Jaydogrules

Uh...actually "hindsight" has nothing to do with it. ASM was a ~50,000 seller for more than a year and a half before this book was even thought of. So they would have had much more than an inkling as to how much of a variant to print to meet a proposed incentive well in advance. Which is why they were caught with their pants down a little on this one with a resulting seriously under-ordered book that ended up turning into a phenomenon. Whoops! It was a perfect storm of events if you will. -J.

There's a "cost benefit" to over-printing a title that's in the doldrums ? I don't think so. I think the cumulative data on your site for this book (and others with comparable print runs) belie that statement. -J. PS: I love your site. (thumbs u No, there is a cost benefit to printing AT LEAST 1,000 copies of each comic. The total cost under 1,000 copies is basically identical to the cost of 1,000. If you print 500, you'll pay the cost of 1,000... and you'll only get 500. "Buy one for the price of two!" (No business would ever do that.) Why wouldn't you pay for 1,000 and get 1,000? My concern (if I was "invested" in this book) would be: All indications are that there are NOT 1,000 copies of this book in the current market. Which means that this particular book is in danger of being significantly impacted if boxes of the book are sitting somewhere. It would be much better for owners of this comic if EVERY copy was distributed. If would be better if there was not a "hoard" of these books anywhere... particularly in unknown (and potentially uncaring) hands. But... because there are so few available in the market... and because Marvel likely printed 1,000 copies. There is a huge risk associated with those missing books. If they're in one place... they could kill the market when they arrive. Primer #2 is a perfect example... even though it happened 20 years after printing. Again, this statement could literally be said about "any" book of "any" era. I'm not so sure what the sudden obsession seems to be with "this" book to belabor such a blatantly speculative and extraordinarily unlikely scenario. -J.

There's a "cost benefit" to over-printing a title that's in the doldrums ? I don't think so. I think the cumulative data on your site for this book (and others with comparable print runs) belie that statement. -J. PS: I love your site. (thumbs u

And to think that the ASM 667 Dell'otto has a print run estimated as low as 200. -J.

Neither you nor RMA have presented any actual "fact". The "fact" is there are only 92 copies of this book on the census even after 3.5 years, and a book that has consistently sold for a high dollar since its release. The "fact" is that its high dollar value is partly due to its rarity, both in high grade, in the census, and its availability on the market. The "fact" is that ASM sales were half then what they are now, so not many retailers were blowing up their orders to qualify for this variant. The "fact" is that there are other high dollar moderns with comparable estimated print runs (500) that have even more slabbed copies accounted for than this one (wolverine 1, siege 3 campbell). Those are the "facts". Here now is what you and RMA have speculated about: You have speculated that there is a warehouse full of copies of this book. You have speculated that there are low census numbers only because people aren't bothering to slab this high dollar book. You have speculated that marvel may some day sell "extra copies" of this book for $5. You have speculated that marvel over-printed this book even in a down Spidey market because....well, just because. Contrary to your opinion on the matter, Marvel has, on many, many occasions, printed much less than 1000 copies of a variant. To suggest or state otherwise is pure nonsense. I think that just about covers it. (thumbs u -J.

That's only if every shop that ordered the book ordered 50+ copies of the regular cover. Time and and the book's overall scarcity has suggested that certainly did not happen. (thumbs u -J. Ok we can say that. But it is possible that Marvel still "did" print those copies, but never distributed them to retailers. Maybe some were destroyed or given away to employees? Still a wicked low print run. Again, highly unlikely given how poor spidey sales were at the time. As you can see ASM 678 barely cracked the top 20 then. There would be little reason or motivation for Marvel to randomly decide to over-print "this" specific book, regardless of what poppycock RMA is trying to float for whatever reason. Reality has already proven his far fetched theories and speculation to be wrong. (thumbs u And frankly his sweeping and unsubstantiated statements can be made about virtually "any" book from any era, so I'm really starting to wonder what his fixation is about trying so strenuously (and yet so unsuccessfully) to make them about "this" particular book. -J. You're completely off base. Marvel's motivation is cost. It is substantially cheaper per copy to have 1,000+ printed. It was Marvel's SOP to print more than you are suggesting. Why would they randomnly decide to underprint? Uh....because the books weren't selling well then. As you said, "motivation being cost". -J.

That's only if every shop that ordered the book ordered 50+ copies of the regular cover. Time and and the book's overall scarcity has suggested that certainly did not happen. (thumbs u -J. Ok we can say that. But it is possible that Marvel still "did" print those copies, but never distributed them to retailers. Maybe some were destroyed or given away to employees? Still a wicked low print run. Again, highly unlikely given how poor spidey sales were at the time. As you can see ASM 678 barely cracked the top 20 then. There would be little reason or motivation for Marvel to randomly decide to over-print "this" specific book, regardless of what poppycock RMA is trying to float for whatever reason. Reality has already proven his far fetched theories and speculation to be wrong. (thumbs u And frankly his sweeping and unsubstantiated statements can be made about virtually "any" book from any era, so I'm really starting to wonder what his fixation is about trying so strenuously (and yet so unsuccessfully) to make them about "this" particular book. -J.

That's only if every shop that ordered the book ordered 50+ copies of the regular cover. Time and and the book's overall scarcity has suggested that certainly did not happen. (thumbs u -J.

Can anyone point to some sales on GPA that reflect a consistent and/or quantifiable "discount" or "premium" either way, because I sure do not see any (and never have). It truly seems to be more myth that is rooted in individual personal preference and/or bias than actual fact. -J.

Many people on these boards say that they essentially regard PGX graded books as raw anyway and pay accordingly. As an example, here's a a PGX graded copy "9.8" that sold for half what a CGC 9.8 sold for privately on the boards recently: http://www.ebay.com/itm/2012-MARVEL-COMICS-AMAZING-SPIDER-MAN-678-VARIANT-PGX-9-8-LIKE-CGC-VERY-RARE-/351351522770?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item51ce2ec5d2 Raw copies were going for between $1200-$1400ish at the same time. -J.

+1 I usually expect to lose 1-2 grading increments going from PGX to CGC. -J. I'll check it out when it gets here as it's now definitely coming as part of a larger deal. I don't usually have moderns of this magnitude (or at all, really) so this information definitely helps. If I can't get it sold quickly I'll definitely look into a re-sub to CGC. I know PGX sucks nuts. Thanks again for the info. (thumbs u Good luck. -J.

+1 I usually expect to lose 1-2 grading increments going from PGX to CGC. -J.

I find it ironic that in one thread you use the census to trumpet the "rarity" of ASM 301 (not a "rare" book in any grade, whatsoever), yet here, when an actually rare book is at issue, you essentially dismiss the census as meaningless. I'm not even sure what windmill you're tilting at this time because you are literally attempting to argue against all conventional wisdom when it comes to the actual and very real rarity of the 678. For a book you apparently resent so much, you sure can't seem to stop talking about it. Anywho, this, and numerous other high dollar variants printed by Marvel, DC, and Image have estimated print runs of much less than 1000, with scarcity on both the census and the marketplace to support those estimates. And no, I am not going to take the time to list them (though I have already listed three from Marvel, including the 678). (thumbs u -J.

I'm still bummed about the "Spider-Gwenom" cover. That would have been a hot book with an even halfway decent concept and art. -J.

2000? No way. The entire print run for the regular cover was only about 50,000, and Spider-man sales sucked at this time so there would be no reason for Marvel to over-print this particular variant. Furthermore, comparing this book, where the entire point of it is rarity (be it manufactured rarity, or otherwise) to any version of Spider-Man 1 and its million+ print run is absolutely nonsensical. As for the Primer 2 comparison- I see absolutely no relevant commonality or connection between the two books whatsoever. So Primer 2 had a small warehouse find. Who cares? That has nothing to do with this book. More appropriate comparisons would be siege 3 and wolverine 1 (the Campbell variants). Both also have print runs estimated at around 500, and both were released within 18 months or so of this. As of now there are 132 wolverine 1's (52, 9.8's) and 102 siege 3's (61, 9.8's). Meanwhile there are currently 92 ASM 678's VenoMJ's (22, 9.8's), all consistent with a ~500 print run. -J.

Man, you have bad luck with this book! Something's telling me the tide has turned. -J.

Jay answered, a few posts back: (thumbs u Elijah and Spidey78 pretty much have the narrative down. Plus Spider-Man was a weak seller at the time, so the book itself was under-ordered. Coupled with the lack of any hyped storyline and merchant fatigue with ASM variants, and the fact that it was a 1:50 created a very short print run for the variant. The odds of a case of this specific book sitting in a warehouse somewhere are beyond remote. The book has been tough since Day One, and particularly tough in NM/M condition for the reasons Spidey78 mentioned. The book popped right away amongst die hards, but really took off when it gained a larger awareness in the general marketplace. I'm seeing fan recreated art, posters and prints of this thing now. It really is quite remarkable. -J.

You guys are killing me with how you once had all of these 9.8's. You're right, those two copies above do look a little "ticky" on the spine. If CGC is grading "tight" right now that would explain why only 1 out of the last 10 of these submitted since the price spike has gotten a 9.8. Here's the large scan of my OO copy, still owned by me. It looks like a pretty tightly graded 9.8 to me: -J.

Holy . -J.

Another for you, Leto. This "Joker" will be an effeminate, borderline androgynous interpretation with a touch of moody, unpredictable psychopath. You heard it here first. (thumbs u -J. Now THAT is cool. Agreed on the (thumbs u Here's to hoping you are right! Ironically, as I typed it I also thought it sounded kind of good. I suppose execution will truly be everything in order to overcome (or mesh effectively with) this outlandish character design. -J.

Perhaps... I missed the PQ. Grading PQ is a little wish/washy, but brittle is generally not great. Yeah, it surely would make me hesitate, but for the grade it looks underpriced. And not everyone care so much about PQ. To an extent I agree with you...whilst i am one of the people who greatly considers PQ, the market of people who dont care what the PQ is still is higher than the ones like me who cares about them. Yes, just for the record, I also care. W or OW are both fine (I'm no WP snob hehe), CR is different and I want a bit of a rebate for that. Brittle is where I might not be interested even if the rebate is considerable. But of course even brittle has a price. I see no "rebates" for DC SA books with "cr" on the label (or most key Marvel books). "Slightly Brittle", yes, since that is seldom seen in SA books (and actually is a quantifiable page QUALITY as opposed to "colour"). -J.

Another for you, Leto. This "Joker" will be an effeminate, borderline androgynous interpretation with a touch of moody, unpredictable psychopath. You heard it here first. (thumbs u -J.

Do you have a source for this information? It would be good to file this away for reference. I don't think anyone has a definitive source. It's generally believed the MJI's were only in copies distributed through overseas (and possibly stateside) military bases. 5% doesn't seem out of line. So total the number of military base retailers and compare that number to total published copies (returnable or not) and that's where the 5% comes from. 10% seems way too high. Maybe it's 7%? Until Mark Jewelers chimes in I doubt we'll ever have an accurate figure on any numbers. So you're saying all star-stamped books have inserts, but not all insert books have star stamps? Star stamped books only came from a few overseas AAFES stores, so not every insert book will carry a star stamp. Here is a Mark Jeweler's insert comic without the star stamp: I also have comics that were picked up by me from the bookstore in Ramstein Germany in the late 1970s/early 1980s that have a star stamp but do not have the Mark Jewelers insert. But by far, most of the comics do have the insert. That's pretty cool. Your comics, bought by you in Germany, in the 70's, brought back stateside by you, and still with you today. Do you have any BA "keys" in the lot by any chance? -J.

Do you have a source for this information? It would be good to file this away for reference. I don't think anyone has a definitive source. It's generally believed the MJI's were only in copies distributed through overseas (and possibly stateside) military bases. 5% doesn't seem out of line. So total the number of military base retailers and compare that number to total published copies (returnable or not) and that's where the 5% comes from. 10% seems way too high. Maybe it's 7%? Until Mark Jewelers chimes in I doubt we'll ever have an accurate figure on any numbers. So you're saying all star-stamped books have inserts, but not all insert books have star stamps? Star stamped books only came from a few overseas AAFES stores, so not every insert book will carry a star stamp. You are correct about this. I'll also add that my research has suggested that the inserts only came in "newsstand" editions, so no direct market copies will have them, thus narrowing the percentages further. I feel very comfortable with and stand by the 5% estimate as that seems to be the consensus amongst those who have *really* tracked these things. -J.

What, you worry? I know you've been wanting a 9.8, but a "best offer" was accepted on another copy of a 9.6 for $2,080 shortly after your auction closed, so you did fine. (thumbs u http://item.ebay.co.uk/281695552404?item_hash4=a7e75484&LH_Complete=1&LH_BIN=1&LH_BO=1&_ipg=200&_pgn=1&rc=nt&rmvSB=true @Lon- You're still the only one to pull a new 9.8 (or offer one) in the last year. @Chip- A PGX "9.6" would probably go for about what a CGC 9.4 would go for- $1400-$1500ish. -J.