

 

 

[Domo Arigato]

Restoration does not return a book to its original state. It only brings the appearance of the original state. Restoration brings a change in mass(as with adding pieces or trimming), or a change in the chemical composition of the book(adding pieces or color, or chemical cleaning). Pressing does neither of these things. Pressing can, in fact, bring a book to (or nearer to) its original state.

Nope, this is what restoration is. Restoration is treatment intended to return a comic book to a known or assumed state by adding non-original material. Detected restoration is always disclosed on the CGC certification label. Non-additive procedures, such as pressing, dry cleaning and tape removal, are not classified as restoration by CGC. Trimmed books are given an apparent grade, and, in accordance with CGC's policy, are encapsulated with CGC's restored label. Learn more about comic book restoration. Pressing is simply a flattening process. Doesn't do anything else.

 

This is the kind of mis-information that gets repeated over and over until people actually start believing it's true. And it's really starting to me off.

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp.

 

In controlled environments, conservators sometimes use humidification to flatten works. However, the method by which it occurs and on what kinds of paper are both very broad factors that are considered. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

-- Paper Conservator - Conservation Division - U.S. Library of Congress

 

This is from Classic Inc website...

 

We strive to make sure every technique is safe for the short and long term. Our pressing process does not involve disassembly, nor do we use abrasive materials like chemicals, or perform any work that would constitute restoration. No excessive pressure or heat is used in our work. You will not receive comics that appear to be "pancaked," or any other unfortunate side effect that usually occurs with improper pressing. The end result is undetectable, with each comic exhibiting a fresh, untouched feel and look.

Yes...that is a quote from a website that presses comic books for profit. The fact is...they do use heat and pressure...and I believe they also use moisture (water) if needed. And simply because a book does not appear to be "pancaked"...does not mean that it hasn't suffered any damage.

 

The U.S. Library of Congress (someone who doesn't press comics for profit) clearly stated:

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

I think increased heat would have to be defined, and compared to what, if any, heat is actually used for this argument to have any merit. Also, the paragraph you quote here talks about the perils of introducing moisture, but doesn't the very next paragraph in the full quote you posted earlier talk about conservators sometimes adding humidifiation to flatten works?

Yes they will introduce moisture...but only if it's necessary as you say to "flatten works". As FFB mentioned in that thread, the Decleration of Independence was stored for years rolled up in a tube. It would have to be pressed in order to lay flat for study and presentation. I don't think squeeking another .02 grade out of a comic book would qualify as their definition of necessary.

[Domo Arigato]

Restoration does not return a book to its original state. It only brings the appearance of the original state. Restoration brings a change in mass(as with adding pieces or trimming), or a change in the chemical composition of the book(adding pieces or color, or chemical cleaning). Pressing does neither of these things. Pressing can, in fact, bring a book to (or nearer to) its original state.

Nope, this is what restoration is. Restoration is treatment intended to return a comic book to a known or assumed state by adding non-original material. Detected restoration is always disclosed on the CGC certification label. Non-additive procedures, such as pressing, dry cleaning and tape removal, are not classified as restoration by CGC. Trimmed books are given an apparent grade, and, in accordance with CGC's policy, are encapsulated with CGC's restored label. Learn more about comic book restoration. Pressing is simply a flattening process. Doesn't do anything else.

 

This is the kind of mis-information that gets repeated over and over until people actually start believing it's true. And it's really starting to me off.

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp.

 

In controlled environments, conservators sometimes use humidification to flatten works. However, the method by which it occurs and on what kinds of paper are both very broad factors that are considered. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

-- Paper Conservator - Conservation Division - U.S. Library of Congress

 

 

 

This is from Classic Inc website...

 

We strive to make sure every technique is safe for the short and long term. Our pressing process does not involve disassembly, nor do we use abrasive materials like chemicals, or perform any work that would constitute restoration. No excessive pressure or heat is used in our work. You will not receive comics that appear to be "pancaked," or any other unfortunate side effect that usually occurs with improper pressing. The end result is undetectable, with each comic exhibiting a fresh, untouched feel and look.

 

 

Beyond this, a comic which is pressed properly and stored under proper conservation conditions(climate control and archival materials) will last practically forever.

Comics were stored in the 1930s and 1940s and even up into the 1950s with no climate control, no mylar, no care at all, and sometimes subjected to conditions which would never happen today and yet, they survived.

Argue this mis-information all you want, Dale...but you do NOT know more about paper preservation than the U.S. Library of Congress. A comic that has been properly pressed has still suffered some damage. An increase in heat or the addition of moisture can each individually accelerate paper aging and discoloration.

 

Ok, you win. The book will degrade in 480 years compared to 525.

Pressing sarcasm...when all else fails.

[buttock]

The LOC doesn't know much about the long-term effects of pressing. Nobody does. If you think you do, you're wrong. None of us have lived long enough to find out, and none of us will.

 

Their statement should be taken as "informed opinion" at best. And the information they're operating with is terrible. You can read all the discussions in the resto forum, I'm not going to re-hash it here.

 

Ya bunch of dirtbags.

[Dale Roberts]

Restoration does not return a book to its original state. It only brings the appearance of the original state. Restoration brings a change in mass(as with adding pieces or trimming), or a change in the chemical composition of the book(adding pieces or color, or chemical cleaning). Pressing does neither of these things. Pressing can, in fact, bring a book to (or nearer to) its original state.

Nope, this is what restoration is. Restoration is treatment intended to return a comic book to a known or assumed state by adding non-original material. Detected restoration is always disclosed on the CGC certification label. Non-additive procedures, such as pressing, dry cleaning and tape removal, are not classified as restoration by CGC. Trimmed books are given an apparent grade, and, in accordance with CGC's policy, are encapsulated with CGC's restored label. Learn more about comic book restoration. Pressing is simply a flattening process. Doesn't do anything else.

 

This is the kind of mis-information that gets repeated over and over until people actually start believing it's true. And it's really starting to me off.

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp.

 

In controlled environments, conservators sometimes use humidification to flatten works. However, the method by which it occurs and on what kinds of paper are both very broad factors that are considered. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

-- Paper Conservator - Conservation Division - U.S. Library of Congress

 

This is from Classic Inc website...

 

We strive to make sure every technique is safe for the short and long term. Our pressing process does not involve disassembly, nor do we use abrasive materials like chemicals, or perform any work that would constitute restoration. No excessive pressure or heat is used in our work. You will not receive comics that appear to be "pancaked," or any other unfortunate side effect that usually occurs with improper pressing. The end result is undetectable, with each comic exhibiting a fresh, untouched feel and look.

Yes...that is a quote from a website that presses comic books for profit. The fact is...they do use heat and pressure...and I believe they also use moisture (water) if needed. And simply because a book does not appear to be "pancaked"...does not mean that it hasn't suffered any damage.

 

The U.S. Library of Congress (someone who doesn't press comics for profit) clearly stated:

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

 

I think increased heat would have to be defined, and compared to what, if any, heat is actually used for this argument to have any merit. Also, the paragraph you quote here talks about the perils of introducing moisture, but doesn't the very next paragraph in the full quote you posted earlier talk about conservators sometimes adding humidifiation to flatten works?

 

Your post also contains the phrase, many studies have shown. That certainly excludes all studies. Does this mean that all scientists are not in complete agreement with this and all studies do not show the same results?

 

Certainly, NO ONE on earth would argue that there aren't certain levels of heat and moisture that would damage a comic. But that is addressed, when he says he does not use excessive heat or pressure. And I don't believe the process Matt uses involves moisture.

[Dale Roberts]

The LOC doesn't know much about the long-term effects of pressing. Nobody does. If you think you do, you're wrong. None of us have lived long enough to find out, and none of us will.

 

Their statement should be taken as "informed opinion" at best. And the information they're operating with is terrible. You can read all the discussions in the resto forum, I'm not going to re-hash it here.

 

Ya bunch of dirtbags.

 

 

I would certainly agree that the comics will outlive the people on this board and probably outlive the hobby itself.

[Dale Roberts]

good luck to both sides, I have other things to do today.

[Domo Arigato]

The love of the medium itself is now overshadowed by the love of the mediums condition.

 

The hobby is dying under its own weight.

 

No it's not...people that truly love the hobby are being vocal about what they are seeing in this hobby.

 

I love the hobby.

I think that pressing is not restoration.

I love the hobby too.

And I would somewhat agree that pressing does not seem to be a form of restoration.

According to the Library of Congress...it actually appears to be a minor form of destruction.

According to the Library of Congress there is a possibility of destruction.

The Library of Congress also recommends that older documents not be touched as oils from fingerprints could possibly be destructive.

I don't see a "possible" in this statement.

 

Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp."

[seanfingh]

Pressing sarcasm...when all else fails.

 

I understand your point about the sarcasm, but seriously. When I was a teenager I drove a '76 Monte Carlo with leather interior. I would buy comics and keep them in the back, go and play a couple hours of basketball and come back and the interior of that sumperson_without_enough_empathy would be about 160 degrees. I know I am not the only one.

 

And what about books that were stored in the South, West or Midwest without climate control? A lot of books have had a lot of heat applied to them. Isn't it possible that the purported damage is being overstated?

[joeypost]

Restoration does not return a book to its original state. It only brings the appearance of the original state. Restoration brings a change in mass(as with adding pieces or trimming), or a change in the chemical composition of the book(adding pieces or color, or chemical cleaning). Pressing does neither of these things. Pressing can, in fact, bring a book to (or nearer to) its original state.

Nope, this is what restoration is. Restoration is treatment intended to return a comic book to a known or assumed state by adding non-original material. Detected restoration is always disclosed on the CGC certification label. Non-additive procedures, such as pressing, dry cleaning and tape removal, are not classified as restoration by CGC. Trimmed books are given an apparent grade, and, in accordance with CGC's policy, are encapsulated with CGC's restored label. Learn more about comic book restoration. Pressing is simply a flattening process. Doesn't do anything else.

 

This is the kind of mis-information that gets repeated over and over until people actually start believing it's true. And it's really starting to me off.

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp.

 

In controlled environments, conservators sometimes use humidification to flatten works. However, the method by which it occurs and on what kinds of paper are both very broad factors that are considered. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

-- Paper Conservator - Conservation Division - U.S. Library of Congress

 

 

 

This is from Classic Inc website...

 

We strive to make sure every technique is safe for the short and long term. Our pressing process does not involve disassembly, nor do we use abrasive materials like chemicals, or perform any work that would constitute restoration. No excessive pressure or heat is used in our work. You will not receive comics that appear to be "pancaked," or any other unfortunate side effect that usually occurs with improper pressing. The end result is undetectable, with each comic exhibiting a fresh, untouched feel and look.

 

 

Beyond this, a comic which is pressed properly and stored under proper conservation conditions(climate control and archival materials) will last practically forever.

Comics were stored in the 1930s and 1940s and even up into the 1950s with no climate control, no mylar, no care at all, and sometimes subjected to conditions which would never happen today and yet, they survived.

Argue this mis-information all you want, Dale...but you do NOT know more about paper preservation than the U.S. Library of Congress. A comic that has been properly pressed has still suffered some damage. An increase in heat or the addition of moisture can each individually accelerate paper aging and discoloration.

 

Ok, you win. The book will degrade in 480 years compared to 525.

Pressing sarcasm...when all else fails.

 

How do you know I was being sarcastic?

[comix4fun]

Pressing sarcasm...when all else fails.

 

I understand your point about the sarcasm, but seriously. When I was a teenager I drove a '76 Monte Carlo with leather interior. I would buy comics and keep them in the back, go and play a couple hours of basketball and come back and the interior of that sumperson_without_enough_empathy would be about 160 degrees. I know I am not the only one.

 

 

 

Wrong-o!!!

 

You are the only one. I did exactly the same thing, but it was in a 1972 Olds Delta 88.

 

No one I know would be caught dead in the 76 Monte Carlo, that year smelled of Elderberries, and it's interior as made of hamster.

 

 

[t3quila]

Can we just say those who love pressing have made money from it, and those that don't refuse to make money from it?

[Domo Arigato]

Restoration does not return a book to its original state. It only brings the appearance of the original state. Restoration brings a change in mass(as with adding pieces or trimming), or a change in the chemical composition of the book(adding pieces or color, or chemical cleaning). Pressing does neither of these things. Pressing can, in fact, bring a book to (or nearer to) its original state.

Nope, this is what restoration is. Restoration is treatment intended to return a comic book to a known or assumed state by adding non-original material. Detected restoration is always disclosed on the CGC certification label. Non-additive procedures, such as pressing, dry cleaning and tape removal, are not classified as restoration by CGC. Trimmed books are given an apparent grade, and, in accordance with CGC's policy, are encapsulated with CGC's restored label. Learn more about comic book restoration. Pressing is simply a flattening process. Doesn't do anything else.

 

This is the kind of mis-information that gets repeated over and over until people actually start believing it's true. And it's really starting to me off.

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp.

 

In controlled environments, conservators sometimes use humidification to flatten works. However, the method by which it occurs and on what kinds of paper are both very broad factors that are considered. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

-- Paper Conservator - Conservation Division - U.S. Library of Congress

 

This is from Classic Inc website...

 

We strive to make sure every technique is safe for the short and long term. Our pressing process does not involve disassembly, nor do we use abrasive materials like chemicals, or perform any work that would constitute restoration. No excessive pressure or heat is used in our work. You will not receive comics that appear to be "pancaked," or any other unfortunate side effect that usually occurs with improper pressing. The end result is undetectable, with each comic exhibiting a fresh, untouched feel and look.

Yes...that is a quote from a website that presses comic books for profit. The fact is...they do use heat and pressure...and I believe they also use moisture (water) if needed. And simply because a book does not appear to be "pancaked"...does not mean that it hasn't suffered any damage.

 

The U.S. Library of Congress (someone who doesn't press comics for profit) clearly stated:

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

 

I think increased heat would have to be defined, and compared to what, if any, heat is actually used for this argument to have any merit. Also, the paragraph you quote here talks about the perils of introducing moisture, but doesn't the very next paragraph in the full quote you posted earlier talk about conservators sometimes adding humidifiation to flatten works?

 

Your post also contains the phrase, many studies have shown. That certainly excludes all studies. Does this mean that all scientists are not in complete agreement with this and all studies do not show the same results?

 

Certainly, NO ONE on earth would argue that there aren't certain levels of heat and moisture that would damage a comic. But that is addressed, when he says he does not use excessive heat or pressure. And I don't believe the process Matt uses involves moisture.

I would tend to trust the studies that the U.S. Library of Congress relies upon more than I would the ones that a commercial presser relies upon. And the question was posed to the Libary of Congress in the proper context. I seriously doubt if their conservators are stupid. They would fully realize the heat and pressure a paper product would go through by someone trying to improve it's appearance while trying to minimizing the damage being done to it.

 

That takes care of the heat part...now can someone verify that Matt never uses moisture when he's pressing a comic?

[Domo Arigato]

Restoration does not return a book to its original state. It only brings the appearance of the original state. Restoration brings a change in mass(as with adding pieces or trimming), or a change in the chemical composition of the book(adding pieces or color, or chemical cleaning). Pressing does neither of these things. Pressing can, in fact, bring a book to (or nearer to) its original state.

Nope, this is what restoration is. Restoration is treatment intended to return a comic book to a known or assumed state by adding non-original material. Detected restoration is always disclosed on the CGC certification label. Non-additive procedures, such as pressing, dry cleaning and tape removal, are not classified as restoration by CGC. Trimmed books are given an apparent grade, and, in accordance with CGC's policy, are encapsulated with CGC's restored label. Learn more about comic book restoration. Pressing is simply a flattening process. Doesn't do anything else.

 

This is the kind of mis-information that gets repeated over and over until people actually start believing it's true. And it's really starting to me off.

 

"Using heat to reduce creases, wrinkles, or other planar distortions is not recommended by professional paper conservators. Many studies have shown that increased heat accelerates paper aging, especially papers made from groundwood pulp.

 

In controlled environments, conservators sometimes use humidification to flatten works. However, the method by which it occurs and on what kinds of paper are both very broad factors that are considered. Once any moisture is introduced into the paper sheet, any number of chemical reactions can begin. Many conservators elect to accept minor wrinkling and creasing as part of the artifact's history of use, rather then subject the work to what may begin or cause premature aging and discoloration."

 

-- Paper Conservator - Conservation Division - U.S. Library of Congress

 

 

 

This is from Classic Inc website...

 

We strive to make sure every technique is safe for the short and long term. Our pressing process does not involve disassembly, nor do we use abrasive materials like chemicals, or perform any work that would constitute restoration. No excessive pressure or heat is used in our work. You will not receive comics that appear to be "pancaked," or any other unfortunate side effect that usually occurs with improper pressing. The end result is undetectable, with each comic exhibiting a fresh, untouched feel and look.

 

 

Beyond this, a comic which is pressed properly and stored under proper conservation conditions(climate control and archival materials) will last practically forever.

Comics were stored in the 1930s and 1940s and even up into the 1950s with no climate control, no mylar, no care at all, and sometimes subjected to conditions which would never happen today and yet, they survived.

Argue this mis-information all you want, Dale...but you do NOT know more about paper preservation than the U.S. Library of Congress. A comic that has been properly pressed has still suffered some damage. An increase in heat or the addition of moisture can each individually accelerate paper aging and discoloration.

 

Ok, you win. The book will degrade in 480 years compared to 525.

Pressing sarcasm...when all else fails.

 

How do you know I was being sarcastic?

If you weren't...please feel free to post links to the studies you used to arrive at your figures.