How rare are modern newsstand editions? 6 6

[MetalPSI]

On 1/28/2022 at 3:52 PM, Microchip said:

And your incessant mindset to find fault with everything proves nothing as well.    It's only getting increasingly tired to read over, and over again.

Then stop

He doesn't need to shut up because you say so

[valiantman]

We barely have any of the data about the past 4.3 billion years, so we can't just extrapolate from a few recent years of sunrise data and know anything about the future of sunrises. The sun could rise in the west, north, or south, or there could be two suns or none at all, next time... the east is just from the latest data. Really, no one knows and anyone who thinks they have enough data is fooling themselves and trying to trick you into believing them.  Thankfully, I put no confidence in the direction of future sunrises and I promise to continue to warn others every chance I get.

Edited January 29, 2022 by valiantman

[MetalPSI]

On 1/28/2022 at 5:00 PM, valiantman said:

We barely have any of the data about the past 4.3 billion years, so we can't just extrapolate from a few recent years of sunrise data and know anything about the future of sunrises. The sun could rise in the west, north, or south, or there could be two suns or none at all, next time... the east is just from the latest data. Really, no one knows and anyone who thinks they have enough data is fooling themselves and trying to trick you into believing them.  Thankfully, I put no confidence in the direction of future sunrises and I promise to continue to warn others every chance I get.

Thats a terrible analogy. We've learned the sun rises in the east not just because we've watched it do so since we've had eyes.

We learned the earth spins a certain way, and it wobbles, and we've learned it orbits the sun, and we've learned the sun orbits the galaxy

 

[valiantman]

On 1/28/2022 at 6:23 PM, The Meta said:

Thats a terrible analogy. We've learned the sun rises in the east not just because we've watched it do so since we've had eyes.

We learned the earth spins a certain way, and it wobbles, and we've learned it orbits the sun, and we've learned the sun orbits the galaxy

.... and when thousands of sales in the public marketplace point to a percentage of newsstand issues in the marketplace, we can know with a very high degree of certainty about the percentage of newsstand issues in the marketplace.

We don't have to continue to wonder if the marketplace is going to flip upside down tomorrow and be the exact opposite of what it was for the past few years any more than we need to worry about the sun rising in the west.

It could, but it probably won't.  In both cases, a well-placed meteor of sufficient size ends all speculation about the future of newsstand issues and sunrises for all of humanity, and the odds are never zero.

[MetalPSI]

On 1/28/2022 at 5:26 PM, valiantman said:

.... and when thousands of sales in the public marketplace point to a percentage of newsstand issues in the marketplace, we can know with a very high degree of certainty about the percentage of newsstand issues in the marketplace.

We don't have to continue to wonder if the marketplace is going to flip upside down tomorrow and be the exact opposite of what it was for the past few years any more than we need to worry about the sun rising in the west.

It could, but it probably won't.  In both cases, a well-placed meteor of sufficient size ends all speculation about the future of newsstand issues and sunrises for all of humanity, and the odds are never zero.

Except that data is only a portion of the total data

[valiantman]

On 1/28/2022 at 6:28 PM, The Meta said:

Except that data is only a portion of the total data

That's the definition of "data".

[MetalPSI]

On 1/28/2022 at 5:49 PM, valiantman said:

That's the definition of "data".

You missed "portion"

I respect your encyclopedic knowledge of the hobby, especially Valiant

My criticism of your bias concerning this subject is well placed, and well meaning. Its gone past an intellectual exercise and into bias territory because of making absolute statements and claiming they're fact.

Can't do that, it goes against the scientific principle 

[valiantman]

On 1/28/2022 at 6:52 PM, The Meta said:

My criticism of your bias concerning this subject is well placed, and well meaning. Its gone past an intellectual exercise and into bias territory because of making absolute statements and claiming they're fact.

Can't do that, it goes against the scientific principle 

Show me where I have done that.  I'll wait.

Edited January 29, 2022 by valiantman

[MetalPSI]

On 1/25/2022 at 8:45 AM, valiantman said:

CGC does not identify "newsstand" in many instances at all.  The data that has been presented by myself and @paqart is from visual inspection and compilation of data over time (years, if not more than a decade).

GPAnalysis has chosen to identify additional newsstand books beyond what CGC does identify (most often, a different cover price newsstand).  Amazing Spider-Man #300 and Ultimate Fallout #4 are examples where CGC does not identify newsstand but GPAnalysis does for the past couple of years.  That data is also included.

Those blanks you'd like us to fill in are filled in... but I recognize you haven't read 12 pages of posts.

 

[Microchip]

On 1/29/2022 at 10:46 AM, The Meta said:

On 1/29/2022 at 9:52 AM, Microchip said:

And your incessant mindset to find fault with everything proves nothing as well.    It's only getting increasingly tired to read over, and over again.

Then stop

He doesn't need to shut up because you say so

You quoted me, but replied to your own conversation.  Odd.

[valiantman]

On 1/25/2022 at 9:36 AM, jimjum12 said:

In order to actually have this discussion, we need to determine if isolating "newstand" editions is procedural for CGC or not. and if so, when did this begin? We need to fill in as many blanks as possible before we can comfortably extrapolate.

Isolating "newsstand" editions is not procedural for CGC.  GPA identifies newsstand editions for some issues, and has done so for a couple of years.  That data has been used to extrapolate.

(This is a repeat of earlier posts since @The Meta suggested that I didn't fill in the blanks that jimjum12 described.)

Edited January 29, 2022 by valiantman

[valiantman]

jimjum12 said that in order to actually have this discussion, we need to determine if isolating "newstand" editions is procedural for CGC or not. and if so, when did this begin? We need to fill in as many blanks as possible before we can comfortably extrapolate.

I responded to his description of the blanks with answers to his questions. Those blanks he'd like us to fill in are filled in.  @The MetaWhat other false accusations do you have?

[MetalPSI]

On 1/28/2022 at 6:42 PM, valiantman said:

jimjum12 said that in order to actually have this discussion, we need to determine if isolating "newstand" editions is procedural for CGC or not. and if so, when did this begin? We need to fill in as many blanks as possible before we can comfortably extrapolate.

I responded to his description of the blanks with answers to his questions. Those blanks he'd like us to fill in are filled in.  @The MetaWhat other false accusations do you have?

No need to be arrogant

How do you KNOW GPA keeps track?

We all know CGC doesn't 

At least you're just biased, paqart has agenda

The data is incomplete 

Edited January 29, 2022 by The Meta

[MetalPSI]

On 1/28/2022 at 6:38 PM, Microchip said:

You quoted me, but replied to your own conversation.  Odd.

We all know you aren't clever

So, how about losing the perception that you have any ability to tell anyone what to do?

[MetalPSI]

Until a publisher/printer comes in and says, Hey we printed x newsstand editions of this issue, you can't really extrapolate anything 

Its all guess work. Its great, methodical and fun, but it isn't fact

[valiantman]

On 1/28/2022 at 8:00 PM, The Meta said:

No need to be arrogant

How do you KNOW GPA keeps track?

We all know CGC doesn't 

At least you're just biased, paqart has agenda

The data is incomplete 

The data is always incomplete.  It will never be complete.  That's not a problem for science.

I'm being "arrogant"?  You said that I'm making absolute statements and claiming they're fact. That I can't do that, that it goes against scientific principle.

I asked you "where?", and you had nothing.   So, did you not make a false accusation? 

On 1/28/2022 at 8:05 PM, The Meta said:

Until a publisher/printer comes in and says, Hey we printed x newsstand editions of this issue, you can't really extrapolate anything 

Its all guess work. Its great, methodical and fun, but it isn't fact

Even if a publisher said "we printed 100,000 newsstand editions of this issue"... there would still be a difference between what newsstand buyers do compared to comic shop collectors.  Newsstand buyers don't protect issues as well, they don't save issues as often, and they rarely buy more than one copy - unless it's a comic shop collector who raided the newsstand.

There will never be any possibility of knowing exactly what exists in terms of books remaining.  That's still not a problem for science.

I'm sorry if you can't see that, and I wish you wouldn't accuse me of going against scientific principle.

[MetalPSI]

On 1/28/2022 at 7:09 PM, valiantman said:

The data is always incomplete.  It will never be complete.  That's not a problem for science.

I'm being "arrogant"?  You said that I'm making absolute statements and claiming they're fact. That I can't do that, that it goes against scientific principle.

I asked you "where?", and you had nothing.   So, did you not make a false accusation? 

Even if a publisher said "we printed 100,000 newsstand editions of this issue"... there would still be a difference between what newsstand buyers do compared to comic shop collectors.  Newsstand buyers don't protect issues as well, they don't save issues as often, and they rarely buy more than one copy - unless it's a comic shop collector who raided the newsstand.

There will never be any possibility of knowing exactly what exists in terms of books remaining.  That's still not a problem for science.

I'm sorry if you can't see that, and I wish you wouldn't accuse me of going against scientific principle.

K sorry

[Lazyboy]

On 1/28/2022 at 8:09 PM, valiantman said:

I'm being "arrogant"?  You said that I'm making absolute statements and claiming they're fact. That I can't do that, that it goes against scientific principle.

 

 Newsstand buyers don't protect issues as well, they don't save issues as often, and they rarely buy more than one copy

On 1/28/2022 at 8:09 PM, valiantman said:

I wish you wouldn't accuse me of going against scientific principle.

Well, somebody has to accuse you of what you really are doing.

[MetalPSI]

On 1/28/2022 at 7:27 PM, Lazyboy said:

Well, somebody has to accuse you of what you really are doing.

I respect him enough to know he'll let go of his bias someday.

Meanwhile I don't have the intelligence and stamina to delve into it

[Lazyboy]

On 1/28/2022 at 4:52 PM, Microchip said:

And your incessant mindset to find fault with everything proves nothing as well.    It's only getting increasingly tired to read over, and over again.

Only somebody as extremely biased as you would go after somebody complaining about people trying to pass off as fact instead of going after the people trying to pass off as fact.