SPIDER-MAN 2 from Marvel & Sony (7/5/19) 4 4

[chrisco37]

Saw it last night with the family and we all enjoyed it.  More light-hearted than the past few MCU movies (as expected).  

Mysterio effects and origin were really well done.  He was a good villain.  They never could have pulled him off properly in the Tobey movies.  

Lots of funny moments that had the audience laughing (Peter Tingle, Night Monkey, etc).

I don’t mind the Iron Spider stuff as it’s clearly done for the newer generation of fans and not us old farts.   I don’t think Spidey relies on it too much, he uses his Spider powers for the most part.  

I think Holland is brilliantly cast.  He’s my favorite Parker/Spidey.  

I think I like Homecoming a little better, but this was a fun and re-watchable movie.  

My only (very minor) gripe is that I didn’t hear the Spidey theme song like they did in HC or Spider-Verse.  But, that’s just nitpicking.  

B+/A-

[Bosco685]

I think that's great when people love the movies they go to.

2 hours ago, chrisco37 said:

Mysterio effects and origin were really well done.  He was a good villain.  They never could have pulled him off properly in the Tobey movies.

They pulled off a massively successful Doc Ock - the fellow with robot arms attached to his spine which turned into deadly weapons.

Why not Mysterio?

[chrisco37]

1 hour ago, Bosco685 said:

I think that's great when people love the movies they go to.

They pulled off a massively successful Doc Ock - the fellow with robot arms attached to his spine which turned into deadly weapons.

Why not Mysterio?

Fair question.  I think the answer is two-fold:

1.  His FFH “origin” is really good.  It fits into the MCU neatly.  Obviously, they couldn’t have done that with the Tobey movies (as the MCU didn’t exist), but it’s a better origin story than ASM13 provided (and, I’m assuming they would’ve tried to follow that one).   So, not really a “fair” argument.  I’ll concede that.

2. As far as the FX go, yes, they did a great job with Doc Oc in Tobey 2.  Looked really good and it worked (it’s probably my #2 Spidey movie behind HC).  However, Mysterio required some much more than just “adding tentacles to a body” (yeah, yeah...I know it’s more than that).  Mysterio was full on CGI fest.  We’re talking about close to 15 years advancement in the FX between the two movies.  That’s an incredible amount of time.   I thought parts of FFH looked too “video-gamey” with the CGI.  Dial that back 15 years and it would’ve looked really, really fake.  

[Gatsby77]

13 minutes ago, chrisco37 said:

Fair question.  I think the answer is two-fold:

1.  His FFH “origin” is really good.  It fits into the MCU neatly.  Obviously, they couldn’t have done that with the Tobey movies (as the MCU didn’t exist), but it’s a better origin story than ASM13 provided (and, I’m assuming they would’ve tried to follow that one).   So, not really a “fair” argument.  I’ll concede that.

2. As far as the FX go, yes, they did a great job with Doc Oc in Tobey 2.  Looked really good and it worked (it’s probably my #2 Spidey movie behind HC).  However, Mysterio required some much more than just “adding tentacles to a body” (yeah, yeah...I know it’s more than that).  Mysterio was full on CGI fest.  We’re talking about close to 15 years advancement in the FX between the two movies.  That’s an incredible amount of time.   I thought parts of FFH looked too “video-gamey” with the CGI.  Dial that back 15 years and it would’ve looked really, really fake.  

I had a question about his origin actually. It's been 20+ years since I've read a Mysterio comic, but...didn't his power come from hallucinogenic gas?

The whole "I'm a film director" thing in the film threw me off -- but...likewise would have been impossible/implausible 15 years ago due to recent technological advances in both drones and 3D-cameras.

[chrisco37]

27 minutes ago, Gatsby77 said:

I had a question about his origin actually. It's been 20+ years since I've read a Mysterio comic, but...didn't his power come from hallucinogenic gas?

The whole "I'm a film director" thing in the film threw me off -- but...likewise would have been impossible/implausible 15 years ago due to recent technological advances in both drones and 3D-cameras.

In ASM13 he was, basically, a jaded F/X guy that decided to turn super-criminal.  Can't recall if he used some sort of hypnotic gas at that point.   Later on, the gas may have been hallucinogenic (ASM 66/67), but I don't recall.  I think it may have been. 

Was he part of the storyline in 24 (Spidey goes Mad)?  I don't know on that.  

In any case, going back to his original origin in 13, it worked at the time (early 60's, written for kids).  But, it's total cornball.

Today the updated origin works well and ties it all into the MCU, which makes it a little more palatable to adults and works with the intended audience (10-20 year olds; ie, the new gen).    

[Bosco685]

3 hours ago, chrisco37 said:

Fair question.  I think the answer is two-fold:

1.  His FFH “origin” is really good.  It fits into the MCU neatly.  Obviously, they couldn’t have done that with the Tobey movies (as the MCU didn’t exist), but it’s a better origin story than ASM13 provided (and, I’m assuming they would’ve tried to follow that one).   So, not really a “fair” argument.  I’ll concede that.

2. As far as the FX go, yes, they did a great job with Doc Oc in Tobey 2.  Looked really good and it worked (it’s probably my #2 Spidey movie behind HC).  However, Mysterio required some much more than just “adding tentacles to a body” (yeah, yeah...I know it’s more than that).  Mysterio was full on CGI fest.  We’re talking about close to 15 years advancement in the FX between the two movies.  That’s an incredible amount of time.   I thought parts of FFH looked too “video-gamey” with the CGI.  Dial that back 15 years and it would’ve looked really, really fake.  

I definitely agree CGI advancement has made these films close to flawless with the more advanced and complicated characters, and I really liked the Mysterio character concept and approach in FFH.

Not sure I agree on he fits perfectly into the MCU more than Raimi could have ever delivered him, because we never experienced that character. But we did see amazing performances in those early films that could hint at even more were on the way, and done right. I was sharing this in the Spider-Man 1 & 2 appreciation thread where the concept artist shared recently what they had planned for Spider-Man 4.

How Sam Raimi's Spider-Man 4 Would Have Panned Out

Quote

There were lots of ideas on the table at this stage, then, and of these potential villains, it was the Vulture that got the most press attention. In December 2009, it was reported by Movieline that John Malkovich was under consideration for the role of Adrian Toomes, aka the Vulture. Despite his advanced age compared to most super-villains, this flying foe has caused plenty of trouble for Spidey over decades of comic-book history.

 

 

In the same report, Movieline posited that Anne Hathaway was circling the role of Felicia Hardy, best known to comic book readers as Spidey’s occasional love interest Black Cat. Julia Stiles and Rachel McAdams were apparently considered for the part as well, and the top theory was that this version of Felicia would take on a new super-villain identity – The Vulturess – in the film. Perhaps this was an attempt to ensure that Felicia didn't feel too much like a Catwoman copycat.

 

"I loved what she was doing with the auditions for Spider-Man 4," Raimi told Vulture (the website, not the fictional villain) on the topic of Anne Hathaway’s Felicia in March 2013, confirming that there had been some truth to Moveline’s report.

 

 

So, we know at least that Felicia Hardy would have been in the movie. It seems a fair bet that there would have been at least one other villain as well, especially if Raimi had his eye on the Sinister Six joining the fray at some point.

 

Concept artist Jeffrey Henderson has since shared some of his work on Spider-Man 4, revealing who this other villain might have been: there are several storyboard frames showing Mysterio being handed over to the police by Spidey (see below). We don't know whether he was a brief cameo surprise or a full-on threat throughout the film, but it's clear that ol' goldfish-bowl-head would have shown up at some point.

 

 

It looks like Mysterio would have made a brief appearance in Spider-Man 4 to lay the foundation for why he had an issue with Peter Parker. So since they were also trying to build the roadmap for Spider-Man 5, he probably was going to be the follow-up villain. It could have been quite interesting. Scorpion was being discussed too. So it looks like Homecoming (Vulture) and Far From Home (Mysterio) took up those plans and ran with most of those early concepts.

[paperheart]

$847MM WW- $1BB in the bag; could be looking at CM type #

Edited July 14, 2019 by paperheart

[csaag]

27 minutes ago, paperheart said:

$847MM WW- $1BB in the bag

Adding $7 to that total as I'm catching a Sunday matinee.  Though this showing won't add too much as I bought mine last second and 95 pct is seats were open

[ComicConnoisseur]

Wow! Just came back from this with my significant other and daughter and this has to be the best Spider-Man movie ever.  

I had no expectations and this movie really surprised me.

Marvel continues to be on a roll. 

 

[jcjames]

Saw it last night, really enjoyed it. I really liked how it captured being a teenager with the decisions and reactions that only teens would do.

I laughed out loud at the ball-smack on Flash! OMG so unexpected and yet so perfect for what teen guys do LOL! 

Sure, there were plot holes that you could drive a truck through, but so what, it's a light-hearted spider-man flick and it works! Mysterio did what he does and they brought into the 21st century pretty neatly. The humor was good, story was decent, effects pretty well done.

I give it 8/10 thumbs up.

 

Oh, and "surfboard"

Edited July 14, 2019 by jcjames

[Bosco685]

41 minutes ago, ComicConnoisseur said:

Wow! Just came back from this with my significant other and daughter and this has to be the best Spider-Man movie ever.  

I had no expectations and this movie really surprised me.

Marvel continues to be on a roll. 

 

Even better than Amazing Spider-Man 2? 

[Bosco685]

37 minutes ago, jcjames said:

Oh, and "surfboard"

This got me really fired up for more. But to do that in a Spider-Man film was like yelling 'squirrel'. 

[PunisherPunisherPunisher]

Watched it yesterday, was good, Gyllenhaal was brilliant as Mysterio, and I did notice the part where he was stalking Parker in Venice 

[media_junkie]

Just got back, l really liked it.  At this point in time I think Sony would be fools to stop working with Marvel.

[fantastic_four]

On 7/4/2019 at 10:38 AM, Kon_Jelly said:

Some spoiler thoughts after my second viewing:

  Hide contents

Right after the scene of Mysterio dying, we see the tech guy downloading/saving an illusion to a thumb drive. Edith just told Spidey that the illusions were off, but Mysterio was running illusions even before he had Edith. Is it possible that a second illusion was running outside of Edith's system? It makes me wonder if Mysterio was ever even on the bridge in the first place. The dialogue in that scene is extremely vague - never once in that scene is it mentioned that Mysterio is actually dead. And Edith doesn't actually answer Spidey's question, either: "Is this real?" "All illusions are offline". Maybe all of Edith's illusions are offline. 

I dunno, maybe I'm reading way too much into it. I just know that you never trust anything when it comes to Mysterio, so I feel like there is a good chance there was misdirection going on even at the end. 

I had the EXACT same thought you did.  So I agree, it's entirely unclear what happened with him.

[Bird]

11 minutes ago, fantastic_four said:

I had the EXACT same thought you did.  So I agree, it's entirely unclear what happened with him.

ueah, that happened very quickly and the only reason for it is what you surmise I think

[bentbryan]

Just got back as well. The scenes where Mysterio really uses his illusions were just too wicked.  👍🏻👍🏻

[fantastic_four]

Saw it today, LOVED it.  It's not Spider-Man 2 good, but nothing is, that's still one of the masterpieces of the superhero genre.

I had no idea it was possible to do Mysterio this well.  It always stretched credulity for him to pull off special effects to the extent he did in the comics and cartoons, but this one actually made it seem semi-credible.  LOVED the way they came up with his name.  

I think I need to stare at that very last shot in the second-post credits scene:

Spoiler

All I could tell was that they were in space and there was a LOT of hardware up there.  What exactly is going on there?  And who's doing all of that?  SHIELD is gone, right?  So who is Nick Fury with up there?

Having seen the scene only once and without time to analyze what I was seeing more thoroughly, I assumed it was some kind of allusion to a MAJOR cosmic storyline.  We know they're considering the Eternals, and of course they're getting the Fantastic Four and the X-Men who have ties to the Shi'ar Empire and the Starjammers, so I'm guessing some or all of that may be what that scene is pointing towards.  I guess it could also be a Kree/Skrull thing involving Captain Marvel, so who really knows.  That's why I want to study the scene, to see if there were hints as to what they're doing with all of that stuff.

Tied to that, I also need a few readings of the exact text of that conversation between Happy and Nick Fury (who was really Talos) and what he was saying in code about a "surfboard."  Surfboard?  Odd to use that in a coded message given who we know will be coming up at some point in the not-too-distant future.  

 

Edited July 15, 2019 by fantastic_four

[fantastic_four]

3 minutes ago, bentbryan said:

Just got back as well. The scenes where Mysterio really uses his illusions were just too wicked.  👍🏻👍🏻

Yep, those sequences were freaking amazing.  Everything I was hoping for with Mysterio and far more.

I've never cared for Jake Gyllenhaal in most things I've seen him in, and I've seen most things he's done.  But I LOVED him in this.  

[fantastic_four]

I don't know anything about Zendaya; I've only ever seen her in the two MCU films.  And I've seen the tabloid stuff about her parents and their recent divorce, but that's not terribly relevant to her, I suppose.  I know she's in that new racy "Euphoria" show, and I've seen some clips from that, but nothing with her.  I didn't care for her in Homecoming because of her cool, distant persona, and she had that for the first third of this film, too, but wow, when finally she shed that I really liked her.

Edited July 15, 2019 by fantastic_four