Are prices still climbing or have they eased up a bit??? 43 43

[EastEnd1]

On 1/11/2024 at 5:29 PM, Sweet Lou 14 said:

Hell, I would never dream of going to a comic shop to buy the high-grade CGC Silver Age and Bronze Age stuff I look for.  That's not meant to hurt anyone's feelings, but it's just a fact.  Any local comic shop who has something on my want list, and hasn't put it up on eBay, Shortboxed, MCS, or some other platform where I can see it, is kinda being irresponsible.

That's my assumption as well... anything really good a comic shop picks up winds up being pressed, slabbed and consigned.

[mjoeyoung]

Huh?

Ultimate Fallout #4 Variant Edition (Marvel, 2011) CGC NM/MT 9.8 White pages....

Ultimate Fallout #4 Variant Edition - Signature Series: Clayton Crayon (Marvel, 2011) CGC NM/MT 9.8 White pages....

[Microchip]

On 1/12/2024 at 4:50 AM, Kramerica said:

Alright alright. I hereby retract my statement that FF #48 is plentiful and a warehouse copy.

All good. I was more implying there are different rules for different books in this hobby.

You are absolutely right about the 2 Thor issues, high grades are plentiful, and I even think one of the issues has a 9.9 graded copy.   No one should get excited about a high grade copy of those books.

But looking at the CGCdata website, the most highly subbed books in the hobby, have fantastic sales data attached to them.    But that's only one area of many great area's we see top recurring sales prices, and price appreciation in the hobby.

 

 

 

[Lightning55]

On 1/11/2024 at 5:59 PM, mjoeyoung said:

Huh?

Ultimate Fallout #4 Variant Edition (Marvel, 2011) CGC NM/MT 9.8 White pages....

Ultimate Fallout #4 Variant Edition - Signature Series: Clayton Crayon (Marvel, 2011) CGC NM/MT 9.8 White pages....

That IS disturbing. His last name is not Crayon.

[Ryan.]

Clayton Crayon 

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 1/11/2024 at 5:14 PM, Lightning55 said:

On 1/11/2024 at 4:59 PM, mjoeyoung said:

Huh?

Ultimate Fallout #4 Variant Edition (Marvel, 2011) CGC NM/MT 9.8 White pages....

Ultimate Fallout #4 Variant Edition - Signature Series: Clayton Crayon (Marvel, 2011) CGC NM/MT 9.8 White pages....

Expand  

That IS disturbing. His last name is not Crayon

Wait are we saying heritage listed it with that error in spelling?

That's funny, but I'd be ticked if I was the seller.

Imagining googling Clayton crayon to see if you wanted to bid on this. It's funny but it's not.

 

[Lightning55]

On 1/11/2024 at 9:55 PM, ADAMANTIUM said:

Wait are we saying heritage listed it with that error in spelling?

That's funny, but I'd be ticked if I was the seller.

Imagining googling Clayton crayon to see if you wanted to bid on this. It's funny but it's not.

 

I suspect that the buyer is happy, though.

[mrwoogieman]

On 1/11/2024 at 1:03 PM, Pontoon said:

It's both of course, but I think the current glut is the result of the run-up when Disney got the rights to the FF and the big pandemic surge in buying, slabbing and selling. Despite of the pricing drop we've seen, there still seems to be some demand with a few hundred sold copies on ebay. Over time, even non-key warehouse books seem to just get absorbed and pricing evens out with surrounding issues.

And I believe this is Mr. Bookery's store:

https://www.bookeryfantasy.com/

 

Looks like Fairborn, Ohio is in the path of totality on April 8th.

 

 

[Telegan]

On 1/10/2024 at 6:15 PM, KCOComics said:

Would it be more likely that GA collectors just don't get to the stores anymore? 

I buy a lot of GA books. But I also know any shop within 100 miles of me sells 90% moderns,  a smattering of BA and SA and very little GA. 

I don't bother looking or really even dropping in,  unless my kids want to go. My local guy and I text if he gets anything good. 

This is mainly why I don't go to my local shops anymore.  Since nowadays I only do GA with a smattering of SA/BA here and there, I'd rather wait and see what the auctions have because I know the selection in most local shops of what I'm looking for won't be very good.

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

[MAR1979]

On 1/10/2024 at 10:21 AM, AGGIEZ said:

See it coming back any time? This feels like the crash in 1997-ish again. Then there was a resurgence in the mid-00s. Maybe 2030 is the next resurgence...

I think there is still way too much interest in our hobby to be going the way of stamp collections just yet...

 

Larger the bubble, the larger the burst. Expect ramifications to continue into the next decade.  How long it lasts thereafter depends on amount of attrition that ultimately occurs.

 

Edited January 12 by MAR1979

[Bookery]

On 1/11/2024 at 5:29 PM, Sweet Lou 14 said:

Hell, I would never dream of going to a comic shop to buy the high-grade CGC Silver Age and Bronze Age stuff I look for.  That's not meant to hurt anyone's feelings, but it's just a fact.  Any local comic shop who has something on my want list, and hasn't put it up on eBay, Shortboxed, MCS, or some other platform where I can see it, is kinda being irresponsible.

Don't follow.  If I have something on your want-list, what kind of a jerk would I be to put it up for sale on some site in the hope that you might see it?  Why wouldn't I just call you and let you know I have it?

[Bookery]

On 1/11/2024 at 10:34 PM, Telegan said:

This is mainly why I don't go to my local shops anymore.  Since nowadays I only do GA with a smattering of SA/BA here and there, I'd rather wait and see what the auctions have because I know the selection in most local shops of what I'm looking for won't be very good.

All shops are by nature browsing arenas.  If you're not into browsing, into the thrill of the hunt, into running across something that isn't on your list but suddenly perks your interest upon seeing it in person, then a shop isn't going to be for you.  Frankly, just shopping and clicking for everything on the internet seems pretty boring to me, but I'm from another generation.

[Sweet Lou 14]

On 1/12/2024 at 8:23 AM, Bookery said:

Don't follow.  If I have something on your want-list, what kind of a jerk would I be to put it up for sale on some site in the hope that you might see it?  Why wouldn't I just call you and let you know I have it?

You're assuming that you (the dealer) and I (the customer) have an existing relationship.  And in that case, I completely agree that it would be wonderful if you would reach out to let me know.  I can tell you from experience, having shared my want list with many dealers (some of whom I have great relationships with and consider friends), it's pretty rare for a dealer / shop owner to remember what books their customers are looking for and reach out proactively when they get one.  If you are providing that level of service to your customers, you are definitely a cut above.

So in other words, I would love to live in a world where dealers prioritized my want list like I do, a world in which I could fairly call them a "jerk" if they put a book up for the world to see without first giving me exclusive first dibs on it!  But that's not something I've ever seen even with dealers where I thought I had a very tight relationship.

But getting back to the original question, there's no way I would expect success finding books I want by cruising around and dropping in on random local comic shops.  Like I said, if they have something I want it really ought to be listed somewhere online that I'm already looking.

Edited January 12 by Sweet Lou 14

[Kramerica]

On 1/11/2024 at 3:11 PM, Microchip said:

All good. I was more implying there are different rules for different books in this hobby.

You are absolutely right about the 2 Thor issues, high grades are plentiful, and I even think one of the issues has a 9.9 graded copy.   No one should get excited about a high grade copy of those books.

But looking at the CGCdata website, the most highly subbed books in the hobby, have fantastic sales data attached to them.    But that's only one area of many great area's we see top recurring sales prices, and price appreciation in the hobby.

If Thor #132 or 156 featured the first appearances of two of Marvel's greatest characters, people would get excited about high grade copies of these books regardless of their census numbers. And there is actually a 10.0 of Thor #156. 

But you're correct - there are different rules for different books in this hobby. But this book is truly unique. We all know what movie hype does to comics featuring 1st apps (even the Inhumans). But this is the first time in the CGC era (or ever really) where we've had movie hype on the same characters and films twice.

So gather around the fire kiddies!  

As legend has it, when the Silver Surfer and Big G were announced for the 2nd FF film in 2006, a group of folks (to be further known as the "FF #48 Banking Barons") were holding 95% of the NM/NM+ cases of FF #48 and wisely voted to modify their strategy regarding the number of copies they released to the "public" or sent to CGC. Or simply sat on in the event of a Silver Surfer solo movie. They slowed things down to a mere trickle, allowing them to control and maximize their profits and choosing when and where they would release these copies.

Fast forward to now and word has it that the FF #48 Banking Baron Illuminati will be meeting once again when casting has been made official on the forthcoming FF film. At that time they will examine census numbers, GPA averages, online hype and whether the Surfer will be male or female (and will Big G be wearing his purple short shorts or resemble a swarm of bees). They will then decide when and to which auction houses the 9.4's, 9.6's and 9.8's will go, how many to submit for grading, how many to eBay and so forth.

[Bookery]

On 1/12/2024 at 9:45 AM, Sweet Lou 14 said:

You're assuming that you (the dealer) and I (the customer) have an existing relationship.  And in that case, I completely agree that it would be wonderful if you would reach out to let me know.  I can tell you from experience, having shared my want list with many dealers (some of whom I have great relationships with and consider friends), it's pretty rare for a dealer / shop owner to remember what books their customers are looking for and reach out proactively when they get one.  If you are providing that level of service to your customers, you are definitely a cut above.

So in other words, I would love to live in a world where dealers prioritized my want list like I do, a world in which I could fairly call them a "jerk" if they put a book up for the world to see without first giving me exclusive first dibs on it!  But that's not something I've ever seen even with dealers where I thought I had a very tight relationship.

But getting back to the original question, there's no way I would expect success finding books I want by cruising around and dropping in on random local comic shops.  Like I said, if they have something I want it really ought to be listed somewhere online that I'm already looking.

Ah.  I misunderstood the previous post.  If you're a golden-age collector, especially, I would never imagine you could fulfill your wants just by shopping at stores.  But I'm not sure why it has to be an either/or thing either.

I will quibble with your assertion that not putting comics on-line is "irresponsible" (responsible to whom?).  But I guess i'm irresponsible.  I used to do shows and mail order and eBay and the whole shebang.  But now my stock stays in the shop.  I don't do mail-order.  It's walk-in or not at all.  I have nearly 100% sell-thru on anything that's remotely decent.  Sometimes within hours, sometimes within weeks, occasionally within months.  But sooner or later it sells.  I don't have trouble selling comics in my shop, so why would I add the bother of setting up at shows or running to the post office all week?  Sure... I might get more in some online or auction venues.  But I'm at the point where I can retire whenever I choose to, so getting a few more dollars isn't worth the hassle to me.

But moreover, it's a very deliberate decision, partly for the reasons many have stated above.  It may be old-fashioned, but I want to have a brick-and-mortar location where customers can walk in and find an assortment that you don't find in other shops.  I don't want to have a boring shop because everything I get immediately goes on eBay or some big auction house.  Now stock is only as good as the collections that can be obtained, and that varies a lot from month to month and year to year.  But you can't have it both ways.  People on here are complaining that they don't go to shops because they never have anything other than moderns.  Then if a shop does carry vintage stuff, they're called irresponsible for not making it available online.  So... which is it?

It's like the other famous dilemma that occurs among many collectors.  They don't like a shop that doesn't have a lot of big hot books.  But if you do have them, they complain that prices are too high.  Because high prices are the only way they are going to stay on your walls.  I try to keep my prices reasonable which is why everything eventually sells.   And I have a variable but good mix of older stuff on any given day.  But I could have a great mix of stuff if I over-priced.  If all the stuff I bought in just the past couple of years were on the walls at one time, it would be a fascinating display indeed.  But customers wouldn't buy it, because the books would have to be well above market to maintain that display. 

In-store selling isn't for everyone.  It's a niche approach to selling.  But if I put everything good up for auction, I would disappoint most if not all of my existing customer base to favor customers-unknown across the country.  And that, in my mind, would be "irresponsible" to the folks that have supported me for 40 years, and to those that drive a few miles out of their way as they pass through from out-of-state.

 

[Chip Cataldo]

On 1/12/2024 at 5:08 PM, Bookery said:

Ah.  I misunderstood the previous post.  If you're a golden-age collector, especially, I would never imagine you could fulfill your wants just by shopping at stores.  But I'm not sure why it has to be an either/or thing either.

I will quibble with your assertion that not putting comics on-line is "irresponsible" (responsible to whom?).  But I guess i'm irresponsible.  I used to do shows and mail order and eBay and the whole shebang.  But now my stock stays in the shop.  I don't do mail-order.  It's walk-in or not at all.  I have nearly 100% sell-thru on anything that's remotely decent.  Sometimes within hours, sometimes within weeks, occasionally within months.  But sooner or later it sells.  I don't have trouble selling comics in my shop, so why would I add the bother of setting up at shows or running to the post office all week?  Sure... I might get more in some online or auction venues.  But I'm at the point where I can retire whenever I choose to, so getting a few more dollars isn't worth the hassle to me.

But moreover, it's a very deliberate decision, partly for the reasons many have stated above.  It may be old-fashioned, but I want to have a brick-and-mortar location where customers can walk in and find an assortment that you don't find in other shops.  I don't want to have a boring shop because everything I get immediately goes on eBay or some big auction house.  Now stock is only as good as the collections that can be obtained, and that varies a lot from month to month and year to year.  But you can't have it both ways.  People on here are complaining that they don't go to shops because they never have anything other than moderns.  Then if a shop does carry vintage stuff, they're called irresponsible for not making it available online.  So... which is it?

It's like the other famous dilemma that occurs among many collectors.  They don't like a shop that doesn't have a lot of big hot books.  But if you do have them, they complain that prices are too high.  Because high prices are the only way they are going to stay on your walls.  I try to keep my prices reasonable which is why everything eventually sells.   And I have a variable but good mix of older stuff on any given day.  But I could have a great mix of stuff if I over-priced.  If all the stuff I bought in just the past couple of years were on the walls at one time, it would be a fascinating display indeed.  But customers wouldn't buy it, because the books would have to be well above market to maintain that display. 

In-store selling isn't for everyone.  It's a niche approach to selling.  But if I put everything good up for auction, I would disappoint most if not all of my existing customer base to favor customers-unknown across the country.  And that, in my mind, would be "irresponsible" to the folks that have supported me for 40 years, and to those that drive a few miles out of their way as they pass through from out-of-state.

An excellent, mic-drop post. Thanks for posting this.

[jimjum12]

On 1/11/2024 at 12:49 PM, Kramerica said:

Huh. Now I want to find out where you are so I can come visit another cool store!

You have a drive ... unless you catch a starship heading to Wright Patterson and then a Uber from there. I've always wanted to go there at least once. GOD BLESS ... 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

[Telegan]

On 1/12/2024 at 7:27 AM, Bookery said:

All shops are by nature browsing arenas.  If you're not into browsing, into the thrill of the hunt, into running across something that isn't on your list but suddenly perks your interest upon seeing it in person, then a shop isn't going to be for you.  Frankly, just shopping and clicking for everything on the internet seems pretty boring to me, but I'm from another generation.

That's the way I am with Golden Age and some Silver Age.  Consider it another way - I collect PCH and GA sci-fi comics, for the most part.  If I want some Weird Science, Space Detective, Witches Tales, Tales from the Crypt, etc. issue 6.0 or higher in grade, I know none of the stores near me would have it or they'd be crazy-overpriced.  Been there, done that.  I'll definitely go to something like a Collectors Summit where I know my odds of finding something cool that I like is really high.  Also, I have an Excel spreadsheet with tons of comics I'd love to buy at a specific price.  As I keep finding new ones, I keep adding them to the spreadsheet.  If I see them on the Internet or at shows, I'll buy them if the price is right.  I know I'm wasting my time at a lot of the comic stores around me to do that.  I once found 2 comics on a local comic store's website, bought them online, and when they hadn't shipped in a couple of weeks, I asked them what the hold-up was.  They said they couldn't find them.  Um... ok. lol.  For me, the thrill of the hunt will be at auction houses and conventions that are geared toward specifically toward comics (which is why I mentioned Collectors Summit) because I know what I want and there may be a good possibility I'll find something new that I like there or, even better, what I want.

Everybody's different and I don't think it has as much to do with as what generation people are from as it's just what they like.  For example, there are younger and older people of varying generations who love reading comics.  I used to love reading comics as a kid but I don't do that anymore.  I know people in their 50s and beyond that still love reading comics just as much as they did when they were kids, and that's cool, too.  I'm more in it for the cover art, nostalgia, history, etc. nowadays than the story.  There are people that want to drive around the state looking for comic books - I used to drive around states looking for good bbq and catfish while meeting new people. LOL.  When I was in jr. high and high school, I used to ask my dad to drop me off at a university library with lots of old books, and I'd spend hours roaming the library for no reason other than to look through all the old books and smell "the smell" of old books while maybe learning something new or interesting.  A lot of people would consider that boring.  To each their own and to each their definition of "boring".

Edited January 13 by Telegan

[Sweet Lou 14]

On 1/12/2024 at 5:08 PM, Bookery said:

Ah.  I misunderstood the previous post.  If you're a golden-age collector, especially, I would never imagine you could fulfill your wants just by shopping at stores.  But I'm not sure why it has to be an either/or thing either.

I will quibble with your assertion that not putting comics on-line is "irresponsible" (responsible to whom?).  But I guess i'm irresponsible.  I used to do shows and mail order and eBay and the whole shebang.  But now my stock stays in the shop.  I don't do mail-order.  It's walk-in or not at all.  I have nearly 100% sell-thru on anything that's remotely decent.  Sometimes within hours, sometimes within weeks, occasionally within months.  But sooner or later it sells.  I don't have trouble selling comics in my shop, so why would I add the bother of setting up at shows or running to the post office all week?  Sure... I might get more in some online or auction venues.  But I'm at the point where I can retire whenever I choose to, so getting a few more dollars isn't worth the hassle to me.

But moreover, it's a very deliberate decision, partly for the reasons many have stated above.  It may be old-fashioned, but I want to have a brick-and-mortar location where customers can walk in and find an assortment that you don't find in other shops.  I don't want to have a boring shop because everything I get immediately goes on eBay or some big auction house.  Now stock is only as good as the collections that can be obtained, and that varies a lot from month to month and year to year.  But you can't have it both ways.  People on here are complaining that they don't go to shops because they never have anything other than moderns.  Then if a shop does carry vintage stuff, they're called irresponsible for not making it available online.  So... which is it?

It's like the other famous dilemma that occurs among many collectors.  They don't like a shop that doesn't have a lot of big hot books.  But if you do have them, they complain that prices are too high.  Because high prices are the only way they are going to stay on your walls.  I try to keep my prices reasonable which is why everything eventually sells.   And I have a variable but good mix of older stuff on any given day.  But I could have a great mix of stuff if I over-priced.  If all the stuff I bought in just the past couple of years were on the walls at one time, it would be a fascinating display indeed.  But customers wouldn't buy it, because the books would have to be well above market to maintain that display. 

In-store selling isn't for everyone.  It's a niche approach to selling.  But if I put everything good up for auction, I would disappoint most if not all of my existing customer base to favor customers-unknown across the country.  And that, in my mind, would be "irresponsible" to the folks that have supported me for 40 years, and to those that drive a few miles out of their way as they pass through from out-of-state.

 

I appreciate the thoughtful response.  Definitely don't want to be in a debate because we're not really in disagreement.  If it seems like we are, part of the reason it may be that we're talking about different (though potentially overlapping) kinds of inventory.

We're in a thread that is all about the rising and falling of comic book prices -- that discussion isn't exclusively about the top of the market, but it's the top of the market that drives the overall trends.  And it so happens that my personal collecting interest tends to be at the top of the market.  So when I use an admittedly strong word like "irresponsible," I'm saying that for four- and five- and six-figure books, a business owner needs to make sure they're reaching the whole market.  If the local dealer is fortunate and savvy enough to have a strong customer database and sufficient knowledge of those customers to sell some of that top-end material through one-to-one marketing, of course that's ideal.  (And bringing it back to me, since of course my original post was all about my perspective as a buyer, those are books I don't expect to have a crack at anyway.)  But any big-ticket items that don't sell that way, I would expect to be marketed at shows or online in some fashion.

I completely hear you about not wanting to do shows -- I find them noisy and difficult as a buyer, so I can only imagine the hassle as a seller.  And your point about browsing as being the point of shopping is also well taken.  I do shop like that sometimes -- but not when it comes to my want list, which I pursue with total focus and where there's zero ambiguity about what I'm looking to buy.

 

So everything you've said makes sense to me, and I hope the same is true in reverse.