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ASM #252 CGC 9.8 Record Sale - something fishy going on? - Holder Tampering Incident confirmed by CGC
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Started by spidermanbeyond,

9,028 posts in this topic

mosconi

mosconi

Posted
Posted
On 1/11/2024 at 7:57 AM, comicjel said:

Isn't it this?...

https://www.amazon.com/X-ACTO-Heavy-Guillotine-Trimmer-Inches/dp/B0006HVQH8?th=1

 

Very nice catch!  I know several of us had suspicions of trimming on some previous books, namely the JIM #83 that was shown earlier in this thread.  If slab swapping is getting by CGC, it brings to question if trimming has been getting by on some of the Silver Age books that have been "submitted for grading" by this fraudster?  My thoughts are every SA grading submission from this account needs to be re-looked at carefully for possible trimming.  Maybe a crazy task to undertake and sound silly but every Silver Age book submitted by this individual shouldn't be considered safe without additional scrutiny... 

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drotto

drotto

Posted
Posted
On 1/11/2024 at 2:15 PM, EastEnd1 said:

Yes, I just figured out which store this is (my brain works more slowly these days) and this post was gone. Some others with the notorious white carpet are still there though.

I see two shops basically right at that metro station. A third is kinda close.

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agamoto

agamoto

Posted
Posted
On 1/11/2024 at 8:04 AM, BrashL said:

Wow.

For all the folks who keep referring to the "scammer" (singular) as if he's some criminal genius, please stop. As more information comes out this group looks like a bunch of buffoons and yet they still pulled this scam (and probably many like it) for years. Now ask yourself, if this insufficiently_thoughtful_person has been this prolific, what have the really smart crooks been up to?

It reminds me of what Mike Nelson once said about the best restoration he's ever seen, and that's the restoration they didn't catch. 

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wiparker824

wiparker824

Posted
Posted
On 1/11/2024 at 12:23 PM, Silver Surfer said:

Would it be too unreasonable to ask how many submissions this guy has made over the last 5,6 years just to get a scope of what we could be dealing with. They don’t have to name names but should probably publicly ban this guy at some point to protect consumers going forward. 

I can tell you it’s a lot more than 351. 

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drotto

drotto

Posted
Posted
On 1/11/2024 at 2:26 PM, EastEnd1 said:

As Keep It Thoro said in that video, look for a shop that rhymes with nation.

If I have the right one, they also seem to advertise comic book improvement services.  Also have at least one photo online associated with store images with that shows the owner?

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EastEnd1

EastEnd1

Posted
Posted
On 1/11/2024 at 2:39 PM, wiparker824 said:

I can tell you it’s a lot more than 351. 

If the volume and quality of books in those instagram posts is any indication, it's scary how many books it could possibly be.

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GDN

GDN

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Posted

I also noted on their IG an image of a ASM 300 that has the CGC# photoshopped out.  Yet most (all?) of their other slabs still show the serial #.  Hmmmm....odd.....

I wish the photo with the 6 ASM 300s had more resolution to read the numbers.  The two with custom labels especially. :shiftyeyes:

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MatterEaterLad

MatterEaterLad

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Posted
On 1/11/2024 at 11:36 AM, Number 6 said:

So we're still withholding the name of this shop from those not-in-the-know?

The shop in question is Comic Book Station in Brooklyn. 

They're very active on social media, and by the photos, it looks like a great shop.

Any connection to the switched comics is alleged at this point, but it appears that they may have sold switched books (perhaps unwittingly).

The heat gun in that one photo is a bad look. The paper cutter, not so much. I have one in my workshop as well, as do lots of people. I don't have a heat gun.

 

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EastEnd1

EastEnd1

Posted
Posted
On 1/11/2024 at 2:52 PM, drotto said:

If I have the right one, they also seem to advertise comic book improvement services.  Also have at least one photo online associated with store images with that shows the owner?

I saw a number of before and after pressing images and also some images of folks associated with the shop.  Some convention pics too. 

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wiparker824

wiparker824

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 1/11/2024 at 1:00 PM, GDN said:

I wish the photo with the 6 ASM 300s had more resolution to read the numbers.  The two with custom labels especially. :shiftyeyes:

That’s one I’ve tried to figure out as well. The top right 2 with the custom labels I think I have a guess at, but it’s just not clear enough to confirm. 

Edited by wiparker824
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Heronext

Heronext

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 1/11/2024 at 10:57 AM, comicjel said:

Isn't it this?...

https://www.amazon.com/X-ACTO-Heavy-Guillotine-Trimmer-Inches/dp/B0006HVQH8?th=1

 

To me this isn't evidence.  I use something similar to cut backing boards and separate mailing labels from receipts, you know, cutting paper

Edited by Heronext
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sledgehammer

sledgehammer

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 1/11/2024 at 2:03 PM, MatterEaterLad said:

 

Any connection to the switched comics is alleged at this point, but it appears that they may have sold switched books (perhaps unwittingly).

 

this is what we are trying to avoid. I have not seen any evidence yet, that they may have sold switched books, unwittingly, or not, and you may be inviting a lawsuit..

all I have seen, is that they seem to have had books in their possession, many years ago, that are now on CGC's list.

Edited by sledgehammer
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360flip

360flip

Posted
Posted
On 1/11/2024 at 10:45 AM, wiparker824 said:

IMG_2353.thumb.jpeg.3b3b03beae47e7c76c8bb1102ac0da8d.jpeg
 

they have a lot of social media accounts and they like reposting. The oldest one is from one of their IG accounts 6/6/18.

 

On 1/11/2024 at 11:12 AM, 360flip said:

If you're on insta, just search the hashtag comicbookunderground and you'll find at least 2 accounts that share a lot of images.Shop looks like it's near Nassau metro station.

It looks like that shop has done some CGCs signature series stuff. Is it possible it's all legit and they have the heatgun and cutter to open up slabs and inner wells to get existing books out that are going for signatures?

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Heronext

Heronext

Posted
Posted
On 1/11/2024 at 3:12 PM, 360flip said:

 

It looks like that shop has done some CGCs signature series stuff. Is it possible it's all legit and they have the heatgun and cutter to open up slabs and inner wells to get existing books out that are going for signatures?

For sure it could be a tool for opening up slabs they want to resubmit, as in crack (melt) - press - resubmit

This coming from someone who has never opened a slab

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Lightning55

Lightning55

Posted
Posted
On 1/11/2024 at 3:14 PM, Heronext said:

For sure it could be a tool for opening up slabs they want to resubmit, as in crack (melt) - press - resubmit

This coming from someone who has never opened a slab

A new term, MPR?

Or maybe MSR? Melt, swap, reassemble? 

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wiparker824

wiparker824

Posted
Posted
On 1/11/2024 at 1:11 PM, sledgehammer said:

this is what we are trying to avoid. I have not seen any evidence yet, that they may have sold switched books, unwittingly, or not, and you may be inviting a lawsuit..

all I have seen, is that they seem to have had books in their possession, many years ago, that are now on CGC's list.

I think it’s pretty clear they’ve sold books on the list or at least they’ve claimed to. I have no idea why else you’d post this otherwise:IMG_2355.thumb.jpeg.18ba30ce34cf955e68576c0a5b7bae18.jpeg


now, was that book switched, trimmed, or any wrongdoing evident - not to our knowledge but this wasn’t many years ago, this post was from 2021. They also have this book posted before it got the custom label going back as far as 2016.

You are correct though that people should be careful making accusations, and we do not have any hard evidence they’ve been involved in any wrong doing. 

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