Ever buy art to flip? 2 2

[Panelfan1]

Most of us have sold some of the art we bought at some time.  The question here is - has anyone bought art specifically with the intention to sell it (either right away or within a short period (say under a year or so).   Perhaps you found a piece that isn't exactly right for your collection but you thought it was a good value and figured you could flip it or trade it to get art you like or just some cash.

Would love to hear of your experiences.  How has it worked for you?  Things to consider? Lessons learned?

[JadeGiant]

I have not

[SquareChaos]

I'm very new to the game compared to some of you veterans, but no, I've never done this, and I don't really see much chance of doing it either... most of the resources I have set aside for purchases is pretty well budgeted, and it would basically mean that I'd potentially risk missing the chance to buy something I actually want due to liquidity issues thanks to that aforementioned budgeting.

[Panelfan1]

Question came up  -because I noticed a Frank Miller Daredevil page on the March CLINK auction that was on ebay previously and sold the first day ( for those that recall the old boards - I had started a post on that page, asking if folks thought it was priced too low, too high or what.) So at any rate - it looks like someone saw that item , priced too low in their opinion. They bought it and now it's going to be auctioned. 

 

miller dd

[cloud cloddie]

I haven't bought art to flip, per se. I just have a short attention span.

I've turned around pieces in less than a year, but generally breaking even or at a slight loss. I figure I've enjoyed the pieces, but not enough to look at em for 10 years, so might as well put the money into something else. If I happen to make a little extra, great. But that's not the goal. 

[Khazano]

When I started in my late teens circa 2001 flipping was the way I built my collection. Hell, it was the only way I could have ever afforded this hobby in those early years. And that was with yesterday's prices! (A Spencer sale was a serious gold mine back then!)

Now, not so much. But there's been a few times Ive seen an auction ending with a silly low price or BIN and said, "ah why not."  

Edited February 9, 2017 by Khazano

[Kohei]

I do not, have not, and cannot see myself doing this.

However, I see this happen often amongst the auction sites and CAF. I've seen a Kaluta Shadow piece on Pedigree, H.A., & CLink all in the past year. It first sold for 275ish, then 325ish, and didn't sell on the last auction where the reserve was 475 (My memory may be off some but that's all ballpark).

[Michael Browning]

24 minutes ago, Khazano said:

When I started in my late teens circa 2001 flipping was the way I built my collection. Hell, it was the only way I could have ever afforded this hobby in those early years. And that was with yesterday's prices! (A Spencer sale was a serious gold mine back then!)

Now, not so much. But there's been a few times Ive seen an auction ending with a silly low price or BIN and said, "ah why not."  

I started building my collection the exact same way. I bought what I liked at first, then, as I watched the values grow, I started buying stuff I knew was cheap in order to flip it for something bigger and better.

These days, I focus on stuff I want in my collection, but there are still those times I see something pop up that is so low I can't resist and I buy with the intent to flip. It's been awhile since that has happened, though.

[Meeley Man]

My advice on this: Don't do it. You won't get a satisfactory outcome. The days of buying cheap and selling for a profit are done. The hobby has reached that point where most within it know the value of things and are not willing to accept a loss of any kind (if at all possible). No matter how "cheap" you think you got it, you only get it at that price, because no one else wanted to pay that much. That is the attitude you need to have now. Anything you buy today for "investment" is now a LONG TERM proposition. The only way you'll make money flipping like that today, is fi the art is stolen. A method I would not say is a wise one, for those considering it.

My advice: Buy what you like and stop looking for "get rich quick" schemes. You'll only end up getting burned in this hobby.

[Shemp]

Many years ago there was a Lightle Legion of Superheros cover on eBay with a ridiculously low buy it now. I was a fan of Lightle but have no particular fondness for LSH. I bought it thinking I could flip it or trade for something else I wanted.

I still own the cover.

Guess I'm not the flipping type.

Edited February 9, 2017 by Shemp

[malvin]

1 hour ago, Meeley Man said:

My advice on this: Don't do it. You won't get a satisfactory outcome. The days of buying cheap and selling for a profit are done. The hobby has reached that point where most within it know the value of things and are not willing to accept a loss of any kind (if at all possible). No matter how "cheap" you think you got it, you only get it at that price, because no one else wanted to pay that much. That is the attitude you need to have now. Anything you buy today for "investment" is now a LONG TERM proposition. The only way you'll make money flipping like that today, is fi the art is stolen. A method I would not say is a wise one, for those considering it.

My advice: Buy what you like and stop looking for "get rich quick" schemes. You'll only end up getting burned in this hobby.

While there is some logic to that advice, it is based on the fundamental assumption that the comic art market is perfectly efficient.  There is no right answer but most people would argue that it is not.

Malvin

[MyNameIsLegion]

On 2/8/2017 at 11:38 PM, malvin said:

While there is some logic to that advice, it is based on the fundamental assumption that the comic art market is perfectly efficient.  There is no right answer but most people would argue that it is not.

Malvin

exactly, because direct sales, trades, ebay, clink, HA, all have differently levels of efficiency (roughly in that order)  NO one would go from HA to ebay (unless they are Make-Mine-Marvel and shillin' like a villain) but fresh to market art on ebay still hits Clink and/or HA, though granted the returns are not what they were even 5 years ago.  

Edited February 10, 2017 by MYNAMEISLEGION

[John E.]

Ha! Of course! Like Michael wrote, I used it to build my collection. Every once in a while I run into something under priced at a show that I can flip, usually from a comic dealer who doesn't know the OA market, but that's the only way to make the flip worthwhile, buying low and selling high(er). If there is an absurdly low BIN on eBay and you're the first to see it, then you can probably make some profit from it later. 

Generally, flipping is quite hard because you're likely to sell on an auction site and the fees will kill your margin. If you started now, you'd be paying a lot in "tuition" figuring out what sells and what doesn't. When you get it right you'll see that the returns are okay, but not life changing, and that you were better off just saving the money for the piece you really want. That's why I left that game. It's break-even. Maybe in the end, as I got better, I was 10-15% in the black?

 

You might be better off digging through comic long boxes at a show looking for overlooked gems if you're thinking of flipping. A comic already has a market--an ASM 300 already has a line of buyers with cash in their hands. An original page from the Green Team, not so much. 

[Bird]

I was doing it as recently as two years ago. Buying at Clink or Sunday HA and trading them to dealers for larger pieces. I was doing it with pieces selling low, under $100 or so. I would not risk a larger sum doing this.

[delekkerste]

I can't recall buying any pieces specifically for the intention of flipping them, though I certainly have bought a number of pieces because (a) I liked (but didn't love) it, (b) I thought it was undervalued and (c) I thought it could be used as trade bait or sold for cash should the need arise.  I would say that, of the art that falls into that category, I ended up selling or trading the vast majority of it at a modest profit overall.  So, I was correct in identifying pieces that were undervalued, but they certainly weren't dramatically so after accounting for commissions and taxes and such.  And, because I didn't really love them, I didn't feel like keeping them for the long-term.

As such, nowadays, I just save my money and focus only on those pieces that I know are long-term keepers.  I mean, sure, if I see an obviously mispriced BWS Weapon X cover on eBay, I'm going to jump all over it like white on rice like Malvin did.  But, generally speaking, I think that many venues of the market have become efficient enough so that buying (perceived undervalued) art to flip or use as trade bait has become a grinder's game. 

 

Edited February 9, 2017 by delekkerste

[Dumur]

Yeah, I am in the "did it to build my collection" group, but don't specifically do it anymore. I used to scour ebay for cheap BIN's or multi page lots that I knew I could make money on if I sold them individually, but as people have stated here, the increasing knowledge of OA in general has made those deals not only more rare, but the "profit" gleaned from them isn't really worth my time I used to invest in doing so.

That being said, as many others have posted, if I see a great deal it's hard for me to avoid, particularly on the "like don't love" category, I buy it. Though that is also happening less and less, but does require me to have a little bit of will power.

And so I occasionally do find myself pulling the trigger on something I don;t love and selling it less than a year later. I usually break even or lose a bit of money on those while on the rare occasion (recent Joe Mad Gargoyles cover on CLink) I make a bit of money. It all kind of balances out these days.

[MHoes]

I have never considered buying something I didn't love and wanted to own or hang on my wall. The main factor for me is that I consider it too risky: you may never get more for the piece than you paid for it, or ever find just the right person (and pieces) to strike a trading deal. Furthermore, I simply do not have even nearly enough knowledge of the *entire* market (beyond my own specific interests) to recognize a piece that's on sale for (far) less than it's fair market value.

[F For Fake]

I've bought lots of art to flip, but never high dollar pieces. My LCS will occasionally get someone selling a few pages, and since they don't deal much with OA, they generally price it pretty cheap. It's always been a really random selection. Once they got in a nice stack of Keith Pollard stuff, including some late Silver Surfer pages that I got for about $40 each, and sold for around $200 each. Again, nothing mindblowing, but there are occasional opportunities lurking out there.

[staffman]

I have only bought a few pieces with the intention of selling them down the road.  Just as Gene stated they were pieces I liked, not loved, and with that in mind I figured a little extra cash from selling them would go towards something I loved.  On two of them I ended up breaking even and the other two I ended up nicely ahead.  While the effort to get the pieces was nothing difficult.  the effort to get them off my hands and into a profitable status was really not worth it in my opinion.  Prices are going up more and more all the time so unless one has been doing this for awhile or can somehow land that  Coollines Artwork whale that seems to be out there with their high prices they charge I don't think it's really worth it.  In fact just with my taste change in the last year, I have found that I have ended up just breaking even overall since I am selling off pieces that I thought I "loved" at the time.  Much happier now with my more focused pursuit and my wallet has gotten a nice break as well.  I'm sure collector's who have been doing this since before 2010 can make out nicely if they decide to part with their pieces, but anything from here on out is a big gamble.

[Junkdrawer]

Financial Suicide