FF 3

[tth2]

Do we know for certain that Ewert/Brulato submitted the books?

Back on the first page of this thread, when we were talking about the 8.5 FF 3 that kicked this whole thing off, Bob said:

 

I bought this book as a CGC 8.5 from Jason Ewert/Tom Brulato.

 

The FF 9 came from the same submission, which means it was submitted to CGC by whoever submitted the FF 3. So if Ewert/Brulato want to come on here and explain that it was not they who purchased the 3 and 9 from Heritage, and it was not they who trimmed and pressed the books (or arranged for the books to be trimmed and pressed), they're welcome to do so. But right now, there's certainly enough probable cause to bring them in for questioning.

 

I'd also like to know whether they did the trimming themselves, or used someone else. In a PM, someone suggested Matt Nelson to me, but I have to wonder if it's Chris Friesen's new service. Who else is in better position to slip new undetectable restoration methods by CGC than their former resto detection expert?

[Rip]

That's a lot of speculation.

 

I'd say the best thing to do is hope Pedigree Comics mentions the name Ewert, or that the seller mentions that he bought the FF from Ewert

[Aman619]

Im hoping Bob will break ranks and help expose this mess.....

[Rip]

Given his grumpy [embarrassing lack of self control] poor manner on this thread, I doubt it. But we can hope

Sometimes I wonder if people read this site by braille.

[FFB]

Do we know for certain that Ewert/Brulato submitted the books?

 

If not, then they certainly have a beauty of a libel case in this thread.

[Aman619]

do you really think this is more of a witchhunt than an disappointing eye-opener?

[Rip]

If not, then they certainly have a beauty of a libel case in this thread.

 

Yep,....

[FFB]

do you really think this is more of a witchhunt than an disappointing eye-opener?

 

Who said anything about a witchhunt? I am just pointing out that there is a lot of speculation being thrown around as fact by people who don't know what the facts actually are. Maybe they're right about Ewert and Brulato, but maybe they're not. And if they're not, I doubt the apologies will be forthcoming with the same vigor as the accusations.

 

But, what else is new on the CGC boards?

[Silver Surfer]

It's no wonder very few dealers bother to respond on this site.

 

Bob this obviously doesn't apply to you but perhaps those that stay away have something to hide. Personally I'm glad this has come out in the open because I currently have high grade Ewart books in my collection but I will be more cautious before I buy them again.

[FFB]

It's no wonder very few dealers bother to respond on this site.

 

Bob this obviously doesn't apply to you but perhaps those that stay away have something to hide. Personally I'm glad this has come out in the open because I currently have high grade Ewart books in my collection but I will be more cautious before I buy them again.

 

Or maybe they don't have something to hide, but just don't want to have to deal with the bullt.

[Aman619]

do you really think this is more of a witchhunt than an disappointing eye-opener?

 

Who said anything about a witchhunt? I am just pointing out that there is a lot of speculation being thrown around as fact by people who don't know what the facts actually are. Maybe they're right about Ewert and Brulato, but maybe they're not. And if they're not, I doubt the apologies will be forthcoming with the same vigor as the accusations.

 

But, what else is new on the CGC boards?

 

what you describe above wa exactly what I was talking about. I called it a witchhunt. SO maybe thats the wrong word. Sounds right to me, a lot of noise and fuss and a target to go after. My gut feeling is that Ewert has maybe been caught at what many have suspected for a while. And Brulato just may have succumed to greed and been seduced by the easiness of adding a few zeros to the value of some books that are flippable. Just because he owns great stuff doesnt make him immune from taking advantage of the 'system' as others are.

 

let em sue for libel. good luck. What does borock have to say about this? Share with us please.

[Silver Surfer]

It's no wonder very few dealers bother to respond on this site.

 

Bob this obviously doesn't apply to you but perhaps those that stay away have something to hide. Personally I'm glad this has come out in the open because I currently have high grade Ewart books in my collection but I will be more cautious before I buy them again.

 

Or maybe they don't have something to hide, but just don't want to have to deal with the bullt.

 

I don't see honest, pleasant and respected dealers like Doug (to name one) having to deal with too much BS? We all buy and sell on these boards, through EBay and if your fair and honest then why worry about it. If I was making a living cooking books I sure as heck would stay away from these boards.

[tth2]

That's a lot of speculation.

 

I'd say the best thing to do is hope...that the seller mentions that he bought the FF from Ewert

What seller? Has it not occurred to you that Ewert/ Brulato are the consignors of the FF 9 on Pedigree? Just because Ewert directly sells stuff on eBay doesn't mean that's the only way they sell books. They spread it around among several sales channels. Quite a few books that have been listed on Pedigree since its inception have been Brulato's books.

 

What am I missing here?

 

1. The seller of the FF 3 to Bob was Ewert/Brulato. I didn't say that, Bob did. There's no reason for Bob to lie, and in fact I was surprised he came out straight away regarding who he bought it from.

 

2. The submitter of the FF 3 was the same submitter of the FF 9. I guess you can tell that from the CGC serial numbers.

 

3. Theoretically, Ewert/Brulato might not be the submitters, and might have purchased the FF 3 and 9 from whoever did. But that is not their modus operandi. They're not JP. They don't buy newly slabbed books at full value and then quickly try to flip them. Their business model is identifying an asset that is undergraded or can be "improved" and arbitrage the difference. Ergo, they purchased the books in their previous condition, trimmed and pressed them and then resubbed them, and then sold the FF 3 to Bob and listed the FF 9 on Pedigree.

[tth2]

Do we know for certain that Ewert/Brulato submitted the books?

 

If not, then they certainly have a beauty of a libel case in this thread.

So I should just cower and bite my tongue because of the potential of punitive action?

[Rip]

That's a lot of speculation.

 

I'd say the best thing to do is hope...that the seller mentions that he bought the FF from Ewert

What seller? Has it not occurred to you that Ewert/ Brulato are the consignors of the FF 9 on Pedigree? Just because Ewert directly sells stuff on eBay doesn't mean that's the only way they sell books. They spread it around among several sales channels. Quite a few books that have been listed on Pedigree since its inception have been Brulato's books.

 

What am I missing here?

 

1. The seller of the FF 3 to Bob was Ewert/Brulato. I didn't say that, Bob did. There's no reason for Bob to lie, and in fact I was surprised he came out straight away regarding who he bought it from.

 

2. The submitter of the FF 3 was the same submitter of the FF 9. I guess you can tell that from the CGC serial numbers.

 

3. Theoretically, Ewert/Brulato might not be the submitters, and might have purchased the FF 3 and 9 from whoever did. But that is not their modus operandi. They're not JP. They don't buy newly slabbed books at full value and then quickly try to flip them. Their business model is identifying an asset that is undergraded or can be "improved" and arbitrage the difference. Ergo, they purchased the books in their previous condition, trimmed and pressed them and then resubbed them, and then sold the FF 3 to Bob and listed the FF 9 on Pedigree.

 

So basicly that's a lot of speculation.

You don't know if someone had the FF3 before Ewert/Brulato sold it to Blazing Bob

You don't know who had the book on Pedigree.

Hey I've heard tons of bad things about Ewert, (Believe me I'm not an Ewert fan) but you need something more before you start yelling "Ewert is a Scam Artist"

 

If the seller who had the book (FF 9) on Pedigree comes forward and says he bought the book from Ewert or if Pedigree says it was Ewert, then you've got something.

[tth2]

This isn't a court of criminal law. I don't have to prove anything beyond a reasonable doubt. There is enough circumstantial evidence here to create probable cause.

[jbud73]

Well I've kinda sat back and watch this one develop - I must say thanks gents it made for interesting reading between doing some research on the UN Charter clauses - which can be extremely dry.

 

Comments:

 

1. Now the speculation is onto who did what to whom, or it (a comic) as it were in the case. Would it surprise me if indeedy this was a TB/JE submission? Not in the slightest. Regardless I'm sure it will come out sooner or later - I'm more interested in precedent (been spending too much time around Scott - Jesus I'm starting to feel like a lawyer)

 

You see during the who pressing debate, debacle there was a lot of talk about, "well it doesnt bother me so I don't care if its resto." But what I think this glosses over is the precedent it sets. See I think the mentality is akin to "Well we can press out certain defects and still get a Blue Label. I wonder what else we can do to improve a book and still ring in True Blue? ANd it seems we are poised to find out what that something else is.

 

2. sfilosa will often point out that, even with the things that go on here and there, we are better off that previously was the case without CGC. Now I think the advent of CGC is a good thing, however I'm not so sure about this point Steve. A few things I think about are. "We dont know so much more now because once it goes into the Plastic Coffin a lot is taken for granted about the book, its almost like case closed - which is potential dangerous. Secondly, the stakes are higher now. HG books have always brought a premium and a multiple, but never has it been greater than today across a wide spectrum of books. So I wonder is the net utility all that much greater than it was previously when all factors are taken into account. Maybe yes, but I think not as much as some would like us to believe.

 

3. I too echo FFB (Scott's) sentiments - I will wait and see how Steve and the gang handle this. They have been quick to remedy big blunders before. But this book considering who may have subbed it and the circles it travelled in has the potential to be a very big issue.

 

Short points.

 

- personally I'm more horrified about the staple replacement inconsistency.

 

- Just because Brulato has killer books doesnt make him and less likely, or more likely to attempt anything. Hammer has a great collection too dont kid yourself.

 

- Remind me not to [embarrassing lack of self control] off Tim Hui (sp? sorry Tim) or Redhook, they sure had the dander up on this topic. Dont worry Tim most of these insufficiently_thoughtful_persons only Tamper with Marvels the DCs seem safer for now.

 

- JC's point about "I told you so" made me

 

- Steve Peds arent safer I fear to say. I mean this hobby has a highly documented history of CT to the Church books. Trust me the Peds are HUGE targets. I still love them though and you need to buy more of them, if nothing else than to save them from getting tampered with.

[Rip]

[tth2]

- personally I'm more horrified about the staple replacement inconsistency.

I found that pretty shocking too, but that issue slipped between the cracks for me once Brad showed me the FF 9.

 

Tim Hui (sp? sorry Tim)

 

Dont worry Tim most of these insufficiently_thoughtful_persons only Tamper with Marvels the DCs seem safer for now.

Faint consolation indeed, if indeed it's true. I think there've been a few big ticket SA DC press and resub jobs.

 

- Steve Peds arent safer I fear to say. I mean this hobby has a highly documented history of CT to the Church books. Trust me the Peds are HUGE targets. I still love them though and you need to buy more of them, if nothing else than to save them from getting tampered with.

Tom Hanlin/Linmoth actually made a great point that the structural integrity of pedigrees such as the PCs in fact make them great candidates for pressing (and presumably for more extreme forms of restoration), because the flaws in them tend to be so minor. People shouldn't get a false sense of security that a pedigreed book means it hasn't been tampered with.

[Aman619]

Im getting a headache........