Jaydogrules Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 A raw nm to mint sold for 670 tonight on eBay. I wouldn't Be shock if someone say it was shilled auction too. I hope It wasn't. Raw book sales aren't reported to GPA. -J. It's a good thing completed listings on eBay are unavailable to everyone immediately and forever and GPA is the only source people are allowed to look at when trying to determine comic values. Right. I think you missed the point. But okay. (thumbs u -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockMyAmadeus Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 A raw nm to mint sold for 670 tonight on eBay. I wouldn't Be shock if someone say it was shilled auction too. I hope It wasn't. Raw book sales aren't reported to GPA. -J. It's a good thing completed listings on eBay are unavailable to everyone immediately and forever and GPA is the only source people are allowed to look at when trying to determine comic values. Right. I think you missed the point. But okay. (thumbs u -J. Soooo...what was the point, if not that raw listings can be shilled, too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 A raw nm to mint sold for 670 tonight on eBay. I wouldn't Be shock if someone say it was shilled auction too. I hope It wasn't. Raw book sales aren't reported to GPA. -J. It's a good thing completed listings on eBay are unavailable to everyone immediately and forever and GPA is the only source people are allowed to look at when trying to determine comic values. Right. I think you missed the point. But okay. (thumbs u -J. Soooo...what was the point, if not that raw listings can be shilled, too? Any listing can be shilled on ebay. Ebay listings are only visible for 1-3 months, however, so raw listings do not move the needle on a book in the same way it can be done when a CGC listing is shilled on ebay and potentially becomes a permanent data point on GPA. That can (and does) move the needle. Raw books usually reflect a trickle down proximate value that is usually a percentage of what a third party graded book would realize. Thus those sales will tend to drive and determine the raw book sales and not vice versa. Therein lies the dual incentive for shilling CGC books. -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockMyAmadeus Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 A raw nm to mint sold for 670 tonight on eBay. I wouldn't Be shock if someone say it was shilled auction too. I hope It wasn't. Raw book sales aren't reported to GPA. -J. It's a good thing completed listings on eBay are unavailable to everyone immediately and forever and GPA is the only source people are allowed to look at when trying to determine comic values. Right. I think you missed the point. But okay. (thumbs u -J. Soooo...what was the point, if not that raw listings can be shilled, too? Any listing can be shilled on ebay. Ebay listings are only visible for 1-3 months, however, so raw listings do not move the needle on a book in the same way it can be done when a CGC listing is shilled on ebay and potentially becomes a permanent data point on GPA. That can (and does) move the needle. Raw books usually reflect a trickle down proximate value that is usually a percentage of what a third party graded book would realize. Thus those sales will tend to drive and determine the raw book sales and not vice versa. Therein lies the dual incentive for shilling CGC books. -J. eBay listings are visible for 3 months. However, your contention that permanent GPA data points "move the needle" is an overstatement. Data points from 1, 2, 3 years ago have little bearing on what people are willing to pay now for any particular book when there are multiple sales on a regular basis. As well, not everyone subscribes to and/or uses GPA, even slab buyers. eBay sales history, on the other hand, is accessible by anyone with an eBay account. I also completely disagree with your contention that raw sales are driven by slabbed sales. The divide between raw and slabbed sales is quite wide, and rarely have anything to do with each other from a buyer's perspective. I am not saying that there's no crossover; obviously there is. However, it is limited, and certainly not to the extent that "raw books sell for X BECAUSE a slabbed copy sold for X+Y." Turns out Lazyboy got the point after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 A raw nm to mint sold for 670 tonight on eBay. I wouldn't Be shock if someone say it was shilled auction too. I hope It wasn't. Raw book sales aren't reported to GPA. -J. It's a good thing completed listings on eBay are unavailable to everyone immediately and forever and GPA is the only source people are allowed to look at when trying to determine comic values. Right. I think you missed the point. But okay. (thumbs u -J. Soooo...what was the point, if not that raw listings can be shilled, too? Any listing can be shilled on ebay. Ebay listings are only visible for 1-3 months, however, so raw listings do not move the needle on a book in the same way it can be done when a CGC listing is shilled on ebay and potentially becomes a permanent data point on GPA. That can (and does) move the needle. Raw books usually reflect a trickle down proximate value that is usually a percentage of what a third party graded book would realize. Thus those sales will tend to drive and determine the raw book sales and not vice versa. Therein lies the dual incentive for shilling CGC books. -J. eBay listings are visible for 3 months. However, your contention that permanent GPA data points "move the needle" is an overstatement. Data points from 1, 2, 3 years ago have little bearing on what people are willing to pay now for any particular book when there are multiple sales on a regular basis. As well, not everyone subscribes to and/or uses GPA, even slab buyers. eBay sales history, on the other hand, is accessible by anyone with an eBay account. I also completely disagree with your contention that raw sales are driven by slabbed sales. The divide between raw and slabbed sales is quite wide, and rarely have anything to do with each other from a buyer's perspective. I am not saying that there's no crossover; obviously there is. However, it is limited, and certainly not to the extent that "raw books sell for X BECAUSE a slabbed copy sold for X+Y." Turns out Lazyboy got the point after all. Nope. Still don't think so. And I don't think you have either. Only "sold" ebay listings and the "re-lists" (the ones in green), are visible for 3 months. Unsold listings (the ones in black) are visible for about 30 days. Unsold listings can be just as informative as what sold. If not more so. And whether or not you believe raw sales are usually or typically representative of a percentage of what a slabbed copy of the same book might go for is your opinion, it is not a fact. I happen to disagree with your opinion and I suspect many would. Most even small time sellers, even those who peddle their wares on these boards, cite GPA "closed sales" in their listings. And even if they don't literally say "GPA" in their listings it is quite evident they are using it based simply on their asking price most of the time. Other sellers, who don't use GPA see what those sellers set their prices at and then price their copies accordingly. These shilled ebay sales have now affected how multiple sellers have priced their items, thus infecting the overall slabbed market on the book. Unsuspecting buyers need not have a subscription to GPA when they log into ebay and see these listings, with their bloated sales prices that have been influenced by these shilled auctions and listings on ebay. Then some of these buyers may start bidding on raw books because those appear to be "cheaper" than the slabbed listings (and they almost always are), yet they are still overpaying for that raw copy because of increased bidding competition from other buyers also looking for a "better deal on a raw book". Thus the raw book market has now been corrupted as well. It's all fruit from the poisonous tree. I feel as if this is all quite obvious already, but I did find summing it up to be a good reminder for why shilling on ebay is so toxic. (thumbs u -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockMyAmadeus Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 A raw nm to mint sold for 670 tonight on eBay. I wouldn't Be shock if someone say it was shilled auction too. I hope It wasn't. Raw book sales aren't reported to GPA. -J. It's a good thing completed listings on eBay are unavailable to everyone immediately and forever and GPA is the only source people are allowed to look at when trying to determine comic values. Right. I think you missed the point. But okay. (thumbs u -J. Soooo...what was the point, if not that raw listings can be shilled, too? Any listing can be shilled on ebay. Ebay listings are only visible for 1-3 months, however, so raw listings do not move the needle on a book in the same way it can be done when a CGC listing is shilled on ebay and potentially becomes a permanent data point on GPA. That can (and does) move the needle. Raw books usually reflect a trickle down proximate value that is usually a percentage of what a third party graded book would realize. Thus those sales will tend to drive and determine the raw book sales and not vice versa. Therein lies the dual incentive for shilling CGC books. -J. eBay listings are visible for 3 months. However, your contention that permanent GPA data points "move the needle" is an overstatement. Data points from 1, 2, 3 years ago have little bearing on what people are willing to pay now for any particular book when there are multiple sales on a regular basis. As well, not everyone subscribes to and/or uses GPA, even slab buyers. eBay sales history, on the other hand, is accessible by anyone with an eBay account. I also completely disagree with your contention that raw sales are driven by slabbed sales. The divide between raw and slabbed sales is quite wide, and rarely have anything to do with each other from a buyer's perspective. I am not saying that there's no crossover; obviously there is. However, it is limited, and certainly not to the extent that "raw books sell for X BECAUSE a slabbed copy sold for X+Y." Turns out Lazyboy got the point after all. Nope. Still don't think so. And I don't think you have either. Only "sold" ebay listings and the "re-lists" (the ones in green), are visible for 3 months. Unsold listings (the ones in black) are visible for about 30 days. Unsold listings can be just as informative as what sold. If not more so. Yes, but as you do frequently, you are again trying to change the parameters of the discussion. We're not talking about unsold items. We are talking about SHILLING, which means SOLD, so how long unsold listings remain in the completed section isn't relevant to the discussion. Unsold listings DO say something...but not more than sold listings. (Yes, you can shill lower than a reserve and have it "not sell", but that's such a rare scenario, it doesn't merit inclusion, so let's not go in that direction.) And whether or not you believe raw sales are usually or typically representative of a percentage of what a slabbed copy of the same book might go for is your opinion, it is not a fact. I happen to disagree with it and I suspect many would. Every single raw book that sells does so for a percentage of what a slabbed copy would sell for. That isn't opinion, that's a self-evident fact of math. The actual question, then, is just what that percentage IS. 50%? 20%? 2%? 89%? 175%? And, the better question is: "how can anyone possibly KNOW, much less APPLY, some sort of "percentage" of raw to slabbed sales?" You can't, because it's not possible. Say a slabbed copy of Book X sells for $1200 in 9.8, $500 in 9.6, and $300 in 9.4. What percentage is the raw "NM/M" copy going to sell for, if it sells for $347? Did it sell for 29% of the 9.8 slab? 69% of the 9.6 slab? 115% of the 9.4 slab? There's no way to know. Because there are completely different factors involved in raw sales that don't apply to slabbed sales, you cannot possibly compare. It's not possible. There are too many variables involved. Most even small time sellers, even those who peddle their wares on these boards, cite GPA "closed sales" in their listings. On these boards, sure. In the wider eBay market? No. And even if they don't actually say "GPA" in their listings it is quite evident they are using it based simply on their asking price most of the time. Other sellers, who don't use GPA see what those sellers set their prices at and then price their copies accordingly. That's an assumption based on a foundation that doesn't actually exist. An assumption based on an assumption. And how do they know what "closed sales" prices to quote...? Most sellers on eBay don't know that GPA even exists. These shilled ebay sales have now affected how multiple sellers have priced their items, thus infecting the overall slabbed market on the book. An assumption built on a foundation of assumptions that don't pan out. Unsuspecting buyers need not have a subscription to GPA when they log into ebay and see these listings, with their bloated sales prices that have been influenced by these shilled auctions and listings on ebay. They then start bidding on raw books because those appear to be "cheaper" than the slabbed listings (and they almost always are), thus the raw book market has been corrupted as well. Yet another assumption. Do you know how many people buy things simply because it was the first item that caught their fancy, for whatever reason? I've had people pay more than GPA (both for slabs AND raw books) when essentially identical items were available for lower prices ON EBAY at the SAME TIME. You assume that everyone does research when they buy, and this is not true. It's all fruit from the poisonous tree. That's a legal phrase that doesn't really mean what you're trying to make it mean. It has to do with how evidence is obtained, not how pricing models are derived. Evidence obtained illegally can be perfectly legitimate, and still excluded, because of the trail of how it was discovered. What you're trying to concoct would be more like a Ponzi or pyramid scheme. Which, of course, it still isn't, because your assumptions don't pan out. I feel as if this is all quite obvious already, but I did find summing it up to be a good reminder for why shilling on ebay is so toxic. (thumbs u -J. Except you're forgetting the very basic hole in your entire theory: if there's a buyer, they thought the item was worth what they paid. Regardless of *why* (and yes, there's a good separate argument to be made with regards to that why), the fact is, someone believed that the item was worth what they paid at that time. You have forgotten that very critical fact: if a whole bunch of shilled listings "sell" for $1200, and someone comes along and says "well, ok, I guess $1200 is a fair price. Here's my money!" then that buyer has now established an ACTUAL sales price for that book. They were willing to pay $1200 for it. Now, is it fair? No. But is it REAL? Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Your opinions of my anecdotal scenario on how a shilled listing can (and does) corrupt the market on a book aside.... ....I think you just also made a very strong case for why shilling on ebay actually works, and why it is done. -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockMyAmadeus Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Your opinions of my anecdotal scenario on how a shilled listing can (and does) corrupt the market on a book aside.... ....I think you just also made a very strong case for why shilling on ebay actually works, and why it is done. -J. Of course it works. Why do you think it's done? That isn't an endorsement of shilling; it's simply a statement of fact. The really nice thing is that, in general, the market isn't greatly affected by shilling. If there's 3 shilled listings, you're likely to have 10-12-15-20 listings that aren't. Shilling isn't anywhere near as pervasive as you are making it seem. Again, not an endorsement or absolution of shilling; just a statement of what is. And this is critical: the people that aren't going to do research to find out if an item has been shilled are ALSO usually not going to do research to find out "what others are selling for." The only question is "do I have the money, and do I think it's a fair price, yes/no?" That's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 I am not saying that shilling occurs on all books all the time. What happens (and what's seen on BA 12) is a targeted market manipulation when a book seems to get "hot", that is easier to execute on more common moderns (like BA 12 and NM 98), and formerly obscure/irrelevant books with scant prior collector interest and therefore more limited prior sales data (like MP 4 and 7). Then the shilling on that particular book most certainly becomes pervasive, completely skewing the market on that book, creating false price points for the book. You seem to be placing some responsibility at the feet of prospective buyers, and I agree, buyers should do their due diligence. But the failure of a casual buyer to do that should not be a license for a scam artist to take advantage IMO. Many of these sellers have multiple ebay accounts and have the whole thing down to a science. Unsold listings are certainly relevant because we can see how many times a particular book has been listed, and what kind of bidding activity it received if it did not meet reserve. The best way to stop shilling, or at least interrupt it, is to point it out. -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r100comics Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 I have no dog in this fight bc I don't own the book, but I gotta say that, Jay, you're calling shills on books--from what I have noticed--isn't exactly done with integrity or objective view of facts. You have a hard on for books you hate and then you go after them. I don't know why you're not calling shills on Hulk 1s which have been plagued recently by fake sales and constant relists. Yet you go on the Hulk 1 club thread pumping Hulk 1 and ST110 constantly. But you sure are going hard after BA12. Wonder if it's bc you own a Hulk 1--and not a BA12. Hard to say you have integrity when you do that. And who sets a reserve on a shilled auction? That's just silly. The whole point of a shill is to make sure it sells above the shill price (already a reserve). My understanding of reserve ebay auctions is you pay a fee even if the book doesn't sell. Why pay extra listing fees a book that won't sell unless you the reserve price is real. I can see low feedback bidders going after BA12 bc at least some will be non-comic ppl who love the character and want a high graded copy but don't use ebay much or buy comics normally. I find it odd that you question the "integrity" of someone who is pointing out obvious shill activity on the only two CGC auctions going on right no on ebay for this book, and not the shillers themselves. And I wasn't aware that owning a book was a pre-requisite for doing so. I don't "hate" any book, I hate shillers. It's disturbing to witness the obvious pump and dump on books, over and over and over again. I mean really, if a book has the cred, it should be able to stand on its own two feet without being shilled and pumped. This is market manipulation at its worse, and it is bad for the hobby, and frustrating for legitimate buyers. I doubt there isn't a single person here who has not been the victim of a shill at least once. I'm not sure what you are referring to about me "pumping" other books in other threads. I do not sell comic books. Are there other books being shilled right now on ebay? Obviously. I am usually the first one to point out the latest AF 15 scam. I pinpoint scams quite frequently on the boards. Whether I own the book or not. Perhaps you missed the MP 4/7 thread over in the comic magazines section. There's also entire threads on the "bubble bursting" on NM 98 and Walking Dead in CG. Are you saying that BA 12, a book seemingly having tripled in price in a couple months, together with relentless carnival barking on these boards by people who have copies to sell, shouldn't raise more than a few red flags and eyebrows as well? If you think Hulk 1 and/or ST 110 are being shilled as well, feel free to point it out. Although it is much harder to shill higher end, less frequently traded books such as those because they are sold on many other sites than just ebay. Ebay is the garbage dump for shills, and books like BA 12 and NM 98 are easy targets for them, as they are very plentiful and frequently traded, and not so expensive as to be out of reach for a casually interested buyer to take a shot at in an auction, and possibly get bid up unnecessarily (and unfairly) by a shill. By the way after you mentioned Hulk 1 and ST 110 I went back and looked at the last 90 days for those. Yes there are a few re-lists for a couple of Hulk 1's, and one for an ST 110. But those do not get recorded by GPA, you do know that, right? Therefore those few re-lists do not move the needle on the market, or impact the sales data at all. In situations like that it is just as likely that a buyer did not pay. And if you need anymore "evidence" that these two BA 12's currently at auction are being shilled, take a look at the prior auctions for the same books: http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&item=251767023140&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2565 http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&item=221646456494&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2565 That is some blatantly scandalous BS right there. -J. You are joking, right ? You've been the chief cheerleader on the movie hype books. I've lost count of the number of times you've posted the icon to trumpet a high sale on books you own whilst ignoring all the lower / suspicious sales and constantly calling shill on the books I presume you don't own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Again with trying to shoot the messenger ? I'm not sure what your implication is, but I can assure you that I have never pointed out targeted shilling on any particular book that was not easily within my reach ("presuming", as you say, of course, that I do not actually already own one). Shall I presume by your post (the relative accuracy of it notwithstanding) that you either have some books to sell, or that you are a shill yourself ? -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r100comics Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 The implication is that you hype the books you own and, whilst you are 100% right to point out shilling, that you don't apply the same level of scrutiny to books you own as those you don't choosing to only highlight high sales. I have never owned a BA #12 or NM #98 and don't shill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 The implication is that you hype the books you own and, whilst you are 100% right to point out shilling, that you don't apply the same level of scrutiny to books you own as those you don't choosing to only highlight high sales. I have never owned a BA #12 or NM #98 and don't shill. ...and I have no reason to "hype" books one way or the other because I don't sell books. As I said in the post that you originally quoted, I have called out numerous sketchy sales/listings on books I own as well. And others are free to point out other shilling that I don't. It's not as though I am scanning ebay 24/7 for scams. I keyed in on BA 12 because somebody said "8.5's are going for $400 and it won't be long before 9.8's will be $2500!". And I thought "Wtf?" and then looked and saw four consecutively shilled CGC ebay auctions for the book, with two ongoing, and decided to sound the alarm. But shilling is bad for the hobby in general, not just one book in particular. -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardian Comics Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 "A fool and his money are lucky enough to get together in the first place." -Gordon Gekko (Wall Street) I love that quote. It won't turn out to be accurate in this case, though. Harley's rise in popularity has been building for a while. She'll be a key hobby fixture for years. When you look at BA 12 print and supply numbers, and use NM 98 as a measuring stick, you realize there may even be more room to run for 9.8s. Five years out, $1500 for a BA 12 in 9.8 may seem cheap. Right. "This time will be different." *yawn* -J. No. It'll be the same. The same as other characters who've become leading players in the hobby and seen the values of their first appearances rise. Think Wolverine circa 1980, Punisher circa 1986, Deadpool over the past few years ... and now Harley. There's a long history of characters becoming hobby favorites to draw from. Or....more like the same pumped up movie hype, with the same subsequent crash. The market has changed since Wolverine and the Punisher, and this book is being relentlessly pumped (on these boards) and shilled (on ebay). These are not the hallmarks of long term viability. That, and the character is rapidly becoming over-exposed. -J. Book has staying power, it's not Squirrel Girl, or Legends 3 or X-Factor 6 even, it's a bonafide key with the top five character in the planet. It's a big deal and a good book. Jim Batman Spiderman Superman Wolverine Iron Man Captain America Incredible Hulk Thor Wonder Woman Flash Joker Daredevil Archie Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles "Top 5 character on the planet"? Come on dude. Cosplay doesn't count and stop acting like the book has been "selling" for $1500 for the last two years instead of two weeks. People can buy what they want and pay whatever they want but enough with the pumping and carnival barking already. -J. Bats, Wolvie, Deadpool, Spidey and Harley...that's a reasonable top 5. To put DD, Flash and Wonder Woman is kinda silly. Stop by your children's school playground one day and ask the other kids on the playground when you pick your kids up and ask around? Bet you might me a little bit surprised. I'd guessing you'll get a whole lot of DareWho? and WonderWho? Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 "A fool and his money are lucky enough to get together in the first place." -Gordon Gekko (Wall Street) I love that quote. It won't turn out to be accurate in this case, though. Harley's rise in popularity has been building for a while. She'll be a key hobby fixture for years. When you look at BA 12 print and supply numbers, and use NM 98 as a measuring stick, you realize there may even be more room to run for 9.8s. Five years out, $1500 for a BA 12 in 9.8 may seem cheap. Right. "This time will be different." *yawn* -J. No. It'll be the same. The same as other characters who've become leading players in the hobby and seen the values of their first appearances rise. Think Wolverine circa 1980, Punisher circa 1986, Deadpool over the past few years ... and now Harley. There's a long history of characters becoming hobby favorites to draw from. Or....more like the same pumped up movie hype, with the same subsequent crash. The market has changed since Wolverine and the Punisher, and this book is being relentlessly pumped (on these boards) and shilled (on ebay). These are not the hallmarks of long term viability. That, and the character is rapidly becoming over-exposed. -J. Book has staying power, it's not Squirrel Girl, or Legends 3 or X-Factor 6 even, it's a bonafide key with the top five character in the planet. It's a big deal and a good book. Jim Batman Spiderman Superman Wolverine Iron Man Captain America Incredible Hulk Thor Wonder Woman Flash Joker Daredevil Archie Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles "Top 5 character on the planet"? Come on dude. Cosplay doesn't count and stop acting like the book has been "selling" for $1500 for the last two years instead of two weeks. People can buy what they want and pay whatever they want but enough with the pumping and carnival barking already. -J. Bats, Wolvie, Deadpool, Spidey and Harley...that's a reasonable top 5. To put DD, Flash and Wonder Woman is kinda silly. Stop by your children's school playground one day and ask the other kids on the playground when you pick your kids up and ask around? Bet you might me a little bit surprised. I'd guessing you'll get a whole lot of DareWho? and WonderWho? Jim I think 99.99 percent of objective minds would vociferously disagree with your "top 5" and your data sampling. But I do not begrudge you your right to your opinion. (thumbs u -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500Club Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Your opinions of my anecdotal scenario on how a shilled listing can (and does) corrupt the market on a book aside.... ....I think you just also made a very strong case for why shilling on ebay actually works, and why it is done. -J. Take off the tin foil hat. Shilling is done ... wait for it! ... because a seller wants to make more money. That's it. To suggest shillers in general have overall market manipulation in mind is pretty grandiose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500Club Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Bats, Wolvie, Deadpool, Spidey and Harley...that's a reasonable top 5. To put DD, Flash and Wonder Woman is kinda silly. Stop by your children's school playground one day and ask the other kids on the playground when you pick your kids up and ask around? Bet you might me a little bit surprised. I'd guessing you'll get a whole lot of DareWho? and WonderWho? Jim I think 99.99 percent of objective minds would vociferously disagree with your "top 5" and your data sampling. But I do not begrudge you your right to your opinion. (thumbs u -J. There's historical top 5 characters, and there's top 5 in terms of popularity. Right now, I'd have a tough time arguing with Jim's list, as far as popularity goes. Historically, Superman is top 3. Popularity wise, he may not be top 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul747 Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 I talk to lots of kids: Iron man #1 with/ Wolverine Batman spider-man Hulk SMASH ! Captain America x-men Thor -------------------------------------------------- Tier 2 Dead-pool red skull (shocks me but they know a lot about him) changeling (beast boy) Star wars TMNT Be on the look out for Kamala khan young girls love her ! cant wait till she has a cartoon or something. Harley is hot and has a following but I would not say top 5 ! Its all about the cartoons and the marketing the movies have made a huge impact ! and the toys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkdrawer Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 (edited) Instagram numbers are where the youth are today. Kids today have phones. They game, they text, they post. The numbers here are significant to make an argument. #batman 6,358,639 posts #superman 4,356,753 #spiderman 3,230,708 #walkingdead 1,785,855 #wonderwoman 937,023 #wolverine 892,581 #harleyquinn 584,395 #deadpool 543,251 #guardiansofthegalaxy 432,545 #teenagemutantninjaturtles 336,674 #daredevil 247,460 #thanos 54,174 #antman 29,102 #inhumans 9,915 Edited January 6, 2015 by Junkdrawer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EwanUK Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 I just asked my two boys aged 9 and 5 they are playing Batman 2 on the x-box right now 1. Batman 2. Robin 3. Superman 4. Hulk 5. Bane 6. Teen Titans (new cartoon) 7. Harley Quinn 8. Joker and all other Batman Villains.... All of this from toys, mostly Lego, games, films and cartoons they know Daddy likes comics but neither of them have any interest in them My 5 year old says he thinks about Batman "all the time" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
