Obadiah Oldbuck vs. Superman

[ArnoldTBlumberg]

This has to be some of the rudest, most disrespectful, offensive and plain juvenile discussion I have ever seen from so-called adults.

 

It's really just shameful, no matter how much you disagree with a person's views, to attack one another in this manner.

 

I find myself completely amazed that these comments are posted by people who are grown and have wives and families and careers.

 

I'd hate to think people see this and get their impression of the comic book collecting community from this behavior.

[BLBcomics-migration]

Arnold,

I respond like for like, Ponseti fired the trigger of his mental gun, i spent a couple days pondering whether i would even respond. He thinks he is on a roll of clarity, when he remains confused.

 

Ever since Obadiah Oldbuck, as well as the entire 1800s comics section, entered the consciousness of those who buy the Overstreet PG, there have been "a few" who get rather vocal in their narrow world view and come at me as if i have some sort of ultimate power over the powers that be at Gemstone, which is funny in a way, don't you think?.

 

I am just about done with this thread, i am leaving out for NYC Big Apple and MidOhio in a few days, and maybe this thread will have run its course. I thought so earlier, even watched it slide onto the 2nd page again

 

- and it got resurrected by some one, brought to the head of the class, and i replied to a query, like i have been doing since Steve Meyer asked me to answer a couple questions on here after it had been running for a couple months.

 

I think Black Hand was joking, pointing to the absurdity of the previous post

[The Black Hand ®]

I was joking, I like Bob. I think people are being way too rough on him.

[BLBcomics-migration]

it was easy to tell from your previous post which starts " I understand what Bob is getting at with his view of comic history. My grandfather would tell me how great the silent film era was. It was huge......" that you understood what i was saying there, and, actually, my story line has not altered since this educational exercise began this summer

 

i thought your one liner funny, if that helps

 

You "get" it

 

Some day maybe some of these others will

 

The world certainly does not have to listen to me re comics history, but i feel secure in knowing what i pen to be correct, hence, there is nothing to back down from when not wrong

 

If i ever get proved wrong, i will be the first to cheerfully admit same

 

so far, the "opposing" side(s) have zip nada zero on their score card - shut out from the comics score card of life

[showcase4]

This has to be some of the rudest, most disrespectful, offensive...

It's really just shameful, no matter how much you disagree with a person's views, to attack one another in this manner.

 

...yes Dr.B is right....there has been something about this thread in particular that has triggered much stubborn pride/ego and venom. As the guy who started the whole thing about 6 months ago, I can tell you that the input -- over 2,000 replies ( probably more like 1,600 if you take mine out ) has been invaluable. And the 25,000 views ( probably more like 23,000 if you take mine out ) has proven widespread interest in the subject, even if it it's because "controversy sells".

 

Taking a step back and having a moment of reflection, now that I'm not "caught up in it", here's what I see as a summary of the responses to this thread. One of the main differences between Bob B and myself is that he sees the CGC Gold Boards members as a small segment of the collecting community, and I see you guys "as the community". I'll put this in bullet points even though I could write 20 pages on the subject:

 

1. Obadiah Oldbuck is still the 1st US comic book ( to Bob, myself, and about 3 other peolpe...on these Boards, that is. I will agree with Bob that in this forum, there is much more resistance to OO than I have ever experienced )

 

2. this belief (summary #1) is potentially held by less people than I previously thought

 

3. there is no universally accepted definition of what a comic book is

 

4. interest in the Victorian and Platinum Age does not have the "crossover"

appeal to GA collectors like books from the SA would.

 

5. Obadiah Oldbuck is a key, Action 1 is "THE" key

 

6.Victorian and Platinum Age markets need alot of expanded interest to realize their potential....the GA is already there

 

7. Action 1 is a $200,000 comic book because EVERYONE wants it ( answers my 1st question - 1st post )

 

8. We are all passionate about what we collect...that confirms that I have chosen my hobby wisely. My only regret about buying 3 copies of Obadiah Oldbuck is that it's not 4

[Theagenes]

It is very sad to see this discussion descend into unecessary ad hominum attacks again.

 

Adams, do you have anything constructive to add to these boards or are you just here to attack people? All I have seen from you are posts that bash people, like your ridiculing of herald2galactus in the User ID thread for his appearance while not having the balls to post your own info. If you're not just trying to be a troll, then give it a rest on the personal attacks because you're just making an of yourself.

 

Regardless of whether or not one agrees with the conclusions that Bob has drawn from his research, his contribution to comics history has been enormous in identifying all of these early predecessors of the modern comics books. As to their individual significance in the larger scheme of things, that is an area that is still open for debate -- but we could not even have that debate if Bob and others had not brought these early books to the attention of the collecting community. If nothing else, Bob has shown quite clearly that Famous Funnies and Action did not spring into being ex nihilo; they weren't born in a vacuum -- they were products of a larger, evolving entertainment medium.

 

I think that Bob's view, stated in an earlier post, that comics have undergone a continuous process of evolution, with occasional mutations that shape and influence that process, is an excellent way of looking at it. I shouldn't speak for Bill, but I don't get the impression that he would disagree with this view -- but what he and the other Action #1 proponents are saying is that in their view Action #1 is the most significant of these "mutations" as far as the impact it has had on the comic book industry. Bob, I gather from your position that you would say there are a number of other "mutations," presumably including OO, that are of equal importance to Action #1 and no one book stands out as more important than any other -- all of them have been a part of the process. Both of these viewpoints are legitimate interpretations; they are subjective opinions influenced by the way in which each individual views the history of the comicbook industry. Bill and Bob, I really don't think that you two are that far apart -- just coming at the issue from different vantage points. If I have mischaracterized your views, please correct me. I have tried to avoid the "Importance of Action #1" debate in this thread, but I'll say that it is hard for me to come up with another book that was as influential a "mutation" as Action #1 in shaping what the comic book industry has become today. That said, I freely admit that I am no doubt biased by the superhero-centric nature of the US comic book community and I'm certainly open to other possibilities.

 

Bob, I'm curious, I know you say that there is no one comic that is more important than any other and I can understand that view, but you do say that there occasional "mutations" that have had an effect on the evolution of the medium -- what other books would you include in those mutations? I assume Action #1 and OO would be included, but what others? Yellowkid? Comic Monthly? Zap #1? Showcase #4/FF#1? A Disney book perhaps (WDC&S #1 or MM Magazine 1/1 maybe)? I'm just curious to see which books you believe have had the most imact on the industry, even if none of them are more important than the others.

[BLBcomics-migration]

I will shortly be in a time-constraint position of having to take a sabbatical from this discussion as i am in final prep mode for leaving out of here to set up at the Big Apple National show as well as doing Roger Price's MidOhio in Columbus the following week end - i will be gone about two weeks

 

I still have to fine tune prepping my boxes, my wall display, pulling out extraneous material i do not think will turnover easily at the shows, etc

 

I have not stated "there is no one comic that is more important than any other", there are a lot of comics more important than the vast majority ever published. However, after all this research i undertook for my personal self and have been asked to share in Overstreet for a decade now, i have come to the conclusion that there are no single "most important" comic book.

 

I have a lot of respect for professional archeologists, and have a rather extensive library on the vast subject, a line of work i wish i had pursued in lieu of immersing myself in the comics world for some 40+ years now.

 

I honestly do not have time the next couple days before i depart to compile a listing such as you request. You previously posted scans of the second time line Clark Kannaird issued in the late 1950s. That would involve thinking thru all the material which has been published, and leaving anything out of context in a simple internet post would invite potential retaliation.

 

Heck, i invite people to simply read the three inter-twined history articles in Overstreet for starters

 

Like i told you in one of the PMs i sent you, Kinnaird was an editor at King Features newspaper comic strip division. Jay Kennedy occupies that same position these days

 

his first time line was issued in 1948 as a part of a brochure issued as part of the 50th anniversary of William Randolph Hearst - i have had one of these brochures for decades now, but am unsure where it is until it resurfaces

 

The second one is what you posted from the late 1950s. He expanded and corrected errors he discovered he had made in the first one.

 

his 3rd and final published time line came out inside RUBE GOLDBERG VS THE MACHINE AGE, edited by Clark Kinnaird 1968 Hasting House, (same publisher as the b&w early 50s series of Prince valiant hard covers, that 7 volume PV series reprinted by Woody Gelman's Nostalgia Press in the early 1970s.)

 

In this again-expanded & corrected time line he adds Topffer comic books from the 1840s, mentioning among other things "...Töpffer introduced space travel into strips via Le Docteur Festus, a satire on Goethe's FAUST..."

 

FESTUS is one of the Töpffer comic strip books which has never been translated into English, and is something what will soon be rectified as i have been involved with Art Spiegelman and Chris Ware on some levels to bring all of Töpffer's comic books together translated into English in one volume

 

Since there is resistance here as to what defines the term "comic book" as well as i must get back at whipping my booth display into final shape, i will forgo for right now listing anything in a time line of "important" occurrences in the evolution of comics as it will most likely be too contentious for follow up posts at this time.

 

I have pretty much made forays into such concepts in previous posts - and witness the bashing such as the term "A**hole" being bandied my direction - simply because i do not consider any one individual comic book "most important" in the 160 year time line of comic strip books in America.

 

When this thread was resurrected and unlocked by Steve Meyer contacting Steve Borock, my first post of the "new era" stated plainly that i would continue to involve myself in this thread if it did not devolve into the name calling earlier on

 

And then it did, and then i responded like for like, and, well, one can read what is on this thread to make one's own judgment calls in that scenario

 

To answer one of Steve Meyer's thoughts, i have grown to a conclusion that the Gold section of this discussion area of CGC is passionate re comics, there are a fair amount of knowledgeable people here, is a part of "the community" of comics fandom, but is, and remains, a microcosm of "the" community of collectors when added up in toto.

 

The super hero is not the be-all end-all of comics, comic strips, comic books, in America

 

That is the implication one derives from attaching the term "most important"

 

After i spend the day doing final whacking at my comics stock, i will come back here tonight to see where this discussion is going and how it is unfolding. I will also try to get some scans of Kinnaird's 3rd time line prepped to place here for people to read where Kinnaird's brain was at by the late 1960s

[Bronty]

Bob, I'm curious, I know you say that there is no one comic that is more important than any other .

 

Bob, is that exactly what you said? If so, I don't see how you could argue Action #711 is as important as #1? Or tec 544 as important as #27, etc? I am assuming you've been taken out of context?

[BLBcomics-migration]

yes, i am taken out of context a lot on this thread. It would be assinine to argue Action 711 being equal to #1, etc - something i have never uttered. How one makes a jump from there are no "most important" comic books to equating i mean all comic books are "equal" is maybe due to my not examining every tiny nuance before posting here

 

That is why i am not going to venture any listing Theagenes requested, as i will then be gone for two shows for two weeks, and the natives would get too restless at my expense.

 

I only entered this arena in the summer to defend my comics research in the first place, and am not about to post my book (as some have asked) for a "peer" review here, as too few here are what i would consider "peers"

 

as well as misinterpreted because so many people here have not seen all the comics material published in America as I have - there are a few people here i would consider knowledgeable understanding the Big Picture,

 

thanks for bringing up this out of context thing - my response to this thought is somewhat buried in my just posted long response right above your query

[Aman619]

I only entered this arena in the summer to defend my comics research in the first place, and am not about to post my book (as some have asked) for a "peer" review here, as too few here are what i would consider "peers"

 

as happens with so many people on internet chat boards your problems here stem less from what you say, than how you say it. You have a terse "my way or the highway" attitude/style that frankly rubs many of us the wrong way. The above is one small example. I understand that now, after 6 months, you probably feel justified at making disparaging remarks and speaking down to others who have harassed you.... but the condescending began on day one. Think about it. You have very little tolerance for anyone here who does not see things (about comics) as you do. Its become frustrating and tiresome dealing with Moses Down With the Tablets of Truth. There are a few others here who have also done lots of research and are knowledgeable about comics history (not me) ... but you cant find common ground with them either.

 

Sorry Big Fella. I know you mean well and truly love talking about this stuff. But maybe try talking with people instead of down to them. See how it works! And if someone is just here to poke sticks at you ignore them, dont stoop. And if some have opinions based on their research or experience that differ from YOUR conclusions, thats cool too. Or should be.

[BLBcomics-migration]

Yo aman619

 

i have thought about it, and you are taking the big picture out of context, excuse to say

 

there were yo-yos making disparaging remarks about me personally, my comics research, as well as even my comics customers, LONG BEFORE i entered this thread.

 

You maybe need to have a "bigger picture" in this little tent, prithee

 

- and i did come heavy at those individuals, like for like, tit for tat, throwing back that which was evil-minded at me, yes, indeed

 

- just a few persons in particular (not Ponseti, he comes responding at me along some time later pontificating on aspects he has a lot yet to learn)

 

- and that has maybe tempered some perspectives about me from those who came into this even after i got on this thread,

 

but, then, the context becomes out of whack, as i surely did not start the bad mouth scenarios.

 

i also am not one to walk away from any one disparaging me personally, my research, and especially my comics customers, most of whom i count as friends

 

If there had been sanity Day One along this thread BEFORE i got here, emailed by a few to check out what snotty remarks were being said about me re San Diego Comicon time, when my brain & efforts are in full mercantile mode, i would have come here all peaches & cream all sugary to your satisfaction

 

And i have talked WITH plenty of posters here.

 

I would say he without sin cast the first stone (not directed at you)

 

I was not here on this thread yet when the first sins occurred

[Theagenes]

Bob, I'm curious, I know you say that there is no one comic that is more important than any other .

 

Bob, is that exactly what you said? If so, I don't see how you could argue Action #711 is as important as #1? Or tec 544 as important as #27, etc? I am assuming you've been taken out of context?

 

Apparently I did misstate what Bob said. Looking back over the posts it was something like "There is no single most important comic book." That is an important distinction and I apologize for that error.

[Theagenes]

I will shortly be in a time-constraint position of having to take a sabbatical from this discussion as i am in final prep mode for leaving out of here to set up at the Big Apple National show as well as doing Roger Price's MidOhio in Columbus the following week end - i will be gone about two weeks

 

I still have to fine tune prepping my boxes, my wall display, pulling out extraneous material i do not think will turnover easily at the shows, etc

 

I have not stated "there is no one comic that is more important than any other", there are a lot of comics more important than the vast majority ever published. However, after all this research i undertook for my personal self and have been asked to share in Overstreet for a decade now, i have come to the conclusion that there are no single "most important" comic book.

 

As I said above I misquoted you and apologize for that. That is an important distinction. But I didn't mean to imply that you thought all comics are of equal importance -- that would be silly. I was talking about the various "mutations" that come along from time to time that have an impact on the industry and what I thought was your position that none of them stand out above the others in terms of importance; I wasn't talking about the vast thousands of comics ever published, most of which have little or no importance at all. Obviously my comments were poorly worded.

I have a lot of respect for professional archeologists, and have a rather extensive library on the vast subject, a line of work i wish i had pursued in lieu of immersing myself in the comics world for some 40+ years now.

 

I honestly do not have time the next couple days before i depart to compile a listing such as you request. You previously posted scans of the second time line Clark Kannaird issued in the late 1950s. That would involve thinking thru all the material which has been published, and leaving anything out of context in a simple internet post would invite potential retaliation.

Bob, it wasn't intended as a "gotcha" question. I was genuinely curious as to the other books that you would rank up there with Action 1. I accept that we American collectors are more superhero oriented than most of the rest of the world and so I'm open to the idea that we may be overstating the importance of Action 1. I was trying to come up with other books that can be ranked alongside it, that's all. I know you've mentioned OO and Zap as other influential books and I was thinking maybe a Disney book given the huge market for funny animal books over the decades and the popularity of characters like MM and DD internationally.

 

Heck, i invite people to simply read the three inter-twined history articles in Overstreet for starters

 

Like i told you in one of the PMs i sent you, Kinnaird was an editor at King Features newspaper comic strip division. Jay Kennedy occupies that same position these days

 

his first time line was issued in 1948 as a part of a brochure issued as part of the 50th anniversary of William Randolph Hearst - i have had one of these brochures for decades now, but am unsure where it is until it resurfaces

 

The second one is what you posted from the late 1950s. He expanded and corrected errors he discovered he had made in the first one.

 

his 3rd and final published time line came out inside RUBE GOLDBERG VS THE MACHINE AGE, edited by Clark Kinnaird 1968 Hasting House, (same publisher as the b&w early 50s series of Prince valiant hard covers, that 7 volume PV series reprinted by Woody Gelman's Nostalgia Press in the early 1970s.)

Would you believe I was just reading Vol. 1 of the Nostalgia PV books to my son earlier today!

In this again-expanded & corrected time line he adds Topffer comic books from the 1840s, mentioning among other things "...Töpffer introduced space travel into strips via Le Docteur Festus, a satire on Goethe's FAUST..."

 

FESTUS is one of the Töpffer comic strip books which has never been translated into English, and is something what will soon be rectified as i have been involved with Art Spiegelman and Chris Ware on some levels to bring all of Töpffer's comic books together translated into English in one volume

I'd like to see to Kinnaird's other timelines sometime. But I would especially like to see this Dr. Festus with space travel! Good luck on that Toepffer project, that would be something I'd like to read very much. (Hey you figured out how to do umlauts! - how do you do that?)

Since there is resistance here as to what defines the term "comic book" as well as i must get back at whipping my booth display into final shape, i will forgo for right now listing anything in a time line of "important" occurrences in the evolution of comics as it will most likely be too contentious for follow up posts at this time.

Understood - no problem.

 

I have pretty much made forays into such concepts in previous posts - and witness the bashing such as the term "A**hole" being bandied my direction - simply because i do not consider any one individual comic book "most important" in the 160 year time line of comic strip books in America.

 

When this thread was resurrected and unlocked by Steve Meyer contacting Steve Borock, my first post of the "new era" stated plainly that i would continue to involve myself in this thread if it did not devolve into the name calling earlier on

 

And then it did, and then i responded like for like, and, well, one can read what is on this thread to make one's own judgment calls in that scenario

I have to admit, that one of the reasons I even posted here again today was try and turn things back to a civilized discussion before it got too far out of hand again -- trying to play peacemaker I suppose. Whoever this adams character is, his comments were way out of line and completely uncalled for. He has done this elsewhere on the boards to others. Either he has some serious insecurity issues or he's just a troll. Either way it is best to just ignore him.

To answer one of Steve Meyer's thoughts, i have grown to a conclusion that the Gold section of this discussion area of CGC is passionate re comics, there are a fair amount of knowledgeable people here, is a part of "the community" of comics fandom, but is, and remains, a microcosm of "the" community of collectors when added up in toto.

 

The super hero is not the be-all end-all of comics, comic strips, comic books, in America

 

That is the implication one derives from attaching the term "most important"

 

After i spend the day doing final whacking at my comics stock, i will come back here tonight to see where this discussion is going and how it is unfolding. I will also try to get some scans of Kinnaird's 3rd time line prepped to place here for people to read where Kinnaird's brain was at by the late 1960s

Thanks Bob, I'd like to see that.

Jeff

[mica]

I would say something, but Arnold would smack me down.

[showcase4]

a "retro moment" found on page 4 of this all-time great thread....

 

[BLBcomics-migration]

I have to admit, that one of the reasons I even posted here again today was try and turn things back to a civilized discussion before it got too far out of hand again -- trying to play peacemaker I suppose. Whoever this adams character is, his comments were way out of line and completely uncalled for. He has done this elsewhere on the boards to others. Either he has some serious insecurity issues or he's just a troll. Either way it is best to just ignore him.

 

Jeff

 

Yo Jeff

 

am stopping in for a pit stop in my race to get done before the van is loaded up tomorrow by a couple friends

 

I knew you misinterpreted, and others (myself included) misinterpreted your misinterpretation, and when things of that nature are not nipped in the bud, some one else comes along and begins going off thinking the misinterpretation must be gospel, hence, that must be what Beerbohm believes

 

And the many hands involved leads to the use of language on this thread that is not so wholesome and uplifting - but we are easily past all that now, so onward to other things

 

Yes, OO and ZAP #1 are important, both for different reasons. i will leave it at that for right now, as i will not be around to discuss the after-shock concepts.

 

I did not interpret your query as a gotcha concept, rather, i am in work mode for the next couple weeks, and it will be good to hook up with my many friends in NYC and Columbus at the shows.

 

I posted that previous longish response as you are a voice of reason, one of many here, but there are also too many persons in the peanut gallery to be able to invest hours till i get back

 

Later tonight will come the 3rd Kinnaird time line - i have the book sitting next to my scanner now, and still have to finish the prep work i mentioned

[ciorac]

This has to be some of the rudest, most disrespectful, offensive and plain juvenile discussion I have ever seen from so-called adults.

 

It's really just shameful, no matter how much you disagree with a person's views, to attack one another in this manner.

 

I find myself completely amazed that these comments are posted by people who are grown and have wives and families and careers.

 

I'd hate to think people see this and get their impression of the comic book collecting community from this behavior.

 

And it is nice to see you took the "high road" Doc, by calling us

 

1."rude"

2."disrespectful"

3. "offensive"

4. "juvenile"

5. "shameful"

 

And all in one post! Nice.

 

I am not attacking Bob. I would wager, I've known him longer than you have, and have had many debates/dicussions with Bob. One, lasted all night in San Diego back around 1994 or 95.

 

We disagree on a fundamental level about some important issues in comics history. He is passionate about what he does, and the enormous amount of research he has done. He is entitled to that passion and has earned his right to shout his opinion to the rafters.

 

I'm passionate about this hobby too, and have also done a good deal of research into comics history. Admittedly, as I have stated several times in this thread, not nearly as much as Bob. I have limited my research to the 1933 and forward timeline. By choice.

 

He and Steve have opened my eyes to some fascinating pieces of information about some of the earlier books, and I am intrigued by them and plan to delve into them further.

 

I shouldn't have said that Bob was acting like an A**hole, but in truth I did it mostly for humor and dramatic effect. Those who know me, know that I have a very dry sarcastic sense of humor. The other comment I levied at Bob was that some of his assertions were lamebrained.

 

So that is two that I shouldn't have, in my nearly 1000 posts. You knocked out FIVE in one post.

 

So who is being rude? (oops, does that count as my third?)

 

I respect Bob, I just strongly disagree with him on a couple of very key issues. I would wager we agree on quite a bit too.

 

But either way Doc, I've known Bob a long time, and will bust his chops whenever I feel like it, and he is entitled to bust mine any time he feels like it.

 

He's earned it.

 

You haven't.

[BLBcomics-migration]

Most likely my last post here for a couple weeks. Big Apple National & MidOhio bound soon.

 

As promised, here is the 3rd comics history time line Clark Kinnaird has printed in America, long time King Features Syndicate comics editor and comics historian, which appeared in RUBE GOLDBERG VS THE MACHINE AGE in 1968.

 

At some point I will post the first time line he did back in 1948.

 

Compare to Kinnaird's 2nd time line from THE FUNNIES ANNUAL #1 from 1959 Theagenes posted a few days ago.

 

He did not have use of the internet (ie eBay) which makes research in most any subject easier than it used to be

 

Also note he did not indicate such stalwarts in 1929 as the first appearances of Popeye or Buck Rogers - there are also a lot of errors, some minor, very close, and some major ones

 

[FlyingDonut]

as I said before

 

My comics history is the pinnacle of integrity

 

My comics history lessons in Overstreet have nothing to do with what i sell or buy for re-sale

 

I listed Deadwood Gulch, Clancey the Cop as well as Detective Dan, Ace King, Bob Scully, as well as Tim McCoy Police Car 17 from 1934 as examples of original comics material pre-dating Action #1, as some one (you?) listed that as a starting point of original material in the posts which ran while i was gone comicon in Baltimore

 

I've tried to stay out of this, but I have a serious problem with your comic history. Ask 1,000 collectors and dealers what are the most important comics published since 1955, and I guarantee you at least ten of these will be on that list. NOT value, but importance to the industry.

 

Action Comics 252

Adventure 247

Amazing Fantasy 15

Amazing Spider-Man 1

Amazing Spider-Man 96

Amazing Spider-Man 121

Amazing Spider-Man 122

Amazing Spider-Man 129

Amazing Spider-Man 300

Avengers 1

Avengers 4

Brave and the Bold 28

Brave and the Bold 34

Batman 232

Batman 234

Cerebus 1

Conan 1

Daredevil 1

Detective 225

Detective 328

Fantastic Four 1

Fantastic Four 5

Flash 105

Giant Size X-Men 1

Green Lantern 76

Harvey Hits 3

Incredible Hulk 1

Incredible Hulk 181

Journey Into Mystery 83

Justice League of America 1

Our Army at War 83

Richie Rich 1

Showcase 4

Showcase 8

Showcase 9

Showcase 13

Showcase 22

Strange Adventures 205

Strange Tales 101

Tales of Suspense 39

Tales to Astonish 27

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles 1

X-Men 1

X-Men 94

X-Men 137

 

You don't mention any of them in the Guide, outside of a caption for five of them. You discuss for several pages books from 1929-1955 (which is interesting and informative ), and then fill less than a page on everything published in the last 50 years, with most of that on undergrounds. That's just superheroes. You don't mention funny animals, romance, westerns, anything.

 

Your "comprehensive history" doesn't discuss what the overwhelming majority of comics history is. For crying out loud, give Amazing Spider-Man - arguably the most recognizable fictional character in the world - at least the same amount of discussion as The Gilmore Club.

[Monstro]

man i wish i could figure out the point of this thread. can someone sum it up in a few sentences?

is it who is more important to comics sups or oldbuck?

 

i’m trying to think of a parallel in the music business or sports history, if there is one.