Are prices still climbing or have they eased up a bit??? 43 43

[THE_BEYONDER]

Wow. A 9.4 W copy of HULK 162 just sold for $515

Previous sale $1296

Edited November 9, 2022 by THE_BEYONDER

[Sweet Lou 14]

On 11/9/2022 at 1:25 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

Wow. A 9.4 W copy of HULK 162 just sold for $515

Previous sale $1296

Well that $1296 sale is the one worth looking sideways at.  Somebody got hosed there.

Just this past January I bought a 9.6 WP copy for $1,200 and I thought that was too much money.    Based on that data point, $515 for a 9.4 seems about right.

This is an overrated book that I can only assume gets pumped up by people through some sort of weird two-degrees-of-separation logic ... "yeah that's the first appearance of the character that later ends up on the cover of that Hulk issue where Wolverine shows up."

[Sweet Lou 14]

On 11/9/2022 at 6:24 AM, Tec-Tac-Toe said:

Yes.

Of course, as we know, in the period since Doug, to continue using his former collection as an example, sold his Marvel Comics the point value of many comics, especially Marvel, increased substantially particularly, if memory serves, commencing about seven or eight year ago and lasting for perhaps 5 years. Granted, some comics in the last two or three years continue to see point increases although CGC may "level the playing field" in that respect.

Interesting observation -- I don't know much about historical CGC point values, maybe we need some analysis on that!!

It feels like the point values on my books have been pretty static since I started using the registry in 2017 or so, but maybe I'm not paying close enough attention.

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 11/9/2022 at 1:30 PM, Sweet Lou 14 said:

Well that $1296 sale is the one worth looking sideways at.  Somebody got hosed there.

Just this past January I bought a 9.6 WP copy for $1,200 and I thought that was too much money.    Based on that data point, $515 for a 9.4 seems about right.

This is an overrated book that I can only assume gets pumped up by people through some sort of weird two-degrees-of-separation logic ... "yeah that's the first appearance of the character that later ends up on the cover of that Hulk issue where Wolverine shows up."

 

On 11/9/2022 at 1:30 PM, Sweet Lou 14 said:

Well that $1296 sale is the one worth looking sideways at.  Somebody got hosed there.

Just this past January I bought a 9.6 WP copy for $1,200 and I thought that was too much money.    Based on that data point, $515 for a 9.4 seems about right.

This is an overrated book that I can only assume gets pumped up by people through some sort of weird two-degrees-of-separation logic ... "yeah that's the first appearance of the character that later ends up on the cover of that Hulk issue where Wolverine shows up."

I don’t think the book is overrated at all.  Tough in grade, And even tougher with white pages with good QP.

And I’m definitely one of those people who think Wendigo will show up when Hulk meets Wolvy in the MCU.

[rexinnih]

Hoping Wendigo makes an MCU appearance. Mine just came back from CGC as a 9.2 and was happy with that one. 

[dikran]

On 11/9/2022 at 3:02 PM, rexinnih said:

Hoping Wendigo makes an MCU appearance. Mine just came back from CGC as a 9.2 and was happy with that one. 

Way things are going for comics & the MCU, you should hope he never makes it to the MCU...

[Microchip]

On 11/9/2022 at 1:47 AM, Sweet Lou 14 said:

3 million would be enough for third place today.  One of the only two collections above that number belongs to a professional dealer.

The points have changed over time.  Certain books have jumped up in points value.   I strongly suspect Doug's former collection would score well above 3million points today.

[lou_fine]

On 11/9/2022 at 3:06 PM, Microchip said:

The points have changed over time.  Certain books have jumped up in points value.   I strongly suspect Doug's former collection would score well above 3million points today.

To each their own, but I would much rather have a collection that scores over $3 million real dollars, as opposed to collection that scores over 3 million play points.  

[Microchip]

On 11/10/2022 at 6:02 PM, lou_fine said:

To each their own, but I would much rather have a collection that scores over $3 million real dollars, as opposed to collection that scores over 3 million play points.  

Those points are arbitrary, the collection would be worth many millions today.  

Not every book went under the hammer at Heritage from his collection.   None of duplicates went through.    Only one of the Pacific Coast Strange Tales #110 CGC 9.6 copies, went through for instance.

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

On 11/9/2022 at 6:06 PM, Microchip said:

The points have changed over time.  Certain books have jumped up in points value.   I strongly suspect Doug's former collection would score well above 3million points today.

Yes.

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

On 11/10/2022 at 6:19 AM, Microchip said:

Those points are arbitrary, the collection would be worth many millions today.  

Not every book went under the hammer at Heritage from his collection.   None of duplicates went through.    Only one of the Pacific Coast Strange Tales #110 CGC 9.6 copies, went through for instance.

If you review this thread:

you'll note that CGC states that points "... do no equate to market dollars." However, as some posters on that thread comment, clearly the sale prices of whichever specific comic book is obviously one of the factors (scarcity, demand, etc., being others) that influences the points assigned to it. Arguably, cost may be the most influential one since, for example, a great many relatively common Bronze Age issues that sell for large sums are worth substantial points.

Now, will the recent prices paid for IH 181 in CGC graded 9.8 cause CGC to raise its points or will it do as discussed in the thread and commence assigning points more "equitably," including possibly to, as one poster notes in the thread, comic books just purchased at the LCS?

 

[Brock]

On 11/10/2022 at 6:47 AM, Tec-Tac-Toe said:

you'll note that CGC states that points "... do no equate to market dollars." However, as some posters on that thread comment, clearly the sale prices of whichever specific comic book is obviously one of the factors (scarcity, demand, etc., being others) that influences the points assigned to it. Arguably, cost may be the most influential one since, for example, a great many relatively common Bronze Age issues that sell for large sums are worth substantial points.

I think for most sets, it’s more how the factors (scarcity, demand, etc.) were perceived years ago when the person who created the set took a brief look at GPA. Some sets are so out of whack after the passage of time that it’s painful… look at the DC Whitman variant registry set, where some books that trade for reasonable sums (say, $400 plus in 8.0 or 9.0) will see the highest graded copy on the census get 8 or 12 points.

[mjoeyoung]

On 11/7/2022 at 8:45 PM, VintageComics said:

On 11/7/2022 at 4:01 PM, DC# said:

Not to go back to old topics but somewhat related to the Pedigree conversation given the recent IH 181 9.8 sale.    Yet another 9.8 sold on Heritage last night for $90k.    So that was $125k on Pedigree, $148k on Clink (Sucha news), $86.4k on Goldin, and $90k on Heritage........all in the past 4 weeks or so.  

 

There was also a $138K copy on Heritage 2 months ago. 

What this shows is that the floor seems to be the $90K range where it has been for a year now, and that the ceiling in the $150K range for premium copies such as the Sucha News.

Sucha copies in general seem to usually fetch premiums and a 20-30% range for non-Pedigree copies seems to be right in the range of fluctuation for high grade Bronze where people weight page quality and production quality much more than SA or GA books. 

EXCEPT, the two Stan Lee signed 9.8s that sold for $46K and $50K in October.  There is a lot of "floor" between those and $90K.

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

On 11/10/2022 at 4:35 PM, Brock said:

I think for most sets, it’s more how the factors (scarcity, demand, etc.) were perceived years ago when the person who created the set took a brief look at GPA. Some sets are so out of whack after the passage of time that it’s painful… look at the DC Whitman variant registry set, where some books that trade for reasonable sums (say, $400 plus in 8.0 or 9.0) will see the highest graded copy on the census get 8 or 12 points.

As concerns the current point value of some books, the thread I linked begins to address that. However, it may be a long time coming before point values are addressed and very likely when they are not everyone will be satisfied by a country mile.

[VintageComics]

On 11/11/2022 at 3:20 AM, mjoeyoung said:

On 11/7/2022 at 10:45 PM, VintageComics said:

On 11/7/2022 at 6:01 PM, DC# said:

Not to go back to old topics but somewhat related to the Pedigree conversation given the recent IH 181 9.8 sale.    Yet another 9.8 sold on Heritage last night for $90k.    So that was $125k on Pedigree, $148k on Clink (Sucha news), $86.4k on Goldin, and $90k on Heritage........all in the past 4 weeks or so.  

 

There was also a $138K copy on Heritage 2 months ago. 

What this shows is that the floor seems to be the $90K range where it has been for a year now, and that the ceiling in the $150K range for premium copies such as the Sucha News.

Sucha copies in general seem to usually fetch premiums and a 20-30% range for non-Pedigree copies seems to be right in the range of fluctuation for high grade Bronze where people weight page quality and production quality much more than SA or GA books. 

Expand  

EXCEPT, the two Stan Lee signed 9.8s that sold for $46K and $50K in October.  There is a lot of "floor" between those and $90K.

Those must have slipped under the radar somehow and are outliers. Things slip through the cracks all the time only to resurface later at much higher prices. It's how a some dealers procure inventory. 

There was a time when auctions were NOT the determination of FMV. This is a fairly recent phenomenon that's only been around just over a decade. Auctions are a contest between how many viewers an item has and a timeclock and sometimes the timeclock wins. 

Any dealer with half a brain and the pocketbook to do so would have bought those both all day long at those prices.

In fact, most dealers would have probably paid much more for them. I know I would have, had I seen them.

What probably happened is that people saw that these were sig series copies and anybody (like me) who is looking for a blue label copy would have ignored these copies.

Whoever bought these is going to double their money. 

 

 

 

[lizards2]

On 11/11/2022 at 7:43 AM, VintageComics said:

Those must have slipped under the radar somehow and are outliers. Things slip through the cracks all the time only to resurface later at much higher prices. It's how a some dealers procure inventory. 

There was a time when auctions were NOT the determination of FMV. This is a fairly recent phenomenon that's only been around just over a decade. Auctions are a contest between how many viewers an item has and a timeclock and sometimes the timeclock wins. 

Any dealer with half a brain and the pocketbook to do so would have bought those both all day long at those prices.

In fact, most dealers would have probably paid much more for them. I know I would have, had I seen them.

What probably happened is that people saw that these were sig series copies and anybody (like me) who is looking for a blue label copy would have ignored these copies.

Whoever bought these is going to double their money. 

 

 

 

My eyes glaze over when I see yellow labels, and I just turn the page.

[VintageComics]

On 11/11/2022 at 11:27 AM, lizards2 said:

My eyes glaze over when I see yellow labels, and I just turn the page.

Ditto. I NEVER pay close attention to a yellow label.

The buying pool for yellow labels is much smaller than blue label books (especially on the high end) and I'm certain that's what happened to those two books. 

[Motor City Rob]

On 11/11/2022 at 11:27 AM, lizards2 said:

My eyes glaze over when I see yellow labels, and I just turn the page.

Same. I used to love yellow labels. Now, I just feel like they're inferior. Yes....I'm a label-ist.

[musicmeta]

On 11/11/2022 at 10:27 AM, lizards2 said:

My eyes glaze over when I see yellow labels, and I just turn the page.

The only yellow labels I want are the ones I actually witnessed the signature in person and sent the the signed book off to be graded.  I only have two books and one book that has Frank Miller's signature on it (If you can call it that), I had to drop off the book at the CGC booth here in Dallas, Texas when the Fan Days Expo was happening. I didn't actually get to see him sign it. I'll never do that again. 

[lizards2]

On 11/11/2022 at 9:12 AM, musicmeta said:

The only yellow labels I want are the ones I actually witnessed the signature in person and sent the the signed book off to be graded.  I only have two books and one book that has Frank Miller's signature on it (If you can call it that), I had to drop off the book at the CGC booth here in Dallas, Texas when the Fan Days Expo was happening. I didn't actually get to see him sign it. I'll never do that again. 

Frank Miller will always be the guy who ruined Daredevil for me.