modern ASM #667 variant sells for $9K

[SquareChaos]

The truth of the matter is that logic is dead. People can spend whatever they want for anything, and anyone questioning the "value" that something holds from a "why" perspective is seen as somehow gross and offensive for daring to "judge" what someone collects - even though these are clearly two very different things.

 

 

Again with this ?

 

Who are you to "judge" anything of what anyone collects ? Why do "you" believe that a cogent explanation of a transaction that makes sense to "you", and submitted for "your" approval or acceptance of something is required to validate the value of anything? This isn't necessarily just directed at you, but- Narcissistic much? It is what it is whether you agree with it or not. Some people collect different things than you. Some people have more than you. Why does that bother you so much ?

 

Reminding you once more that while "your" logic may seem compromised, there are other people who think and collect differently than you.

 

-J.

 

Why does it bother YOU?

 

There are plenty of sales of comics throughout the history of this hobby that are debated and discussed as far as VALUE, which is what THIS book is being judged on by some.

 

Has always gone on. Heck, when that Action #1 sold for $1000 back in the day, people were shocked someone would pay that much for a comic book.

 

Why you think that's wrong to question is both strange and a bit suspect.

 

We get that you want to inflate the value of this book for some reason we don't yet know, but your insistence that anyone questioning it is somehow wrong is...peculiar.

 

When someone buys the first Green Lantern #76 CGC 9.6 or the first New Mutants #98 CGC 9.9, two books at the time that were much more rare than what you're talking about, the exact same questions pop up.... was that a good price to pay? Will there be another copy brought to market? Will it sell for the same type of money as the first one (hold it's value)etc., etc.

 

(The answer was NO and YES and NO, part of the reason why you're 'logic' is hotly debated by some as far as ASM 667 DO variant holding it's value)

 

The truth is, generally speaking, the worst time to buy is when a book is hot, and there a very few copies of it available. Most likely more will show up, demand won't be as high and the price will come down. Everyone here of course knows this, but since most of the board now consists of 'sellers', everyone acts like it some kind of secret and is in constant pump mode.

 

No one's telling you that you can't pump, pump, pump this book. Go for it.

 

But trying to tell others they're narcissistic or wrong to ask is...combative for no reason.

 

You make a definitive value statement on something around here, people are going to question it.

 

As expected and predicted you are conveniently talking around the Bats 608RRP to ASM 667 census correlation that I posted to show each book's rarity factor at the same point in time.

 

Instead you misdirect (again) and accuse me of "pumping" the one copy of this book that I own, and that isn't for sale anywhere , in a sales announcement thread that I did not start. Perhaps in your narcissistic, self-righteous know-it-all psyche somewhere you believe you are performing some kind of "public service" by constantly denigrating this book, and by extension, the fans, admirers, and owners of it. I can assure you that you are not. Your real motives are clear, you are not interested in any good faith debates of any facts and figures presented. You are only interested in trolling the ASM 667 Dell'otto.

 

What a way to spend your day.

 

-J.

 

Don't judge how he spends his day. Are you afraid of how he spends his day? Why do you hate his day? Are you suggesting that how he spends his day drools and how you spend your day rules?

 

For shame.

[Prince Namor]

The truth of the matter is that logic is dead. People can spend whatever they want for anything, and anyone questioning the "value" that something holds from a "why" perspective is seen as somehow gross and offensive for daring to "judge" what someone collects - even though these are clearly two very different things.

 

 

Again with this ?

 

Who are you to "judge" anything of what anyone collects ? Why do "you" believe that a cogent explanation of a transaction that makes sense to "you", and submitted for "your" approval or acceptance of something is required to validate the value of anything? This isn't necessarily just directed at you, but- Narcissistic much? It is what it is whether you agree with it or not. Some people collect different things than you. Some people have more than you. Why does that bother you so much ?

 

Reminding you once more that while "your" logic may seem compromised, there are other people who think and collect differently than you.

 

-J.

 

Why does it bother YOU?

 

There are plenty of sales of comics throughout the history of this hobby that are debated and discussed as far as VALUE, which is what THIS book is being judged on by some.

 

Has always gone on. Heck, when that Action #1 sold for $1000 back in the day, people were shocked someone would pay that much for a comic book.

 

Why you think that's wrong to question is both strange and a bit suspect.

 

We get that you want to inflate the value of this book for some reason we don't yet know, but your insistence that anyone questioning it is somehow wrong is...peculiar.

 

When someone buys the first Green Lantern #76 CGC 9.6 or the first New Mutants #98 CGC 9.9, two books at the time that were much more rare than what you're talking about, the exact same questions pop up.... was that a good price to pay? Will there be another copy brought to market? Will it sell for the same type of money as the first one (hold it's value)etc., etc.

 

(The answer was NO and YES and NO, part of the reason why you're 'logic' is hotly debated by some as far as ASM 667 DO variant holding it's value)

 

The truth is, generally speaking, the worst time to buy is when a book is hot, and there a very few copies of it available. Most likely more will show up, demand won't be as high and the price will come down. Everyone here of course knows this, but since most of the board now consists of 'sellers', everyone acts like it some kind of secret and is in constant pump mode.

 

No one's telling you that you can't pump, pump, pump this book. Go for it.

 

But trying to tell others they're narcissistic or wrong to ask is...combative for no reason.

 

You make a definitive value statement on something around here, people are going to question it.

 

As expected and predicted you are conveniently talking around the Bats 608RRP to ASM 667 census correlation that I posted to show each book's rarity factor at the same point in time.

 

Not talking around it at all. When ASM 667 has 9 more years under it's belt, we'll know how to judge it.

Saying 'in comparison to where Bats was at the same time" is an interesting correlation, but that book was WELL KNOWN at the time. ASM 667 isn't. You've made it more well known by pumping it as much as you have, but this will either, bring more copies out into the open and drive the price down, OR show its true rarity.

Only time will tell.

 

Instead you misdirect (again) and accuse me of "pumping" the one copy of this book that I own, and that isn't for sale anywhere , and a sales announcement thread that I did not start. Perhaps I'm your narcissistic, self-righteous know-it-all head somewhere you believe you are performing some kind of "public service" by constantly denigrating this book, and by extension, the fans, admirers, and owners of it. I can assure you that you are not. Your real motives are clear, you are not interested in any good faith debates of any facts and figures presented. You are only interested in trolling the ASM 667 Dell'otto.

 

Once again, in jay's world, anyone presenting more information to show just how much he doesn't know is met with name calling. Really, of all the active board members here, you truly are the most contentious poster we have. By far.

 

What a way to spend your day.

 

-J.

 

Why are you concerned about how I spend my day? That's kinda weird.

 

 

 

 

[VintageComics]

Once again, in jay's world, anyone presenting more information to show just how much he doesn't know is met with name calling. Really, of all the active board members here, you truly are the most contentious poster we have. By far.

 

The first rule of Fight Club is you never argue with jaydogrules.

 

 

[I like pie]

Once again, in jay's world, anyone presenting more information to show just how much he doesn't know is met with name calling. Really, of all the active board members here, you truly are the most contentious poster we have. By far.

 

The first rule of Fight Club is you never argue with jaydogrules.

 

 

It seriously looks exhausting.

[Lethal_Collector]

This leads me to the following conclusions:

Either

1. This book does exist in the hundreds or thousands but everyone is hoarding theirs or are completely clueless about what they have.

2. There's a bunch of boxes of these stashed away (or were until something happened) in a warehouse somewhere that Marvel, diamond, Q4 printing hasn't gotten around to unloading despite all the hype.

3. There really are less than a few hundred copies.

 

1. Not likely as we recently saw ASM 678 MJ variant get a couple sales records last year, and within a month people unloaded tons of copies on feebay. I snagged one of such copies myself during that time.

 

2. Marvel, DC, Diamond, etc. have to pay taxes on assets of left over inventory which cuts into their bottom lines, especially if it's an 'enormous warehouse' with tons of packs, do you think companies want to keep paying taxes year over year on old inventory? Thats their incentive to sell off their stock asap. Now they do get to deduct the depreciation of the inventory for the first couple years (not certain how many years), but it's been 6 years since this book came out.

 

3. Seems the most logical imo. The census numbers tend to support this and with the ungodly amount of spec and flippers in the wild these days, I think this book is on their radar's. So I agree with Jay on this one until someone else can prove otherwise or have a better explanation, haven't heard it so far.

 

 

Jerome

[Jaydogrules]

The truth of the matter is that logic is dead. People can spend whatever they want for anything, and anyone questioning the "value" that something holds from a "why" perspective is seen as somehow gross and offensive for daring to "judge" what someone collects - even though these are clearly two very different things.

 

 

Again with this ?

 

Who are you to "judge" anything of what anyone collects ? Why do "you" believe that a cogent explanation of a transaction that makes sense to "you", and submitted for "your" approval or acceptance of something is required to validate the value of anything? This isn't necessarily just directed at you, but- Narcissistic much? It is what it is whether you agree with it or not. Some people collect different things than you. Some people have more than you. Why does that bother you so much ?

 

Reminding you once more that while "your" logic may seem compromised, there are other people who think and collect differently than you.

 

-J.

 

Why does it bother YOU?

 

There are plenty of sales of comics throughout the history of this hobby that are debated and discussed as far as VALUE, which is what THIS book is being judged on by some.

 

Has always gone on. Heck, when that Action #1 sold for $1000 back in the day, people were shocked someone would pay that much for a comic book.

 

Why you think that's wrong to question is both strange and a bit suspect.

 

We get that you want to inflate the value of this book for some reason we don't yet know, but your insistence that anyone questioning it is somehow wrong is...peculiar.

 

When someone buys the first Green Lantern #76 CGC 9.6 or the first New Mutants #98 CGC 9.9, two books at the time that were much more rare than what you're talking about, the exact same questions pop up.... was that a good price to pay? Will there be another copy brought to market? Will it sell for the same type of money as the first one (hold it's value)etc., etc.

 

(The answer was NO and YES and NO, part of the reason why you're 'logic' is hotly debated by some as far as ASM 667 DO variant holding it's value)

 

The truth is, generally speaking, the worst time to buy is when a book is hot, and there a very few copies of it available. Most likely more will show up, demand won't be as high and the price will come down. Everyone here of course knows this, but since most of the board now consists of 'sellers', everyone acts like it some kind of secret and is in constant pump mode.

 

No one's telling you that you can't pump, pump, pump this book. Go for it.

 

But trying to tell others they're narcissistic or wrong to ask is...combative for no reason.

 

You make a definitive value statement on something around here, people are going to question it.

 

As expected and predicted you are conveniently talking around the Bats 608RRP to ASM 667 census correlation that I posted to show each book's rarity factor at the same point in time.

 

Not talking around it at all. When ASM 667 has 9 more years under it's belt, we'll know how to judge it.

Saying 'in comparison to where Bats was at the same time" is an interesting correlation, but that book was WELL KNOWN at the time. ASM 667 isn't. You've made it more well known by pumping it as much as you have, but this will either, bring more copies out into the open and drive the price down, OR show its true rarity.

Only time will tell.

 

Instead you misdirect (again) and accuse me of "pumping" the one copy of this book that I own, and that isn't for sale anywhere , and a sales announcement thread that I did not start. Perhaps I'm your narcissistic, self-righteous know-it-all head somewhere you believe you are performing some kind of "public service" by constantly denigrating this book, and by extension, the fans, admirers, and owners of it. I can assure you that you are not. Your real motives are clear, you are not interested in any good faith debates of any facts and figures presented. You are only interested in trolling the ASM 667 Dell'otto.

 

Once again, in jay's world, anyone presenting more information to show just how much he doesn't know is met with name calling. Really, of all the active board members here, you truly are the most contentious poster we have. By far.

 

What a way to spend your day.

 

-J.

 

Why are you concerned about how I spend my day? That's kinda weird.

 

 

 

 

I agree that the ASM 667 was a slower burn than the Bats608. But again, that's because of the rarity. That's because many retailers did not know about it, did not order it. I showed where both books were census-wise after five and a half years. By that time in both of their slabbing "lives" everybody knew what they were and how much they sold for. That is indisputable. While the Bats608 might have had more slabs out the gate, more than enough time has passed to equalize that first year. However, even if you spot the 608 that entire first year of its slab count, that only removes 57 slabs from its total, and still puts it 122 ahead of pace of the 667 at the same point in time. Do you know how many slabs for the 667 have hit since that raw copy sold for $2000+ a year and a half ago ? 10. And that ten includes a 9.8 resubmit for a Stan Lee SS (the prior blue counterpart was never removed from the census), wowithurts' OO copy (a 9.6), another boardie acquired raw copy that was previously on ebay that he traded his 9.6 for with cash, another 9.6 boardie submitted copy, and the two copies that were sold on ebay in 2015. That's 5 of the 10 copies that we have first hand knowledge of where they started and where they came from. That means only 5- let me repeat that - 5 unique copies surfaced in the last year and a half since that big raw copy sale.

 

Are you able to acknowledge that that is highly irregular and unusual, even if you can't agree with the cause of it? I put my theory out there - the book was offered too late after the FOC and had a wonky, way too high, counter intuitive ratio that was directly off set by the other variant, with a completely different percentile based incentive requirement, that was offered months in advance, that undermined interest in it at the retailer level even more (assuming they even saw or cared about the solicitation that came out after the FOC at all or qualified, or bother to go back into their accounts to actually order it, even if they did).

 

If It was a slower burn compared to the 608, it wasn't by much. In a year it was trading at or near the four figure range. People knew about it then. But by then it was long since out of retailer hands. And as stated , even after an extremely well publicized and touted sale a year and a half ago, only 5 unique copies have gone to Florida.

 

I can't let my source for the actual print run be known. But I can say that the 225 number provided to me (and him) is fully and wholly supported by the circumstantial evidentiary support that we all can see.

 

-J.

[FlyingDonut]

Again, I have zero dogs in this fight, but just want to make a couple of observations.

 

1) Comparing the GL 76 9.6 and NM98 9.9 to this book is not an apples to apples nor an apples to oranges comparison. It is an apples to cheeseburgers. There's nothing similar - while there was only one (at the time) GL 76 9.6 there were literally 100s of thousands of copies of GL 76 in various grades - through all of this conversation a realistic data point has been that there are very few (+/- 200) known copies of the Dell'Otto 667. My assumption is this number is low, but not by much. We can't make comparisons against single datapoint slabs because it isn't the same.

 

2) Would I have spent nine grand on this book? No, because it isn't my thing. I'd buy a raw one for $1500 in this grade if I could find it to flip, but that's just because I'm a greedy . I would pay a huge amount for one of the FFs I'm looking for, does that make it wrong?

 

3) I still want to know what the other ASM variants are that are harder than this. Just for my own edification, because I don't play in this space.

[Prince Namor]

Again, I have zero dogs in this fight, but just want to make a couple of observations.

 

1) Comparing the GL 76 9.6 and NM98 9.9 to this book is not an apples to apples nor an apples to oranges comparison. It is an apples to cheeseburgers. There's nothing similar - while there was only one (at the time) GL 76 9.6 there were literally 100s of thousands of copies of GL 76 in various grades - through all of this conversation a realistic data point has been that there are very few (+/- 200) known copies of the Dell'Otto 667. My assumption is this number is low, but not by much. We can't make comparisons against single datapoint slabs because it isn't the same.

 

2) Would I have spent nine grand on this book? No, because it isn't my thing. I'd buy a raw one for $1500 in this grade if I could find it to flip, but that's just because I'm a greedy . I would pay a huge amount for one of the FFs I'm looking for, does that make it wrong?

 

3) I still want to know what the other ASM variants are that are harder than this. Just for my own edification, because I don't play in this space.

 

The comparison with the 9.6 and 9.9 was for a specific type of book that has few known copies and how that can turn around pretty fast. Those two books sold for what they did because they were outliers within the title, the same as a variant might be.

The point is, just because a book shows x copies on census to demand y in price - it can change pretty quick and cause a price adjustment just as quickly.

It's been that way with many books throughout the history of this hobby - in fact, I'd say it's much more likely we'all see MORE copies of this book, showing it to be LESS rare than is being said, because that generally seems to be the standard.

A book remaining rare in this hobby seems to happen much less often.

[Prince Namor]

I can't let my source for the actual print run be known. But I can say that the 225 number provided to me (and him) is fully and wholly supported by the circumstantial evidentiary support that we all can see.

 

-J.

 

 

Hilarious.

 

jay, you DON'T know the print run total.

 

You DON'T. Because you can't prove it.

 

You look silly making these statements.