Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice movie thread for your reading pleasure 2 2

[Gatsby77]

Eh...Clooney was (inexplicably) the worst.

 

Kilmer was actually decent in a bad movie.

 

Whereas yes -- Batman & Robin _wretched_ but Clooney himself never looked comfortable in the suit, separate & apart from the movie around him

[Davenport]

Also,

why not let the warrior princess toss the spear/scepter thingy? I'm sure she would be mo better at it.

My take was...

Superman understands Doomsday is kryptonian. Says as much, so emotionally Superman's right back in Zod-territory. Responsible for what's happening.

 

Also, the way it was played out, even if Wonder Woman had thrown the spear (which would've been cool) Superman would've still had to get in there and drive it through to Doomday's heart. Right? Superman jabbed him at full super-speed and still had to give a couple more goes to get it in there (costing him his life).

 

Agree? Superman felt and took full responsibility. For this particular story-chapter, for Superman's ultimate sacrifice, it needed to be 'all him' for maximum audience emotional impact. Yes?

 

[Rip]

I agree. If WW chucked the spear, it likely wouldn't have done the job. Someone had to make sure it was driven in and I don't think WW would have been able to do it, at least without suffering the same fate. Sups felt it was his job since it was a Kryptonian monster.

Edited April 30, 2016 by Rip

[Cat-Man_America]

I agree. If WW chucked the spear, it likely wouldn't have done the job. Someone had to make sure it was driven in and I don't think WW would have been able to do it, at least without suffering the same fate. Sups felt it was his job since it was a Kryptonian monster.

 

Sorry, I looked at the spoiler and probably shouldn't have (my bad).

 

I'm still planning on watching the uncensored version when it's available, but this just looks like one more fork in BvS's rotting corpse. The misogyny in MoS (both real and apparent) was one of the things I found dehumanizing about that movie. And here we have yet another example of a female character being inadequate for the job, incapable of performing as an equal in Superman's world, or should I say in Zack's world view.

 

Explaining it away as some sort of chivalrous act doesn't cut it. Well, so much for WW earning equal pay, apparently she's not up to the job.

 

I may be admonished (and fairly) for expressing an opinion about a movie that I haven't seen (yet), but this is one of the things that has steered me away from other films directed by Mr. Snyder.

 

I have no issues with macho films, but perceived sexism is something else. It's the reliance on male domination in combination with the exploitation of women (who are little more than sex objects in Zack's films) that I find troubling. Hey, he may be the most sensitive and compassionate guy in the world off the set, but his films leave an impression that women should always be submissive and are solely dependent upon their male counterparts.

 

Interestingly, James Cameron, who's films I like, is exactly the opposite. Apparently, off the set, his personal life is a mess, but I doubt anyone can say that he fails to write and direct strong female characters and provide them plenty of space to perform as equals.

 

For those who think I'm overly hostile to this film or Zack Snyder and post in this thread too often, you're probably half right. I'm just not sure which half.

 

Try to look on the bright side, ...since BvS is heading out the side door and into the dollar houses, we can discuss other films by better directors and perhaps we'll be able to reach a positive consensus about some of those.

[rjrjr]

I agree. If WW chucked the spear, it likely wouldn't have done the job. Someone had to make sure it was driven in and I don't think WW would have been able to do it, at least without suffering the same fate. Sups felt it was his job since it was a Kryptonian monster.

 

Sorry, I looked at the spoiler and probably shouldn't have (my bad).

 

I'm still planning on watching the uncensored version when it's available, but this just looks like one more fork in BvS's rotting corpse. The misogyny in MoS (both real and apparent) was one of the things I found dehumanizing about that movie. And here we have yet another example of a female character being inadequate for the job, incapable of performing as an equal in Superman's world, or should I say in Zack's world view.

 

Explaining it away as some sort of chivalrous act doesn't cut it. Well, so much for WW earning equal pay, apparently she's not up to the job.

 

I may be admonished (and fairly) for expressing an opinion about a movie that I haven't seen (yet), but this is one of the things that has steered me away from other films directed by Mr. Snyder.

 

I have no issues with macho films, but perceived sexism is something else. It's the reliance on male domination in combination with the exploitation of women (who are little more than sex objects in Zack's films) that I find troubling. Hey, he may be the most sensitive and compassionate guy in the world off the set, but his films leave an impression that women should always be submissive and are solely dependent upon their male counterparts.

 

Interestingly, James Cameron, who's films I like, is exactly the opposite. Apparently, off the set, his personal life is a mess, but I doubt anyone can say that he fails to write and direct strong female characters and provide them plenty of space to perform as equals.

 

For those who think I'm overly hostile to this film or Zack Snyder and post in this thread too often, you're probably half right. I'm just not sure which half.

 

Try to look on the bright side, ...since BvS is heading out the side door and into the dollar houses, we can discuss other films by better directors and perhaps we'll be able to reach a positive consensus about some of those.

 

Mysogyny? You are just making stuff up.

[Cat-Man_America]

I agree. If WW chucked the spear, it likely wouldn't have done the job. Someone had to make sure it was driven in and I don't think WW would have been able to do it, at least without suffering the same fate. Sups felt it was his job since it was a Kryptonian monster.

 

Sorry, I looked at the spoiler and probably shouldn't have (my bad).

 

I'm still planning on watching the uncensored version when it's available, but this just looks like one more fork in BvS's rotting corpse. The misogyny in MoS (both real and apparent) was one of the things I found dehumanizing about that movie. And here we have yet another example of a female character being inadequate for the job, incapable of performing as an equal in Superman's world, or should I say in Zack's world view.

 

Explaining it away as some sort of chivalrous act doesn't cut it. Well, so much for WW earning equal pay, apparently she's not up to the job.

 

I may be admonished (and fairly) for expressing an opinion about a movie that I haven't seen (yet), but this is one of the things that has steered me away from other films directed by Mr. Snyder.

 

I have no issues with macho films, but perceived sexism is something else. It's the reliance on male domination in combination with the exploitation of women (who are little more than sex objects in Zack's films) that I find troubling. Hey, he may be the most sensitive and compassionate guy in the world off the set, but his films leave an impression that women should always be submissive and are solely dependent upon their male counterparts.

 

Interestingly, James Cameron, who's films I like, is exactly the opposite. Apparently, off the set, his personal life is a mess, but I doubt anyone can say that he fails to write and direct strong female characters and provide them plenty of space to perform as equals.

 

For those who think I'm overly hostile to this film or Zack Snyder and post in this thread too often, you're probably half right. I'm just not sure which half.

 

Try to look on the bright side, ...since BvS is heading out the side door and into the dollar houses, we can discuss other films by better directors and perhaps we'll be able to reach a positive consensus about some of those.

 

Mysogyny? You are just making stuff up.

 

No, I spelled it correctly. You made your word up.

 

Both my wife and I had similar reactions to MoS and we don't often see eye to eye on films. I'm not expecting miracles from BvS, The Snyder Cut.

[Bosco685]

Mysogyny? You are just making stuff up.

 

He's just a postulating postulator. But not the Roman Church-type (although secretly he may wish to canonization Snyder one day).

 

But on a more serious note, misogyny in 'Man of Steel'?!

 

If anything, Clark worshiped his mother who is a strong influence on his life views. Even in reflecting back on his early years when his powers started appearing, it was Martha Kent that taught him how to calm his fears.

 

 

She becomes his guiding light to overcome his transition pains from unknowing youth to super-powered being. And without her stability and love, who knows what he would have become.

 

And it carries over to his later life. When he defends his co-worker at the bar, and was pushed to the point he could have killed the disrespectful patron, it is that female co-worker that brings him out of that pending rage that could have led to a horrible situation - for that patron.

 

 

Even when Clark needs to find peace in his life, he comes back to Martha to share the news he has discovered his origin and his birth father.

 

 

The women in Clark's life are his peace and comfort in his adopted world. And for those that would be disrespectful to them - like Zod threatening Martha Kent - watch out!

 

 

Other than that - misogyny. Misogyny everywhere in 'Man of Steel'.

 

[Bosco685]

No, I spelled it correctly. You made your word up.

Thanks Zack Snyder! You made David misspell the word.

 

 

Both my wife and I had similar reactions to MoS and we don't often see eye to eye on films. I'm not expecting miracles from BvS, The Snyder Cut.

You sure this was the right theater you were sitting in, and not The Purge, Hangover Part III, This is the End, Fast & Furious 6 or Now You See Me? You know, they all start to blur after a while (and a few beers).

 

[kdoginohio]

Also,

why not let the warrior princess toss the spear/scepter thingy? I'm sure she would be mo better at it.

My take was...

Superman understands Doomsday is kryptonian. Says as much, so emotionally Superman's right back in Zod-territory. Responsible for what's happening.

 

Also, the way it was played out, even if Wonder Woman had thrown the spear (which would've been cool) Superman would've still had to get in there and drive it through to Doomday's heart. Right? Superman jabbed him at full super-speed and still had to give a couple more goes to get it in there (costing him his life).

 

Agree? Superman felt and took full responsibility. For this particular story-chapter, for Superman's ultimate sacrifice, it needed to be 'all him' for maximum audience emotional impact. Yes?

Agreed, but it is WW.

 

I would think her throw would be pretty close to that of Supes, with him coming in to drive it home.

Just a thought. I know I'm not a film genius, but I've read a few comics on teams working together.

[Bosco685]

Agreed, but it is WW.

 

I would think her throw would be pretty close to that of Supes, with him coming in to drive it home.

Just a thought. I know I'm not a film genius, but I've read a few comics on teams working together.

 

Hey, you read comics too? Small world. We should find a forum that focuses on such things.

 

 

But at this point in early comic book development - and in the DCEU - the superheroes are still learning of each other's skills. So playing off of each individual's capabilities so in the end they overcome a threat would have felt a little too orchestrated.

 

Batman: "Diana, you throw the Kryptonite spear into Doomsday's chest."

 

Wonder Woman: "On the way, Batman!"

 

Batman: "Clark, you then drive it deep into his chest for added measure."

 

Superman: "You got it, Bruce!"

 

They'll get there soon enough. But this was supposed to be their in-battle introduction to individual powers so they come to realize combined they are that much more effective.

[Davenport]

Watched it a 3rd time and had a completely different take on the ending.

 

The 1st two viewings I left thinking...

 

the rocks rising off his coffin was Superman returning. I associated the floating pebbles with when he put his fist on the ground to take flight in MOS.

 

 

This last viewing I got really excited thinking...

 

that's not Superman coming to, that's Darkseid bodysnatching his corpse. Motherboxing it to Apokolips. Where DeSaad will resurrect Superman and they'll mentally reprogram him as Darkseid's champion.

A theme explored in both the comics and the animated series. Mirroring Batman's premonition in the film.

 

 

The Flash told Batman "Lois is the key". In Batman's vision Superman declared "She was my world and you took her from me." So now I'm thinking Apokolips will manipulate Superman using Lois somehow. Twist him into what Batman was in this movie, a revenge-obsessive out to right a perceived wrong. At least for the 1st part of the film, with the Justice League emerging from the chaos.

 

 

 

[Davenport]

Other than that - misogyny. Misogyny everywhere in 'Man of Steel'.

 

Wouldn't it be interesting if you could 'see' how much baggage some filmgoers lug in.

 

[NewEnglandGothic]

Wouldn't it be interesting if you could 'see' how much baggage some filmgoers lug in.

I'm in no way a fan of Snyder, but he has put some women in strong lead roles in action films, that I haven't seen since Cameron (Sarah Polley in "Dawn", Just about the entire cast of "Suckerpunch" to name a couple.) Now Eli Roth to me would be a filmmaker that would fit the bill of that label. "Hostel II" might be one of the most evil movies against women since Jack Ketchum's "The Girl Next Door." Then he made "The Green Inferno."

[Rip]

Huh? That was out of left field.

 

I have never thought of Wonder Woman as being in the same strength or invulnerability class (Aside from certain moments) as Superman? Have you?

 

I know you like Timelys, but..ever read a Superman comic?

 

 

He dies while fighting Doomsday. It wasn't Wonder Woman.

Should they further alter the story in fears of appearing sexist?

 

Edit, sorry one other thought. It was Wonder Woman who saved Batman when she first came to the fight. Or chopped off Doomsdays hand in an awesome moment.

 

 

 

Edited May 1, 2016 by Rip

[Rip]

He does like his beer.

[kdoginohio]

Okay, different angle. How come Darkseid never finished off Supes? Or has he? Or did he get bored with him? Not a big follower of Superman, so if it did happen I wouldn't know.

[Bosco685]

This weekend's estimates are in, and BvS now is at 3.5X budget.

 

 

[kagenish]

This weekend's estimates are in, and BvS now is at 3.5X budget.

 

 

for the second movie in the new DCCU is looking good. the movie got everybody talking about Batman and Wonder Woman with each movie adding to the universe by helping it grow is just going to get better.

[Bosco685]

for the second movie in the new DCCU is looking good. the movie got everybody talking about Batman and Wonder Woman with each movie adding to the universe by helping it grow is just going to get better.

 

You had noted that BvS may match or pass Men In Black (1997). And now it is only $7.1 MM away from that goal.

 

[chezmtghut]

 

This last viewing I got really excited thinking...

 

that's not Superman coming to, that's Darkseid bodysnatching his corpse. Motherboxing it to Apokolips. Where DeSaad will resurrect Superman and they'll mentally reprogram him as Darkseid's champion.

A theme explored in both the comics and the animated series. Mirroring Batman's premonition in the film.

 

 

 

 

 

+1

 

That's exactly what I expect will happen. The newly formed JLA will most likely be going up against Supes & the parademon's in part 1. Then after Supes memories are restored with the aid of his love for Lois, he will band together with the JLA to take on Darkseid.