I miss covers with substance 3 3

[Lazyboy]

On 11/28/2021 at 4:41 PM, LarsUmlaut said:

I would recommend doing drugs before reading Grant Morrison

I don't do drugs and I love Morrison! Not that I doubt that doing drugs and reading Morrison would be an experience.

[Randall Dowling]

On 11/28/2021 at 6:08 PM, ttfitz said:

I would say, so do you.

If you want a start, go to comics.org and put "Mark Waid" and "Garth Ennis" and "Kurt Busiek" and "Warren Ellis" and "Brian K. Vaughan" into the search box. That should give you plenty to read for a while.

I've read all of those (look at my avatar).  I'm not saying there isn't material produced in the last 20 years worth reading.  I'm saying it's a far cry from the work I mentioned before.  That's all.

[Lazyboy]

On 11/28/2021 at 5:45 PM, ttfitz said:

On 11/26/2021 at 6:59 PM, kav said:

#Saynotopinupcovers!

Good god, yes!

There can sometimes be a bit of a fine line between covers that are related to the interiors and generic pin-ups. I'll generally give a pass to first issues since the focus is often on the new series beginning, as it clearly is in your examples. But I think you're being a bit unfair to Avengers #4 and #57. Sure, on any other issue, the cover to #4 would be a generic pin-up that reveals nothing about the story, but it's not any other issue.

[universal soldier]

On 11/28/2021 at 6:46 PM, LarsUmlaut said:

Swamp Thing bored you to tears?

 

On 11/28/2021 at 6:48 PM, kav said:

I read it when it came out-perhaps a reread would change my mind.  

I bet it would. I remember reading this when it came and saying holy . Love all his stuff but he really took the stories to the next level. Given that time of my life, I was probably super baked though...

[universal soldier]

I think that every era has it's "drek" and boring covers and we all have our own opinion of what makes a good story or art that appeals to us. Some books strike home in different ways. sometimes it's the cover and others it's the story. Two ASM issues invoke different emotions for me.

ASM #121 is a classic story that defined the collector and fan I am today. While the cover art is classic Spider-man, the layout of it has always bothered me. Borderline hate it really.

 

ASM #36. You can't get much simpler than this but it's perfect for what it represents. It invokes so much raw emotion of the events at that time. The story itself isn't that great, and at points, somewhat stupid. Don't even get me started on the art...

 

I devour Silver and Bronze, grew up with Copper and still read moderns. I don't appreciate Gold like I should and need to think outside the super-hero genre more than I do. My opinion of what is great may not be the same for everyone in the room although we all can likely agree on the classics. There have been many threads or posts over the years here that have led me to read a book I may have passed on otherwise, to me that is what makes this hobby so great. We all appreciate different things, it's nice to see differing view points whether you agree with them or not.

 

[kav]

On 11/28/2021 at 5:10 PM, universal soldier said:

 

I bet it would. I remember reading this when it came and saying holy . Love all his stuff but he really took the stories to the next level. Given that time of my life, I was probably super baked though...

I have all the issues still wonder if there (sic) worth anything.

[universal soldier]

On 11/28/2021 at 9:44 PM, kav said:

I have all the issues still wonder if there (sic) worth anything.

Anything that Moore wrote on this run can fetch good $$ in higher grades. #37 is the first John Constantine and a 9.8 sold this month for $2100+. 

[kav]

On 11/28/2021 at 7:05 PM, universal soldier said:

Anything that Moore wrote on this run can fetch good $$ in higher grades. #37 is the first John Constantine and a 9.8 sold this month for $2100+. 

mine look like abt a 9.2 thx.  The more stuff sits in my long boxes the more it is worth it seems.

[ttfitz]

On 11/28/2021 at 7:53 PM, Lazyboy said:

There can sometimes be a bit of a fine line between covers that are related to the interiors and generic pin-ups. I'll generally give a pass to first issues since the focus is often on the new series beginning, as it clearly is in your examples. But I think you're being a bit unfair to Avengers #4 and #57. Sure, on any other issue, the cover to #4 would be a generic pin-up that reveals nothing about the story, but it's not any other issue.

No doubt - I just picked examples that were easy for me to think of and get covers for without thinking too hard about it.  

But it was just to make a general point, which is that blanket pronouncements tend to be easily countered. One could say that there was a tendency towards pinup type covers now, and no one would disagree. But that isn't unique to our current times, either. Nor is the "cover without substance" that is alluded at the beginning of this thread - I've seen @kav on many occasions complain about such things in the DC Silver Age books. Sure, it wasn't a pinup cover as being mentioned here, but non-pinups that were totally unrelated to anything in the interior stories (and not just some sort of concept cover, but stuff that didn't actually happen in any way).

I circle back to Sturgeon's Law, with a smidge of "grass is always greener" flavored with nostalgia colored glasses to completely mix my metaphors. 

[ttfitz]

On 11/26/2021 at 6:20 PM, Randall Ries said:

It never occured to me to ever post a selfie on purpose or a picture of what I was just served for lunch. And they called us from the late 1960's and early 1970s "The 'ME' Generation". We had NOTHING on this self centered generation.

Speaking as someone approaching 60, I am pretty sure that if we had cameras that we could easily carry in our pockets that would instantly produce an image that we could send to all of our friends with a few touches on a screen, we would have given "the kids today" a run for their money in "self absorption."

[kav]

On 11/28/2021 at 9:13 PM, ttfitz said:

No doubt - I just picked examples that were easy for me to think of and get covers for without thinking too hard about it.  

But it was just to make a general point, which is that blanket pronouncements tend to be easily countered. One could say that there was a tendency towards pinup type covers now, and no one would disagree. But that isn't unique to our current times, either. Nor is the "cover without substance" that is alluded at the beginning of this thread - I've seen @kav on many occasions complain about such things in the DC Silver Age books. Sure, it wasn't a pinup cover as being mentioned here, but non-pinups that were totally unrelated to anything in the interior stories (and not just some sort of concept cover, but stuff that didn't actually happen in any way).

I circle back to Sturgeon's Law, with a smidge of "grass is always greener" flavored with nostalgia colored glasses to completely mix my metaphors. 

I love DC silver age books.

[Larryw7]

You can't get more substantive than EC war comics of the 1950's.

[theCapraAegagrus]

4: Somewhat agree.

There's plenty of old dreck with TMI on the cover, too. Variants are my #1 concern.

[NoMan]

On 11/28/2021 at 3:35 PM, LarsUmlaut said:

this has always been a fairly haunting cover

[Ken Aldred]

On 11/29/2021 at 1:32 AM, universal soldier said:

I think that every era has it's "drek" and boring covers and we all have our own opinion of what makes a good story or art that appeals to us. Some books strike home in different ways. sometimes it's the cover and others it's the story. Two ASM issues invoke different emotions for me.

ASM #121 is a classic story that defined the collector and fan I am today. While the cover art is classic Spider-man, the layout of it has always bothered me. Borderline hate it really.

 

ASM #36. You can't get much simpler than this but it's perfect for what it represents. It invokes so much raw emotion of the events at that time. The story itself isn't that great, and at points, somewhat stupid. Don't even get me started on the art...

 

I devour Silver and Bronze, grew up with Copper and still read moderns. I don't appreciate Gold like I should and need to think outside the super-hero genre more than I do. My opinion of what is great may not be the same for everyone in the room although we all can likely agree on the classics. There have been many threads or posts over the years here that have led me to read a book I may have passed on otherwise, to me that is what makes this hobby so great. We all appreciate different things, it's nice to see differing view points whether you agree with them or not.

 

I agree. It’s subjective.

I’ve found maybe 5 to 10 comics at most, any month, any Age, that I’d consider still appeal to me, and few really outstanding classics which have stood the test of time and have retained some degree of lifelong magic, once they’re been sifted out from among the common mediocrity and outright garbage.

That said, everyone has their own criteria and tastes to apply here and could have a bit of nostalgic fun playing around on the Newsstand website.  The results naturally, understandably, will vary.

 

Edited November 29, 2021 by Ken Aldred

[Ken Aldred]

On 11/29/2021 at 5:19 AM, ttfitz said:

Speaking as someone approaching 60, I am pretty sure that if we had cameras that we could easily carry in our pockets that would instantly produce an image that we could send to all of our friends with a few touches on a screen, we would have given "the kids today" a run for their money in "self absorption."

Yup. Who’d have thought, reading a Fourth World comic as a kid in the 70s, that one day we’d have our own handheld Mother Boxes.

Excuse me, I need to reply to a text ping.

Edited November 29, 2021 by Ken Aldred

[Ken Aldred]

On 11/29/2021 at 12:53 AM, Lazyboy said:

But I think you're being a bit unfair to Avengers #4 and #57

I thought that about Avengers 4, which is one of my all-time favourite covers. It’s an incredibly dynamic way to reintroduce one of the most significant Marvel characters of all time.

Totally in your face, approaching like an unstoppable juggernaut,  simple-but-powerful, energetic composition, and no messing about with hiding the greatness inside.

Always liked it that much.

[kav]

On 11/28/2021 at 9:19 PM, ttfitz said:

Speaking as someone approaching 60, I am pretty sure that if we had cameras that we could easily carry in our pockets that would instantly produce an image that we could send to all of our friends with a few touches on a screen, we would have given "the kids today" a run for their money in "self absorption."

I dont know about that.  Parents when I were growing up didnt buy their kids expensive stuff just because everyone else had one.  And my dad was quick to bust up my stuff if I misbehaved.  There's a change in culture involved not just the new technology.  As a teacher I've advised parents of completely out of control students to take away their phone.   For a month.  "Oh no I cant do that what if there's an EMERGENCY?"
There is an emergency-your kid has straight Fs and is wildly out of control.
Any self absorbed kid back in my day was mocked mercilessly.

Edited November 29, 2021 by kav

[ttfitz]

On 11/29/2021 at 12:25 AM, kav said:

I love DC silver age books.

As do I. But no way around that there were many covers totally divorced from their content.

[ttfitz]

On 11/29/2021 at 3:26 PM, kav said:

Any self absorbed kid back in my day was mocked mercilessly.

FTFY.