Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice movie thread for your reading pleasure 2 2

[drotto]

Following a quick Google source, the consensus seems to be about $410 million all in.

 

$250 mill. for the film (source: BoxOfficeMojo), plus $160-$170 million for marketing.

 

(source: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/batman-v-superman-inside-warner-878208)

 

And everyone on the first two pages of Google is quoting $410 million, but the original source for that quote is Latino Review, which hasn't always been the most accurate.

 

Either way, the consensus from a panoply of sources is $410-$420 million all in.

 

At $350 million domestic and $850-$900 million worldwide it'll be profitable, but nowhere near expectations.

 

Recall that Amazing Spider-Man 2's $700-plus million take led to scrapping the next two movies & a total reboot.

 

Who's expectations? Warner Bros made it clear upfront they were looking at $800 million world wide. And it looks like they hit that number.

 

Do people here really thing Warner Bros didn't know there movie was dark and aimed at a different demography than Marvel's movies? They are coming off a very successful series with Batman which was dark. It only makes sense they would try what worked for them in the recent past.

 

And, whatever mistakes they feel they made, it is pretty clear they are adjusting and going forward. B vs S didn't sink the DCU. It is more akin to Marvel's early movies in their cinematic universe in box office take (more actually) than Marvel's later movies.

 

That is what WB is saying now, but many many people have been saying they thought they really had the goods here. WB is trying to save face. It has nothing to do with what you personally think of the movie. We can also go back through this thread and see many of you now defending the 800 mil. number that were crowing how this film was EASILY a 1 bil movie and would give Avengers a run for its money. These people were making fun of us here that pegged this as a 800 to 900 mil movie, and were calling us stupid. Now they are defending our numbers.

Edited April 17, 2016 by drotto

[Batman]

...I had a better time watching Pushing Tin than The Phantom Menace...

You REALLY didn't like The Phantom Menace, did you!?!

[rjrjr]

DC movies well hit a billion but it's going to take some movies not just in one movie would it have been awesome yeah. the same way marvel films build up and got better until both avengers films and ironman 3 hit a billion. i do think JL well hit a billion because of the universe build up it had from SS and WW movies.

 

Umm...DC movies _have_ hit a billion already.

 

Both The Dark Knight and The Dark Knight Rises broke $1 bn. worldwide, and that's before adjusting for inflation to today's dollars and increased IMAX screens.

 

And it's precisely why BvS can't be seen as anything other than a disappointment.

 

Two years ago, if anyone told you that a Jurassic Park 4 would outgross a Batman v Superman movie by more than 50% you would have had them hauled away to the looney bin.

 

And yet, here we are.

 

 

Can the same be said about the Incredible Hulk for Marvel? Or do we not remember that was Marvel's lead character that had 2 attempts at it. Marvel thought that was the strongest character they had that was not licensed out. B v S was not a failure. It didn't live up to fanboy expectation which is not the same thing. DC is off to a much stronger start that Marvel was and we have not built up to the Justice League yet.

 

I'll go back to my analogy, I hope DC ignores the fanboys on this one. They do not need to hit a home run every time up to bat. Not every movie has to make $1+ billion. They should be happy with the singles, doubles, and triples. Build on them. Marvel did before they made it to Avengers.

 

DC just has to stick to a plan, not worry about trying to hit a home run (Marvel doesn't) and they will be fine. This movie is already the #13 superhero movie in terms of box office take. Not bad IMHO for the 2nd movie in the DCCU. In a few years, as audiences absorb these movies in their home, DC will build the goodwill that Marvel did and make more and more.

 

Slow and steady...

Edited April 17, 2016 by rjrjr

[krighton]

going to see the movie for the first time...can't wait after all the positive comments

[rjrjr]

...And it's precisely why BvS can't be seen as anything other than a disappointment...

Terrible, terrible disappointment. Just terrible. I was SO disappointed with this movie, I went to see it again... just so I could increase my level of disappointment.

 

Wait till you watch Civil War.

You'll change your opinion on BvS.

 

How does one impact the other?

 

Exactly!

[rjrjr]

Following a quick Google source, the consensus seems to be about $410 million all in.

 

$250 mill. for the film (source: BoxOfficeMojo), plus $160-$170 million for marketing.

 

(source: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/batman-v-superman-inside-warner-878208)

 

And everyone on the first two pages of Google is quoting $410 million, but the original source for that quote is Latino Review, which hasn't always been the most accurate.

 

Either way, the consensus from a panoply of sources is $410-$420 million all in.

 

At $350 million domestic and $850-$900 million worldwide it'll be profitable, but nowhere near expectations.

 

Recall that Amazing Spider-Man 2's $700-plus million take led to scrapping the next two movies & a total reboot.

 

Who's expectations? Warner Bros made it clear upfront they were looking at $800 million world wide. And it looks like they hit that number.

 

Do people here really thing Warner Bros didn't know there movie was dark and aimed at a different demography than Marvel's movies? They are coming off a very successful series with Batman which was dark. It only makes sense they would try what worked for them in the recent past.

 

And, whatever mistakes they feel they made, it is pretty clear they are adjusting and going forward. B vs S didn't sink the DCU. It is more akin to Marvel's early movies in their cinematic universe in box office take (more actually) than Marvel's later movies.

 

That is what WB is saying now, but many many people have been saying they thought they really had the goods here. WB is trying to save face. It has nothing to do with what you personally think of the movie. We can also go back through this thread and see many of you now defending the 800 mil. number that were crowing how this film was EASILY a 1 bil movie and would give Avengers a run for its money. These people were making fun of us here that pegged this as a 800 to 900 mil movie, and were calling us stupid. Now they are defending our numbers.

 

Ummm... that is what Warner Bros said weeks before the movie even came out. They know exactly what they had and how much it would make. They've been in the movie making business a long time and I'm sure if the box office take was a disappointment for them, there would have been an article saying one of the execs in Warner Bros was disappointed. To date, I have not read any such article. I'm not saying Warner Bros wouldn't have wanted a surprise to the upside. Who wouldn't? But this constant expousing of expectations on the company that made the movie ("they were expecting more") is strange. I never once read or heard they were expecting a billion. Only fanboys on this site.

 

And if you don't think studio people don't talk, look at some past failures like Lone Ranger, John Carter, Green Lantern, Amazing Spider-Man 2, etc. It was clear the studio, not the fanboys, were disappointed with those movies.

Edited April 17, 2016 by rjrjr

[Batman]

going to see the movie for the first time...can't wait after all the positive comments

[40sJohn]

As David pointed out earlier, Zack was most definitely aware of the spiritual connotations of Supes in MoS. Again, I don't think Zack is as obvious as Bryan Singer was, but nonetheless the parallels are there.

 

First the short Bryan Singer article that helps explain the screen shot above.

Bryan Singer explains failure of Superman Returns

 

And a short article about Zack's take on Man of Steel

Zack interview

Nice research! It's a little harder to argue with the director But I'll give it a go...

 

I understand your view about the parallels and wouldn't say you're wrong. Everyone has their own viewpoint. However, looking at Man of Steel, I don't see these as intentional Christlike references.

 

I suspect in the interview, Snyder was pandering to a conspiracy theory concocted by a brood of vipers. He implied there are similarities between Christ and Superman in the Superman mythos. There aren't... Going back to my previous post, there is confusion between Christlike and godlike. Either he was mistaken or he saw it as an easier win over the critics. My guess would be the latter.

 

The Superman we see in MoS and BvS can fly, shoot fire from his eyes and emerge unscathed from collapsing buildings. Those are the powers of a pre-Biblical heathen god, not Jesus. I appreciate there is the scene NEG referred to where his arms are outstretched but to me that signifies the majesty of floating in space. For the most part, he looks more like this...

 

 

This is my viewpoint based on my understanding of Superman. I wouldn't expect others to share it

 

Thanks for sharing and I can see where you are coming from with the movies. No doubt the directors want Superman to relate to us in many ways and do a good job of putting various elements in the movie to achieve that connection.

 

Per your screen image, I think we can agree on a few things. One, we all dig Superman's heat vision and I especially like Zack's take on it. And... Superman can be one bad mofo when the situation calls for it.

Edited April 17, 2016 by 40sJohn

[40sJohn]

going to see the movie for the first time...can't wait after all the positive comments

 

Don't worry, you will get your money's worth with this movie. WB spent big bucks making it and it shows on the screen. There is plenty to love about it, but I can also see where critics had their issues. Enjoy it!

[Bosco685]

I'm a steamroller, baby...

 

Your posts have definitely been steaming - you got that right. But I doubt they are rolling. If anything, someone yelled, "Get that off my lawn - NOW!"

 

 

[Gatsby77]

http://www.inquisitr.com/3003399/batman-v-superman-dawn-of-justice-just-missed-another-embarrassing-target/

 

BvS fallen behind Deadpools track on Domestic revenue by week, will not catch it. Suicide Squad having scenes reshot to help it not get hammered by critics lke BvS did.

 

This is a really good example - so I am glad you posted it - of a heavily influenced 'article' and someone that is missing the point.

 

According to the box office tracking site Box Office Mojo, Batman v Superman has only grossed $304 million domestically as of Friday (April 15).

 

'only grossed $304 million domestically'? Only 59 movies in history have ever grossed $300 MM or better (not adjusting for inflation).

 

 

When you do look at recent adjusted domestic, you see the ones that exceeded $300 MM are no surprise. They were huge hits for being unique or part of a well-executed franchise. Even little Deadpool, which everyone realizes was so expertly developed and marketed it surprised many.

 

 

It isn't a common experience movies are break $300 MM domestic.

 

 

Except it is becoming not only vastly more common, but a new benchmark for blockbusters.

 

Example: 31 movies have hit $350 million domestic (with BvS sure to become # 32).

 

7 of those 31 have been released in the last year and a half (i.e., since 01/01/15).

 

When BvS crosses that threshold, that means 25% of the movies that have ever reached $350 million did so within just the last 16 months.

[Cat-Man_America]

Following a quick Google source, the consensus seems to be about $410 million all in.

 

$250 mill. for the film (source: BoxOfficeMojo), plus $160-$170 million for marketing.

 

(source: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/batman-v-superman-inside-warner-878208)

 

And everyone on the first two pages of Google is quoting $410 million, but the original source for that quote is Latino Review, which hasn't always been the most accurate.

 

Either way, the consensus from a panoply of sources is $410-$420 million all in.

 

At $350 million domestic and $850-$900 million worldwide it'll be profitable, but nowhere near expectations.

 

Recall that Amazing Spider-Man 2's $700-plus million take led to scrapping the next two movies & a total reboot.

 

Who's expectations? Warner Bros made it clear upfront they were looking at $800 million world wide. And it looks like they hit that number.

 

If you believe that, I've gotta a bridge in Brooklyn going up for sale. Do you want time shares?

 

Do people here really thing Warner Bros didn't know there movie was dark and aimed at a different demography than Marvel's movies? They are coming off a very successful series with Batman which was dark. It only makes sense they would try what worked for them in the recent past.

 

And, whatever mistakes they feel they made, it is pretty clear they are adjusting and going forward. B vs S didn't sink the DCU. It is more akin to Marvel's early movies in their cinematic universe in box office take (more actually) than Marvel's later movies.

 

Really? Do you actually think there's a distinctly separate demography of Marvel and DC filmgoers. There are fans of comic characters and mainstream audiences who like action adventure films. That pretty much covers the demographic, and I doubt anyone goes to the cinema thinking "I just wanna be bummed-out." Batman works as a dark character because he was conceived in that vein.

 

Superman wasn't envisioned as a dark character, and unlike Batman, is out of place in a dystopian world. WB executives apparently haven't gotten the memo (yet). The folks in charge need to go back and soberly reexamine Siegel and Shuster's original vision and then trace the histories of both characters. The only way Superman and Batman work in the same universe is through incorporating ideas that worked in the original comics.

 

IMO, making the entire DC universe dark and dystopian is doomed to failure. WB is trying to play catch-up with Disney/Marvel Studios, but their vision stubbornly ignores those things that have worked for the competition. No amount of handicapping will improve their score against Kevin Feige's more structured fan-friendly system until they respect the material and fans.

 

My

[Gatsby77]

Weekend estimate is up at BoxOfficeMojo.

 

They're saying just over $9 million, which puts it at less than half the 4th weekend take of other recent superhero blockbusters:

 

Age of Ultron: $21.7 million

 

Iron Man 3: $19.3 million

 

Dark Knight Rises: $19 million

 

Batman v. Superman: $9 million

[NewEnglandGothic]

My

...and I want to sincerely mention that I appreciate all your counter-points to this discussion so far.

I hope that sounded right.

[Bosco685]

Except it is becoming not only vastly more common, but a new benchmark for blockbusters.

 

I'm still wanting to understand how you compared ASM2 to BvS, yet missed some things:

 

- Sony had no merchandising rights as it sold it off to Marvel

- Sony never posted its production budget; Warner must have for Box Office Mojo to post it

- Warner successfully introduced both Batffleck and Gadot Woman; audiences now want these movies

- Justice League also is moving forward despite the rumors

- Warner added a 2018 and 2019 (most probably Batman and Suicide Squad 2)

 

But trying to make up an imaginary budget to support some negativity is silly. A professional site like Box Office Mojo puts a lot into its analysis. And if they cannot confirm a budget figure, they won't even post it. To this day, Amazing Spider-Man 2 is still listed as 'N/A' because Sony never admitted what the final cost was.

 

 

So if it is posting $250 MM, they received this from someone in the studio that was credible.

 

 

Looking for bad news just to have bad news to post is not the best use of time with these movies.

 

How you would compare ASM2 to BvS is just apples-to-pineapples logic.

 

[Bosco685]

My

...and I want to sincerely mention that I appreciate all your counter-points to this discussion so far.

I hope that sounded right.

 

If you are lost in the woods of New Hamphire, I'm sure someone could see your point.

[Cat-Man_America]

My

...and I want to sincerely mention that I appreciate all your counter-points to this discussion so far.

I hope that sounded right.

 

If you are lost in the woods of New Hamphire, I'm sure someone could see your point.

 

Your location appears to be stuck in a long line at the cinema. It must be a Marvel film. May I suggest BvS, that line is shorter.

[Bosco685]

IMO, making the entire DC universe dark and dystopian is doomed to failure. WB is trying to play catch-up with Disney/Marvel Studios, but their vision stubbornly ignores those things that have worked for the competition. No amount of handicapping will improve their score against Kevin Feige's more structured fan-friendly system until they respect the material and fans.

 

My

 

There is no question at all Warner realized it missed a huge opportunity over the years to create a well-planned and executed comic book universe. Looking back at movies like Steel, Catwoman and even Supergirl without any rhyme or reason why they existed (other than $$) is a shame.

 

But now Warner is trying to go down the right path, but in a different way. Does it need to exactly copy Marvel Studios? Not really. And with this Multiverse model that has been coming out slowly, it could be quite interesting the stories we could see delivered in a live or animated production (let's not forget Batman: The Killing Joke).

 

Marvel Studios is killing it right now. But when you go back to some of its hiccups like The Incredible Hulk (only delivered 1.8X budget) and Captain America: The First Avenger (only delivered 2.5X budget), Marvel had to learn a few lessons as well. Now since the Avengers the box office results have been rock solid.

[Bosco685]

Your location appears to be stuck in a long line at the cinema. It must be a Marvel film. May I suggest BvS, that line is shorter.

 

Again, from a fellow that has not even seen this movie. All you are doing is working to deliver a negative message about a production of which you are listening to others.

 

What's that like to be a sheep? Are the pastures greener?

 

[Bosco685]

Estimates for this weekend's wrap-up.