Hurricane Katrina

[Forbush-Man]

You are ignoring this Looser

 

[Darthdiesel]

Fuelman is a closet

 

[Forbush-Man]

Fuelman is a closet

 

 

 

Three Right turns become a Left, I guess.

 

What are all these Shriner's doing here?!?

 

 

S....O.....S...........................!

[shrunkenhead]

It seems to me this shift in media focus on looting, rape, anarchy, etc., makes for an easy way to rationalize the federal gov's slow-as-molasses response. And right-wing radio is eating it up, going so far as to blame the storm victims (I heard a stand-in for Limbaugh yesterday kvetch about how nobody left the city because they were all waiting for their welfare checks). In other words, if we blame the victims, we don't have to help them, or at least not until a lot of them die almost a week later.

 

Where have our leaders been? Where ARE they? Bush has been busy playing golf and stroking a guitar. Condie's been busy spending thousands of dollars on shoes in NY and she found the time to take in a showing of Spam-a-lot. And just where IS Cheney? Does anybody even know?

 

As far as I'm concerned, THIS is what we have a federal government for. Period. We set them up royal so that they'll bail us out in a situation like this. That's what we pay taxes for. That's what the people of new orleans paid taxes for. You know what they're calling these people on the news? Refugees. That disgusts me no end. These are not refugees, these are American citizens. Calling them "refugees" implies that these people are something "other" and legitimizes the lack of help. Passing 10 billion dollars in aid, was that really necessary this week? These people don't need billions right now, they need buses, for god's sake.

 

For the "conspiracy theorists" out there (i.e. those who haven't had their blood replaced with kool-aid), I will raise you one further. 10 years from now, when the slums have been completely bulldozed and the gulf coast is rebuilt by major developers and we've got ourselves a nice row of one highrise and fancy hotel after another ("come see the new, new orleans!" I can see the commercial already), you ask yourself then "I wonder why the response was so slow?"

 

Bush is already talking about "rebuilding the coast better than ever", by the way.

[Scrooge]

About the use of the word refugee - Correct me if I am wrong, but weren't these people - when they first got labeled refugees - seeking / taking refuge from the catastrophe, hence being refugees from the storm.

 

I know there is a common association of the word refugee to people crossing borders to take refugee from famine, persecution, warfare but the list is not limited and can include natural disasters. I still think refugee is an appropriate word. If they prefer not to be refered as refugees, fine we can change the syntax but definition-wise to me this is a correct designation.

[towards2112]

If all of you are done pizzing and moaning about politics and such,

check out my thread over in the water cooler.

I'm tired, sleepy, cranky, and have a good feeling in my gut.

I have made a difference today.

Try it, might help buy your way out of pergatory.

 

Phil, in a crowded Houston.

[shrunkenhead]

About the use of the word refugee - Correct me if I am wrong, but weren't these people - when they first got labeled refugees - seeking / taking refuge from the catastrophe, hence being refugees from the storm.

 

I know there is a common association of the word refugee to people crossing borders to take refugee from famine, persecution, warfare but the list is not limited and can include natural disasters. I still think refugee is an appropriate word. If they prefer not to be refered as refugees, fine we can change the syntax but definition-wise to me this is a correct designation.

 

You're right that it's largely an issue of semantics and not the essence of the problem..and in a strict, OED-style definiton, you're correct. However, in the current political climate, the word "refugee" is, I feel, invariably loaded with associations of non-citizenship. It makes it seem like if we choose to help then we're being "charitable" as opposed to doing what's absolutely necessary. These are our people.

 

Sorry if that point took us off-topic, though.

[awe4one]

About the use of the word refugee - Correct me if I am wrong, but weren't these people - when they first got labeled refugees - seeking / taking refuge from the catastrophe, hence being refugees from the storm.

 

I know there is a common association of the word refugee to people crossing borders to take refugee from famine, persecution, warfare but the list is not limited and can include natural disasters. I still think refugee is an appropriate word. If they prefer not to be refered as refugees, fine we can change the syntax but definition-wise to me this is a correct designation.

 

Refugee is exactly the right word to describe the influx out of NO. Americans have to get over the fact that things that happen in other countries can happen in the US. This situation clearly shows yet again that human nature is the same no matter where you live in the world. No one society is above it all. Bad things happen when local authority breaks down and the same will happen again if some other tragedy occurs on US soil and order is lost.

 

To break out the politically correct card or foster the thinking that Americans can't be referred to as a "refugee" is losing focus on what is going on in NO and won't help fix the problem...

 

Jim

[Scrooge]

You're right that it's largely an issue of semantics and not the essence of the problem..and in a strict, OED-style definiton, you're correct. However, in the current political climate, the word "refugee" is, I feel, invariably loaded with associations of non-citizenship. It makes it seem like if we choose to help then we're being "charitable" as opposed to doing what's absolutely necessary. These are our people.

 

Sorry if that point took us off-topic, though.

 

Awe4One and you are on my side. Now, just to be silly should I still be (if I had had the infortune of being affected by the natural disaster) in this context labeled as a refugee considering I am not a citizen (unless I show my tax return) while citizens would get the right to sit in front of the bus? Or should I wait for my gvt to come to help me? Yeah right. How much help can a country who sold the darn town and much much much more to you guys can bring? What a deal that was (the Louisiana sale that is) [Note to self: Read up on the circumstances of the Louisiana deal to know the historical context of the agreement]

 

Back to your regular thread.

[skybolt]

What worries me about this whole situation is the lack of quick response from the military. About 15,000 national guardsman moved in yesterday and the Louisiana area seems to be under control now. I would've expected this to occur at least 2 or 3 days earlier to combat the suffering and lawlessness. These troops and supplies should have been mobilized as soon as the storm was approaching. Once the storm cleared, then they should have moved in quickly within a day. If the storm wasn't severe and nothing happened, then I'd still rather be safe than sorry by having these troops mobilized.

 

Jim is right, these things happen when there's a lack of authority and leadership, so we have to be much more prepared next time. For instance, if we had sent more troops to Iraq during the early stages, then perhaps the violence would've been quelled earlier and the borders shored up to cut the insurgency at its roots.

 

If you dilly-dally and don't or refuse to acknowledge a problem early on, then things will go wrong every time.

[The Black Hand ®]

We can Monday morning quarterback this until New Orleans is re-built, but that won't solve anything in the here and now. Should all coastal areas that are in hurricane paths have evacuation routes, yes,,,and they should do like Miami, ,,,have pick up areas for the handicap and those without transportation. But that won't change what has happened and what will happpen in the days, weeks, and months to come.

 

Money from individuals, corporations and from other countries will help. Cities across the country, going through their housing lists and coming up with real apartments and homes for all of the the displaced will help.

 

 

What we have seen and learned in the past few years are unfortunately there is no Superman, he isn't here to stop an attack on Towers, he isn't here to be able to stop a huge tidal wave the circles the globe, and now he isn't here to save the people along our Gulf coast. What we have found out that there are many Batmen, Daredevil's, Spider-men and Captain Americas, they are our Coast Guard men and Army flying in for daring and heroic rescue missions, a job that they never in there lives thought they would be doing. They seem to be tireless! These men and women are true super-heroes. And although we may not be able to do it ourselfs, sending money to help may not make us super-heroes, but at least feel a little better about ourselfs!!!

 

God bless everyone down in the Gulf Coast!!!!

 

Now this guy makes a lot of sense. Thank goodness for the military, active, reserve, national guard and coast guard. These tireless people will be saving lives and relocating people and working harder than most of us have ever worked. Then come the backbone of this country, the blue collar workers. The Plumbers and electricians and carpenter and heavy equiptment operators. The people who actually fix and build things. The people with strong backs and even stronger work ethics who will rebuild NO and let's also not forget the heart and soul of the medical profession, the nurses, the glue that holds hospitals together. I'm going to take my limited comic book budget for the next few months and continue to make donations, small as they may be. In fact, events like this really help put thing into perspective, like I've always said whenever I got too obsessed about collecting,"It's only a comic book" it's not real life, not children or grandchildren or close friends, or the feeling you get from building something or growing something. It's after all, just a hobby, right?

[The Black Hand ®]

What worries me about this whole situation is the lack of quick response from the military. About 15,000 national guardsman moved in yesterday and the Louisiana area seems to be under control now. I would've expected this to occur at least 2 or 3 days earlier to combat the suffering and lawlessness. These troops and supplies should have been mobilized as soon as the storm was approaching. Once the storm cleared, then they should have moved in quickly within a day. If the storm wasn't severe and nothing happened, then I'd still rather be safe than sorry by having these troops mobilized.

 

Jim is right, these things happen when there's a lack of authority and leadership, so we have to be much more prepared next time. For instance, if we had sent more troops to Iraq during the early stages, then perhaps the violence would've been quelled earlier and the borders shored up to cut the insurgency at its roots.

 

If you dilly-dally and don't or refuse to acknowledge a problem early on, then things will go wrong every time.

 

Skybolt makes some good points here, I don't know about you guys, but I'm tired of being told to stop complaining about past mistakes and to get out there and fix the problem, I'm going to do both! Because besides winning , I want to see the people responsible for lying about the reasons for going to war and not planning properly for the insurgecy held accountable. And I don't want to be attacked and told I'm unpatriotic because of that. I also want to see people held accountable for dropping the ball in NO. People need to be fired for these kinds of mistakes, not patted on the back and promoted.I especially don't want to be swift boated and attacked personally like so many people who disagree with this present administration have been because I hold these views.I just want to be able to express my opinion. What is so wrong about wanting to hold people accountable for their action?

[Aman619]

but W sure showed a lot of compassion and warmth yesterday to those two cute young black (?) girls!! He couldnt keep his hands off of them, kept putting his arms around them. Who says W hatges black people?

[Forbush-Man]

Donations have reached $200,000,000.00

 

60 countries have offered aid, including Cuba which has offered Doctor's.

[drice6900]

Skybolt makes some good points here, I don't know about you guys, but I'm tired of being told to stop complaining about past mistakes and to get out there and fix the problem, I'm going to do both! Because besides winning , I want to see the people responsible for lying about the reasons for going to war and not planning properly for the insurgecy held accountable. And I don't want to be attacked and told I'm unpatriotic because of that. I also want to see people held accountable for dropping the ball in NO. People need to be fired for these kinds of mistakes, not patted on the back and promoted.I especially don't want to be swift boated and attacked personally like so many people who disagree with this present administration have been because I hold these views.I just want to be able to express my opinion. What is so wrong about wanting to hold people accountable for their action?

 

[precodekeith]

I was attacked after I stepped back by the guy you're schilling for, so I stepped back in...

 

Black Hand - I'm a day or so late with this reply, I spent all day yesterday at a local school helping collect/organize material donations (clothes, can food, toothpaste, water, what have you) for our hurricane friends in need, I'm sure you won't mind.

 

I'm sorry you feel you were "attacked" by my post. You should know I was typing that reply during the time you posted your "bow out," that's why my post came after you bowed out.

 

Personally, I wasn't looking at it as an "attack" on you. I was, and still am, in disagreement with your assessment of race being a factor in the slow response time, when in fact all races would appear to have been effected in the 90,000 square miles (if that is still accurate) of destruction.

 

To me, America has the greatest government in the world. It may not be perfect, but I think it's the best! When someone says that my government didn't respond because these people were minorities, they implying our government is blatantly racist, and I won't agree with that.

 

BTW- "devil bat" is not my shill. I sold the man four copies of my 'zine a few weeks ago. He's a cool guy. Thanks for having my back, DB, but I don't really need it.

[precodekeith]

..... and let's also not forget the heart and soul of the medical profession, the nurses, the glue that holds hospitals together.

 

Thanks, Black Hand! I knew you really liked me after all!

[The Black Hand ®]

..... and let's also not forget the heart and soul of the medical profession, the nurses, the glue that holds hospitals together.

 

Thanks, Black Hand! I knew you really liked me after all!

 

On the nurses point it's quite easy to agree, on all the other points there will undoubtedly be disagreement from time to time, but that's america, we all have our opinions and points of view. Wouldn't be america if we all walked in lockstep. Emotions run high and people aren't perfect during these type of situations. As long as we do our best and what we feel is right we'll all make it through this troubling period in time.

No hard feeling!

[Rip]

The Aqua Bus story seems to have legs...

 

This shot is making the rounds as the "The Ray Nagin Memorial Motor Pool."

 

 

Note the gas spilling out of them and mixing into the water.

 

 

 

Here's another shot of Buses. These were less than a mile from the Superdome.

 

 

 

Satellite wide shot

http://www.junkyardblog.net/images/NO-buses-satellite-wide.jpg

[The Black Hand ®]

He should be fired then, I would imagine,if that's the case. Don't you think?Unless all the bus drivers had split, which I think was what had happened.