Jim Starlin hates CGC! 3 3

[SteppinRazor]

1 minute ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

No doubt. But he was paid for that work. He didn't do it for free. He was just doing his job, and, while doing a smashing job of it, didn't really do anything great "for the hobby."

I just re-red SS #34-38, 40-43 (he didn't write #39), and it's STILL as awesome as it was to my 18 year old self the first time I red it.

If, during the course of your work, you create art...that's really cool. But I dunno if I'd say it was "great for the hobby."

Anyways, probably a moot point.

Just because he was paid for it doesn't mean he didn't contribute.  Babe Ruth was paid to play baseball, but he contributed much more through his play than just a tally of home runs and hits.  I'm not saying Starlin is the Babe Ruth of comics, but if his work fostered the cultivation of the readership, then in addition to providing story in exchange for money, he also contributed to the continuing existence of the industry and is one of the many support beams of comic book enthusiasm today.

[RockMyAmadeus]

2 minutes ago, SteppinRazor said:

Just because he was paid for it doesn't mean he didn't contribute.  Babe Ruth was paid to play baseball, but he contributed much more through his play than just a tally of home runs and hits.  I'm not saying Starlin is the Babe Ruth of comics, but if his work fostered the cultivation of the readership, then in addition to providing story in exchange for money, he also contributed to the continuing existence of the industry and is one of the many support beams of comic book enthusiasm today.

Ok, fair enough...what did Babe Ruth contribute to the game of baseball?

I can think of a couple of things, but only a couple...he brought in people to watch the games, enabling clubs to pay more for all the players in the clubs.

Not sure that's analogous to comics, though it could be. Starlin selling more copies of Infinity Guantlet helps Byrne sell more issues of She-Hulk...? Oblique, but I suppose the argument could be made.

Did Ruth change the way the game was played...? I think so, but a baseball historian would be better to answer that question. Did Starlin change the way comics were made...?

I don't think so. Not in the sense that Adams, or Byrne, or McFarlane did.

And a guy like Phil Seuling literally changed how the entire new comics market worked. That's pretty impressive.

[SteppinRazor]

13 minutes ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

Ok, fair enough...what did Babe Ruth contribute to the game of baseball?

I can think of a couple of things, but only a couple...he brought in people to watch the games, enabling clubs to pay more for all the players in the clubs.

Not sure that's analogous to comics, though it could be. Starlin selling more copies of Infinity Guantlet helps Byrne sell more issues of She-Hulk...? Oblique, but I suppose the argument could be made.

Did Ruth change the way the game was played...? I think so, but a baseball historian would be better to answer that question. Did Starlin change the way comics were made...?

I don't think so. Not in the sense that Adams, or Byrne, or McFarlane did.

And a guy like Phil Seuling literally changed how the entire new comics market worked. That's pretty impressive.

He basically changed the way baseball was played.  People weren't really trying to hit home runs before Babe Ruth, the game was more about strategic hitting and running bases.  He also was the biggest savior of baseball from the Black Sox scandal, bringing fans back in and saving its image to make it kid-friendly again.

I'm not necessarily saying Starlin did something particularly spectacular, I'm only saying contributions don't end at the paycheck.  Without quality creators, the comic book industry would not look like it does now.  Imagine if the glut of lousy stuff from the 90s happened with silver age or today's readership numbers.  Could well have killed the medium.

Edited May 18, 2017 by SteppinRazor

[Broke as a Joke]

I have no problem with Mr. Starlin deciding to not SS with CGC anymore, and he also said he will still sign books for free for the fans who don't need to have a sig verified and encased in plastic.  (Like me)

 

Some guys don't even do conventions anymore so let's not badmouth a guy that still comes out.

[porcupine48]

4 hours ago, Chuck Gower said:

Yeah...And a lot of these creators would prefer to talk about whatever it is that they're working on NOW, as opposed to stuff they did 40 years ago that they may not even be making money from now...

yep,like Lemmy said...'i'm so tired of hearing'Ace of Spades' shouted out to me.Yes,i'm glad you like it,but why not try some of our newer albums?

[RockMyAmadeus]

7 minutes ago, SteppinRazor said:

He basically changed the way baseball was played.  People weren't really trying to hit home runs before Babe Ruth, the game was more about strategic hitting and running bases.  He also was the biggest savior of baseball from the Black Sox scandal, bringing fans back in and saving its image to make it kid-friendly again.

I'm not necessarily saying Starlin did something particularly spectacular, I'm only saying contributions don't end at the paycheck.  Without quality creators, the comic book industry would not look like it does now.  Imagine if the glut of lousy stuff from the 90s happened with silver age or today's readership numbers.  Could well have killed the medium.

They did. Have you red most Dells from the early 60's? Or DCs? Or Harvey's?

Didn't kill the medium.

[RockMyAmadeus]

3 minutes ago, porcupine48 said:

yep,like Lemmy said...'i'm so tired of hearing'Ace of Spades' shouted out to me.Yes,i'm glad you like it,but why not try some of our newer albums?

But the number one reason people come to concerts is to hear the songs they know. Not the "new stuff."

[porcupine48]

2 minutes ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

But the number one reason people come to concerts is to hear the songs they know. Not the "new stuff."

Oh,I know.I hadn't heard the new album when I saw them in 2003-and I was one of the idgits screaming ACE OF SPADES!

Of course they played it..twice!

 

 

[porcupine48]

ps..this thread...in a good way.most discussion i've seen in a while.

 

 

[reddwarf666222]

Chandler Rice‎ to Jim Starlin

May 14 at 10:06pm ·

 

Jim do you have your show appearances posted anywhere?

 

 

 

 

3 3

Comments

Mark Stong following

May 15 at 3:33am

Jim Starlin Not going to be doing anymore Con appearances for a while.

Yesterday at 7:31am

Tim Finnerty Too bad... you were always very accommodating and nice to your fans. We'll miss ya at Baltimore Comic Con.

Yesterday at 12:40pm

Mark Stong Not Baltimore that was a staple for you!

Yesterday at 1:34pm

Chandler Rice I just saw you will be at the North Dallas show in July?

Yesterday at 8:59am

Jim Starlin Had to cancel out on that show.

Yesterday at 11:03am

Chandler Rice Oh ok. I would love to bring you to our show in Las Vegas next February.

Yesterday at 11:04am

[jcjames]

9 hours ago, Chuck Gower said:

And it just got worse...

From the Facebook page of Jim Starlin:

MY FELLOW FREELANCERS, if any of you have ever had trouble with CGC at a convention and want to do something about it, feel free to copy and paste this letter from a lawyer that Spencer Beck provided. Sign your name and send it via certified mail to CGC.

May 16, 2017
 
CGC
PO Box 4738
Sarasota, FL 34230
Attn: Chief Executive Officer
 
 
Dear Sirs:
 
Effective immediately, please cease and desist from using my name in any marketing, promotional or other materials.  Please also do not use my name to solicit business for your company or in any way to advance your own commercial interests/profits.  My name is valuable to me and I do not authorize you to use it in commerce.
 
Additionally, I no longer wish to be involved with your “Signature Series” and do not authorize or consent to someone employed, affiliated or related to your company (or an independent contractor working in any manner related to your company) from witnessing my signatures.  I ask that you instruct your employees not to act as a witness and to identify themselves to me as I will not sign items if I understand they are to be verified by CGC or made part of your Signature Series.
 
I would also appreciate it if this was noted on your website as well so my fans are not disappointed.
 
 
Thank you for your prompt attention and understanding. 

So now he's "asking" CGC to tell their employees to do what HE wants.... not what CGC's paying customers want.

I see.

How in the world do you stop someone from watching you sign your name in a public setting???

"Hey, you have a CGC lanyard - close your eyes! Hey! I ORDER you to not look at me! STOP LOOKING!"

Wow, has he always bet a loose nut or something? I mean he's really coming off as quite loony now.

Basically he's angry that HE forgot to collect HIS money that HE charged for his signature from ONE fan, and so he goes after the entire company of the guy who was standing next to the fan that HE wasn't paying attention to. Isn't that kinda like asking the guy running the booth next to you to reimburse you for a wallbook that you forgot to charge a customer for?

I don't have any Starlin signatures, and I'm now CERTAIN I don't want any of his scribbly mess of a "signature".

 

[kav]

2 hours ago, SteppinRazor said:

Just because he was paid for it doesn't mean he didn't contribute.  Babe Ruth was paid to play baseball, but he contributed much more through his play than just a tally of home runs and hits.  I'm not saying Starlin is the Babe Ruth of comics, but if his work fostered the cultivation of the readership, then in addition to providing story in exchange for money, he also contributed to the continuing existence of the industry and is one of the many support beams of comic book enthusiasm today.

He does have one of the most unattractive sigs in the biz.  Compared to how he draws it's a head scratcher.

[reddwarf666222]

2 hours ago, SteppinRazor said:

He basically changed the way baseball was played.  People weren't really trying to hit home runs before Babe Ruth, the game was more about strategic hitting and running bases.  He also was the biggest savior of baseball from the Black Sox scandal, bringing fans back in and saving its image to make it kid-friendly again.

I'm not necessarily saying Starlin did something particularly spectacular, I'm only saying contributions don't end at the paycheck.  Without quality creators, the comic book industry would not look like it does now.  Imagine if the glut of lousy stuff from the 90s happened with silver age or today's readership numbers.  Could well have killed the medium.

Let's see Babe Ruth was a double threat player. Some people say he was a better pitcher than hitter, but the Red Sox misunderstood his offensive side not realizing what they had when they traded him. The Yankees realized fast and removed him from pitching to be a regular fielder and hitter. Ruth was the starting piece to the Yankees dynasty and arguably the greatest player to ever live. Ruth also was one of the first players to spend a lot of times with kids and charitable causes. Ruth also has had multiple movies made on him and the Sandlot as well. 

Gehrig Vs Ruth was a spectacle one year when the were fighting over who would be home run king. Yes Ruth did not invent the homerun, but he was the reason it became popular why kids waited outside stadiums hoping a ball would clear a wall and why people brought gloves to the stadium.

 

Also despite what Baby Ruth says named after a presidents daughter it became popular after Ruth was a player. Ruth is a legend for that no baseball player will ever surpass its like Michael Jordan or Stan Lee they are legendary people that no one will ever pass.

[Prince Namor]

7 hours ago, Logan510 said:

I have not personally experienced this. The biggest charge I've seen artists get when I've brought stuff to get signed ( not slabbed), is when I've brought something of theirs that isn't super common such as fanzine work  or when I've asked for them to personalize the signature to me.

YMMV of course

Yes, when presenting them with something from 40 years ago that they haven't seen over and over again, they tend to like that. 

But that wasn't specifically what I meant. 

[Logan510]

53 minutes ago, Chuck Gower said:

Yes, when presenting them with something from 40 years ago that they haven't seen over and over again, they tend to like that. 

But that wasn't specifically what I meant. 

And your response to my post had little to do with what I said. Unfortunately these days I'm not sure what you're going on about half the time.

[Andahaion]

Reading the comments on Mr. Starlin's Facebook page has been enlightening.  Maybe I'm too disengaged from the hobby, but I did not realize the vitriol some have for slabbing.  I met Starlin at Baltimore's Con in 2015.  He signed my copy of Iron Man #55 which was subsequently sent to CGC for Signature Series.  Very nice guy.  He had a can out for donations to the CBLDF and I gladly donated.  The book is proudly displayed on my small comic book case and I'm disheartened that these events have transpired in a way that appear to have been avoidable.  Hopefully all parties can come to a sensible conclusion that works for everyone.

This was my first (and probably last) experience with CGC and SS.  Lots of moving pieces, and I'm sure my inexperience was unattractive to the regulars.  

[ADAMANTIUM]

42 minutes ago, Andahaion said:

 

This was my first (and probably last) experience with CGC and SS.  Lots of moving pieces, and I'm sure my inexperience was unattractive to the regulars.  

Sorry to hear that  it was intimidating for me the first and even the 2nd and 3rd time. I can respect your perspective, hopefully if another artist speaks to you as proudly as Starlin, you'll give it another go round  for SS. Inexperience is the name of the game, this hobby would die out a bit without new blood.....

Hopefully your not giving up on CGC blue label, and if you do decide against grading that you can still enjoy the boards for other things.....

Edited May 18, 2017 by ADAMANTIUM

[comix4fun]

42 minutes ago, Andahaion said:

Reading the comments on Mr. Starlin's Facebook page has been enlightening.  Maybe I'm too disengaged from the hobby, but I did not realize the vitriol some have for slabbing.  

And the comments are entirely misplaced and demonstrate a clear lack of comprehension for the issues and facts at hand. Starlin is NOT taking a stance against slabbing. This is a very specific complaint, with a very specific set of facts and grievances and yet it's attracted a myriad people with their pet peeves, personal vendettas, and long-held grudges out of the wood work without any of them giving a single thought towards trying to understand what's actually occurred. 

Edited May 18, 2017 by comix4fun

[jsilverjanet]

1 minute ago, comix4fun said:

 This is a very specific complaint, with a very specific set of facts and grievances and yet it's attracted a myriad people with their pet peeves, personal vendettas, and long-held grudges out of the wood work without any of them giving a single thought towards trying to understand what's actually occurred. 

The same can be said about some of the posters posting in this thread. 

[comix4fun]

6 minutes ago, jsilverjanet said:

The same can be said about some of the posters posting in this thread. 

Sure, I was really including comments on facebook, here, in the clubs and private groups. 

I don't see how people can look at what Jim's stated and then post something like "HUZZAH!!! Down with slabbing. Congrats on fighting the good fight!!"  When it's not at all what he's said or meant or what he's stated he's doing.

However it is hilarious to see Robbie Beerbong copy and paste the same comment 16 times in the same comment thread. 

Edited May 18, 2017 by comix4fun