Just finished IC #6... <spoilers>

[chrisco37]

Yup. In issue 5 the son throws a boomerang towards his dad but it goes right towards his dad's head and Captain Boomerang isn't fast enough to get out of the way. Suddenly the son races over at super-speed and catches the boomerang before it hits. Captain Boomerang is quite proud that his son has meta-human (super-speed) abilities. That's when the son asks if Golden Glider was really his mother, and CB says she wasn't.

 

Yeah, it certainly looks as though he has super-speed, but not 100%. Batman can dodge bullets and he's normal. I was wondering if Meltzer was using the same "comic-logic" (for lack of a better term).

 

But, I agree, he is more than likely not Ollie's son. The line in Issue #1 about Connor was interesting.

 

Meltzer is a mystery writer. It seems that many mystery writer give you subtle clues right off the bat (ones that you forget later, or brush off as inconsequential) as to what's going on (noir mysteries not included, of course).

[chrisco37]

OK guys, set me straight.

 

 

that's one 40 too many...know when to say when ...

 

You're getting predicatble in your old age. I could have almost written your response.

[Illiterati-migration]

Yup. In issue 5 the son throws a boomerang towards his dad but it goes right towards his dad's head and Captain Boomerang isn't fast enough to get out of the way. Suddenly the son races over at super-speed and catches the boomerang before it hits. Captain Boomerang is quite proud that his son has meta-human (super-speed) abilities. That's when the son asks if Golden Glider was really his mother, and CB says she wasn't.

 

Yeah, it certainly looks as though he has super-speed, but not 100%. Batman can dodge bullets and he's normal. I was wondering if Meltzer was using the same "comic-logic" (for lack of a better term).

 

But, I agree, he is more than likely not Ollie's son. The line in Issue #1 about Connor was interesting.

 

Meltzer is a mystery writer. It seems that many mystery writer give you subtle clues right off the bat (ones that you forget later, or brush off as inconsequential) as to what's going on (noir mysteries not included, of course).

 

But CB says something to the effect of: "My son's got speed!"

[chrisco37]

But CB says something to the effect of: "My son's got speed!"

 

You are correct, that is exactly what he says. I took note that he said those precise words. Not, "My son's got SUPER-speed".

 

A clue from Meltzer or just the internet ramblings of a dumbarse? You decide.

[Illiterati-migration]

But CB says something to the effect of: "My son's got speed!"

 

You are correct, that is exactly what he says. I took note that he said those precise words. Not, "My son's got SUPER-speed".

 

A clue from Meltzer or just the internet ramblings of a dumbarse? You decide.

 

 

I'll say it again, this is why I'm having trouble with the "comic book mystery"...

There's just too much room for "interpretation" and I think a lot of the "clues" are being diluted along the way from writer to artist to reader.

 

Let us not forget The Brain's sig line quote from Meltzer:

 

"The most beautiful thing about comic books as a medium, is the tapesty of interpretation."

[Kevin Boyd]

Like I said, I'm not too well-versed on GA's history and abilities.

 

Millionaire industrialist Oliver Queen, feeling his life was missing something was accidentily knocked off his yacht and ended up stranded on an island. Like Robinson Crusoe, had to fend for his life. He ended up making a bow and arrows and had to train himself how to use them properly in order to bring down some of the larger game that lived on the island. After many months on the island (years?) Queen is surprised to learn that the island is a base for smugglers (in Grell's retelling it was drug smugglers). He uses his archery skills to incapacitate and capture the smugglers and called for help. The press refer to him as a modern day Robin Hood.

 

Queen liked the idea so much that he used part of his fortune to set up an operation for himself that resembled Batman's - a Robin Hood inspired costumed identity, an Arrowcar, an Arrowplane, an Arrowcave and a series of non-lethal trick arrows that would be used to capture criminals. He allowed his young ward to become his sidekick Speedy. Queen was later revealed to be an early financial backer for the Justice League of America, which he was invited to join (by merit) at a later date.

 

Queen enjoyed playing super-hero too much and while he was absent the share-holders and board of directors at his company maneuvered him out of his company (and his money). It was around this time that he altered his costume, grew a goatee and started to become more of a social activist hero. Teaming up with his friend Hal Jordan they travelled across the US exploring the social fabric of America and helping out where they could. Queen also started romancing fellow JLA-er the Black Canary. Sometime before Black Canary entered the picture Queen had a brief fling with a woman in San Francisco who would later give birth to his son Conner.

 

During the 70's and 80's Queen was active as a Justice Leaguer and often came into conflict with the more conservative Hawkman. In the mid-80's after leaving the League he had a bit of a mid-life crisis and he and the Black Canary moved to Seattle to open a flower shop. It was there he altered his costume again (the hooded version) and ditched the trick arrows, becoming a bit more ruthless and forced into situations that increasingly challenged his values, particularly when the Canary was assaulted at the hands of a serial killer. He began to undertake covert operations for the CIA.

 

He was eventualy killed in duty while infiltrating a batch of terrorists - they strapped his hand into a bomb and Superman was unable to save Queen - who would not allow Superman to sever his arm in order to save him. His son, Conner, who had just recently met at a monastary, and just happened to be an expert archer, took up the Green Arrow mantle and travelled around the country. He became friends with GL Kyle Rayner who asked him to join the JLA, which he did for a while as a reservist.

 

During the Sun-Eater incident (The Final Night mini) Queen's body was revived by Hal Jordan (as Parallax's second last act) before Hal sacrificed himself to revive the sun and save the earth. The revived GA was younger and healthier, but seemed to be stuck at a point in the past before the events in Seattle. Turns out he was a soul-less echo of GA and Oliver Queen's spirit was still in heaven. When his son was in danger, Queen's soul decided to return and inhabit the revived body and he's been active since. He lives in Star City with his son Conner Hawke (GAII) and a troubled young girl he saved named Mia. Mia recently learned that she is HIV positive and will become the new Speedy in GA 45.

 

Phew....

[AlexH]

Meltzer is a mystery writer. It seems that many mystery writer give you subtle clues right off the bat (ones that you forget later, or brush off as inconsequential) as to what's going on (noir mysteries not included, of course).

 

I was thinking about this last night after I read issue #1 again. Remember how this all starts? Elongated man is being "surprised" by his wife for his birthday. He says ever year she tries to surprise him with a big mystery, but he always figures it out. What if this is Sue Dibny's doing??? OK, I know I'm probably talking out of my with this, but it came to mind. And since no clue is a small clue...

 

I know it is a stretch (pun intended), but what if she faked her own death, and is behind all the other stuff? Admittedly, she would need some help, but it sure is one hell of a mystery for her hubby to try and solve.

 

OK, start your abuse now.

[Illiterati-migration]

And the Kevin Smith GA was terrific!

[Kevin Boyd]

Yeah, it certainly looks as though he has super-speed, but not 100%. Batman can dodge bullets and he's normal. I was wondering if Meltzer was using the same "comic-logic" (for lack of a better term).

 

Yes, it 100% looked to me like he was using super-speed. We even see the "flash-effect" as he runs the 30+ feet towards his father and grabs the boomerang out of the air.

[chrisco37]

Meltzer is a mystery writer. It seems that many mystery writer give you subtle clues right off the bat (ones that you forget later, or brush off as inconsequential) as to what's going on (noir mysteries not included, of course).

 

I was thinking about this last night after I read issue #1 again. Remember how this all starts? Elongated man is being "surprised" by his wife for his birthday. He says ever year she tries to surprise him with a big mystery, but he always figures it out. What if this is Sue Dibny's doing??? OK, I know I'm probably talking out of my with this, but it came to mind. And since no clue is a small clue...

 

I know it is a stretch (pun intended), but what if she faked her own death, and is behind all the other stuff? Admittedly, she would need some help, but it sure is one hell of a mystery for her hubby to try and solve.

 

OK, start your abuse now.

 

I almost brought that up, as I did take note of it. However, the fact that the body was not burned to a crisp (I think they say something like 43% of the body was burned) makes that a moot point. Chalk it up to coincedence.

 

When Ralph finds the body, you can tell it's still Sue.

 

And, wouldn't a DNA test be one of the first performed in the autopsy anyway?

[chrisco37]

 

 

I'll say it again, this is why I'm having trouble with the "comic book mystery"...

There's just too much room for "interpretation" and I think a lot of the "clues" are being diluted along the way from writer to artist to reader.

 

Let us not forget The Brain's sig line quote from Meltzer:

 

"The most beautiful thing about comic books as a medium, is the tapesty of interpretation."

 

They don't call him the Brain for nothing!

[Kevin Boyd]

I was thinking about this last night after I read issue #1 again. Remember how this all starts? Elongated man is being "surprised" by his wife for his birthday. He says ever year she tries to surprise him with a big mystery, but he always figures it out. What if this is Sue Dibny's doing??? OK, I know I'm probably talking out of my with this, but it came to mind. And since no clue is a small clue...

 

I know it is a stretch (pun intended), but what if she faked her own death, and is behind all the other stuff? Admittedly, she would need some help, but it sure is one hell of a mystery for her hubby to try and solve.

 

OK, start your abuse now.

 

No, it's a reasonable theory. "Who killed me?" would be a great mystery, especially if she shows up alive at the end of issue #1, but it's gotten out of hand.

 

There are a few things about that theory that bother me.... why reveal that she was pregnant? He would obviously be shaken up about her death, but adding the death of their child would push fragile Ralph over the edge (and it has). He's obviously not thinking clearly OR trying to solve the mystery, and we haven't really seen him at all since the events in issue #3 (aside from crying on the couch and learning he was rich in #4). If she did fake her death, it's very cruel and unusual and has gone waaaay past "too far". To make Ralph go thru the grief of losing wife and child, he's not looking to solve the mystery at all, he's a broken shell. Not only that but the entire meta-human community is in disarray.

 

It's possible that Atom was brought in to microscopically knock her out and make it look like she had died, but that would put their child (maybe the pregancy was a fake as well) at unnecessary risk. It also doesn't explain who burned her? Was it the Atom who also burned her to cover a mistake (out of character), or was there a second person who came in after the fact? Or did they burn a clone or doppleganger? Either way, then logically the Atom would have said something by now because it's out of hand and a second killer seems to be involved. Or maybe he's too distracted by Jean's revived romantic attraction.

 

It's also possible that Jean was brought into this by Sue to fake her own death as well, knowing the Atom would save her.

[AlexH]

I also think at one point that the Flash had his memory "wiped" too. How that plays out in the story line, I am not sure.

[Kevin Boyd]

I see Ronnie Raymond's death was VERY temporary. He's back to harass his successor in February's Firestorm #9.

[500]

The Killer's words, "Goodbye Sue" keep bothering me

 

he didn't just turn on the flamethrower

 

he didn't say, "Goodbye Mrs. Dibny"

 

He actually said "Goodbye Sue"

 

And I've also been looking at all the phones Atom has been standing next to, has everyone agreed He can use wireless phones for travel? It sure looks like he can.

[AlexH]

There is also something else that is bothering me about issue #1:

 

When sue opens her present for Ralph, the box opens to show a magnifying glass. And in one of the frames, you can see a reflection of a misshaped face in the glass. Anyone have any thoughts???

[Kevin Boyd]

Ok. Atom and wireless phones. In theory his powers shouldn't work on cell phones at all. He's been shown as travelling along the electrical impules within the wires of the phone lines - in theory he could travel along to the transponder which broadcasts the frequency on which the call is broadcast, but he should be stopped there.

 

With handheld (or wireless) units the theory should be that Atom exits from the base unit (which is attached to a land line - where you put the handheld phone to recharge when you aren't using it). IMHO there is no reasonable explanation for how the Atom can go from the phone line/base unit and then cross thru the air to the handheld unit. He could physically jump to the handheld unit first, but he might as well just jump to whereever he needs to go.

[chrisco37]

The Killer's words, "Goodbye Sue" keep bothering me

 

he didn't just turn on the flamethrower

 

he didn't say, "Goodbye Mrs. Dibny"

 

He actually said "Goodbye Sue"

 

And I've also been looking at all the phones Atom has been standing next to, has everyone agreed He can use wireless phones for travel? It sure looks like he can.

 

Something just struck me!

 

Is that why Jean was blindfolded?

 

The Atom blindfolds Jean so that she cannot identify him, knowing that he is going to "save" her.

 

I still don't like the Atom theory though. Why, as you (I think) pointed out earlier, would we be let into his head?

 

Who benefits from this situation? Ray does, but only if Jean survives. And, is he really willing to risk everything for her love? This assumes he will never get caught.

 

As Kevin said, it's not his character.

 

This is driving me crazy! You don't know how hard it is not to click on that Spoiler Thread!

 

[chrisco37]

There is also something else that is bothering me about issue #1:

 

When sue opens her present for Ralph, the box opens to show a magnifying glass. And in one of the frames, you can see a reflection of a misshaped face in the glass. Anyone have any thoughts???

 

I noticed that too. I thought it was either Ralph (who it doesn't look like) or Alfred (who helped her locate the store).

[Fan4Fan]

I still don't like the Atom theory though. Why, as you (I think) pointed out earlier, would we be let into his head?

 

I've seen this misdirection used in a few prose stories... can't recall the exact ones... wherein the narrator is the perp.

 

I haven't been reading this series, but I may have to...