CGC Case Indentations 0

[mackenzie999]

Disappointing but also suggests a wise call to action. If submissions to CGC slow down significantly because of this issue, perhaps they will address it more quickly. I know I would be very hesitant to purchase a book in a case like these, as while they might be fine now, there is no data showing what may happen over time. I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels this way. Also, as far as the QC comment, CGC are not selling us back our own books, they are selling admittedly defective cases.

[Sqeggs]

Yeah, I won't be submitting until after this is fixed. I think it's pretty clear why they aren't willing to reslab: 1) They are still cranking out slabs with this defect and don't want to have QC pass only books without it; and 2) As a result, there are probably a ton of these books out there and offering to reslab them would result in CGC taking a financial bath and causing even further delays in turnaround time.

 

I think they will eventually fix it. They would only move to fix it faster if some of their big customers, say HA, Sparkle City, and some others, began to pressure them. Who knows, maybe the big customers are already being allowed to return slabs with this defect.

 

Final thought: Buyers of recently slabbed books should insist on a look at the back of the slab before making a purchase. Unfortunately, not usually possible on Clink, Metro, or, often, HA.

[Tom473]

I just checked the CGC website and noticed that they still are not disclosing to members/customers the defective inner wells. The process section on QC still reads:

 

"CGC is careful to make certain that the comics it certifies are not only accurately graded, but attractively presented as well."

 

I think they should at least be upfront and honest about the defects and status of the troubleshooting. It would be better for a customer to know upfront, rather than be surprised after the fact. This is especially important given that they refuse to make it right for customers that have already been impacted by the change in QC standards - without a fair warning.

 

It may hurt business in the short term, but it is the honorable thing to do.

Edited August 7, 2013 by Tom473

[ramrod44]

I have 2day off work and nothing much to do so I went through my entire CGC collection of 112 comics. Here is what I found:

 

* A total of 16 books or 14% had the defect.

 

* 15 of 92 or 16% of my Bronze collection was affected.

only 1 0f 20 or 5% of my Copper collection was affected.

 

* 14 of the 16 comics with the defect were graded after 01/15/2011.

(4 in 2011, 6 in 2012 and 4 so far in 2013)

The other 2 comics were graded in 2007 and 2008 but if I had to guess, I would bet they were sent in for reholder service after Jan 2011. ( I purchased them in May 2012 and Jan 2013 off ebay)

 

* I have 9 old label comics and NONE of them had the defect.

 

It looks like this issue started in late 2010 or at least got a lot worse after that time.

 

 

[Sqeggs]

I just checked the CGC website and noticed that they still are not disclosing to members/customers the defective inner wells. The process section on QC still reads:

 

"CGC is careful to make certain that the comics it certifies are not only accurately graded, but attractively presented as well."

 

I think they should at least be upfront and honest about the defects and status of the troubleshooting. It would be better for a customer to know upfront, rather than be surprised after the fact. This is especially important given that they refuse to make it right for customers that have already been impacted by the change in QC standards - without a fair warning.

 

It may hurt business in the short term, but it is the honorable thing to do.

 

I agree with you, but, unfortunately, I think there is no way they will note this problem on their web site. To do so would be to admit that it is a defect, which to this point they aren't willing to do. If they did, then they could hardly refuse to reholder books with the problem and they could hardly continue to send books out that had the problem.

[gadzukes]

Well craap.... I have about 30 books being slabbed right now.

[crazyhips]

Monopolies are never good.

[gyro-1]

Just contacted CGC about my 19 books that arrived with the defect. Paraphrased, but I'm typing this right after the call, to be as accurate as possible with no attempt to mischaracterize the answers I received.

 

Q: My 19 books have a wierd indentation defect on the back of the book, others have apparently been reporting the same issue, are you aware of this?

 

A: Yes, it is a problem with the manufacturer of the inner wells, we have contacted them and we are awaiting a response.

 

Q: What can be done for my books that already have the defect.

 

A: Nothing, because the defect does not impact your books themselves.

 

Q: Why are these cases making it through QC?

 

A: Because the books themselves are not damaged.

 

Q: Yes, but what if I sell one of these defective capsules and get a complaint, or hurt my feedback rating or buisiness in the process? (note I don't have a business, but it's a legit question)

 

A: The buyer can contact CGC and we will tell the same thing.

 

Well, there you have it. I'm taking a collector's strategic pause of sorts until CGC can restore quality standards to the pre-CGC case defect era. It would be good to nail down when the "O" defect manifested itself.

 

Minor grammar edit to Q2

 

That is truly disappointing.

Very much so

[The Jerr]

So without reading all these pages, basically CGC is telling us its not going to hurt the book? I have 1 with this indentation out of the 22 I sent.

[Tom473]

I have 10 additional books on the way back, fingers crossed, I'll let everyone know how they turned out.

 

I agree that CGC won't officially use the big "D" word on their website. At a minimum they should update the QC section with the little "D" word - as in disclaimer. Something along the lines of,

 

"CGC makes every effort to ensure an attractive presentation. In some cases, an indentation known as "puddling" may occur on the back of the inner well as a result of the cooling process. While unsightly, CGC has decided that the irregularity is within our acceptable design parameters; however, we continue strive for improvements in our encapsulation process. To the best of our knowledge, these indentations will have no impact on the book itself."

 

 

 

 

[accessndx]

Since these indentations have only existed for a brief period of time, how can anyone possibly know the eventual impact they may have?

 

It's not like they've been following the progress of these slabs in some peer reviewed study for 10+ years.

 

I think it's fairer to say that nobody knows anything, but logic dictates that uneven pressure...given enough time can cause some distortions.

[Ant-Man]

No onsite grading for me this year. That saved a couple of bucks.

[joeypost]

Just contacted CGC about my 19 books that arrived with the defect. Paraphrased, but I'm typing this right after the call, to be as accurate as possible with no attempt to mischaracterize the answers I received.

 

Q: My 19 books have a wierd indentation defect on the back of the book, others have apparently been reporting the same issue, are you aware of this?

 

A: Yes, it is a problem with the manufacturer of the inner wells, we have contacted them and we are awaiting a response.

 

Q: What can be done for my books that already have the defect.

 

A: Nothing, because the defect does not impact your books themselves.

 

Q: Why are these cases making it through QC?

 

A: Because the books themselves are not damaged.

 

Q: Yes, but what if I sell one of these defective capsules and get a complaint, or hurt my feedback rating or buisiness in the process? (note I don't have a business, but it's a legit question)

 

A: The buyer can contact CGC and we will tell the same thing.

 

Well, there you have it. I'm taking a collector's strategic pause of sorts until CGC can restore quality standards to the pre-CGC case defect era. It would be good to nail down when the "O" defect manifested itself.

 

Minor grammar edit to Q2

 

That is truly disappointing.

Very much so

 

Sorry I am getting back to everyone so late but the above post is pretty much the explanation I received when I was at CGC. I was waiting to talk to Paul and harshen at the show (WW Chicago) to see what the long term approach was...but it appears they have answered all of my questions already.

[vhunter]

I found 11 out 37 books had indents on the back case. Only going through one box.

 

Joey, please let us know what you hear from Paul and Harshen.

[crazyhips]

If they don't fix this, it could significantly affect their business over time. Their response is not acceptable.

[Ant-Man]

For those that subbed on-site in Chicago, how did your books come out?

[Logan510]

As an FYI, all of my on site subs at WW Chicago came back with this issue.

[NewEnglandGothic]

[Ditch Fahrenheit]

As an FYI, all of my on site subs at WW Chicago came back with this issue.

 

Wow.

[Sqeggs]

As an FYI, all of my on site subs at WW Chicago came back with this issue.

 

Well, if it's true that SC had 400 books slabbed, it will be interesting to see if we start seeing some books with this defect showing up in their auctions. There is the point raised by Shellhead as to whether the defect is visible on scans. All I know is that if I win a slab with this defect in one of their auctions, I'm sending it back.