Star Wars Comic No. 1 Hoard 0

[Topnotchman]

I noticed that the new Overstreet still has Cerebus 1 in 9.2 ahead of Hulk 181 in 9.2. Just in case someone was wondering.

 

 

[rjrjr]

Does anyone else feel like the OP just whacked a hornet's nest and ran away?

 

Here's how I see it:

 

The number of copies of Star Wars #1 (1977) for sale on eBay has usually been very high. This year, many of those copies began to dry up including the 9.8s. If the OP listed all his CGC books at once, I doubt it would have much effect on the long term prices for Star Wars #1 right now. Currently, issues are being bought up and tucked away into collections, set aside for resale, etc. But it is not just Star Wars #1 that is seeing movement, all of the original Marvel run is seeing significant movement:

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Star-Wars-Marvel-77-Complete-Set-1-107-Annuals-1-3-Return-of-the-Jedi-1-4-/171806692041?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item28007a12c9

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Star-Wars-1-107-Complete-Annuals-1-3-Extras-High-Grade-2-42-68-/251979298011?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3aab22f4db

http://www.ebay.com/itm/MARVEL-COMICS-STAR-WARS-complete-original-1970s-series-1-107-Near-Mint-EXTRAS-/131494349786?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e9dac8bda

http://www.ebay.com/itm/MARVEL-STAR-WARS-COMICS-COMPLETE-ISSUES-1-107-ANNUALS-1-3-RETURN-JEDI-1-4-1977-/161730244228?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25a7dfae84

 

I bought a couple of NM complete runs about 3-4 years ago for about $250 each. At the time, I thought I overpaid.

 

The prices realized for these lots are astonishing:

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/STAR-WARS-6-Lot-of-10-1st-Prints-Near-Mint-CGC-Quality-/151655082243?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item234f58e903

http://www.ebay.com/itm/STAR-WARS-3-Lot-of-10-1st-Prints-Near-Mint-CGC-Quality-/161678374105?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25a4c834d9

http://www.ebay.com/itm/STAR-WARS-5-Lot-of-10-1st-Prints-Near-Mint-CGC-Quality-/151655081418?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item234f58e5ca

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRONZE-COPPER-AGE-LOT-OF-FORTY-ONE-41-STAR-WARS-MOSTLY-DEALER-STOCK-/261879603559?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cf93da167

http://www.ebay.com/itm/STAR-WARS-BRONZE-COPPER-AGE-LOT-OF-THIRTY-TWO-32-DEALER-STOCK-/371369956839?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item56775fd5e7

 

All of the NM or better copies of Star Wars #1 (1977) don't equal the total number of copies of Star Wars #1 (2015) that are out there. If you are paying attention, many of those 2015 copies are also being swallowed up by collectors/speculators/etc. I would have guess the glut of variants would have turned off buyers, but they seem to be taking that glut in stride and absorbing the supply. It is a Star Wars sellers market right now and I don't see that ending until after the new movie is released, at the earliest, and probably much longer.

 

I'm seeing record prices for many, many Star Wars comics that just sat on eBay for years. For example, the DF copies of Dark Horse comics have been moving upwards in price. Sales like this are astonishing:

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Star-Wars-Jedi-VS-Sith-1-Dynamic-Forces-Gold-Foil-Numbered-Variant-COA-Dark-/131543811670?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1ea09f4656

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Star-Wars-Jedi-Vs-Sith-2001-1-Dynamic-Forces-Variant-Dark-Horse-Comics-/161728338909?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25a7c29bdd

 

That was a $10 - 15 book for many, many years.

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rare-Star-Wars-Jedi-Council-1-Dynamic-Forces-Exclusive-Photo-Cover-Mint-COA-/301649094341?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item463bafe6c5

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Star-Wars-Jedi-Council-Acts-of-War-1-Dynamic-Forces-photo-variant-/321711091013?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ae779ad45

 

This book was a $5 book.

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Star-wars-Dark-Empire-II-Gold-1-6-N-M-Key-issue-Sold-Out-New-Jedi-Solo-children-/221786904415?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item33a387975f

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Star-Wars-Dark-Empire-II-Gold-edition-1-6-NM-/161729951197?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25a7db35dd

 

This was a $30 - 50 set not too long ago.

 

I'm seeing many Dark Horse issues realize prices that are amazing.

 

Overall, Star Wars #1 (1977) in 9.8 isn't the only book seeing substantial movement. Many, many Star Wars comics are seeing movement whereas in years past they just sat.

[CAHokie]

I just assumed the OP was a shill having fun.

[kav]

I see a bubble ripe for popping. Something not rare in HG going for big bucks.

[rjrjr]

With that said, the collectors buying the new variants for high prices are the ones who are being fleeced. This comic sold for $1000 original through DCBS:

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Star-Wars-1-Joe-Quesada-sketch-variant-1-500-2015-new-CGC-9-8-/271894056838?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item3f4e260f86

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Star-Wars-1-1-500-Quesada-Sketch-Variant-CGC-9-8-/181718978541?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a4f4b8fed

http://www.ebay.com/itm/STAR-WARS-1-JOE-QUESADA-1-500-SKETCH-VARIANT-MARVEL-COMICS-NM-/111646973332?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19fead9d94

 

it goes for about 1/3rd of what it "retailed" for.

 

Numerous examples of these "rarer" variants dropping in price. It use to be a 1:50 ratio would be a $50 book. Nowadays, I think it more a $20-25 book. 1:10 is a $5 book. 1:20 is a $10 book. 1:100 is a $50 book. And so on. The flood of variants has led to a lower "floor" for these ratio'd books.

 

 

Edited July 14, 2015 by rjrjr

[jaeldubyoo]

I just assumed the OP was a shill having fun.

 

Even if he was a shill, he's not far from the truth as far as it being possible. I find the situation plausible.

[rjrjr]

I see a bubble ripe for popping. Something not rare in HG going for big bucks.

 

Wouldn't that describe most of the domestic (i.e. U.S.) comic market though?

 

There seem to be no end to collectors with deep pockets.

Edited July 14, 2015 by rjrjr

[kav]

I see a bubble ripe for popping. Something not rare in HG going for big bucks.

 

Wouldn't that describe most of the domestic (i.e. U.S.) comic market though?

Any book after 1970 going for more than $800 except for a few exceptions yes

[rjrjr]

I see a bubble ripe for popping. Something not rare in HG going for big bucks.

 

Wouldn't that describe most of the domestic (i.e. U.S.) comic market though?

Any book after 1970 going for more than $800 except for a few exceptions yes

 

Why though? What is this stigma with post 1970s comics selling for more than $800 if there is demand for them? Hasn't AF15 shown us that supply and demand is more relevant than age?

[Sqeggs]

I just assumed the OP was a shill having fun.

 

Kind of a reverse shill, though, because if we believed him we would be less likely to bid up 9.8s.

 

I thought from the start that he was legit but overly optimistic about the grades. My guess is the books will come back in the 8.0 to 9.0 range. Perhaps they already have and that's why he stopped posting.

[kav]

I see a bubble ripe for popping. Something not rare in HG going for big bucks.

 

Wouldn't that describe most of the domestic (i.e. U.S.) comic market though?

Any book after 1970 going for more than $800 except for a few exceptions yes

 

Why though? What is this stigma with post 1970s comics selling for more than $800 if there is demand for them? Hasn't AF15 shown us that supply and demand is more relevant than age?

 

After around 1970 people started seeing comics as valuable and tucking them away after buying them. Previous to that AF 15 etc could be read and thrown away.

[Jaydogrules]

I see a bubble ripe for popping. Something not rare in HG going for big bucks.

 

+1

 

I pointed out the problems with the rampant shilling on this book literally months ago. It looks like it's gotten so obvious and epidemic that even the apologists can't deny it anymore.

 

-J.

[Jaydogrules]

 

If this is how simply the market worked then literally almost no price for a 9.8 copy would be "too high" (and fear not, there are far, far more than the 350, 9.8 copies out there than we see on the census now, which are already far, far more 9.8 copies than every other bona fide Bronze Age key)..

 

-J.

 

The are 346 9.8s of all flavors of Star Wars #1.

 

There are 373 Spectacular Spiderman #1s.

 

There are 150 Nova #1s.

 

There are 99 Ms. Marvel #1s, although Ms. Marvel is a late player to the game.

 

There are 210 X-Men #121s.

 

(And this all assumes no duplication!)

 

I don't know if that is "far, far more 9.8 copies than every other bona fide BA key", but Star Wars #1 has been the most important book of 1977 since the beginning. Of course, it's going to have more higher grade copies than most....but it still doesn't beat PPSS #1.

 

It probably will...but a lot of the other "bona fide Bronze Age keys" from this era still aren't worth slabbing.

 

When I say "bona fide keys" I am referring to books that indeed are (and have been) slab worthy in nearly every grade other than 9.6/9.8 since the advent of CGC. (I don't consider PPSM to be a "key" either BTW, and I'm a foaming at the mouth Spider-man fan).

 

In that regards, SW 1 blows every other book out of the water with its copious amounts of 9.8's that have already been slabbed even prior to the speculative movie hype that has bloated its apparent "FMV" to its current levels. Here's just a small sampling for comparison:

 

ASM 129, 9.8's- 93

 

IH 181, 9.8's- 26

 

GL 76, 9.8's- 2

 

X Men 94, 9.8's- 26

 

Conan, 9.8's- 37

 

WWBN 32, 9.8's- 11

 

TOD 10, 9.8's- 24

 

Marvel Spotlight 5, 9.8's - 2

 

 

Star Wars 1, 9.8's- 346

 

In many cases the tremendous amounts of SW 1, 9.8's exceed those keys books' numbers in 9.8, 9.6, 9.4, etc. combined.

 

-J.

 

 

There is a phenomenal, substantive, massive shift in collecting dynamics that had happened by 1977. Every single book you cite is from 1975 or prior, and NONE OF THEM ARE #1s except Conan #1, which came out in an entirely different mindframe, 1970.

 

No, you're never going to see "X-Men #94" in anywhere near the numbers of Star Wars #1 in 9.8.

 

Star Wars #1 was a #1, smack dab in the middle of the era when #1s were all the rage.

 

Star Wars #1 was nearly an immediate colossal success, ensuring that high grade copies would be safely tucked away for a long time.

 

Every book you mentioned except Conan #1 was essentially ignored by the hobby of the day, slowly succumbing to attrition over years and sometimes decades.

 

Why, then, would it be a surprise that, under these conditions, Star Wars #1 would have a far higher survival rate than the books you mentioned?

 

It's apples to welding goggles.

 

This is all well and good, but it only takes one book to completely undermine most of your statements- GSXM 1.

 

It is a "#1" issue, it is post 1975, it has been a well entrenched bona fide BA key for decades, and even it has "only" 128 copies in 9.8 on the census.

 

That's about one-third of SW 1 and the books came out less than what, a year and a half apart from each other.

 

There's no two ways about it, SW 1 is outrageously common in a 9.8.

 

-J.

 

 

[lou_fine]

Actually, if you check Google, it is relatively easy to find out the shipped dates and on-sale dates for the Star Wars comic book, which are as follows:

 

1) Star Wars #1 had a shipped date of March 8th and an on-sale date of April 12th;

 

2) Star Wars #2 had a shipped date of April 12th and an on-sale date of May 10th; while

 

3) Star Wars #3 had a shipped date of May 10th and an on-sale date of June 7th.

 

Since the Star Wars movie was not released until May 25th, this means that the first 2 issues were already out on the newsstand well prior to the movie's release. With a shipped date of May 10th for SW 3, this means that comic shops probably did not increase their initial orders for the Star Wars comic book due to the popularity of the movie until issue #4.

 

Star Wars was 1977, not 2007. The direct market barely existed and certainly wasn't influential to the point that print runs were based on initial orders from specialty shops.

 

Of course I was not referring to sending the request all the way up the ladder so that the print run could be increased. I was referring to only increasing the number of copies to be shipped to the individual comic shops, if requested.

 

Do you remember those print distribution and copies sold statistics which they used to have in all of the comics once a year. Needless to say, the sell-through rates on almost all of the titles were actually pretty abysmal. There were probably more unsold copies sitting in the distribution warehouses than there were sold copies sitting in the hands of collectors and purchasers.

 

So, no increase in the actual print runs. More a case of increasing the shipments to the comic shops as requested through better allocation of the initial distribution along with processing reorder requests by the comic shops from unsold returns from the newsstand stores.

 

 

 

[kav]

Sold my copy that was about an 8.5 about a year ago-got $20

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

If this is how simply the market worked then literally almost no price for a 9.8 copy would be "too high" (and fear not, there are far, far more than the 350, 9.8 copies out there than we see on the census now, which are already far, far more 9.8 copies than every other bona fide Bronze Age key)..

 

-J.

 

The are 346 9.8s of all flavors of Star Wars #1.

 

There are 373 Spectacular Spiderman #1s.

 

There are 150 Nova #1s.

 

There are 99 Ms. Marvel #1s, although Ms. Marvel is a late player to the game.

 

There are 210 X-Men #121s.

 

(And this all assumes no duplication!)

 

I don't know if that is "far, far more 9.8 copies than every other bona fide BA key", but Star Wars #1 has been the most important book of 1977 since the beginning. Of course, it's going to have more higher grade copies than most....but it still doesn't beat PPSS #1.

 

It probably will...but a lot of the other "bona fide Bronze Age keys" from this era still aren't worth slabbing.

 

When I say "bona fide keys" I am referring to books that indeed are (and have been) slab worthy in nearly every grade other than 9.6/9.8 since the advent of CGC. (I don't consider PPSM to be a "key" either BTW, and I'm a foaming at the mouth Spider-man fan).

 

In that regards, SW 1 blows every other book out of the water with its copious amounts of 9.8's that have already been slabbed even prior to the speculative movie hype that has bloated its apparent "FMV" to its current levels. Here's just a small sampling for comparison:

 

ASM 129, 9.8's- 93

 

IH 181, 9.8's- 26

 

GL 76, 9.8's- 2

 

X Men 94, 9.8's- 26

 

Conan, 9.8's- 37

 

WWBN 32, 9.8's- 11

 

TOD 10, 9.8's- 24

 

Marvel Spotlight 5, 9.8's - 2

 

 

Star Wars 1, 9.8's- 346

 

In many cases the tremendous amounts of SW 1, 9.8's exceed those keys books' numbers in 9.8, 9.6, 9.4, etc. combined.

 

-J.

 

 

There is a phenomenal, substantive, massive shift in collecting dynamics that had happened by 1977. Every single book you cite is from 1975 or prior, and NONE OF THEM ARE #1s except Conan #1, which came out in an entirely different mindframe, 1970.

 

No, you're never going to see "X-Men #94" in anywhere near the numbers of Star Wars #1 in 9.8.

 

Star Wars #1 was a #1, smack dab in the middle of the era when #1s were all the rage.

 

Star Wars #1 was nearly an immediate colossal success, ensuring that high grade copies would be safely tucked away for a long time.

 

Every book you mentioned except Conan #1 was essentially ignored by the hobby of the day, slowly succumbing to attrition over years and sometimes decades.

 

Why, then, would it be a surprise that, under these conditions, Star Wars #1 would have a far higher survival rate than the books you mentioned?

 

It's apples to welding goggles.

 

This is all well and good, but it only takes one book to completely undermine most of your statements- GSXM 1.

 

It is a "#1" issue, it is post 1975, it has been a well entrenched bona fide BA key for decades, and even it has "only" 128 copies in 9.8 on the census.

 

1. GSXM #1 is a squarebound book. Squarebound books are their own beasts entirely.

 

2. As I said up there, 1975 was a cutoff point, of sorts, for #1s.

 

3. Also as I said up there, X-Men did a slow burn until about 1978 (heh. Slow burn.) It had several years of attrition to get banged up. In 1976, GSXM #1 was worth the same as GS Defenders #1 (in fact, in the 1978 OPG, GSXM #1 is $1.80 in Mint, and GS Defenders #1 is $2.25.)

 

That's about one-third of SW 1 and the books came out less than what, a year and a half apart from each other.

 

No. The books came out fully two years apart. X-Men #94 has an August, 1975 cover date, SW #1 has a July, 1977 cover date, and GSXM #1 has a "Summer 1975" cover date, making at least two years between GSXM #1 and SW #1. Details, yes, but important ones.

 

There's no two ways about it, SW 1 is outrageously common in a 9.8.

 

-J.

 

 

Compared to the books you listed? Absolutely.

 

Compared to the average 1976-1979 Marvel #1?

 

No, not at all.

[shadroch]

Maestro Net offered a lot of, I believe, six hundred copies of what they promoted as the best of the best copies of SW#1. They supposedly came from an undistributed hoard of several thousand.

[NewWorldOrder]

Would you mind sharing what you got for the 9.8 ?

 

I had one on eBay for a bit at $2000 or best offer for 30 days. This comic is very prone to manipulation. I only received a few offers, the high being $1200 or so although ones in auctions were as high as my buy it now option. Giving proof they were very manipulated. I have 100% feedback so it is not like mine was avoided for low feedback or negative feedback. I wound up selling them through direct sales locally for $1700 each.

 

The feedback here has been very wise. Trickle them out. It would have been wiser to trickle them onto the census but that's after the fact and I'm sure others have stock as you do. So it will rise greatly indeed but I suspect the sooner they are sold the better at this point.

 

Probably one of the most "manipulated" books on the market right now.

 

-J.

 

 

Hulk #1 by a landslide.

 

The difference is Hulk #1 cant get lower because the manipulation is now the new price going forward.

Edited July 14, 2015 by SPECTRE_nWo

[NewWorldOrder]

I am not really understanding why anyone remotely thinks this effects the Star Wars #1 market. Last sale shilled or not was $2350 for a Star Wars #1 CGC 9.8.

 

The OP is very vague about the actual grading scale of these supposed 100 copies.

 

I am pretty sure they won't be a 100 CGC 9.8's so who cares.

 

Star Wars in now set for the next 10 years so this book shilled or not ain't losing steam anytime soon.

 

At SDCC this weekend SW #1 (and #42) was asked about more than ever.

 

NM #98 is common as dirt but the supply is still not keeping up with the demand so the same thing could happen here.

 

Walking Dead #1 was show manipulated big time, and that book has double the 9.8's in the census and is still holding up strong. Most SW #'1's are not 9.8 quality so with the millions of Star Wars fans I am pretty sure the book will handle a couple hundred more copies per month on the census just fine.

Edited July 14, 2015 by SPECTRE_nWo

[lou_fine]

 

I remember the Star Wars comic book did not catch on until issue #3 was out or around the time the movie debuted. I remember Star Wars #1 were already going for $10 or more at the time.

 

$10 by late May? That would be quite a shocking price (equivalent to a $2.95 cover price book being $100 in two months today.)

 

Ok, probably not late May then, more like June after the fans had found out how popular the movie was.

 

What's so unbelievable about a scorching hot book being at the equivalent of $100 after a few months? Have we forgotten about some of the early Valiants along with some of the Wizard driven hot books once they got their hype machine running at full speed.

 

It's a case of when you are hot, you are hot, and Star Wars was indeed hot back then after it first came out. Why, even Overstreet had the book listed at something like $5 in his price guide and we all know how slow Bob is when it comes to raising prices on books, especially on new ones.