The Distribution of US Published Comics in the UK (1959~1982) 15 15

[Malacoda]

On 9/23/2022 at 6:19 PM, Albert Tatlock said:

But where had the well out-of date ASM 6 and FF2 been for 1 and almost 3 years respectively?

Pure speculation, but logically, the T&P reps must have had their own storage facilities (maybe just their own garages and lock ups) to make up the separate batches for the different towns and newsagents in those towns.  And they must have stored the returns somewhere before taking them back to the nearest depot to be returned to Oadby.  If you were the rep for Devon, based let's say in Ilfracombe, there is no way you did 8 hours of driving every day just to pick up and drop off stock at the Plymouth depot. You'd have to have storage. So the potential for a box of odds & sods that get forgotten is no surprise.  

[Albert Tatlock]

On 9/23/2022 at 6:10 PM, Albert Tatlock said:

Maybe from Ireland, maybe not

Probably not from Ireland, on reflection.

If the going rate in 1962 was a shilling, why would there be someone willing to accept 10d?

Of course, Miller deliberately undercut T & P, even to the extent of repricing 9d printed covers with a 6d stamp, but the situation in Ireland was different, in that it was a much smaller market, with less room for competing suppliers.

The variant stamp looks so much like the regular T & P stamp in terms of size, shape, design and placement on the cover, however, that it is tempting to attribute it to a short-lived ad hoc response to an unexpected situation.

The FF 2 bugs me, though. It was clearly not originally sold to T & P, who in any case would have priced it at 9d in 1962.

The other examples of UKPVs receiving a T & P stamp are easily explained if Oadby had a high turnover of low paid, possibly at least partly part-time, low skilled staff. Their job was to mechanically apply stamps to whatever was put in front of them, so no surprise when they failed to realise that their efforts on the UKPV were superfluous. Pay peanuts, get monkeys. Blame the foreman for bringing over the wrong stack.

 

[Malacoda]

On 9/23/2022 at 7:44 PM, Albert Tatlock said:

The FF 2 bugs me, though. It was clearly not originally sold to T & P, who in any case would have priced it at 9d in 1962.

Don't suppose you know where that copy is?  If it ever passed through Leicester, we could easily tell....

[Malacoda]

On 9/23/2022 at 7:44 PM, Albert Tatlock said:

The other examples of UKPVs receiving a T & P stamp are easily explained if Oadby had a high turnover of low paid, possibly at least partly part-time, low skilled staff. Their job was to mechanically apply stamps to whatever was put in front of them, so no surprise when they failed to realise that their efforts on the UKPV were superfluous. Pay peanuts, get monkeys. Blame the foreman for bringing over the wrong stack.

It was certainly a job no one wanted.  I found one of the Ethels (don't get excited) but she literally spent 2 weeks putting price stickers on comics in 1960, and then moved up to a job in the office. The interview for the job in the office, she said, went like this:  they asked her to add up some numbers in her head and as she got it right, she got the job.  I would imagine the interview structure for the price label sticking job was even less rigorous. 

[Albert Tatlock]

On 9/23/2022 at 8:29 PM, Malacoda said:

Don't suppose you know where that copy is?  If it ever passed through Leicester, we could easily tell....

It is here, safely in my clutches.

I have just double checked and it is a straightforward cents copy, regular US indicia.

If that stamp is by T & P, I am mystified as to how it got onto their premises.

Only thing I can think of is that one of T & P's retailers who dealt in both new and secondhand comics returned it to them, either by accident or design. They cannot have received it through the regular channels.

So maybe someone else was applying those stamps, but it looks like a near twin of the usual T & P stamp to me.

We will have to wait and see whether anything similar turns up.

[Malacoda]

On 9/23/2022 at 9:02 PM, Albert Tatlock said:

We will have to wait and see whether anything similar turns up.

Yes. It's logical to think that whatever made it an odd-bod going out might also be the reason it survived i.e. it wasn't part of normal distribution so never got sent back in.  It therefore doesn't indicate that there's a load more of them out there. 

[Kevin.J]

On 9/23/2022 at 3:07 PM, Malacoda said:

I've been watching the whole of Marvel in chronological order - so starting with the Cap 1 movie, then the Agent Carter TV series, the Agent Carter one shot, Xmen First Class, DOFP, Xmen Origins: Wolverine....you get the idea. All the movies, TV series & one shots from every studio, everything from Blade onwards. 
I can send you the viewing order if you REALLY want a binge.

Yes please, I have seen all the films and a few series like Wanda vision etc but a list to work through sounds great  

[Kevin.J]

On 9/23/2022 at 2:10 AM, Yorick said:

Have not read the comics?!!!

Oh my.  What a great series.  The show can't quite do it justice, but I'm happy that you'll enjoy the show more now due to not reading the comics. 

Is it still worth reading the comics?

I remember buying some big black slipcase thing with a key on the front, that's still sealed on a shelf upstairs.

Think I have a few slabs too, I heard great things at the time the comics were out so bought with every intention, I just never got caught up enough to read them, as is always the case 

[Malacoda]

On 9/23/2022 at 11:57 PM, Kevin.J said:

 I heard great things at the time the comics were out so bought with every intention, I just never got caught up enough to read them, as is always the case 

OK, can anyone beat this one?  In 1973/4, I was about 7 or 8 so beyond the Beano and the Beezer but not yet into Marvel. I used to read comics like Warlord, Victor, Valiant, etc.  One of these was, I think, the Hotspur. It had a strip which I remember being called 'the Denizen of the Deep' (I think it's actually called Fishboy: the denizen of the deep, but I really liked the word 'denizen').  I only got these occasionally, so I was never able to follow a story properly, and the story that really caught my imagination was 'the Terror in the Tall Tower', but I only had sporadic copies of the Hotspur (or whichever one it was), so I knew I would never know what happened in the (completely ludicrous) story. 

In 1980, I walked into Sutton's (my local newsagent) and there on the shelf was the whole thing - all episodes of that very story in a single issue.  What we would later call a graphic novel and now call a TPB. I had never seen anything like this before.  I bought it and kind of saved it. I was so stunned to see it, to 'have it back', that I was kind of saving it for a 'special read' (no, I don't know what that means either).    

Skip ahead 42 years and I still have it.  Still unread. I sort of feel like when I do read it, a part of my life will be over. I think I may have inadvertently started my bucket list at the age of 13.  The really odd thing is that the 6 years that passed between me reading this as 7 year old and finding the compiled edition as a 13 year old seemed like an absolute eternity. It seemed like something from a previous life.  The 42 years since have gone by in the blink of an eye.  

So who can beat 42 years?  (this can't be a comic you just forgot about or lost or decided you weren't actually interested in.  It has to be one that has always been on your reading list, and somehow you just never actually sit down with it). 

Edited September 24, 2022 by Malacoda

[Kevin.J]

On 9/24/2022 at 2:51 AM, Malacoda said:

OK, can anyone beat this one?  In 1973/4, I was about 7 or 8 so beyond the Beano and the Beezer but not yet into Marvel. I used to read comics like Warlord, Victor, Valiant, etc.  One of these was, I think, the Hotspur. It had a strip which I remember being called 'the Denizen of the Deep' (I think it's actually called Fishboy: the denizen of the deep, but I really liked the word 'denizen').  I only got these occasionally, so I was never able to follow a story properly, and the story that really caught my imagination was 'the Terror in the Tall Tower', but I only had sporadic copies of the Hotspur (or whichever one it was), so I knew I would never know what happened in the (completely ludicrous) story. 

In 1980, I walked into Sutton's (my local newsagent) and there on the shelf was the whole thing - all episodes of that very story in a single issue.  What we would later call a graphic novel and now call a TPB. I had never seen anything like this before.  I bought it and kind of saved it. I was so stunned to see it, to 'have it back', that I was kind of saving it for a 'special read' (no, I don't know what that means either).    

Skip ahead 42 years and I still have it.  Still unread. I sort of feel like when I do read it, a part of my life will be over. I think I may have inadvertently started my bucket list at the age of 13.  The really odd thing is that the 6 years that passed between me reading this as 7 year old and finding the compiled edition as a 13 year old seemed like an absolute eternity. It seemed like something from a previous life.  The 42 years since have gone by in the blink of an eye.  

So who can beat 42 years?  (this can't be a comic you just forgot about or lost or decided you weren't actually interested in.  It has to be one that has always been on your reading list, and somehow you just never actually sit down with it). 

I dunno how long exactly but I was more a DC collector when I was a kid and had a big bunch of Action comics & Supermans (not sure which title) these were late 60s early 70s books dunno the issue number without looking it up. I guess it would have been around the same time as you are talking, maybe early to mid 70s at the latest.

The stories were never continued, and I used to read them over and over as I didn't have that many comics, one of the stories was about an alien criminal been taken to prison by a guard, but they crashed the ship on earth and died, their personalities survived in their costumes, the bad guy costume possesses criminals but they are not strong enough, after fighting Superman the costume wants to possess him for his power and seeks him out, just as it finds Superman, the Prison guards costume comes flying in too.

The End..... continued next issue 

I used to re-read that comic still even though I never had the next issue, about 20 years ago I got the next issue when I started to buy from Ebay and was over the moon to get it, but tbh, I have still never read it and its probably just as well as I doubt it would stand up to well, I think the writers were on drugs in the 1970s as the DC stories were strange to say the least.

99% of the new comics I bought since the 1980s I haven't read, I do still read but only older stuff.

 

[themagicrobot]

On 9/24/2022 at 2:51 AM, Malacoda said:

So who can beat 42 years?  (this can't be a comic you just forgot about or lost or decided you weren't actually interested in.  It has to be one that has always been on your reading list, and somehow you just never actually sit down with it).

I think all older "collectors" have far more stuff than they can actually hope to read. In 1967 and 1968 I had Odhams Pow! delivered weekly by the newsagent. As each one was delivered I carefully stacked them in a pile with the intention to read them at some point but never did. I had read the Spider-man stories in the "proper" comics previously anyway. Even in 1968 I had a "to read" pile getting out of hand. So fast forward to 1978 when I gave away a whole Estate cars worth of comics (apart from two suitcases in the loft full of early 60s DCs I had forgotten about). The next day I realized the error of my ways and began collecting all over again.

Fast forward to 2022 and I have recently purchased a complete run of Pow! and am now happily working my way through them just 55 years late.

 

 

 

Edited September 24, 2022 by themagicrobot

[Kevin.J]

On 9/24/2022 at 4:51 AM, Kevin.J said:

I dunno how long exactly but I was more a DC collector when I was a kid and had a big bunch of Action comics & Supermans (not sure which title) these were late 60s early 70s books dunno the issue number without looking it up. I guess it would have been around the same time as you are talking, maybe early to mid 70s at the latest.

The stories were never continued, and I used to read them over and over as I didn't have that many comics, one of the stories was about an alien criminal been taken to prison by a guard, but they crashed the ship on earth and died, their personalities survived in their costumes, the bad guy costume possesses criminals but they are not strong enough, after fighting Superman the costume wants to possess him for his power and seeks him out, just as it finds Superman, the Prison guards costume comes flying in too.

The End..... continued next issue 

I used to re-read that comic still even though I never had the next issue, about 20 years ago I got the next issue when I started to buy from Ebay and was over the moon to get it, but tbh, I have still never read it and its probably just as well as I doubt it would stand up to well, I think the writers were on drugs in the 1970s as the DC stories were strange to say the least.

99% of the new comics I bought since the 1980s I haven't read, I do still read but only older stuff.

 

Thinking about this when I went to bed this morning for ages, couldnt get to sleep had to get up and find them, thanks Malacoda  

Tbh, it was nostalgic just looking through the drawers as I haven't needed any Action comics that late in a long time.

A title I will never complete, I still need over 100 issues and my earliest is only #33, so even a lottery win wouldn't get it done 

Action comics 383 = read 20+ times, Action comics 384 = read 1 time and that was just now.

...and was it worth the wait, well whaddaythink 

Both stamped copies too 

[Malacoda]

On 9/24/2022 at 11:48 AM, Kevin.J said:

Thinking about this when I went to bed this morning for ages, couldnt get to sleep had to get up and find them, thanks Malacoda  

Pleasure, mate, any time. 

On 9/24/2022 at 11:48 AM, Kevin.J said:

Action comics 383 = read 20+ times, Action comics 384 = read 1 time and that was just now.

...and was it worth the wait, well whaddaythink 

Pretty cool. I think the Robot has still pipped you, but that's almost a 53 year wait between issues. Bizarre, isn't it that as kids there were some comics where you couldn't wait to get the next issue and the month until it arrived was an absolute eternity. Other comics just sit unread forever.  Or until someone plants the itch on your head in the middle of the night, obviously. 

[Malacoda]

On 9/24/2022 at 9:48 AM, themagicrobot said:

I had read the Spider-man stories in the "proper" comics previously anyway.

Wow. You had read them all in proper US copies of ASM before you ever saw a UK reprint? That's really not the experience of most of us 70's kids. 

On 9/24/2022 at 9:48 AM, themagicrobot said:

The next day I realized the error of my ways and began collecting all over again.

Literally the next day? That must have been utterly crushing. 

On 9/24/2022 at 9:48 AM, themagicrobot said:

happily working my way through them just 55 years late

I stopped reading comics for about 20 years which was a catastrophic mistake as I've never really managed to get the magic back. I can still enjoy them, but when I was a kid, I was utterly transported by them. I guess that would have happened anyway but I can't help feeling it was the break in continuity with the little lad who learned to read on them. I mean, I'm still scared of Daleks (obviously).....

[themagicrobot]

There are people here who have collected from day one and never disposed of anything

There are people like Steve who built up large collections that were sold for a fair price at the time that would now be worth a kings ransom 

And then there is me. I disposed of my whole collection not once but three times between 1973 and 1986 for beer money. It appeared to make perfect sense at the time due to major life upheavals both good and bad. Those comics I owned prior to 1973 and purchased from Comic Marts up to 1986 just don’t bear thinking about so I dont

.I have probably replaced most of them since at considerable expense over the last 30 years when I already had them for pennies once

And yet….and yet… there is currently a feeling that it’s time to offload some again. In the meantime I’m reading this

[Malacoda]

On 9/24/2022 at 1:22 PM, themagicrobot said:

There are people here who have collected from day one and never disposed of anything

There are people like Steve who built up large collections that were sold for a fair price at the time that would now be worth a kings ransom 

And then there is me. I disposed of my whole collection not once but three times between 1973 and 1986 for beer money. It appeared to make perfect sense at the time due to major life upheavals both good and bad. Those comics I owned prior to 1973 and purchased from Comic Marts up to 1986 just don’t bear thinking about so I dont

.I have probably replaced most of them since at considerable expense over the last 30 years when I already had them for pennies once

And yet….and yet… there is currently a feeling that it’s time to offload some again. In the meantime I’m reading this

WANT!!!!!

Is it good (lots of detail, specific attribution, quotes from Ones Who Know)?

[Yorick]

On 9/23/2022 at 3:57 PM, Kevin.J said:

Is it still worth reading the comics?

Yes, but since you've started the TV show I would suggest holding off.  Wait until a few years after the show has completed.  Let it become a slightly distant memory so that it won't influence how the comic plays out.

[Get Marwood & I]

Evening 

This post is dedicated to the memory of Kathy Thorn.

Way back somewhere in the thread, I think I posted the June 1979 cover dated Superman Family #195 (May/June indicia) as being the latest DC that I could find with a T&P price stamp. I've done the earliest, you see, so it makes sense to get back to the latest. Here are three examples, priced 35p (one reduced to 20p):

It looks like the super people are getting it on there, doesn't it, in that curtailed cover shot. 

Anyway, I plan to revisit all the ongoing DC titles at some point, from the point that DC UKPVs materialise for the second time, but here are the early results for just five of them (Action, Adventure, Batman, Flash and Superman Family) - click to enlarge:

I used my original UK Price Variant tracking spreadsheet and added in where I found a cents priced copy with a T&P UK price stamp.

So if you look at Batman as an example...

• Issue #296 does not exist as a UKPV, but has a 12p T&P branded price stamped cents copy in circulation
• Issue #297 is the first second wave UKPV, priced at 12p, and it also has 12p T&P price stamped cents copies in circulation (unbranded, this time)
• Issue #300 does not exist as a UKPV, being an oversize issue, but a T&P stamped cents copy does exist, priced at an increased 25p to reflects the US difference
• Issues 303-305 exists as 15p stamped copies, but not as UKPVs
• Issue #310 is the latest issue I can find so far for Batman with a T&P stamp

What this early five title snapshot also shows us is:

1. T&P stamped cents copies were in circulation for issues which were not solicited as printed UKPVs (makes sense, if they were unsold US copies)
2. T&P were clearly happy to stamp higher cover priced cents copies at a higher UK price (but not solicit them as higher priced UKPVs)
3. The stamped standard cover price increase (12p to 15p) predates / is not in line with the printed UKPV cover price increase (possibly due to arriving later in the UK)

Additionally, there are issues for which I have yet to find a stamped copy in three of the five title runs and some titles appear to end their stamped copies earlier than others (Action seems to cease with the September 1978 issue whereas Batman and Flash carry on to April 1979. Of course, we don't know when the stamped copies came across and in what date order. 

One other observation - some stamps are T&P branded, others are not. If you look at these two for Batman #300 though, it strikes me that the 'T&P' may have been wearing out:

 

So it may be that some of the 'unbranded' stamps at least were just the result of stamp degradation. Degrade my stamp!

Back to Batman, issue #302 is missing from the group below as a stamped cents copy because I couldn't find one...

...but I did find this:

Coincidence? You decide (Big Brother Bloke Voice)

 

[Malacoda]

On 9/23/2022 at 11:52 PM, Kevin.J said:

Yes please, I have seen all the films and a few series like Wanda vision etc but a list to work through sounds great  

Kev, I've done this, for all Marvel-content films (Fox, Marvel, New Line, Sony/Columbia, Universal & Lionsgate) and all TV series (Marvel, ABC, Fireworks, New Line, Disney, Hulu, Netflix & Freeform) and the one-shots. but my list includes a column which explains the reason why I think each piece of the puzzle fits where it fits, but this of course means that the list is crawling with spoilers, so I suggest I paste a copy which offers no explanation of the running order other than the year it was made, the year it appears to be set and where you can find it.  Does that sound about right? I can take out the year it's set as well if you like, but I think this is overkill.  I don't think that ruins anything. 

Everyone else, do you want to see this or shall I just send it to Kev? (It's pretty cool, btw). 

Note to purists (hey, what are the odds):  This doesn't go back to the 1944 Cap serial, either of the 1979 movies or the Matt Salinger one, the Spider Man or Hulk TV series, the 1978 Doc Strange film, the 1994 Sony FF movie if such it can be called, Howard the Duck, the Punisher (Lundgren) or anything else that far back.  I basically started with Blade as that seems like the real start point of the 21st century Marvel revolution (though the Blade films are terrible).  Also, starting in 1998, I probably should have included the Hoff's turn as Nick Fury.  I did not. For obvious reasons. 

Edited September 27, 2022 by Malacoda

[Yorick]

On 9/27/2022 at 10:23 AM, Get Marwood & I said:

It looks like the super people are getting it on there, doesn't it, in that curtailed cover shot.

It's okay.  They're just cousins.