Just Got Back Some Books - VERY Ticked Off 4 4

[FFB]

On 2/27/2022 at 2:27 PM, PovertyRow said:

Sadly no matter how I angle it I cannot get a good shot showing the NCB dents on the Moon Knight #1. So here is a full scan of a 6.0. Again, no sign of any light stain on back and scanning it just shows a nice white reverse.

NOTE the lower right line on the red dress is a NCB crease that is reflecting light so it looks color breaking. And a lot of that mess next to "Premier Issue" is from NCB creasing within that dent along with the Color Breaking Creasing. Note that the deep breaking creasing there was not present when I sent the book in.  6.0 is very harsh for this. At least they did WP.

 

Mike, on this one, it just looks like your presser maybe didn't do his job.  Were those bends present when you sent it to the presser?  That's a lot of damage spread out over a large area to have been caused by handling.  The back cover of that Spider-Woman #1 looks the same.  Handling during grading shouldn't cause bends like that.  

[Randall Dowling]

On 3/21/2022 at 1:41 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

ASM 300s aren’t chipping though. They are cut that way.

To be clear, chipping (Marvel and otherwise) is a result of tearing from a dull blade when the open side of the book is trimmed during production.

[Still Only 35c]

It certainly seems to me that CGC are significantly under/tight grading and at times, mishandling books with all these finger creases and other new issues appearing.

I've got a number of submissions in at the moment, including some that are CPRs, that are trickling through. All the books have been cleaned and pressed by a very reputable source, yet the books are coming back with new issues and very inconsistent grades (some with a distinct lack of grader notes too).

Suspect the new influx of new "talent" at CGC may be the cause.

I always try to make sure I have photos of books prior shipping, post clean and press as well as when I finally have the slab in hand. That way, those difficult conversations with CGC are less so.

 

Edited March 21, 2022 by Every Day A Story
Photograph everything!!!

[joeypost]

On 2/27/2022 at 5:27 PM, PovertyRow said:

Sadly no matter how I angle it I cannot get a good shot showing the NCB dents on the Moon Knight #1. So here is a full scan of a 6.0. Again, no sign of any light stain on back and scanning it just shows a nice white reverse.

NOTE the lower right line on the red dress is a NCB crease that is reflecting light so it looks color breaking. And a lot of that mess next to "Premier Issue" is from NCB creasing within that dent along with the Color Breaking Creasing. Note that the deep breaking creasing there was not present when I sent the book in.  6.0 is very harsh for this. At least they did WP.

 

I blew the picture up and noticed CGC did not include a major defect in the notes which may be why the grade is 6.0 despite the book looking better. 
 

Look on the right edge of the back cover where it says “idea book all the way down to Lego logo in the larger of the boxes. There is a fairly large tide mark from water damage. That alone would put this in the 7.5 range. 

[Readcomix]

On 3/20/2022 at 5:28 PM, Engr62 said:

I thought "Marvel chipping" was only on books from the late 50s to the early 60s.  I could be wrong--and I usually am--but I doubt the edge wear on a very late 1969 book would be from Marvel chipping and would just be normal edge wear.

I’ve got some on a couple early Subbys (1968-1969 books) a couple issues within the first eight, but I can’t remember which ones. They are sitting in a stack somewhere. The books are otherwise gorgeous, with gloss and spines that look like they just got plucked off a 60’s newsstand before getting handled by anyone. It’s more common earlier, but dull blades still plagued the Marvel press runs in the later 60’s.

[Readcomix]

Okay, it was just the #6 -- I had pix of the books after all. You can see the ragged cuts along the right edge. No actual pieces missing but the classic "chipping" cut from dull blades.

[PovertyRow]

On 3/21/2022 at 5:47 PM, joeypost said:

I blew the picture up and noticed CGC did not include a major defect in the notes which may be why the grade is 6.0 despite the book looking better. 
 

Look on the right edge of the back cover where it says “idea book all the way down to Lego logo in the larger of the boxes. There is a fairly large tide mark from water damage. That alone would put this in the 7.5 range. 

Thanks Joey. I really think I missed that tideline. Seems a lot more faint than many but still no excuse. I am still concerned about some other defects I do not recall but regardless tht tideline does impact. So I will take the hit for that. Woulod never have sub'd it had I spotted it.

As far as the  Spotlight #32 goes, no question those bends/folds would have been pressed out. I have to wonder if they were caused during the encapsulation at CGC.

[djzombi]

I'm usually pretty close with my estimates regarding sending items in for grading and the final analysis by CGC, but I got back a Special Marvel Edition #15 that I'm still salty over.  I estimated a 7.0 the lowest, it came back 5.5.  

Notes:
light bends to cover
light creasing to cover
light soiling on cover
light spine stress lines to cover
very light fingerprints on cover

I was surprised by the soiling note.  Maybe that's what it brought it down so much    >:( 

Death by a thousand "light" demerits  >:(  

Edited March 22, 2022 by djzombi

[onlyweaknesskryptonite]

On 3/22/2022 at 4:43 PM, djzombi said:

I'm usually pretty close with my estimates regarding sending items in for grading and the final analysis by CGC, but I got back a Special Marvel Edition #15 that I'm still salty over.  I estimated a 7.0 the lowest, it came back 5.5.  

Notes:
light bends to cover
light creasing to cover
light soiling on cover
light spine stress lines to cover
very light fingerprints on cover

I was surprised by the soiling note.  Maybe that's what it brought it down so much    >:( 

Death by a thousand "light" demerits  >:(  

 they are just trying to force everything to run through CCS so they can maximize their profit.  

[The Lions Den]

On 3/21/2022 at 9:34 PM, Readcomix said:

I’ve got some on a couple early Subbys (1968-1969 books) a couple issues within the first eight, but I can’t remember which ones. They are sitting in a stack somewhere. The books are otherwise gorgeous, with gloss and spines that look like they just got plucked off a 60’s newsstand before getting handled by anyone. It’s more common earlier, but dull blades still plagued the Marvel press runs in the later 60’s.

In fact, all you have to do to duplicate this flaw is to cut a thick piece of cardboard with a dull pair of scissors... 

 

[The Lions Den]

On 3/22/2022 at 5:43 PM, djzombi said:

I'm usually pretty close with my estimates regarding sending items in for grading and the final analysis by CGC, but I got back a Special Marvel Edition #15 that I'm still salty over.  I estimated a 7.0 the lowest, it came back 5.5.  

Notes:
light bends to cover
light creasing to cover
light soiling on cover
light spine stress lines to cover
very light fingerprints on cover

I was surprised by the soiling note.  Maybe that's what it brought it down so much    >:( 

Death by a thousand "light" demerits  >:(  

Please note the range of the grading scale this occurred in. I rest my case...

[djzombi]

On 3/23/2022 at 8:37 PM, The Lions Den said:

Please note the range of the grading scale this occurred in. I rest my case...

I understand that.  I was just confident that it was going to be at the higher end of that scale.  No need to be snarky.  

[The Lions Den]

On 3/24/2022 at 8:50 AM, djzombi said:

I understand that.  I was just confident that it was going to be at the higher end of that scale.  No need to be snarky.  

No snarkiness expressed or implied, my friend. 

I was just referring to a recent post where I pointed out that this range of the grading scale is difficult even for many professional graders. In fact, I've seen instances where several different grades in this range weren't actually wrong. 

Sorry it wasn't what you were hoping for... 

[djzombi]

@The Lions Den

[joeypost]

Mike sent me the books to review. I cracked out the MS 32 and this is the only issue with a real crease I see on the front cover. Everything else lays flat. 

[joeypost]

The ripples he points out in an earlier post were from the inner well, which is very common. 

[PovertyRow]

On 3/22/2022 at 12:54 PM, PovertyRow said:

As far as the  Spotlight #32 goes, no question those bends/folds would have been pressed out. I have to wonder if they were caused during the encapsulation at CGC.

This is interesting. The  grader notes point these out:

Grader Notes
bend right top of front cover 
multiple crease back cover 

Would these grader notes have been created after encapsulation? I would have assumed the bends etc. would have been notated before encapsulation.

Edited March 28, 2022 by PovertyRow

[The Lions Den]

On 3/28/2022 at 1:17 AM, PovertyRow said:

This is interesting. The  grader notes point these out:

Grader Notes
bend right top of front cover 
multiple crease back cover 

Would these grader notes have been created after encapsulation? I would have assumed the bends etc. would have been notated before encapsulation.

The grading notes take place before the book is encapsulated, since grading comes before encapsulation in the CGC process flow. It would be very unusual for any notes to be entered after the book has been encapsulated...  

[joeypost]

On 3/28/2022 at 1:17 AM, PovertyRow said:

This is interesting. The  grader notes point these out:

Grader Notes
bend right top of front cover 
multiple crease back cover 

Would these grader notes have been created after encapsulation? I would have assumed the bends etc. would have been notated before encapsulation.

It has been my experience that even light color breaking creases are noted, even when they lay perfectly flat. Especially if they happen in the white areas of the cover, where no color break technically happens but a thin line is still remains. 

[PovertyRow]

On 3/28/2022 at 12:56 PM, joeypost said:

It has been my experience that even light color breaking creases are noted, even when they lay perfectly flat. Especially if they happen in the white areas of the cover, where no color break technically happens but a thin line is still remains. 

Are you referring to these? I assume those would have been pressed out if they were present when you received them?