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Moderns that are heating up on ebay!
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Started by thirdgreenham,

63,832 posts in this topic

GeeksAreMyPeeps

GeeksAreMyPeeps

Posted
Posted
Its just not that far of a stretch from MOS 17 to Web 18. Its just not for me. I can understand other taking the other side, but when you read Web 18 and then they introduce Venom(Later) how many of you didn't go back and look at Web 18.

 

Why? Everyone knows the answer even haters. I get the disagreement there just isn't enough evidence for me to come over to that side. I have enjoyed the back and forth.

 

 

Again the big difference is in MOS 17, there's really no arguing that those were not Doomsday fists. However, in Web 18, those hands are just too ordinary looking and there's no other supporting evidence that they belong to Eddie Brock / Venom. I know what you mean that it would make sense that they should belong to Venom, but what's stopping a writer from making a new villain tomorrow that knows Spider-Man's secret identity and can evade his spider sense? If that writer decides to reference back to Web 18 stating that this character has always been stalking or trying to kill him, that will throw a wrench to all the folks that bought the book thinking it was Venom. I'm not saying its not Eddie's Brocks hands nor can anyone officially say it belongs to him. It's just too vague to be considered a key.

 

Start listing to this at about 25:40:

 

https://superiorspidertalk.com/spider-talk-and-their-amazing-friends-w-david-michelinie/

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Escaflown4

Escaflown4

Posted
Posted (edited)
Its just not that far of a stretch from MOS 17 to Web 18. Its just not for me. I can understand other taking the other side, but when you read Web 18 and then they introduce Venom(Later) how many of you didn't go back and look at Web 18.

 

Why? Everyone knows the answer even haters. I get the disagreement there just isn't enough evidence for me to come over to that side. I have enjoyed the back and forth.

 

 

Again the big difference is in MOS 17, there's really no arguing that those were not Doomsday fists. However, in Web 18, those hands are just too ordinary looking and there's no other supporting evidence that they belong to Eddie Brock / Venom. I know what you mean that it would make sense that they should belong to Venom, but what's stopping a writer from making a new villain tomorrow that knows Spider-Man's secret identity and can evade his spider sense? If that writer decides to reference back to Web 18 stating that this character has always been stalking or trying to kill him, that will throw a wrench to all the folks that bought the book thinking it was Venom. I'm not saying its not Eddie's Brocks hands nor can anyone officially say it belongs to him. It's just too vague to be considered a key.

 

Start listing to this at about 25:40:

 

https://superiorspidertalk.com/spider-talk-and-their-amazing-friends-w-david-michelinie/

 

Thanks, so this podcast pretty much confirms that Eddie Brock / Venom was not even created yet when Web 18 was released. David Micheline was originally planning on creating a female villain which got nixed by the EIC. This literally goes back to what I have been saying all along, that hand is literally just a placeholder for a villain that has not materialized yet. This is my stance on why the book shouldn't be considered a key of any sort.

Edited by Escaflown4
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Lazyboy

Lazyboy

Posted
Posted
Its just not that far of a stretch from MOS 17 to Web 18. Its just not for me. I can understand other taking the other side, but when you read Web 18 and then they introduce Venom(Later) how many of you didn't go back and look at Web 18.

 

Why? Everyone knows the answer even haters. I get the disagreement there just isn't enough evidence for me to come over to that side. I have enjoyed the back and forth.

 

 

Again the big difference is in MOS 17, there's really no arguing that those were not Doomsday fists. However, in Web 18, those hands are just too ordinary looking and there's no other supporting evidence that they belong to Eddie Brock / Venom. I know what you mean that it would make sense that they should belong to Venom, but what's stopping a writer from making a new villain tomorrow that knows Spider-Man's secret identity and can evade his spider sense? If that writer decides to reference back to Web 18 stating that this character has always been stalking or trying to kill him, that will throw a wrench to all the folks that bought the book thinking it was Venom. I'm not saying its not Eddie's Brocks hands nor can anyone officially say it belongs to him. It's just too vague to be considered a key.

 

Start listing to this at about 25:40:

 

https://superiorspidertalk.com/spider-talk-and-their-amazing-friends-w-david-michelinie/

 

Thanks, so this podcast pretty much confirms that Eddie Brock / Venom was not even created yet when Web 18 was released. David Micheline was originally planning on creating a female villain which got nixed by the EIC. This literally goes back to what I have been saying all along, that hand is literally just a placeholder for a villain that has not materialized yet. This is my stance on why the book shouldn't be considered a key of any sort.

 

So you're saying that Eddie is the important part of Venom? Okay...

 

You know character designs get changed all the time, especially early in their existence (including before publication), right?

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Prince Namor

Prince Namor

Posted
Posted

"When I was switched over to Amazing, and Jim Salicrup wanted to do something special for 300, so I suggested this character I had started to develop and to tease in Web of Spider-man..."

 

So it IS Venom, or rather, at least, the alien symbiote, that David Michelinie is writing about in WOS 18... that WAS his plan... it just wasn't developed as a character that we would see in ASM.

 

Really, I could care less if it's considered a first appearance or not... it's NOT in my eyes.... but the intent to create a character called Venom was the basis for those scenes in WOS.

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MrWeen

MrWeen

Posted
Posted
If we're going with "behind the scenes" as being key, there's other appearances of Carnage before ASM 361

 

Well the cover to 361 is published in 360.

 

#359

 

Yea you might be right on that I was going by memory.

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Escaflown4

Escaflown4

Posted
Posted
Its just not that far of a stretch from MOS 17 to Web 18. Its just not for me. I can understand other taking the other side, but when you read Web 18 and then they introduce Venom(Later) how many of you didn't go back and look at Web 18.

 

Why? Everyone knows the answer even haters. I get the disagreement there just isn't enough evidence for me to come over to that side. I have enjoyed the back and forth.

 

 

Again the big difference is in MOS 17, there's really no arguing that those were not Doomsday fists. However, in Web 18, those hands are just too ordinary looking and there's no other supporting evidence that they belong to Eddie Brock / Venom. I know what you mean that it would make sense that they should belong to Venom, but what's stopping a writer from making a new villain tomorrow that knows Spider-Man's secret identity and can evade his spider sense? If that writer decides to reference back to Web 18 stating that this character has always been stalking or trying to kill him, that will throw a wrench to all the folks that bought the book thinking it was Venom. I'm not saying its not Eddie's Brocks hands nor can anyone officially say it belongs to him. It's just too vague to be considered a key.

 

Start listing to this at about 25:40:

 

https://superiorspidertalk.com/spider-talk-and-their-amazing-friends-w-david-michelinie/

 

Thanks, so this podcast pretty much confirms that Eddie Brock / Venom was not even created yet when Web 18 was released. David Micheline was originally planning on creating a female villain which got nixed by the EIC. This literally goes back to what I have been saying all along, that hand is literally just a placeholder for a villain that has not materialized yet. This is my stance on why the book shouldn't be considered a key of any sort.

 

So you're saying that Eddie is the important part of Venom? Okay...

 

You know character designs get changed all the time, especially early in their existence (including before publication), right?

 

 

Yes I understand that characters get changed all the time, but all we've been given in Web 18 is just a generic hand and "planning stages" behind the scenes by the creators. The character was still on the drawing board waiting to be designed. How is that supposed to be considered a key? So if I draw a random foot today in the latest issue of ASM kicking Spidey, but I don't refine and develop the character until four years later to tie it back to the foot, is this issue with the foot considered a key now? To me the concept seems a bit silly. To each its own, if folks are willing to spend good money on this book and call it a key, then by all means. To me, I will never consider it as one.

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ygogolak

ygogolak

Posted
Posted
Is there a reason why this book shot up this much? Apologies if it was already covered:

 

 

All-New X-Men #25 variant

 

100% cover driven

 

Actually, someone on google+ ordered one for $50.00, and when it arrived he almost tore the cover off taking out the book, and shared his self destroyed copy, creating a run up on the book that is slightly genuine, only because 1 copy is now........un-9.8'able.

 

 

No, that's not what happened at all.

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500Club

500Club

Posted
Posted
Really, I could care less if it's considered a first appearance or not... it's NOT in my eyes.... but the intent to create a character called Venom was the basis for those scenes in WOS.

This is how I see it.

 

I agree that the essence of what became Venom began in Web 18.

 

I also agree with those who feel that the event is minimally important.

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freecharlie

freecharlie

Posted
Posted

As far as moderns go, that Campbell Silk 3 variant is sold out all over my area. Can't find even a beat up one. I see a few BIN have sold, and an auction went for $112. Where does this go from here? I missed it at $40, should I wait and hope for a major drop in price?

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RockMyAmadeus

RockMyAmadeus

Posted
Posted
Really, I could care less if it's considered a first appearance or not... it's NOT in my eyes.... but the intent to create a character called Venom was the basis for those scenes in WOS.

This is how I see it.

 

I agree that the essence of what became Venom began in Web 18.

 

I also agree with those who feel that the event is minimally important.

 

Hey! I'm watching all of you! How DARE you have a discussion that isn't about "moderns heating up on eBay"?? It doesn't matter that it was an organic outgrowth of the topic, it's VERBOTEN!!! NEIN!!

 

Don't worry, the on-topic police will be by to notify the mods soon enough.

 

:whistle:

 

I'm kidding. Mostly. Well, ok, partly. Some element of my comment is kidding.

 

:D

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krighton

krighton

Posted
Posted
Was checking out ebay on power rangers 1 1:100, crazy

 

I saw someone looking for the Green ranger cover and thought that was a cool cover. I didn't know about these at all but I want them all now :pullhair:

 

Why get those when you can buy a few Web 18

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revat

revat

Posted
Posted
Was checking out ebay on power rangers 1 1:100, crazy

 

I saw someone looking for the Green ranger cover and thought that was a cool cover. I didn't know about these at all but I want them all now :pullhair:

 

Why get those when you can buy a few Web 18

 

i like to have all my bases covered. Who knows, maybe under the mask, Green Ranger is Venom.

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MrWeen

MrWeen

Posted
Posted
Its just not that far of a stretch from MOS 17 to Web 18. Its just not for me. I can understand other taking the other side, but when you read Web 18 and then they introduce Venom(Later) how many of you didn't go back and look at Web 18.

 

Why? Everyone knows the answer even haters. I get the disagreement there just isn't enough evidence for me to come over to that side. I have enjoyed the back and forth.

 

 

Again the big difference is in MOS 17, there's really no arguing that those were not Doomsday fists. However, in Web 18, those hands are just too ordinary looking and there's no other supporting evidence that they belong to Eddie Brock / Venom. I know what you mean that it would make sense that they should belong to Venom, but what's stopping a writer from making a new villain tomorrow that knows Spider-Man's secret identity and can evade his spider sense? If that writer decides to reference back to Web 18 stating that this character has always been stalking or trying to kill him, that will throw a wrench to all the folks that bought the book thinking it was Venom. I'm not saying its not Eddie's Brocks hands nor can anyone officially say it belongs to him. It's just too vague to be considered a key.

 

Start listing to this at about 25:40:

 

https://superiorspidertalk.com/spider-talk-and-their-amazing-friends-w-david-michelinie/

 

Thanks, so this podcast pretty much confirms that Eddie Brock / Venom was not even created yet when Web 18 was released. David Micheline was originally planning on creating a female villain which got nixed by the EIC. This literally goes back to what I have been saying all along, that hand is literally just a placeholder for a villain that has not materialized yet. This is my stance on why the book shouldn't be considered a key of any sort.

 

So you're saying that Eddie is the important part of Venom? Okay...

 

You know character designs get changed all the time, especially early in their existence (including before publication), right?

 

 

Yes I understand that characters get changed all the time, but all we've been given in Web 18 is just a generic hand and "planning stages" behind the scenes by the creators. The character was still on the drawing board waiting to be designed. How is that supposed to be considered a key? So if I draw a random foot today in the latest issue of ASM kicking Spidey, but I don't refine and develop the character until four years later to tie it back to the foot, is this issue with the foot considered a key now? To me the concept seems a bit silly. To each its own, if folks are willing to spend good money on this book and call it a key, then by all means. To me, I will never consider it as one.

 

are you overlooking 24 which shows clear character development?

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manetteska

manetteska

Posted
Posted
Was checking out ebay on power rangers 1 1:100, crazy

 

I saw someone looking for the Green ranger cover and thought that was a cool cover. I didn't know about these at all but I want them all now :pullhair:

 

Why get those when you can buy a few Web 18

 

i like to have all my bases covered. Who knows, maybe under the mask, Green Ranger is Venom.

 

Green = Hobgoblin underneath.

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