drbanner Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 .....but when page quality is considered as a preference, NOONE wants a book with lower page quality. (thumbs u When you have dealers saying they get more for copies with better page quality and collectors saying they'll pay more for copies with better page quality and the fact that not a single collector would pay more for a copy with lower page quality, the matter is settled. So it's just silly-season now...Jaydog vs. the world and he ain't backing down no way, no how, no matter what! I actually passed on a 5.5 and 6.0 when I was buying my BB 28 5.0 because I didn't want the cream pages, I downgraded for better PQ. Yes PQ does make a difference in terms of a buying decision. Yeah, it does for me as well. For Silver Age books, I won't even consider a book with cream pages, has to be OW or better and I know we're not alone. (thumbs u Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drbanner Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 PQ is only one factor and it's impact on a final price is contingent with other factors such as eye appeal. Crunching numbers will not automatically provide the answer to such a subjective concern. PQ is ultimately going to be part of the larger "buy the book and not the label" mentality. It will not, by itself, be the "silver bullet". GOD BLESS... -jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u Absolutely, everyone agrees that PQ affects the final value/price of a book, but it's not the only factor. And yeah, you certainly can't attempt to draw conclusions from a limited sample of reported sales on GPA without knowing all the other factors (e.g. eye appeal) that went into the sales price. (thumbs u Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kinzebac Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 PQ is only one factor and it's impact on a final price is contingent with other factors such as eye appeal. Crunching numbers will not automatically provide the answer to such a subjective concern. PQ is ultimately going to be part of the larger "buy the book and not the label" mentality. It will not, by itself, be the "silver bullet". GOD BLESS... -jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u Absolutely, everyone agrees that PQ affects the final value/price of a book, but it's not the only factor. And yeah, you certainly can't attempt to draw conclusions from a limited sample of reported sales on GPA without knowing all the other factors (e.g. eye appeal) that went into the sales price. (thumbs u Great Post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 PQ is only one factor and it's impact on a final price is contingent with other factors such as eye appeal. Crunching numbers will not automatically provide the answer to such a subjective concern. PQ is ultimately going to be part of the larger "buy the book and not the label" mentality. It will not, by itself, be the "silver bullet". GOD BLESS... -jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u Absolutely, everyone agrees that PQ affects the final value/price of a book, but it's not the only factor. And yeah, you certainly can't attempt to draw conclusions from a limited sample of reported sales on GPA without knowing all the other factors (e.g. eye appeal) that went into the sales price. (thumbs u ...except when it doesn't. Which is a whole, whole lot. (thumbs u I suppose it's easier to draw conclusions from the "no reported sales" that you have provided. And the "sampling" wasn't "limited". It was pulled from nearly every grade with more than one transaction over a two year period. You are literally just creating fiction at this point. -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gumiho Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 So let me see if I got this right as per the previous statements. So the acceptable "minimum" PQs: For Marvel SA: ow or better For DC SA: c/ow or better did i get that right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 So let me see if I got this right as per the previous statements. So the acceptable "minimum" PQs: For Marvel SA: ow or better For DC SA: c/ow or better did i get that right? "Buy the book and not the label." -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageComics Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 There is no 'acceptable minimum' for everyone. Some people care, some people don't. Everyone is different. Some people just want a copy of the book and some people want a White page copy of the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 There is no 'acceptable minimum' for everyone. Some people care, some people don't. Everyone is different. Some people just want a copy of the book and some people want a White page copy of the book. +1 That basically nails it. (thumbs u -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazyboy Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 Grade: 2.0 4/16/14- "Brittle" on the label- $1300 9/14/14/14- "Cr/OW" on the label- $1300 1/14/2015- "Cr/OW" on the label- $1381 Grade: 2.5 9/24/13- "Cr/OW" on the label- $1300 11/17/13- "Cr/OW" on the label- $1325 12/22/13- "OW/W" on the label- $1250 Grade: 3.0 3/26/15- "OW/W" on the label- $1880 4/29/15- "OW" on the label- $2330 Grade: 3.5 9/22/13- "OW" on the label- $1788 10/15/2013- "Cr/OW" on the label- $2250 Grade: 4.0 8/4/2013- "White" on the label- $2076 8/18/2013- "Cr/OW" on the label- $2749 9/9/13- "Cream" on the label- $2565 12/5/13- "Cr/OW" on the label- $1950 Grade 4.5: 3/4/15- "Cr/OW" on the label- $3500 3/27/15- "LT/OW" on the label- $4500 Grade 6.5: 3/23/14- "OW" on the label- $8500 8/7/14- "OW/W" on the label- $7170 That's seven different grades, over a two year period, and nearly two dozen examples where the so-called "PQ" that CGC decided to put on a label had absolutely no apparent effect on pricing. If anything, this data would ironically suggest that people pay *more* for books with "lesser 'PQ'" on the label. But I am not making such an argument. To do so would be ridiculous. Your examples show multiple lower grade books selling for more than higher grade copies. So apparently the grade CGC puts on the label doesn't affect prices either. I always thought that was a major factor. I guess nothing actually affects prices. Maybe they're all just determined by a random number generator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
showcase22gr1959 Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 (edited) The problem with this data is the market moves so quickly in a given time. If one has two books to choose at the same time with almost the same structure (centering, chips, no chips), the book with better PQ will always sell more. Edited May 27, 2015 by showcase22gr1959 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Knight Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 Again, going over this whole hurrah on PQ is giving me a headache I don't ever want to read another post that talks about PQ ever again. If anyone wants to talk about it, please say so before the discussion happens. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttfitz Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 Grade: 2.0 4/16/14- "Brittle" on the label- $1300 9/14/14/14- "Cr/OW" on the label- $1300 1/14/2015- "Cr/OW" on the label- $1381 Grade: 2.5 9/24/13- "Cr/OW" on the label- $1300 11/17/13- "Cr/OW" on the label- $1325 12/22/13- "OW/W" on the label- $1250 Grade: 3.0 3/26/15- "OW/W" on the label- $1880 4/29/15- "OW" on the label- $2330 Grade: 3.5 9/22/13- "OW" on the label- $1788 10/15/2013- "Cr/OW" on the label- $2250 Grade: 4.0 8/4/2013- "White" on the label- $2076 8/18/2013- "Cr/OW" on the label- $2749 9/9/13- "Cream" on the label- $2565 12/5/13- "Cr/OW" on the label- $1950 Grade 4.5: 3/4/15- "Cr/OW" on the label- $3500 3/27/15- "LT/OW" on the label- $4500 Grade 6.5: 3/23/14- "OW" on the label- $8500 8/7/14- "OW/W" on the label- $7170 That's seven different grades, over a two year period, and nearly two dozen examples where the so-called "PQ" that CGC decided to put on a label had absolutely no apparent effect on pricing. If anything, this data would ironically suggest that people pay *more* for books with "lesser 'PQ'" on the label. But I am not making such an argument. To do so would be ridiculous. Your examples show multiple lower grade books selling for more than higher grade copies. So apparently the grade CGC puts on the label doesn't affect prices either. I always thought that was a major factor. I guess nothing actually affects prices. Maybe they're all just determined by a random number generator. Lower grade books in the examples shown only sell for more than higher grade copies if you disregard the dates. Yes, in 2014 and 2015, 2.0 books sold for more than 2.5 books sold for in 2013. But unless I missed something, in the same general time-frame the higher the grade, the higher the price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttfitz Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 Okay, looking closer I do see one 4.0 selling a couple months after a 3.5 for $300 less. But I think the rest fit the dates scenario I put forth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 The problem with this data is the market moves so quickly in a given time. If one has two books to choose at the same time with almost the same structure (centering, chips, no chips), the book with better PQ will always sell more. In the extraordinarily unlikely event a situation like that ever arose, it may sell "first". But "more"? As the data suggests, probably not. -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageComics Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 The problem with this data is the market moves so quickly in a given time. If one has two books to choose at the same time with almost the same structure (centering, chips, no chips), the book with better PQ will always sell more. In the extraordinarily unlikely event a situation like that ever arose, it may sell "first". But "more"? As the data suggests, probably not. -J. If you have two different PQ books being offered at two different weeks, all things are not equal even if the books look alike. All things being equal the nicer PQ book (almost) ALWAYS sells for more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageComics Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 There is no 'acceptable minimum' for everyone. Some people care, some people don't. Everyone is different. Some people just want a copy of the book and some people want a White page copy of the book. +1 That basically nails it. (thumbs u -J. While not everyone cares about PQ, QP or eye appeal, on average the nicer books, whether it's eye appeal, quality of production, page quality or grade, always sell for more than books not as nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydogrules Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 The problem with this data is the market moves so quickly in a given time. If one has two books to choose at the same time with almost the same structure (centering, chips, no chips), the book with better PQ will always sell more. In the extraordinarily unlikely event a situation like that ever arose, it may sell "first". But "more"? As the data suggests, probably not. -J. If you have two different PQ books being offered at two different weeks, all things are not equal even if the books look alike. All things being equal the nicer PQ book (almost) ALWAYS sells for more. Books do not have to sell within a minute of each other and within the same venue to be "comps". You are attempting to impose impossible and unrealistic criterion on the legitimate hard data, and absolutely none at all on those attempting to argue the counter point. Doing so actually only further reinforces the irrelevance of the "PQ" on the label as any kind of legitimate or consistent or quantifiable determining factor in final price on the open market. The data speaks for itself. There is no correlation. Myth busted. (Again.) -J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttfitz Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 The problem with this data is the market moves so quickly in a given time. If one has two books to choose at the same time with almost the same structure (centering, chips, no chips), the book with better PQ will always sell more. In the extraordinarily unlikely event a situation like that ever arose, it may sell "first". But "more"? As the data suggests, probably not. -J. I'd even say the "first" isn't a given - if those two books were offered to someone like me, who doesn't care that much about the PQ (besides not brittle), and the seller subscribed to the "better PQ is worth more" notion, the cheaper book could sell faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
showcase22gr1959 Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 The problem with this data is the market moves so quickly in a given time. If one has two books to choose at the same time with almost the same structure (centering, chips, no chips), the book with better PQ will always sell more. In the extraordinarily unlikely event a situation like that ever arose, it may sell "first". But "more"? As the data suggests, probably not. -J. If two books were priced at the same price, the better PQ will sell first. At the same time, the better PQ will be priced higher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageComics Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 You are attempting to impose impossible and unrealistic criterion on the legitimate hard data, and absolutely none at all on those attempting to argue the counter point. Eh, no. You initially argued that 'all things being equal' the PQ doesn't matter and then went on to provide examples where 'all things were not equal'. Look man, I think you're wrong (again) but I'm not going to get sucked into a back and forth. The nicer the book the stronger the price it fetches. Anybody who will argue that, well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
