Most Overpriced/Undervalued Modern?

[N/A]

I know it has been said before, but Walking Dead 1 has got to be the most overvalued Modern, in my opinion.

 

Once this show runs it's course, it is due for a drop. Of course, if I am wrong...well then...

 

+1 ... there is a lot of Dead right now and i personally feel that it's hotter than it should be. I mean consider the census

 

Walking Dead 1 (grade, Unversal, Qualified, SS, Restored, Total)

Near Mint/Mint 9.8 257 1 58 0 316

Near Mint + 9.6 201 6 42 0 249

 

There are 300+ of these at CGC 9.8 ... sorry, but i can't justify $700+ bones (no pun intended) for that kind of market saturation.

 

Market saturation? You just went to a Comicon that had a 200 copy book and is considered rare but 300 is saturation?

 

Now now, don't get mad at me... i simply feel that with more than 300 9.8's on the market, it's hard for me to justify the price points. That's it. And almost 250 9.6's et al suggest that there is a lot of #1's to choose from ... and if we're talking sheer numbers (i.e. print run's), then yes, a book with only 200 copies (i assume your talking about the WD 94 B/W? No?) printed SHOULD be more valuable than one printed at 1000+. Of course, it all depends on POV... right?

 

 

 

Mad?

 

I just don't follow the logic. There is the 200 print run 94 B/W being considered rare and there are 316 #1 9.8 and you referred to it as market saturation. One is limited by print run while the other is limited by CGC encapsulation but there is still a limited quantity of each. One is a #1 while the other is a 94. Usually the #1 commands more money.

 

I think it's hitting a spike but I don't think it's hit the peak or will completely deflate. What other factors do you need to allow it to have staying power? What has kept Spider-man or Batman so valuable?

[MattP]

blah blah some numbers, more logic, etc ..etc ... blah

 

 

 

 

Mad?

 

I just don't follow the logic. There is the 200 print run 94 B/W being considered rare and there are 316 #1 9.8 and you referred to it as market saturation. One is limited by print run while the other is limited by CGC encapsulation but there is still a limited quantity of each. One is a #1 while the other is a 94. Usually the #1 commands more money.

 

I think it's hitting a spike but I don't think it's hit the peak or will completely deflate. What other factors do you need to allow it to have staying power? What has kept Spider-man or Batman so valuable?

 

I think my logic is (is this a pun?) if there were 316 Hulk 181's sitting at 9.8, do you believe that each would still command $12K+? I concede; i use the term 'saturation' to suggest that there are more than enough CGC 9.8's available to choose from. But you are correct, i should of suggested a better word ... Staying power is relative to the character, the age, condition ...blah blah (you know what i mean) for each of those 'types' of books. I completely agree with the #1's commanding mo' $$ though ... still want to sell me that Chew 24 9.8? ... please?

[valiantman]

 

 

plenty of 9.8's but not plenty of WD #1's.

 

How does this make any sense...?

 

I understood it to say, 'Don't buy Walking Dead #1 in CGC 9.8 when you can find a beater copy for $35 and still say, "YES! I have Walking Dead #1!"'

[N/A]

blah blah some numbers, more logic, etc ..etc ... blah

 

 

 

 

Mad?

 

I just don't follow the logic. There is the 200 print run 94 B/W being considered rare and there are 316 #1 9.8 and you referred to it as market saturation. One is limited by print run while the other is limited by CGC encapsulation but there is still a limited quantity of each. One is a #1 while the other is a 94. Usually the #1 commands more money.

 

I think it's hitting a spike but I don't think it's hit the peak or will completely deflate. What other factors do you need to allow it to have staying power? What has kept Spider-man or Batman so valuable?

 

I think my logic is (is this a pun?) if there were 316 Hulk 181's sitting at 9.8, do you believe that each would still command $12K+? I concede; i use the term 'saturation' to suggest that there are more than enough CGC 9.8's available to choose from. But you are correct, i should of suggested a better word ... Staying power is relative to the character, the age, condition ...blah blah (you know what i mean) for each of those 'types' of books. I completely agree with the #1's commanding mo' $$ though ... still want to sell me that Chew 24 9.8? ... please?

 

No worries. Did I show you my sketched Chew #1's?

[jjeanius]

I know it has been said before, but Walking Dead 1 has got to be the most overvalued Modern, in my opinion.

 

Once this show runs it's course, it is due for a drop. Of course, if I am wrong...well then...

 

+1 ... there is a lot of Dead right now and i personally feel that it's hotter than it should be. I mean consider the census

 

Walking Dead 1 (grade, Unversal, Qualified, SS, Restored, Total)

Near Mint/Mint 9.8 257 1 58 0 316

Near Mint + 9.6 201 6 42 0 249

 

There are 300+ of these at CGC 9.8 ... sorry, but i can't justify $700+ bones (no pun intended) for that kind of market saturation.

 

Market saturation? You just went to a Comicon that had a 200 copy book and is considered rare but 300 is saturation?

 

This seems like incredibly flawed logic to me. I don't care about either book, so I don't have a horse in the race, but the idea of comparing a book's entire print run to the number of encapsulated copies of another book at a specific grade seems a bit asinine. Are you assuming that each and every one of the 200 copies of WB 94 B&W are destined for CGC 9.8's...or are you saying that CGC 9.8's of WD1 are the only copies of WD1 that matter...? Heck, that's not even the complete population of 9.8 copies of WD1...just those that have been submitted to CGC. And what percentage of the 7000+ copies of WD1 have even been submitted?

 

Like I said, I have less than zero interest in collecting Walking Dead, so these particular books make no difference to me...but I just find no logic in this argument.

[MattP]

"No worries. Did I show you my sketched Chew #1's?"

 

 

You most certainly did not ...

[N/A]

The logic is the collectibles market vs the readers market. I don't think the readers of WD care about #1 CGC 9.8's or 94 B/W variants.

 

Of the collectors there is an obvious focus on high grades. The vast majority of collectors I deal with want nothing to do with a 9.6. It must be 9.8.

 

Now comparing #1 CGC 9.8's to a 200 print run isn't a complete apples to apples but there is a similarity in the supply side of the equation. 300 of one and 200 of the other.

 

The demand side is driven by collectors and speculators. Which is more desired?

 

There are a multitude of asinine comparisons in this thread but this is certainly not one of them.

[N/A]

"No worries. Did I show you my sketched Chew #1's?"

 

 

You most certainly did not ...

 

I need to unpack my camera and post in the Chew thread.

 

My apologies for this thread. I don't know why there isn't more discussion about Adventure Time. I assume most will grab a few Sagas in a couple weeks.

[jjeanius]

Hate to break it to you, but plenty of people collect unslabbed comics. Plenty of collectors don't need someone else to tell them the grade of their book to feel good about it. Comic collecting as a hobby survived for decades prior to CGC...unless you are implying that CGC invented "comic collecting"...?

 

Last time I checked, comics are exclusively sold in comic book stores...where comic books are marketed, first and foremost, as a collectible. The idea that all but 300 CGC 9.8 copies are in the hands of "readers" and not "collectors" is (wait for it, wait for it) ASININE.

 

If they were only READERS they wouldn't pay up to $500 for unslabbed "NM" copies of WD 1. First of all, they wouldn't care about grade. Secondly, if reading is the only goal, they would just buy a TPB and save their money.

 

The people you describe are collecting slabs, and a number on a label. They are NOT collecting comics. Comics can be read.

[USArmyParatrooper]

The logic is the collectibles market vs the readers market. I don't think the readers of WD care about #1 CGC 9.8's or 94 B/W variants.

 

Of the collectors there is an obvious focus on high grades. The vast majority of collectors I deal with want nothing to do with a 9.6. It must be 9.8.

 

Now comparing #1 CGC 9.8's to a 200 print run isn't a complete apples to apples but there is a similarity in the supply side of the equation. 300 of one and 200 of the other.

 

The demand side is driven by collectors and speculators. Which is more desired?

 

There are a multitude of asinine comparisons in this thread but this is certainly not one of them.

 

I think you're assigning a bit too much of a divide between collectors and readers. The vast majority of collectors also read comics, and many (like myself) tend to collect the teams or characters that they like to read.

 

The prices of all comics that go up in value is driven by collectors (and/or speculators if you prefer). Otherwise who spends $100 and up for five minutes worth of reading? Why not just buy the trade paperback?

[Hawkman]

 

 

plenty of 9.8's but not plenty of WD #1's.

 

How does this make any sense...?

 

 

there are over 300 9.8's on a book that has 7000 copies total. imo, less people out there collecting 9.8's of WD #1 as opposed to any copy of WD #1.

[Hawkman]

 

 

plenty of 9.8's but not plenty of WD #1's.

 

How does this make any sense...?

 

I understood it to say, 'Don't buy Walking Dead #1 in CGC 9.8 when you can find a beater copy for $35 and still say, "YES! I have Walking Dead #1!"'

 

 

where did i say beater copy? i didn't, so please don't mis represent what i said if you didn't understand it. next time, just ask me a question instead of being an . my copy is a 9.6 easy if i cgc'd it.

[USArmyParatrooper]

Hate to break it to you, but plenty of people collect unslabbed comics. Plenty of collectors don't need someone else to tell them the grade of their book to feel good about it. Comic collecting as a hobby survived for decades prior to CGC...unless you are implying that CGC invented "comic collecting"...?

 

Last time I checked, comics are exclusively sold in comic book stores...where comic books are marketed, first and foremost, as a collectible. The idea that all but 300 CGC 9.8 copies are in the hands of "readers" and not "collectors" is (wait for it, wait for it) ASININE.

 

If they were only READERS they wouldn't pay up to $500 for unslabbed "NM" copies of WD 1. First of all, they wouldn't care about grade. Secondly, if reading is the only goal, they would just buy a TPB and save their money.

 

The people you describe are collecting slabs, and a number on a label. They are NOT collecting comics. Comics can be read.

 

Bologna. Last time I checked there was a comic book inside the slab. It can be removed and read, or the owner can choose to leave it in there. It's no different than the owner of a high grade WD 1 choosing to leave it in the bag & board and just reading the trade.

 

It's pretty arrogant to tell other comic enthusiasts they're not "true" comic collectors if they do things differently from you.

[valiantman]

 

 

plenty of 9.8's but not plenty of WD #1's.

 

How does this make any sense...?

 

I understood it to say, 'Don't buy Walking Dead #1 in CGC 9.8 when you can find a beater copy for $35 and still say, "YES! I have Walking Dead #1!"'

 

 

where did i say beater copy? i didn't, so please don't mis represent what i said if you didn't understand it. next time, just ask me a question instead of being an . my copy is a 9.6 easy if i cgc'd it.

 

You said $35. What copy of Walking Dead #1 could be bought TODAY for $35?

 

Your advice was to avoid CGC 9.8 and get a cheaper copy. YOU said $35.

 

Don't call me an you 2006er. I was here when your mama was buying you second-hand diapers.

[N/A]

 

I think you're assigning a bit too much of a divide between collectors and readers. The vast majority of collectors also read comics, and many (like myself) tend to collect the teams or characters that they like to read.

 

The prices of all comics that go up in value is driven by collectors (and/or speculators if you prefer). Otherwise who spends $100 and up for five minutes worth of reading? Why not just buy the trade paperback?

 

Since we are talking about rising prices and current prices well in excess of $100 I'm not sure why you would try to make your 1st point. You state that the prices of all comics go up because of collectors/speculators which is also what I commented on.

[N/A]

 

 

plenty of 9.8's but not plenty of WD #1's.

 

How does this make any sense...?

 

I understood it to say, 'Don't buy Walking Dead #1 in CGC 9.8 when you can find a beater copy for $35 and still say, "YES! I have Walking Dead #1!"'

 

 

where did i say beater copy? i didn't, so please don't mis represent what i said if you didn't understand it. next time, just ask me a question instead of being an . my copy is a 9.6 easy if i cgc'd it.

 

You said $35. What copy of Walking Dead #1 could be bought TODAY for $35?

 

Your advice was to avoid CGC 9.8 and get a cheaper copy. YOU said $35.

 

Don't call me an you 2006er. I was here when your mama was buying you second-hand diapers.

 

Seniority.

 

Union rules.

[jjeanius]

Hate to break it to you, but plenty of people collect unslabbed comics. Plenty of collectors don't need someone else to tell them the grade of their book to feel good about it. Comic collecting as a hobby survived for decades prior to CGC...unless you are implying that CGC invented "comic collecting"...?

 

Last time I checked, comics are exclusively sold in comic book stores...where comic books are marketed, first and foremost, as a collectible. The idea that all but 300 CGC 9.8 copies are in the hands of "readers" and not "collectors" is (wait for it, wait for it) ASININE.

 

If they were only READERS they wouldn't pay up to $500 for unslabbed "NM" copies of WD 1. First of all, they wouldn't care about grade. Secondly, if reading is the only goal, they would just buy a TPB and save their money.

 

The people you describe are collecting slabs, and a number on a label. They are NOT collecting comics. Comics can be read.

 

Bologna. Last time I checked there was a comic book inside the slab. It can be removed and read, or the owner can choose to leave it in there. It's no different than the owner of a high grade WD 1 choosing to leave it in the bag & board and just reading the trade.

 

It's pretty arrogant to tell other comic enthusiasts they're not "true" comic collectors if they do things differently from you.

 

Au contraire, most comic book collectors who do collect slabs also collect raw books (or TPBs) so that they can read the books contained in the slabs. That doesn't change the fact that slabs are collected as just that: slabs. I don't know too many collectors who pay top dollar for a 9.8 and then crack the slab so they can read it.

 

Any time a book commands a premium in the slab, then the slab is part of the equation. To crack the slab is to devalue the item itself, so book remains slabbed. This makes it a commodity, not reading material.

[N/A]

Hate to break it to you, but plenty of people collect unslabbed comics. Plenty of collectors don't need someone else to tell them the grade of their book to feel good about it. Comic collecting as a hobby survived for decades prior to CGC...unless you are implying that CGC invented "comic collecting"...?

 

I will simply concede that my comment could be interpreted this way only because you did.

 

Last time I checked, comics are exclusively sold in comic book stores...where comic books are marketed, first and foremost, as a collectible. The idea that all but 300 CGC 9.8 copies are in the hands of "readers" and not "collectors" is (wait for it, wait for it) ASININE.

 

I believe I said the CGC 9.8's were sought by collectors. To reverse this statement to say that all raw copies are owned by readers is illogical. Please take the time to understand this. To continue to view a discussion in this light is truly asinine.

 

If they were only READERS they wouldn't pay up to $500 for unslabbed "NM" copies of WD 1. First of all, they wouldn't care about grade. Secondly, if reading is the only goal, they would just buy a TPB and save their money.

 

The people you describe are collecting slabs, and a number on a label. They are NOT collecting comics. Comics can be read.

 

When you 1st commented I was genuinely interested in discussin this. You seem to be harbouring some bad feelings or pushing some other agenda. You've officially derailed my derailment.

[USArmyParatrooper]

Au contraire, most comic book collectors who do collect slabs also collect raw books (or TPBs) so that they can read the books contained in the slabs. That doesn't change the fact that slabs are collected as just that: slabs. I don't know too many collectors who pay top dollar for a 9.8 and then crack the slab so they can read it.

 

Any time a book commands a premium in the slab, then the slab is part of the equation. To crack the slab is to devalue the item itself, so book remains slabbed. This makes it a commodity, not reading material.

 

The slab is nothing more than one form of piece of mind. This is especially important in the modern age, where tons and tons of internet transactions are taking place and restoration is running rampant.

 

But that's all it is, peace of mind and it doesn't have to come from a CGC slab. I don't know if you recall a couple months ago a someone posted an Ebay listing where the seller of an AF15 included a 10 minute video. In it he went through the entire comic page by page, covering every defect and giving his assessments along the way. It was done very intelligently and in a professional manner. That AF15 easily closed at what a slabbed AF15 of the same grade normally goes for.

 

 

[USArmyParatrooper]

 

I think you're assigning a bit too much of a divide between collectors and readers. The vast majority of collectors also read comics, and many (like myself) tend to collect the teams or characters that they like to read.

 

The prices of all comics that go up in value is driven by collectors (and/or speculators if you prefer). Otherwise who spends $100 and up for five minutes worth of reading? Why not just buy the trade paperback?

 

Since we are talking about rising prices and current prices well in excess of $100 I'm not sure why you would try to make your 1st point. You state that the prices of all comics go up because of collectors/speculators which is also what I commented on.

 

The fact that collectors drive up the price of collectibles isn't exactly a revelation. The point I was making is that you (seem to) be making a distinction between readers and collectors. The vast majority of collectors are also readers.