PROBATION DISCUSSIONS 20 20

[zuckuss2003]

He is a board member, he posted here in this very thread. Does it really matter when he became a member? I don't think so.

[PovertyRow]

He is a board member, he posted here in this very thread. Does it really matter when he became a member? I don't think so.

 

Yeah, it does. The OP was not a board member when the transaction took place and for some time after. This system was designed to help protect board member transactions between themselves. There is no grandfathering clause in the rules.

 

I am not negating the severity of this. But there should be sufficient people from what I have read who are boardies that can initiate something here.

 

[Iceman399]

He is a board member, he posted here in this very thread. Does it really matter when he became a member? I don't think so.

 

Yeah, it does. The OP was not a board member when the transaction took place and for some time after. This system was designed to help protect board member transactions between themselves. There is no grandfathering clause in the rules.

 

I am not negating the severity of this. But there should be sufficient people from what I have read who are boardies that can initiate something here.

 

Where does it state the transaction must occur prior to joining the cgc boards?

 

I agree that it must be between cgc forum members, else it would get out of hand by putting ebay user XYZ and craigslist email address silly@madeup.com . However I don't see anywhere it states the transaction has to be started after joining the forum.

[Bronty]

He is a board member, he posted here in this very thread. Does it really matter when he became a member? I don't think so.

 

Yeah, it does. The OP was not a board member when the transaction took place and for some time after. This system was designed to help protect board member transactions between themselves. There is no grandfathering clause in the rules.

 

I am not negating the severity of this. But there should be sufficient people from what I have read who are boardies that can initiate something here.

 

Pov,

 

I suppose you mean well, but why don't you leave it to the mods to decide.

[PovertyRow]

He is a board member, he posted here in this very thread. Does it really matter when he became a member? I don't think so.

 

Yeah, it does. The OP was not a board member when the transaction took place and for some time after. This system was designed to help protect board member transactions between themselves. There is no grandfathering clause in the rules.

 

I am not negating the severity of this. But there should be sufficient people from what I have read who are boardies that can initiate something here.

 

Pov,

 

I suppose you mean well, but why don't you leave it to the mods to decide.

 

I doubt the mods will have any input. They have made it clear we police ourselves.

 

 

 

 

[PovertyRow]

 

Where does it state the transaction must occur prior to joining the cgc boards?

 

I agree that it must be between cgc forum members, else it would get out of hand by putting ebay user XYZ and craigslist email address silly@madeup.com . However I don't see anywhere it states the transaction has to be started after joining the forum.

 

Because the transaction was NOT between CGC forum members. The transaction was between one forum member and one non-member.

[sacentaur]

However, it appears there are many examples on Deals Gone Bad from other boardies. Certainly enough to get a PL or HOS result.

 

There are so many past transgressions with BLB, one hardly knows where to begin.

 

Any takers here?

 

Yeah, me most recently last year. BLB conducted a bait-and-switch over a lobby card. A month of endless excuses and rationalizations to no effect.

 

During that time, he also sent me an unsolicited item and asked for more money.

 

Ultimately I did not get a refund so I kept the item. BLB claims that I "stole" from him, and has slandered me on this Board (receiving a strike for masking a sex act with a horse).

 

BLB is the most manipulative seller that I have ever encountered in over three decades in the hobby.

[sacentaur]

If anyone is deserving of the HOS it is BLB, but I'm going to have to side with Pov here.

 

There are rules in place and there's a process that needs to be followed.

 

Board members need to simply speak up about their most egregious experiences with him, and then a HOS membership should be just a formality.

[PovertyRow]

If anyone is deserving of the HOS it is BLB, but I'm going to have to side with Pov here.

 

There are rules in place and there's a process that needs to be followed.

 

Board members need to simply speak up about their most egregious experiences with him, and then a HOS membership should be just a formality.

 

Thanks Sac. You read me well.

[jaybuck43]

POV, query. Is there a closing time? I mean the violation is still ongoing. So now that both parties are members, could he wait 30 days and then nominate?

[Iceman399]

 

Where does it state the transaction must occur prior to joining the cgc boards?

 

I agree that it must be between cgc forum members, else it would get out of hand by putting ebay user XYZ and craigslist email address silly@madeup.com . However I don't see anywhere it states the transaction has to be started after joining the forum.

 

Because the transaction was NOT between CGC forum members. The transaction was between one forum member and one non-member.

 

No the transaction IS between two forum members:

Matthew42383

&

BLBComics

[Sqeggs]

Leaving aside the particulars of this case, I agree with POV that it may not be the best idea in the world to allow new members to nominate existing members for the PL over off-board transactions. Particularly if the sole reason the new member became a member was to nominate someone to the PL.

 

I think the purpose of the PL and HoS is to protect members from misbehavior by other members. Not to protect the world.

[telerites]

 

Where does it state the transaction must occur prior to joining the cgc boards?

 

I agree that it must be between cgc forum members, else it would get out of hand by putting ebay user XYZ and craigslist email address silly@madeup.com . However I don't see anywhere it states the transaction has to be started after joining the forum.

 

Because the transaction was NOT between CGC forum members. The transaction was between one forum member and one non-member.

 

No the transaction IS between two forum members:

Matthew42383

&

BLBComics

 

I think Pov's point is that Matthew42383 was not a board member at the time of the transaction so the actual transaction was not between CGC forum members when it happened.

[PovertyRow]

Tel and Sqe hit on some of my thinking.

 

I will also pose this comparison:

 

1) It is OK for a non-board member to participate in a transaction with a board member, then come here and join after the fact and nominate them for the PL. The logic is they are NOW board members, even though they were not when the transaction was made.

 

2) We have former board members who have been banned. They are no longer board members. Following the above logic, all of them should be removed from the PL and HOS as they are now NOT board members.

 

Neither of those fly for me.

[skypinkblu]

Matt is a board member now, the problem is continuing.

 

I'd prefer to see Bob on the probation thread first and give him a little bit of time to complete the deal now that Mark has stepped in, but if that won't work for you, I'd go with Hall of Shame.

 

Ignoring the problem is not going to work to the benefit of the members.

 

I would like to propose we make this and exceptional incident and give Bob 2 calendar weeks to complete the deal, if not,I'd propose we put him on the probation list.

 

Just a suggestion given the exceptional circumstances...

 

But, as I said, if that doesn't work for you, then I'd go with the Hall of Shame.

[PovertyRow]

Matt is a board member now, the problem is continuing.

 

I'd prefer to see Bob on the probation thread first and give him a little bit of time to complete the deal now that Mark has stepped in, but if that won't work for you, I'd go with Hall of Shame.

 

Ignoring the problem is not going to work to the benefit of the members.

 

I would like to propose we make this and exceptional incident and give Bob 2 calendar weeks to complete the deal, if not,I'd propose we put him on the probation list.

 

Just a suggestion given the exceptional circumstances...

 

But, as I said, if that doesn't work for you, then I'd go with the Hall of Shame.

 

I'd prefer to see others who have admitted to having bad experiences sound in here as well about those experiences. PL or HOS in this instance would not make much difference, as people CAN be voted off the HOS same way they got voted on. If more who have had issues came forward (and I know all this is just recently brought up) maybe things could eventually be worked out with all of them.

 

The problem with making exceptions is that when one exception is made others will be sure to follow. There is way more than enough potential here for PL or HOS from existing members.

[Iceman399]

Tel and Sqe hit on some of my thinking.

 

I will also pose this comparison:

 

1) It is OK for a non-board member to participate in a transaction with a board member, then come here and join after the fact and nominate them for the PL. The logic is they are NOW board members, even though they were not when the transaction was made.

 

2) We have former board members who have been banned. They are no longer board members. Following the above logic, all of them should be removed from the PL and HOS as they are now NOT board members.

 

Neither of those fly for me.

 

Why would we not encourage members to come to the site? When they come to the site realize they were over a by a board member and bring it to everyone's attention to have it resolved?

 

Why would we remove someone who hasn't deserved to be removed that is just a pointless argument.

 

The purpose of the PL/HOS is to protect the community from bad board members. Isn't that exactly what is being proposed here? Matthew has been wronged by a board member and is looking to ensure others aren't.

[PovertyRow]

However, it appears there are many examples on Deals Gone Bad from other boardies. Certainly enough to get a PL or HOS result.

 

There are so many past transgressions with BLB, one hardly knows where to begin.

 

Any takers here?

 

Yeah, me most recently last year. BLB conducted a bait-and-switch over a lobby card. A month of endless excuses and rationalizations to no effect.

 

During that time, he also sent me an unsolicited item and asked for more money.

 

Ultimately I did not get a refund so I kept the item. BLB claims that I "stole" from him, and has slandered me on this Board (receiving a strike for masking a sex act with a horse).

 

BLB is the most manipulative seller that I have ever encountered in over three decades in the hobby.

 

This is a good start.

[skypinkblu]

Matt is a board member now, the problem is continuing.

 

I'd prefer to see Bob on the probation thread first and give him a little bit of time to complete the deal now that Mark has stepped in, but if that won't work for you, I'd go with Hall of Shame.

 

Ignoring the problem is not going to work to the benefit of the members.

 

I would like to propose we make this and exceptional incident and give Bob 2 calendar weeks to complete the deal, if not,I'd propose we put him on the probation list.

 

Just a suggestion given the exceptional circumstances...

 

But, as I said, if that doesn't work for you, then I'd go with the Hall of Shame.

 

I'd prefer to see others who have admitted to having bad experiences sound in here as well about those experiences. PL or HOS in this instance would not make much difference, as people CAN be voted off the HOS same way they got voted on. If more who have had issues came forward (and I know all this is just recently brought up) maybe things could eventually be worked out with all of them.

 

The problem with making exceptions is that when one exception is made others will be sure to follow. There is way more than enough potential here for PL or HOS from existing members.

 

I agree with Iceman, Mattew did not come here to put Bob on the probation list, he came to advise the community that there was a problem. He didn't have a clue about the list.

 

I read the rules before I suggested he file and I didn't see any language that would preclude him from making the request.

 

I saw language that COULD be interpreted that way, but didn't have to be. The same way the Constitution can be interpreted in different ways, I'm reading this to mean between board members, not between board members at the time the transaction was first initiated.

 

Do we really want to make it harder on this man who is out so much money?

 

 

 

Is there a reason to coddle Bob?

[thehumantorch]

I had a difficult 7 or 8 month deal with Bob but I did eventually get a book in the mail that I accepted so I can't nominate Bob. I'll never deal with him again but I'm not convinced he's dishonest or Dr Bob Evil. I am convinced that he's the most disorganized, forgetful, scattered person I've ever dealt with. I would like to nominate him to the Walking Dead Hall of Zombies.