Robin Comes Out 2 2

[Qalyar]

On 8/10/2021 at 9:36 PM, kav said:

This isnt our first rodeo.  These pandering stories are always flops.  If this is magically the first one that defies the record I will be the first one to eat my hat.

Yep, pretty much this. Doubly so for as high profile a character as this.

You know, now that I think about it, there's probably a really interesting, meaningful story to be told about the parallels between closeted sexuality/"coming out" and the genre trope of the secret identity. That would be the sort of story that could address sexuality in a way that would (or could, at least) come across as more than a clickbait cash grab.

But, sadly, I don't see that happening here. If I'm wrong, crow'll be for dinner. 

[kav]

On 8/10/2021 at 7:38 PM, Mutie Fan said:

What do you mean by flops?

Corny cliche dialogue and situations, low sales, people talking abt how stupid it is-the usual stuff.

[JTLarsen]

On 8/10/2021 at 8:55 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

How does this forward the storyline of the character?

Explain to us how does this helps the character grow? 

Coming out is personal/emotional growth.

[kav]

On 8/10/2021 at 7:41 PM, Qalyar said:

Yep, pretty much this. Doubly so for as high profile a character as this.

You know, now that I think about it, there's probably a really interesting, meaningful story to be told about the parallels between closeted sexuality/"coming out" and the genre trope of the secret identity. That would be the sort of story that could address sexuality in a way that would (or could, at least) come across as more than a clickbait cash grab.

But, sadly, I don't see that happening here. If I'm wrong, crow'll be for dinner. 

There is a ton of fascinating character development and plot situations possible with something like this.  Unfortunately comic writers seem to learn to write from watching sitcoms and TV dramas.

[Mutie Fan]

On 8/10/2021 at 7:44 PM, kav said:

Corny cliche dialogue and situations, low sales, people talking abt how stupid it is-the usual stuff.

If all of the "pandering" stories are flops with no upside, they why do publishers keep doing it? If they don't make money on it, if it does not bring in new readers and it pisses fans off and they still do it, maybe they do it because they feel that having more minority, women and LGBTQ characters in comics is a better representation of our overall society and just the right thing to do. 

[B2D327]

Next sub-plot has an NDA that Bruce made him sign or he’d forfeit his entire inheritance for some odd reason 🤔

[kav]

If you want to see what it looks like when someone does LGBT stories right read Sophie Campbell's Wet Moon series-the characters are interesting and surprising.  Surprising is important-we dont wanna see the same recylced cliches so prevelant on TV.  I've had many interesting online conversations with sophie about how she writes so damn realistically.

[kav]

On 8/10/2021 at 7:48 PM, Mutie Fan said:

If all of the "pandering" stories are flops with no upside, they why do publishers keep doing it? If they don't make money on it, if it does not bring in new readers and it pisses fans off and they still do it, maybe they do it because they feel that having more minority, women and LGBTQ characters in comics is a better representation of our overall society and just the right thing to do. 

I would answer this question but I would receive a strike.

[Terry JSA]

On 8/10/2021 at 10:48 PM, Mutie Fan said:

If all of the "pandering" stories are flops with no upside, they why do publishers keep doing it? If they don't make money on it, if it does not bring in new readers and it pisses fans off and they still do it, maybe they do it because they feel that having more minority, women and LGBTQ characters in comics is a better representation of our overall society and just the right thing to do. 

Alan Scott canonically came out as gay back in March of 2021 when Infinite Frontier #0 released and that has gone no where as of yet.

Edited August 11, 2021 by Terry_JSA

[kav]

On 8/10/2021 at 7:48 PM, Mutie Fan said:

If all of the "pandering" stories are flops with no upside, they why do publishers keep doing it? If they don't make money on it, if it does not bring in new readers and it pisses fans off and they still do it, maybe they do it because they feel that having more minority, women and LGBTQ characters in comics is a better representation of our overall society and just the right thing to do. 

I will say this-fiction has one job-to entertain.  Not to 'fix' society or anything else.

[Mutie Fan]

On 8/10/2021 at 7:55 PM, kav said:

I will say this-fiction has one job-to entertain.  Not to 'fix' society or anything else.

Maybe a little narrow minded there.

Some of the greatest works of fiction in literature have been intended to bring about societal change. 

[shadroch]

 

On 8/10/2021 at 7:55 PM, kav said:

I will say this-fiction has one job-to entertain.  Not to 'fix' society or anything else.

 Nonsense. Try reading Dickens or Uncle Toms Cabin. 

[kav]

On 8/10/2021 at 7:58 PM, Mutie Fan said:

Maybe a little narrow minded there.

Some of the greatest works of fiction in literature have been intended to bring about societal change. 

agreed-The Jungle comes to mind.  But they did it by depicting issues in an interesting manner, not merely by including some underrepresented section of society as the total endgame.

[kav]

On 8/10/2021 at 8:00 PM, shadroch said:

 

 Nonsense. Try reading Dickens or Uncle Toms Cabin. 

Yes those were entertaining.  You can add societal change to fiction but the main focus has to be to entertain.  Or no one will read it.

Edited August 11, 2021 by kav

[Nazirite]

On 8/10/2021 at 10:55 PM, Terry_JSA said:

Alan Scott canonically came out as gay back in March of 2021 when Infinite Frontier #0 released and that has gone no where as of yet. 

Still wrapping my head around that one. 

[Terry JSA]

On 8/10/2021 at 11:02 PM, Nazirite said:

Still wrapping my head around that one. 

There was a story about him DC Pride #1 and that was about it. 

[Mutie Fan]

On 8/10/2021 at 7:55 PM, Terry_JSA said:

Alan Scott canonically came out as gay back in March of 2021 when Infinite Frontier #0 released and that has gone no where as of yet. 

 I haven't read a modern comic book in 15 years, so I have no idea who you are talking about. Give me a little leeway with this, but where exactly is it supposed to go? Someones sexuality doesn't have to be a plot point. 

[oatcrunch]

On 8/10/2021 at 7:53 PM, kav said:

If you want to see what it looks like when someone does LGBT stories right read Sophie Campbell's Wet Moon series-the characters are interesting and surprising.  Surprising is important-we dont wanna see the same recylced cliches so prevelant on TV.  I've had many interesting online conversations with sophie about how she writes so damn realistically.

Thanks for the recommendation, I'll check it out! Regarding this new story line being pandering, I hope - for the sake of good storytelling - that you're wrong, and we get something we both enjoy.

Cheers!

[kav]

On 8/10/2021 at 8:03 PM, Mutie Fan said:

 I haven't read a modern comic book in 15 years, so I have no idea who you are talking about. Give me a little leeway with this, but where exactly is it supposed to go? Someones sexuality doesn't have to be a plot point. 

In fiction everything that happens has to either advance the plot or advance the character.  You cannot just plop something down to make a 'statement'.  

[kav]

On 8/10/2021 at 8:04 PM, benny275 said:

Thanks for the recommendation, I'll check it out! Regarding this new story line being pandering, I hope - for the sake of good storytelling - that you're wrong, and we get something we both enjoy.

Cheers!

Sophie is a transgender woman are her writing skills are top notch.  Nothing is forced or shoehorned in.