Amazing Spider-Man 667 1:100 Dell'Otto Variant

[N/A]

Aren't we all friends? Or at least some level of an acquaintance.

 

[kinzebac]

What a read.

 

This.

 

I stumbled upon this and can't take my eyes off of it.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Since this was brought up, I think this is an excellent opportunity to demonstrate how misinformation, whether major or minor, whether by accident or deliberately, can lead people to irrational, unreasonable conclusions.

 

Let's consider, for a moment, what "recalledcomics.com" has said about ASM #667, in the light of reason:

 

The Amazing Spider-Man #666 "Spider-Island Prologue: The One And Only" was seriously hyped with it's #SpiderIsland hash tag and numerous variants, with an overall world-wide print run of around 150,000 direct editions.

 

Couple of errors and presumptions, one significant, one probably nit-picky and not so significant.

 

First is this: "around 150,000 direct editions." Actually, there were 139,500 (or 135,568, depending on which numbers you use) copies, as reported by Diamond (which is, itself, an estimation), but 139,500 is quite a bit different from "around 150,000", although, ok, we can round up...a bit. But there's no need to be vague, when we know what Diamond reports, and since Diamond holds a monopoly on the Direct market, we can know with precision, or, at least, the precision that Diamond gives us, the numbers.

 

Now, let's consider the phrase "world-wide print run." We are talking about the ENGLISH edition of the book. There are, of course, many foreign editions of many foreign books. Those aren't relevant here, because they aren't included in the numbers we know.

 

So, they say "world-wide"...well, ok, that can technically be true, but the reality is, this book is printed for English readers (who, themselves, are certainly world-wide), so saying "world-wide" is a bit of a mischaracterization. It's really just the first, initial, "regular" edition of the book. The book was printed in one place, and distributed, by Diamond, to customers, the vast majority of whom were in North America. But saying "world-wide" gives the book some gravitas that is, frankly, undeserved.

 

There have been, since then, several reprintings of this book in other languages, but that isn't accounted for in these numbers.

 

As explained before, it's not reasonable to say there were "numerous variants" to this book, when there was only ONE variant available to retailers at the time of ordering, along with the regular book: the store variant (which could be either the Bugle or the Lizard cover.)

 

The other variants (Fan Expo and Midtown) were only available through those venues, and did not figure into the ordering of the book by every other location.

 

And, for those who didn't order the store variant, there were no other variants available until the second printing variant, which was some weeks after the fact.

 

With the initial hype over, #667 seems to have taken a big hit with much lower pre-orders and a print run of around 80,000 direct editions world-wide (almost half that of #666!).

 

Here we get into some downright misinformation. First, "recalledcomics.com" does NOT take into account that 140 stores ordered the store variants...with its minimum requirement of 500 copies of that variant....which accounts for at least 70,000 additional copies!

 

And that's assuming every store only ordered the minimum, which certainly isn't the case. So, if we take 70,000 from the figure of 139,500....we arrive at a print run of about 65,000 to 69,500....which is actually less than the print run for issue #667 (73,500 or 71,235, depending on which numbers you use.)

 

That's actually quite a difference from "about 80,000 direct editions world-wide" (there's that "world-wide" again.)

 

So, right off the bat, "recalledcomics.com", without even bothering (or, perhaps not even knowing) to explain that a huge portion of those numbers were taken up by the store variants, makes it seem as if the orders for #667 fell precipitously...when, in fact, they were actually UP over the previous issue, when the store variants aren't taken into account (something that Jay didn't take into account, either.)

 

That's a BIG problem! Context is absolutely critical, and without that context, it's easy to jump to some very erroneous conclusions (like the so-called "variant fatigue.")

 

They say "almost half that of #666", and while that is technically true, it doesn't at all attempt to explain why that is, or how it came about. The book wasn't some super-special, gotta have it, crazy ordered book...it was, in fact, about average as far as ASM sales were going at the time.

 

But there's more...

 

The 1:100 Dellotto variant of #667 seems very difficult to get hold of; for a start it was a 1:100 dealer incentive variant but the numbers available seem much lower than expected hence it looks like dealers were just not ordering as many batches of 100 for #667. It is very hard to estimate numbers for the variant, normally it would be around 500, given the print run,

 

This is a mischaracterization of the retailer incentive variant program at Marvel, the typical misunderstanding that print run is tied to distribution. It is not, and never has been. Again, more misinformation that people who don't know any better just take as truth.

 

"Normally it would be around 500, given the print run"...where does "recalledcomics.com" come up with that number? Marvel doesn't release its print run info for variants, so....where did that come from? Thin air?

 

And "given the print run"....? As said many, many times, the print run of the regular version has (almost) nothing to do with the print run of the variants, especially the retailer incentive variant.

 

It is false information, presented as fact, with no explanation as to why.

 

. but these seem far too scarce and there could be as little as 200 in circulation.

 

Actually, and this is a bit nit-picky, for sure, but there are ZERO copies "in circulation." "Circulation means "circulating", not "sitting in collections."

 

And, again...how would they know? Marvel does not print books at these numbers, and never has. Typically, the lowest print run for a variant to be cost effective is 700-1000. Not that other publishers don't print in those numbers...they do, and have....but Marvel has not, at least, not according to any documentation that is public.

 

In mid September 2015, the CGC census had only 19 recorded gradings of these so only a small number had been through CGC's doors at that point in time, which is a suprisingly small number.

 

Why?

 

There have only been 27 copies of the Martin Variant cover for ASM #648

 

"But, it's not worth that much, so no one's going to slab it!" - true, but if the argument is being made that people are slabbing to COLLECT, rather than SELL, as is being made with ASM #667, then it works both ways.

 

After all....as has been said here, if the book is in the hands of collectors who have no intention of selling, the census is totally irrelevant. Likewise, if the book is sitting, undistributed, in someone's office (like the 3,000 or so copies of Spiderman #1 Platinum that New Dimension bought a decade ago, 15 years after release) then they won't be on the census, either.

 

Misinformation leads to bad conclusions.

 

[Jaydogrules]

Since this was brought up, I think this is an excellent opportunity to demonstrate how misinformation, whether major or minor, whether by accident or deliberately, can lead people to irrational, unreasonable conclusions.

 

Let's consider, for a moment, what "recalledcomics.com" has said about ASM #667, in the light of reason:

 

The Amazing Spider-Man #666 "Spider-Island Prologue: The One And Only" was seriously hyped with it's #SpiderIsland hash tag and numerous variants, with an overall world-wide print run of around 150,000 direct editions.

 

Couple of errors and presumptions, one significant, one probably nit-picky and not so significant.

 

First is this: "around 150,000 direct editions." Actually, there were 139,500 (or 135,568, depending on which numbers you use) copies, as reported by Diamond (which is, itself, an estimation), but 139,500 is quite a bit different from "around 150,000", although, ok, we can round up...a bit. But there's no need to be vague, when we know what Diamond reports, and since Diamond holds a monopoly on the Direct market, we can know with precision, or, at least, the precision that Diamond gives us, the numbers.

 

Now, let's consider the phrase "world-wide print run." We are talking about the ENGLISH edition of the book. There are, of course, many foreign editions of many foreign books. Those aren't relevant here, because they aren't included in the numbers we know.

 

So, they say "world-wide"...well, ok, that can technically be true, but the reality is, this book is printed for English readers (who, themselves, are certainly world-wide), so saying "world-wide" is a bit of a mischaracterization. It's really just the first, initial, "regular" edition of the book. The book was printed in one place, and distributed, by Diamond, to customers, the vast majority of whom were in North America. But saying "world-wide" gives the book some gravitas that is, frankly, undeserved.

 

There have been, since then, several reprintings of this book in other languages, but that isn't accounted for in these numbers.

 

As explained before, it's not reasonable to say there were "numerous variants" to this book, when there was only ONE variant available to retailers at the time of ordering, along with the regular book: the store variant (which could be either the Bugle or the Lizard cover.)

 

The other variants (Fan Expo and Midtown) were only available through those venues, and did not figure into the ordering of the book by every other location.

 

And, for those who didn't order the store variant, there were no other variants available until the second printing variant, which was some weeks after the fact.

 

With the initial hype over, #667 seems to have taken a big hit with much lower pre-orders and a print run of around 80,000 direct editions world-wide (almost half that of #666!).

 

Here we get into some downright misinformation. First, "recalledcomics.com" does NOT take into account that 140 stores ordered the store variants...with its minimum requirement of 500 copies of that variant....which accounts for at least 70,000 additional copies!

 

And that's assuming every store only ordered the minimum, which certainly isn't the case. So, if we take 70,000 from the figure of 139,500....we arrive at a print run of about 65,000 to 69,500....which is actually less than the print run for issue #667 (73,500 or 71,235, depending on which numbers you use.)

 

That's actually quite a difference from "about 80,000 direct editions world-wide" (there's that "world-wide" again.)

 

So, right off the bat, "recalledcomics.com", without even bothering (or, perhaps not even knowing) to explain that a huge portion of those numbers were taken up by the store variants, makes it seem as if the orders for #667 fell precipitously...when, in fact, they were actually UP over the previous issue, when the store variants aren't taken into account (something that Jay didn't take into account, either.)

 

That's a BIG problem! Context is absolutely critical, and without that context, it's easy to jump to some very erroneous conclusions (like the so-called "variant fatigue.")

 

They say "almost half that of #666", and while that is technically true, it doesn't at all attempt to explain why that is, or how it came about. The book wasn't some super-special, gotta have it, crazy ordered book...it was, in fact, about average as far as ASM sales were going at the time.

 

But there's more...

 

The 1:100 Dellotto variant of #667 seems very difficult to get hold of; for a start it was a 1:100 dealer incentive variant but the numbers available seem much lower than expected hence it looks like dealers were just not ordering as many batches of 100 for #667. It is very hard to estimate numbers for the variant, normally it would be around 500, given the print run,

 

This is a mischaracterization of the retailer incentive variant program at Marvel, the typical misunderstanding that print run is tied to distribution. It is not, and never has been. Again, more misinformation that people who don't know any better just take as truth.

 

"Normally it would be around 500, given the print run"...where does "recalledcomics.com" come up with that number? Marvel doesn't release its print run info for variants, so....where did that come from? Thin air?

 

And "given the print run"....? As said many, many times, the print run of the regular version has (almost) nothing to do with the print run of the variants, especially the retailer incentive variant.

 

It is false information, presented as fact, with no explanation as to why.

 

. but these seem far too scarce and there could be as little as 200 in circulation.

 

Actually, and this is a bit nit-picky, for sure, but there are ZERO copies "in circulation." "Circulation means "circulating", not "sitting in collections."

 

And, again...how would they know? Marvel does not print books at these numbers, and never has. Typically, the lowest print run for a variant to be cost effective is 700-1000. Not that other publishers don't print in those numbers...they do, and have....but Marvel has not, at least, not according to any documentation that is public.

 

In mid September 2015, the CGC census had only 19 recorded gradings of these so only a small number had been through CGC's doors at that point in time, which is a suprisingly small number.

 

Why?

 

There have only been 27 copies of the Martin Variant cover for ASM #648

 

"But, it's not worth that much, so no one's going to slab it!" - true, but if the argument is being made that people are slabbing to COLLECT, rather than SELL, as is being made with ASM #667, then it works both ways.

 

After all....as has been said here, if the book is in the hands of collectors who have no intention of selling, the census is totally irrelevant. Likewise, if the book is sitting, undistributed, in someone's office (like the 3,000 or so copies of Spiderman #1 Platinum that New Dimension bought a decade ago, 15 years after release) then they won't be on the census, either.

 

Misinformation leads to bad conclusions.

 

I think you should start your own website.

 

And then you can be the first to alert the masses when that warehouse, office, backyard, tool shack, five pack, box of fruit loops, etc. find actually happens.

 

Talk about baseless speculation and theories...

 

Wowzers!

 

 

-J.

[Prince Namor]

Since this was brought up, I think this is an excellent opportunity to demonstrate how misinformation, whether major or minor, whether by accident or deliberately, can lead people to irrational, unreasonable conclusions.

 

Let's consider, for a moment, what "recalledcomics.com" has said about ASM #667, in the light of reason:

 

The Amazing Spider-Man #666 "Spider-Island Prologue: The One And Only" was seriously hyped with it's #SpiderIsland hash tag and numerous variants, with an overall world-wide print run of around 150,000 direct editions.

 

Couple of errors and presumptions, one significant, one probably nit-picky and not so significant.

 

First is this: "around 150,000 direct editions." Actually, there were 139,500 (or 135,568, depending on which numbers you use) copies, as reported by Diamond (which is, itself, an estimation), but 139,500 is quite a bit different from "around 150,000", although, ok, we can round up...a bit. But there's no need to be vague, when we know what Diamond reports, and since Diamond holds a monopoly on the Direct market, we can know with precision, or, at least, the precision that Diamond gives us, the numbers.

 

Now, let's consider the phrase "world-wide print run." We are talking about the ENGLISH edition of the book. There are, of course, many foreign editions of many foreign books. Those aren't relevant here, because they aren't included in the numbers we know.

 

So, they say "world-wide"...well, ok, that can technically be true, but the reality is, this book is printed for English readers (who, themselves, are certainly world-wide), so saying "world-wide" is a bit of a mischaracterization. It's really just the first, initial, "regular" edition of the book. The book was printed in one place, and distributed, by Diamond, to customers, the vast majority of whom were in North America. But saying "world-wide" gives the book some gravitas that is, frankly, undeserved.

 

There have been, since then, several reprintings of this book in other languages, but that isn't accounted for in these numbers.

 

As explained before, it's not reasonable to say there were "numerous variants" to this book, when there was only ONE variant available to retailers at the time of ordering, along with the regular book: the store variant (which could be either the Bugle or the Lizard cover.)

 

The other variants (Fan Expo and Midtown) were only available through those venues, and did not figure into the ordering of the book by every other location.

 

And, for those who didn't order the store variant, there were no other variants available until the second printing variant, which was some weeks after the fact.

 

With the initial hype over, #667 seems to have taken a big hit with much lower pre-orders and a print run of around 80,000 direct editions world-wide (almost half that of #666!).

 

Here we get into some downright misinformation. First, "recalledcomics.com" does NOT take into account that 140 stores ordered the store variants...with its minimum requirement of 500 copies of that variant....which accounts for at least 70,000 additional copies!

 

And that's assuming every store only ordered the minimum, which certainly isn't the case. So, if we take 70,000 from the figure of 139,500....we arrive at a print run of about 65,000 to 69,500....which is actually less than the print run for issue #667 (73,500 or 71,235, depending on which numbers you use.)

 

That's actually quite a difference from "about 80,000 direct editions world-wide" (there's that "world-wide" again.)

 

So, right off the bat, "recalledcomics.com", without even bothering (or, perhaps not even knowing) to explain that a huge portion of those numbers were taken up by the store variants, makes it seem as if the orders for #667 fell precipitously...when, in fact, they were actually UP over the previous issue, when the store variants aren't taken into account (something that Jay didn't take into account, either.)

 

That's a BIG problem! Context is absolutely critical, and without that context, it's easy to jump to some very erroneous conclusions (like the so-called "variant fatigue.")

 

They say "almost half that of #666", and while that is technically true, it doesn't at all attempt to explain why that is, or how it came about. The book wasn't some super-special, gotta have it, crazy ordered book...it was, in fact, about average as far as ASM sales were going at the time.

 

But there's more...

 

The 1:100 Dellotto variant of #667 seems very difficult to get hold of; for a start it was a 1:100 dealer incentive variant but the numbers available seem much lower than expected hence it looks like dealers were just not ordering as many batches of 100 for #667. It is very hard to estimate numbers for the variant, normally it would be around 500, given the print run,

 

This is a mischaracterization of the retailer incentive variant program at Marvel, the typical misunderstanding that print run is tied to distribution. It is not, and never has been. Again, more misinformation that people who don't know any better just take as truth.

 

"Normally it would be around 500, given the print run"...where does "recalledcomics.com" come up with that number? Marvel doesn't release its print run info for variants, so....where did that come from? Thin air?

 

And "given the print run"....? As said many, many times, the print run of the regular version has (almost) nothing to do with the print run of the variants, especially the retailer incentive variant.

 

It is false information, presented as fact, with no explanation as to why.

 

. but these seem far too scarce and there could be as little as 200 in circulation.

 

Actually, and this is a bit nit-picky, for sure, but there are ZERO copies "in circulation." "Circulation means "circulating", not "sitting in collections."

 

And, again...how would they know? Marvel does not print books at these numbers, and never has. Typically, the lowest print run for a variant to be cost effective is 700-1000. Not that other publishers don't print in those numbers...they do, and have....but Marvel has not, at least, not according to any documentation that is public.

 

In mid September 2015, the CGC census had only 19 recorded gradings of these so only a small number had been through CGC's doors at that point in time, which is a suprisingly small number.

 

Why?

 

There have only been 27 copies of the Martin Variant cover for ASM #648

 

"But, it's not worth that much, so no one's going to slab it!" - true, but if the argument is being made that people are slabbing to COLLECT, rather than SELL, as is being made with ASM #667, then it works both ways.

 

After all....as has been said here, if the book is in the hands of collectors who have no intention of selling, the census is totally irrelevant. Likewise, if the book is sitting, undistributed, in someone's office (like the 3,000 or so copies of Spiderman #1 Platinum that New Dimension bought a decade ago, 15 years after release) then they won't be on the census, either.

 

Misinformation leads to bad conclusions.

 

Very well said.

 

And once again, this has nothing to do with saying the book ISN'T rare - it very well may be, and currently is very difficult to find - but probably NOT because it was underordered through the means laid out here.

[Prince Namor]

Since this was brought up, I think this is an excellent opportunity to demonstrate how misinformation, whether major or minor, whether by accident or deliberately, can lead people to irrational, unreasonable conclusions.

 

Let's consider, for a moment, what "recalledcomics.com" has said about ASM #667, in the light of reason:

 

The Amazing Spider-Man #666 "Spider-Island Prologue: The One And Only" was seriously hyped with it's #SpiderIsland hash tag and numerous variants, with an overall world-wide print run of around 150,000 direct editions.

 

Couple of errors and presumptions, one significant, one probably nit-picky and not so significant.

 

First is this: "around 150,000 direct editions." Actually, there were 139,500 (or 135,568, depending on which numbers you use) copies, as reported by Diamond (which is, itself, an estimation), but 139,500 is quite a bit different from "around 150,000", although, ok, we can round up...a bit. But there's no need to be vague, when we know what Diamond reports, and since Diamond holds a monopoly on the Direct market, we can know with precision, or, at least, the precision that Diamond gives us, the numbers.

 

Now, let's consider the phrase "world-wide print run." We are talking about the ENGLISH edition of the book. There are, of course, many foreign editions of many foreign books. Those aren't relevant here, because they aren't included in the numbers we know.

 

So, they say "world-wide"...well, ok, that can technically be true, but the reality is, this book is printed for English readers (who, themselves, are certainly world-wide), so saying "world-wide" is a bit of a mischaracterization. It's really just the first, initial, "regular" edition of the book. The book was printed in one place, and distributed, by Diamond, to customers, the vast majority of whom were in North America. But saying "world-wide" gives the book some gravitas that is, frankly, undeserved.

 

There have been, since then, several reprintings of this book in other languages, but that isn't accounted for in these numbers.

 

As explained before, it's not reasonable to say there were "numerous variants" to this book, when there was only ONE variant available to retailers at the time of ordering, along with the regular book: the store variant (which could be either the Bugle or the Lizard cover.)

 

The other variants (Fan Expo and Midtown) were only available through those venues, and did not figure into the ordering of the book by every other location.

 

And, for those who didn't order the store variant, there were no other variants available until the second printing variant, which was some weeks after the fact.

 

With the initial hype over, #667 seems to have taken a big hit with much lower pre-orders and a print run of around 80,000 direct editions world-wide (almost half that of #666!).

 

Here we get into some downright misinformation. First, "recalledcomics.com" does NOT take into account that 140 stores ordered the store variants...with its minimum requirement of 500 copies of that variant....which accounts for at least 70,000 additional copies!

 

And that's assuming every store only ordered the minimum, which certainly isn't the case. So, if we take 70,000 from the figure of 139,500....we arrive at a print run of about 65,000 to 69,500....which is actually less than the print run for issue #667 (73,500 or 71,235, depending on which numbers you use.)

 

That's actually quite a difference from "about 80,000 direct editions world-wide" (there's that "world-wide" again.)

 

So, right off the bat, "recalledcomics.com", without even bothering (or, perhaps not even knowing) to explain that a huge portion of those numbers were taken up by the store variants, makes it seem as if the orders for #667 fell precipitously...when, in fact, they were actually UP over the previous issue, when the store variants aren't taken into account (something that Jay didn't take into account, either.)

 

That's a BIG problem! Context is absolutely critical, and without that context, it's easy to jump to some very erroneous conclusions (like the so-called "variant fatigue.")

 

They say "almost half that of #666", and while that is technically true, it doesn't at all attempt to explain why that is, or how it came about. The book wasn't some super-special, gotta have it, crazy ordered book...it was, in fact, about average as far as ASM sales were going at the time.

 

But there's more...

 

The 1:100 Dellotto variant of #667 seems very difficult to get hold of; for a start it was a 1:100 dealer incentive variant but the numbers available seem much lower than expected hence it looks like dealers were just not ordering as many batches of 100 for #667. It is very hard to estimate numbers for the variant, normally it would be around 500, given the print run,

 

This is a mischaracterization of the retailer incentive variant program at Marvel, the typical misunderstanding that print run is tied to distribution. It is not, and never has been. Again, more misinformation that people who don't know any better just take as truth.

 

"Normally it would be around 500, given the print run"...where does "recalledcomics.com" come up with that number? Marvel doesn't release its print run info for variants, so....where did that come from? Thin air?

 

And "given the print run"....? As said many, many times, the print run of the regular version has (almost) nothing to do with the print run of the variants, especially the retailer incentive variant.

 

It is false information, presented as fact, with no explanation as to why.

 

. but these seem far too scarce and there could be as little as 200 in circulation.

 

Actually, and this is a bit nit-picky, for sure, but there are ZERO copies "in circulation." "Circulation means "circulating", not "sitting in collections."

 

And, again...how would they know? Marvel does not print books at these numbers, and never has. Typically, the lowest print run for a variant to be cost effective is 700-1000. Not that other publishers don't print in those numbers...they do, and have....but Marvel has not, at least, not according to any documentation that is public.

 

In mid September 2015, the CGC census had only 19 recorded gradings of these so only a small number had been through CGC's doors at that point in time, which is a suprisingly small number.

 

Why?

 

There have only been 27 copies of the Martin Variant cover for ASM #648

 

"But, it's not worth that much, so no one's going to slab it!" - true, but if the argument is being made that people are slabbing to COLLECT, rather than SELL, as is being made with ASM #667, then it works both ways.

 

After all....as has been said here, if the book is in the hands of collectors who have no intention of selling, the census is totally irrelevant. Likewise, if the book is sitting, undistributed, in someone's office (like the 3,000 or so copies of Spiderman #1 Platinum that New Dimension bought a decade ago, 15 years after release) then they won't be on the census, either.

 

Misinformation leads to bad conclusions.

 

I think you should start your own website.

 

And then you can be the first to alert the masses when that warehouse, office, backyard, tool shack, five pack, box of fruit loops, etc. find actually happens.

 

Talk about baseless speculation and theories...

 

Wowzers!

 

 

-J.

 

He doesn't need to. The knowledge he can give you is free and not designed to sell you comics you don't need.

[Jaydogrules]

If it's free does that mean I can't return it for being unwanted and defective?

 

I kid, I kid.

 

-J.

[oakman29]

Since this was brought up, I think this is an excellent opportunity to demonstrate how misinformation, whether major or minor, whether by accident or deliberately, can lead people to irrational, unreasonable conclusions.

 

Let's consider, for a moment, what "recalledcomics.com" has said about ASM #667, in the light of reason:

 

The Amazing Spider-Man #666 "Spider-Island Prologue: The One And Only" was seriously hyped with it's #SpiderIsland hash tag and numerous variants, with an overall world-wide print run of around 150,000 direct editions.

 

Couple of errors and presumptions, one significant, one probably nit-picky and not so significant.

 

First is this: "around 150,000 direct editions." Actually, there were 139,500 (or 135,568, depending on which numbers you use) copies, as reported by Diamond (which is, itself, an estimation), but 139,500 is quite a bit different from "around 150,000", although, ok, we can round up...a bit. But there's no need to be vague, when we know what Diamond reports, and since Diamond holds a monopoly on the Direct market, we can know with precision, or, at least, the precision that Diamond gives us, the numbers.

 

Now, let's consider the phrase "world-wide print run." We are talking about the ENGLISH edition of the book. There are, of course, many foreign editions of many foreign books. Those aren't relevant here, because they aren't included in the numbers we know.

 

So, they say "world-wide"...well, ok, that can technically be true, but the reality is, this book is printed for English readers (who, themselves, are certainly world-wide), so saying "world-wide" is a bit of a mischaracterization. It's really just the first, initial, "regular" edition of the book. The book was printed in one place, and distributed, by Diamond, to customers, the vast majority of whom were in North America. But saying "world-wide" gives the book some gravitas that is, frankly, undeserved.

 

There have been, since then, several reprintings of this book in other languages, but that isn't accounted for in these numbers.

 

As explained before, it's not reasonable to say there were "numerous variants" to this book, when there was only ONE variant available to retailers at the time of ordering, along with the regular book: the store variant (which could be either the Bugle or the Lizard cover.)

 

The other variants (Fan Expo and Midtown) were only available through those venues, and did not figure into the ordering of the book by every other location.

 

And, for those who didn't order the store variant, there were no other variants available until the second printing variant, which was some weeks after the fact.

 

With the initial hype over, #667 seems to have taken a big hit with much lower pre-orders and a print run of around 80,000 direct editions world-wide (almost half that of #666!).

 

Here we get into some downright misinformation. First, "recalledcomics.com" does NOT take into account that 140 stores ordered the store variants...with its minimum requirement of 500 copies of that variant....which accounts for at least 70,000 additional copies!

 

And that's assuming every store only ordered the minimum, which certainly isn't the case. So, if we take 70,000 from the figure of 139,500....we arrive at a print run of about 65,000 to 69,500....which is actually less than the print run for issue #667 (73,500 or 71,235, depending on which numbers you use.)

 

That's actually quite a difference from "about 80,000 direct editions world-wide" (there's that "world-wide" again.)

 

So, right off the bat, "recalledcomics.com", without even bothering (or, perhaps not even knowing) to explain that a huge portion of those numbers were taken up by the store variants, makes it seem as if the orders for #667 fell precipitously...when, in fact, they were actually UP over the previous issue, when the store variants aren't taken into account (something that Jay didn't take into account, either.)

 

That's a BIG problem! Context is absolutely critical, and without that context, it's easy to jump to some very erroneous conclusions (like the so-called "variant fatigue.")

 

They say "almost half that of #666", and while that is technically true, it doesn't at all attempt to explain why that is, or how it came about. The book wasn't some super-special, gotta have it, crazy ordered book...it was, in fact, about average as far as ASM sales were going at the time.

 

But there's more...

 

The 1:100 Dellotto variant of #667 seems very difficult to get hold of; for a start it was a 1:100 dealer incentive variant but the numbers available seem much lower than expected hence it looks like dealers were just not ordering as many batches of 100 for #667. It is very hard to estimate numbers for the variant, normally it would be around 500, given the print run,

 

This is a mischaracterization of the retailer incentive variant program at Marvel, the typical misunderstanding that print run is tied to distribution. It is not, and never has been. Again, more misinformation that people who don't know any better just take as truth.

 

"Normally it would be around 500, given the print run"...where does "recalledcomics.com" come up with that number? Marvel doesn't release its print run info for variants, so....where did that come from? Thin air?

 

And "given the print run"....? As said many, many times, the print run of the regular version has (almost) nothing to do with the print run of the variants, especially the retailer incentive variant.

 

It is false information, presented as fact, with no explanation as to why.

 

. but these seem far too scarce and there could be as little as 200 in circulation.

 

Actually, and this is a bit nit-picky, for sure, but there are ZERO copies "in circulation." "Circulation means "circulating", not "sitting in collections."

 

And, again...how would they know? Marvel does not print books at these numbers, and never has. Typically, the lowest print run for a variant to be cost effective is 700-1000. Not that other publishers don't print in those numbers...they do, and have....but Marvel has not, at least, not according to any documentation that is public.

 

In mid September 2015, the CGC census had only 19 recorded gradings of these so only a small number had been through CGC's doors at that point in time, which is a suprisingly small number.

 

Why?

 

There have only been 27 copies of the Martin Variant cover for ASM #648

 

"But, it's not worth that much, so no one's going to slab it!" - true, but if the argument is being made that people are slabbing to COLLECT, rather than SELL, as is being made with ASM #667, then it works both ways.

 

After all....as has been said here, if the book is in the hands of collectors who have no intention of selling, the census is totally irrelevant. Likewise, if the book is sitting, undistributed, in someone's office (like the 3,000 or so copies of Spiderman #1 Platinum that New Dimension bought a decade ago, 15 years after release) then they won't be on the census, either.

 

Misinformation leads to bad conclusions.

 

[N/A]

Why don't you believe there may be a warehouse? Do you believe all comics sell through?

[Jaydogrules]

Why don't you believe there may be a warehouse? Do you believe all comics sell through?

 

No. But I don't believe Marvel is storing millions of back issues in some warehouse either. That is a ridiculous myth and would be a spectacular waste of money and space.

 

RMA insists on using Spiderman #1 is an example and that is ridiculous. The book was printed in the millions, even the "rare variant" had a print run in the tens of thousands.

 

To compare that and imply that something similar "could" happen or is even a remote possibility to a book with a print run of as a few as a couple hundred copies is absurdist conjecturing.

 

-J.

[mysterio]

Why don't you believe there may be a warehouse? Do you believe all comics sell through?

 

No. But I don't believe Marvel is storing millions of back issues in some warehouse either. That is a ridiculous myth and would be a spectacular waste of money and space.

 

RMA insists on using Spiderman #1 is an example and that is ridiculous. The book was printed in the millions, even the "rare variant" had a print run in the tens of thousands.

 

To compare that and imply that something similar "could" happen or is even a remote possibility to a book with a print run of as a few as a couple hundred is absurd.

 

-J.

 

And with an alleged print run of "as few as a couple hundred" imagine what would happen if even 20 more copies were located. Or 50. Those don't take up a lot of space.

 

It seems absurd to imply that this is absurd.

[N/A]

Why don't you believe there may be a warehouse? Do you believe all comics sell through?

 

No. But I don't believe Marvel is storing millions of back issues in some warehouse either. That is a ridiculous myth and would be a spectacular waste of money and space.

 

RMA insists on using Spiderman #1 is an example and that is ridiculous. The book was printed in the millions, even the "rare variant" had a print run in the tens of thousands.

 

To compare that and imply that something similar "could" happen or is even a remote possibility to a book with a print run of as a few as a couple hundred copies is absurdist conjecturing.

 

-J.

 

So, do they sell through? If they are not warehousing then what?

[Jaydogrules]

Why don't you believe there may be a warehouse? Do you believe all comics sell through?

 

No. But I don't believe Marvel is storing millions of back issues in some warehouse either. That is a ridiculous myth and would be a spectacular waste of money and space.

 

RMA insists on using Spiderman #1 is an example and that is ridiculous. The book was printed in the millions, even the "rare variant" had a print run in the tens of thousands.

 

To compare that and imply that something similar "could" happen or is even a remote possibility to a book with a print run of as a few as a couple hundred is absurd.

 

-J.

 

And with an alleged print run of "as few as a couple hundred" imagine what would happen if even 20 more copies were located. Or 50. Those don't take up a lot of space.

 

It seems absurd to imply that this is absurd.

 

Yes imagine. It would still be a super rare book. And if the current slab rate continues there might even be 38 copies on the census by the end of 2020.

 

-J.

 

[oakman29]

Why don't you believe there may be a warehouse? Do you believe all comics sell through?

 

No. But I don't believe Marvel is storing millions of back issues in some warehouse either. That is a ridiculous myth and would be a spectacular waste of money and space.

 

RMA insists on using Spiderman #1 is an example and that is ridiculous. The book was printed in the millions, even the "rare variant" had a print run in the tens of thousands.

 

To compare that and imply that something similar "could" happen or is even a remote possibility to a book with a print run of as a few as a couple hundred copies is absurdist conjecturing.

 

-J.

 

So, do they sell through? If they are not warehousing then what?

 

Maybe there are many collectors who didn't get this book slabbed, I know crazy right!

[bababooey]

Maybe there are many collectors who didn't get this book slabbed, I know crazy right!

A what point did you put it in a mylar/fullback though?

 

 

[N/A]

In general, do people believe that all comics sell through?

[Jaydogrules]

Why don't you believe there may be a warehouse? Do you believe all comics sell through?

 

No. But I don't believe Marvel is storing millions of back issues in some warehouse either. That is a ridiculous myth and would be a spectacular waste of money and space.

 

RMA insists on using Spiderman #1 is an example and that is ridiculous. The book was printed in the millions, even the "rare variant" had a print run in the tens of thousands.

 

To compare that and imply that something similar "could" happen or is even a remote possibility to a book with a print run of as a few as a couple hundred copies is absurdist conjecturing.

 

-J.

 

So, do they sell through? If they are not warehousing then what?

 

Whoa did I just make your sig line?

 

I am honored.

 

But unfortunately I cannot answer your question without engaging and completely unfounded speculation. However I would "speculate" that a severe over printing of books probably are stored somewhere temporarily, given out to employees as Christmas bonuses, sold on the secondary market through some source or sources that we will never know about, pulped and destroyed, put in 5 packs, etc. Who knows man. Anything in the world is "possible", but if you or anyone else is under the fantastical belief that this will happen with the ASM 667....well good luck with that.

 

-J.

 

[oakman29]

Maybe there are many collectors who didn't get this book slabbed, I know crazy right!

A what point did you put it in a mylar/fullback though?

 

 

Right away, after I read it of course.

[Jaydogrules]

Why don't you believe there may be a warehouse? Do you believe all comics sell through?

 

No. But I don't believe Marvel is storing millions of back issues in some warehouse either. That is a ridiculous myth and would be a spectacular waste of money and space.

 

RMA insists on using Spiderman #1 is an example and that is ridiculous. The book was printed in the millions, even the "rare variant" had a print run in the tens of thousands.

 

To compare that and imply that something similar "could" happen or is even a remote possibility to a book with a print run of as a few as a couple hundred copies is absurdist conjecturing.

 

-J.

 

So, do they sell through? If they are not warehousing then what?

 

Maybe there are many collectors who didn't get this book slabbed, I know crazy right!

 

Right!

 

Completely ignoring the book's extraordinary values, maybe this is really is the ONE TIME and the ONE BOOK where that didn't happen in the CGC era.

 

 

 

 

Of course that wouldn't explain why virtually no copies ever come up for sale either slabbed or raw though...

 

Ah, the conundrum!

 

-J.

[N/A]

Why don't you believe there may be a warehouse? Do you believe all comics sell through?

 

No. But I don't believe Marvel is storing millions of back issues in some warehouse either. That is a ridiculous myth and would be a spectacular waste of money and space.

 

RMA insists on using Spiderman #1 is an example and that is ridiculous. The book was printed in the millions, even the "rare variant" had a print run in the tens of thousands.

 

To compare that and imply that something similar "could" happen or is even a remote possibility to a book with a print run of as a few as a couple hundred copies is absurdist conjecturing.

 

-J.

 

So, do they sell through? If they are not warehousing then what?

 

Whoa did I just make your sig line?

 

I am honored.

 

But unfortunately I cannot answer your question without engaging and completely unfounded speculation. However I would "speculate" that a severe over printing of books probably are stored somewhere temporarily, given out to employees as Christmas bonuses, sold on the secondary market through some source or sources that we will never know about, pulped and destroyed, put in 5 packs, etc. Who knows man. Anything in the world is "possible", but if you or anyone else is under the fantastical belief that this will happen with the ASM 667....well good luck with that.

 

-J.

 

The sig line seemed appropriate. So it's cheaper to destroy stock or give it away than to warehouse? Seems like selling it would make the most sense.