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Sale of the Year - New Mutants #98 CGC 9.9 for $12,250
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Started by delekkerste,

1,155 posts in this topic

VintageComics

VintageComics

Posted
Posted
Dammit, why is it whenever I post the discussion stops?

 

:insane:

 

You're like the plague, eveyone wants to avoid you :baiting:

 

I was hoping that someone would say something nice. That's the nicest thing I've heard all week.

 

:grin:

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joe_collector

joe_collector

Posted
Posted
Because another way to look at it is that, if in fact what you are saying is true, that it is "totally arbitary", then there would not be only 1 9.9 and 396 9.8s. If it was "totally arbitrary", then statistically there should be many 9.9s as well as many 9.8s.

 

Have you ever heard the term "grading on a bell curve"? It's a method of distributing grades in a predetermined manner and frequency, so that you have X number (or %) of A's, Y number of B's, Z number of C's, etc.

 

Same with CGC, and you'd have to be incredibly naive not to understand that. In fact, this methodology at the better-than-NM level is absolutely key to their very existence.

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Flaming_Telepath

Flaming_Telepath

Posted
Posted
Because another way to look at it is that, if in fact what you are saying is true, that it is "totally arbitary", then there would not be only 1 9.9 and 396 9.8s. If it was "totally arbitrary", then statistically there should be many 9.9s as well as many 9.8s.

 

Have you ever heard the term "grading on a bell curve"? It's a method of distributing grades in a predetermined manner and frequency, so that you have X number (or %) of A's, Y number of B's, Z number of C's, etc.

 

Same with CGC, and you'd have to be incredibly naive not to understand that. In fact, this methodology at the better-than-NM level is absolutely key to their very existence.

 

(worship) (worship) (worship)

 

Christ, we've missed you. :foryou:

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DrWatson

DrWatson

Posted
Posted
Because another way to look at it is that, if in fact what you are saying is true, that it is "totally arbitary", then there would not be only 1 9.9 and 396 9.8s. If it was "totally arbitrary", then statistically there should be many 9.9s as well as many 9.8s.

 

Have you ever heard the term "grading on a bell curve"? It's a method of distributing grades in a predetermined manner and frequency, so that you have X number (or %) of A's, Y number of B's, Z number of C's, etc.

 

Same with CGC, and you'd have to be incredibly naive not to understand that. In fact, this methodology at the better-than-NM level is absolutely key to their very existence.

 

(worship) (worship) (worship)

 

Christ, we've I've missed you. :foryou:

Fixed that for ye, governor. (thumbs u

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VintageComics

VintageComics

Posted
Posted
Because another way to look at it is that, if in fact what you are saying is true, that it is "totally arbitary", then there would not be only 1 9.9 and 396 9.8s. If it was "totally arbitrary", then statistically there should be many 9.9s as well as many 9.8s.

 

Have you ever heard the term "grading on a bell curve"? It's a method of distributing grades in a predetermined manner and frequency, so that you have X number (or %) of A's, Y number of B's, Z number of C's, etc.

 

Same with CGC, and you'd have to be incredibly naive not to understand that. In fact, this methodology at the better-than-NM level is absolutely key to their very existence.

 

So are you saying that CGC doesn't actually grade the book sitting in front of them but rather assigns grades (at least in the highest tiers) to simply protect the population of books at certain grade levels?

 

I call BS.

 

I've had multiple 9.9 grades of the same book come back where if it was in their best interest to protect that grade, they miserably failed according to your theory.

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Sal

Sal

Posted
Posted

i dunno if it's as prescribed as Joe says it is, but i do believe that CGC carefully controls the number of 9.9 and 10.0 grades it gives out.

 

it would seem that the flaws that seem to be a recent decision for them to be allowed in 9.8 - a single CBC spine crease & etc - would almost allow for a more exact differentiation between a 9.8 and 9.9.

 

10s should nearly be - in the words of tth2 - mythical

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Hedge Collector

Hedge Collector

Posted
Posted
Because another way to look at it is that, if in fact what you are saying is true, that it is "totally arbitary", then there would not be only 1 9.9 and 396 9.8s. If it was "totally arbitrary", then statistically there should be many 9.9s as well as many 9.8s.

 

Have you ever heard the term "grading on a bell curve"? It's a method of distributing grades in a predetermined manner and frequency, so that you have X number (or %) of A's, Y number of B's, Z number of C's, etc.

 

Same with CGC, and you'd have to be incredibly naive not to understand that. In fact, this methodology at the better-than-NM level is absolutely key to their very existence.

 

Naive...hmmm...

 

I was discussing the concept of "totally arbitrary" which you brought up.

 

But now you bring up "grading on a bell curve." A 9.9 book would still stand above the rest of the 9.8s in a bell curve. You have simply allowed for a wider number of books to be 9.8s and much fewer to be assigned 9.9s. That would allow for a 9.8 to be "better" than another 9.8, but it would not allow for any 9.8 to be "better" than a 9.9.

 

That this 9.9 would've been a 9.8 on another given day may be true. What I'm saying is neither your argument of "totally arbitrary" nor "grading on a bell curve" support this conclusion.

 

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VintageComics

VintageComics

Posted
Posted
i dunno if it's as prescribed as Joe says it is, but i do believe that CGC carefully controls the number of 9.9 and 10.0 grades it gives out.

 

Based on my experiences I'm going to disagree although you guys are free to your opinions.

 

Where would they draw the line? Who's submissions and which books?

 

I think that graders have almost no (or little) clue about census numbers and only know what book is sitting in front of them at that time.

 

Anyhow, not trying to be argumentative, just stating what I believe based on my experiences.

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RockMyAmadeus

RockMyAmadeus

Posted
Posted

If I may....JC isn't saying "well, let's see, this book has 482 9.8s, and zero 9.9s...it's time we gave it one, and THIS one looks like it will fit the bill."

 

No.

 

It's simply a brand protection. They simply don't give out 9.9s or 10s unless the books are well within those grades.

 

The census numbers mean nothing (to them), it simply applies to every book they come across that is a potential in those grades.

 

It's not like the difference between 9.4 and 9.6, where one day it could be one, and one day the other. If there's any question at all, they err to the side of 9.8, always.

 

And I doubt it's even really a conscious thing.

 

The census numbers bear this phenomenon out. There are a couple dozen books that have ZERO 9.9s or 10s, but which DO have hundreds of 9.8s. Statistically, this should not be possible. For every hundred 9.8s, there should probably be 2 9.9s and a 10 for every two hundred or so.

 

But there's not.

 

So are we (the collective us) saying that books with literally hundreds and hundreds of "9.8 quality" had not a single "slightly better" copy among them...?

 

Yup.

 

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trmoore54

trmoore54

Posted
Posted
:roflmao:

 

Nick, my point is where do you draw the line as to what is an acceptable price and what isn't?

 

The line is in a different spot for every person depending on how deep their pockets are and what their perspective of the hobby is.

 

There are 100's of sales every year where people wretch at prices and they just continue to happen.

 

Some prices, in hindsight are good investments, and some are not.

 

When Wolverine Limited #1 in CGC 10.0 sold for $4000 that shook people up quite a bit. 6 years later a second copy surfaces and sells for $15,000.

 

Who knows what the future holds?

 

Nobody. That's why every new record price in comics is mocked with scorn.

 

Relativism.

 

It's what's for dinner.

 

At the Delic household.

 

Every Frickin' day. :golfclap:

 

I know of one or two real objectivists throughout all of history. Rand and Jesus come to mind. Except that Rand was inconsistent in her relationships, so she's out. Jesus broke the laws when it suited his purposes, and he's so complex as to defy simple labels.

 

I don't know anyone who isn't a relativist to one degree or another. Roy just happens to be more of a relativist than you.

 

 

 

insert old joke about liberals here.

 

"What's a Liberal?"

"Someone who is to the left of you."

 

As far as objectivists go, you forgot to mention Steve Ditko... :baiting:doh!

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trmoore54

trmoore54

Posted
Posted (edited)
All this back and forth about "it's his money, he can do what he wants with it!" and "what a person_who_is_obnoxiously_self-impressed, paying $12K for a modern book" totally veers around the point.

 

The difference in physical condition between this book and a strong 9.8 is non-existent.

 

Fully 5% of the nearly 400 9.8s now on the census are in the exact same physical condition as this book, or better.

 

It just so happened that the graders agreed to bestow this particular copy with a 9.9 on the day it was graded. Does it DESERVE the grade? Sure, absolutely. But so do at least 10-20 copies of the 9.8s that were graded, too.

 

I have 8 9.8s on the census. Probably 2-3 of those could fairly have been 9.9s. Did they get them? No, but if they had, this copy wouldn't have sold for $12K.

 

The buyer paid $12,000 for a piece of artwork...this:

 

newmutants98cgc99-2.jpg

 

newmutants98cgc99-1-1.jpg

 

NOT the book inside the slab. Kind of a crummy piece of artwork for $12K, but what the hey, modern art is hot.

 

When more 9.9s show up....and they probably will...then what? The X-Men #141 in 9.9 sold for $14,000. This book sold for 85% of that price. Which was "the best value for their money"...?

 

Perspective. It's totally lacking in these sales.

 

That was pretty well-stated! (thumbs u ( :gossip: and I don't know this book from shinola... )

Edited by trmoore54
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bostoncorbett

bostoncorbett

Posted
Posted

Hi there. I'm new to the boards. Decided to join after reading this thread. I did a google search of "New Mutants 98 9.9" to see what people were saying after the Pedigree auction. Funny, funny, funny stuff. Thought you might like to know...

 

1. Payment is on its way. Check was mailed out last Thursday morning (I was traveling out of the country on business, or else I would have mailed it sooner).

 

2. As for the price, I called Doug at Pedigree to assure him that I, in fact, wanted this comic and it wasn't a fluke bid. As you are aware, if you want a 9.9 (or a 10.0) comic of any age, you have to act when it comes up, or risk never ever seeing it again. I'm glad you put it up for sale and I'm glad I bought it. My highest bid at the end (to avoid the stupid bidding war) was $15,000. Post that fact on this board and lets see what's said.

 

Enjoy the check. I'll enjoy the book. Sounds like a great trade. :)

 

Be well, my friend.

 

Best regards,

 

Brian AKA Boston Corbett

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MR.COMICBOOK

MR.COMICBOOK

Posted
Posted
Hi there. I'm new to the boards. Decided to join after reading this thread. I did a google search of "New Mutants 98 9.9" to see what people were saying after the Pedigree auction. Funny, funny, funny stuff. Thought you might like to know...

 

1. Payment is on its way. Check was mailed out last Thursday morning (I was traveling out of the country on business, or else I would have mailed it sooner).

 

2. As for the price, I called Doug at Pedigree to assure him that I, in fact, wanted this comic and it wasn't a fluke bid. As you are aware, if you want a 9.9 (or a 10.0) comic of any age, you have to act when it comes up, or risk never ever seeing it again. I'm glad you put it up for sale and I'm glad I bought it. My highest bid at the end (to avoid the stupid bidding war) was $15,000. Post that fact on this board and lets see what's said.

 

Enjoy the check. I'll enjoy the book. Sounds like a great trade. :)

 

Be well, my friend.

 

Best regards,

 

Brian AKA Boston Corbett

Another Bostonian! Welcome to the boards! (thumbs u

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oakman29

oakman29

Posted
Posted

Welcome to the boards I am really impressed that you "the buyer" of this fine book came to chime in,What a sale. :applause:

You must admit its a pretty amazing price,I just wish I could swim in the same pool and afford books with such ease. meh

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