When will the other shoe drop with CGC and the 'crack, press, and resub' game? 3 3

[Mystafo]

12 minutes ago, kav said:

*spoon*

Douché

 

[James J Johnson]

2 hours ago, comicwiz said:

I realize that is the sentiment around PSA. I truly understand what you are saying. However there has always been a buffer between perception and reality regarding PSA missing things. Like I said, people had been talking up and down about the HW RC being trimmed, but until Mastro admitted it as part of his plea deal, it couldn't be proven in a manner where a judgement could be made against him. Even when that legal judgement was made, PSA didn't take any hit from it, because they found every which way to reason it was undetectable. Do you know how many Wayne Gretzky RC have been cut from sheets? How many of them are floating around out there in PSA slabs? It wouldn't really be a revelation on a sportscard forum, with some long-time collectors, because those collecting cultures actually care, and do look out for each other.

On these forums, you have the hecklers who pop up and do nothing to contribute to a discussion, but are quick to demonstrate their disatisfaction with "yet another pressing thread." Then there's the dealers who depend on the CPR game to make a quick buck, who get their backs up when threads like this try to bring this topic up for discussion.

And with all due respect, I still don't understand the analogies of "day and night" differences, when you have to ask whether the Ewart trimmed books are still in circulation. We're not talking about a single T-206 owned by someone with a net woth of over a billion, who doesn't care one bit it's trimmed, but hundreds of slabs that are floating around where people who have no idea have been trimmed.

I'm using the Wagner as one example. The most infamous example. There's a book written about it. There's also a lot that isn't that book. But believe me, Anyone who is of significance in that hobby knew the Wagner was trimmed long before Mastro finally admitted it. There's a well known photocopy of it in its untrimmed state. Mastro didn't have to admit it. That's one example, times 2, times 2, times 2, times 2, etc.

[James J Johnson]

37 minutes ago, kav said:

is there at least a consensus that there's no consensus? 

When you con, you make sens of us.

[kav]

This thread has arms.

[ADAMANTIUM]

4 minutes ago, kav said:

This thread has arms.

[James J Johnson]

2 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

 

[ADAMANTIUM]

[ADAMANTIUM]

[Chaos_in_Canada]

2 hours ago, comicwiz said:

I realize that is the sentiment around PSA. I truly understand what you are saying. However there has always been a buffer between perception and reality regarding PSA missing things. Like I said, people had been talking up and down about the HW RC being trimmed, but until Mastro admitted it as part of his plea deal, it couldn't be proven in a manner where a judgement could be made against him. Even when that legal judgement was made, PSA didn't take any hit from it, because they found every which way to reason it was undetectable. Do you know how many Wayne Gretzky RC have been cut from sheets? How many of them are floating around out there in PSA slabs? It wouldn't really be a revelation on a sportscard forum, with some long-time collectors, because those collecting cultures actually care, and do look out for each other.

On these forums, you have the hecklers who pop up and do nothing to contribute to a discussion, but are quick to demonstrate their disatisfaction with "yet another pressing thread." Then there's the dealers who depend on the CPR game to make a quick buck, who get their backs up when threads like this try to bring this topic up for discussion.

And with all due respect, I still don't understand the analogies of "day and night" differences, when you have to ask whether the Ewart trimmed books are still in circulation. We're not talking about a single T-206 owned by someone with a net woth of over a billion, who doesn't care one bit it's trimmed, but hundreds of slabs that are floating around where people who have no idea have been trimmed.

The only (PSA10) 79-80 OPC Gretzky RC came from a pack (jagged edges). 

Do you have any scans of a high grade PSA8.5 or PSA9 cut from a uncut sheet with four clean edges & sharp corners? 

 

[ComicConnoisseur]

3 hours ago, bc said:

I am a leg man

 

[ComicConnoisseur]

1 hour ago, kav said:

This thread has arms.

Some one mention arms? lol.

 

[comicwiz]

23 minutes ago, Chaos_in_Canada said:

The only (PSA10) 79-80 OPC Gretzky RC came from a pack (jagged edges). 

Do you have any scans of a high grade PSA8.5 or PSA9 cut from a uncut sheet with four clean edges & sharp corners? 

 

All O-Pee-Chee cards were wire cut in the factory from the sheet in those years. That frayed/ragged edge is a characteristic that's important for the card to have, but it's not a deal-breaker for PSA when they are submitted with clean edges. PSA's reasoning (which isn't entirely flawed) is that the wires were sharper at the beginning of the sheet cutting process, and got duller over the course of cutting thousands of cards. It stands to reason that there should be clean edged examples. However, Gretzky RC's are not as common to find with perfect centering. Even that 10 is not centered. Most of the clean edge "sheet cut" I've seen are perfectly centered.

[Chaos_in_Canada]

16 minutes ago, comicwiz said:

All O-Pee-Chee cards were wire cut in the factory from the sheet in those years. That frayed/ragged edge is a characteristic that's important for the card to have, but it's not a deal-breaker for PSA when they are submitted with clean edges. PSA's reasoning (which isn't entirely flawed) is that the wires were sharper at the beginning of the sheet cutting process, and got duller over the course of cutting thousands of cards. It stands to reason that there should be clean edged examples. However, Gretzky RC's are not as common to find with perfect centering. Even that 10 is not centered. Most of the clean edge "sheet cut" I've seen are perfectly centered.

Are the sheet cut/perfectly centered 79-80 OPC Gretzky RCs in PSA holders?

I don't believe you!

[comicwiz]

6 minutes ago, Chaos_in_Canada said:

Are the sheet cut/perfectly centered 79-80 OPC Gretzky RCs in PSA holders?

I don't believe you!

I've never seen them in a Beckett slab. You don't have to believe me. 

[James J Johnson]

1 hour ago, comicwiz said:

All O-Pee-Chee cards were wire cut in the factory from the sheet in those years. That frayed/ragged edge is a characteristic that's important for the card to have, but it's not a deal-breaker for PSA when they are submitted with clean edges. PSA's reasoning (which isn't entirely flawed) is that the wires were sharper at the beginning of the sheet cutting process, and got duller over the course of cutting thousands of cards. It stands to reason that there should be clean edged examples. However, Gretzky RC's are not as common to find with perfect centering. Even that 10 is not centered. Most of the clean edge "sheet cut" I've seen are perfectly centered.

Which is why 1952 to 1956 Topps cards all have the sawtooth edge. O-Pee-Chee produced them, the cutting mechanism, basically, a wire-saw.

Do you know in what form T-206s were produced?

Edited July 24, 2019 by James J Johnson

[James J Johnson]

1 hour ago, ComicConnoisseur said:

 

They forgot to take her for a small of the back "No Regrets" tattoo.

[kav]

14 minutes ago, James J Johnson said:

 Do you know in what form T-206s were produced?

No but I know the T-1000's were liquid metal

[James J Johnson]

2 minutes ago, kav said:

No but I know the T-1000's were liquid metal

To this day no T-206 sheet or partial sheet has ever turned up. The hobby has been looking for one for a long time, wondering why. It never will. It doesn't exist.

[kav]

1 minute ago, James J Johnson said:

To this day no T-206 sheet or partial sheet has ever turned up. The hobby has been looking for one for a long time, wondering why. It never will. It doesn't exist.

It's like looking for Sarah Connor

[James J Johnson]

1 minute ago, kav said:

It's like looking for Sarah Connor

Except that there's no creamy center if you find the T-206 sheet first.