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Heritage April Auction
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Started by Matches_Malone,

534 posts in this topic

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grapeape

grapeape

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Posted (edited)
On 4/8/2022 at 12:31 PM, Bronty said:

this is an interesting contrast at similar price points

 

25520249%5D%2Csizedata%5B50x50%5D&call=url%5Bfile%3Aproduct.chain%5D 94026 Mark Bagley and Randy Emberlin Amazing Spider-Man #374 Story Page 10 Venom Original Art (Marvel, 1993).... $40,800.00 Sold to HA.com/Live
  25621099%5D%2Csizedata%5B50x50%5D&call=url%5Bfile%3Aproduct.chain%5D 94025 Ayers Strange Tales #115 Story Page 3 Sandman Original Art (Marvel, 1963).... $45,600.00 Sold to Internet

Bagley very impressive piece and this is a cool comparison. I have another one. Also Gotta appreciate Ayers getting love on the very early Spider-Man appearance from the sixties.

Check out this one:

Lot # 94120 Erik Larsen ASM 322 $54,000

Lot # 94162 Romita Sr.  ASM   75 $45,600

The Romita was a 1/2 splash with Spider-Man from the sixties. It’s clear now that age is just a number. Money goes where it goes for all kinds of reasons.

I think the sixties stuff is very strong. I’m also very impressed with nineties art. If you’d told me that Erik Larsen and now Mark Bagley would bring these kind of numbers four years ago I would of bet against it.

If you really love art for art sake there’s plenty of affordable art left. You probably won’t find it at these auctions.Maybe value can be found buying from some of the brand new artists out there. I enjoyed the last two days chaos from the side lines. Good luck to anyone brave enough to fight the good fight out there.


 

 

Edited by grapeape
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delekkerste

delekkerste

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On 4/8/2022 at 3:21 PM, batman_fan said:

Cover I was secretly hoping to win.  No one would be very interested in it so figured $6k-$8k.  Boy was I wrong.

I think at $24K it sold at the lower-to-mid range of many peoples' expectations. I was surprised that the owner of the #1 cover didn't step up to buy it at that price. Though, it probably didn't help that I got his message too late to egg him on to bid higher. lol 

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delekkerste

delekkerste

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On 4/8/2022 at 4:45 PM, Brian Peck said:

96K with juice for Excalibur #16 cover by Alan Davis and Paul Neary

I know there were things that sold for (much) larger dollar prices, but, this may have been the most shocking result of them all for me. Because at least I can fathom why someone might love a Jim Lee X-Men page so much to pay $360K, or pay $168K for the first Firestar in comics cover, or pay big money for super nostalgic Superman vs. Doomsday or Batman vs. Bane pieces.

But this Excalibur cover? Really? 

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delekkerste

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On 4/8/2022 at 9:25 PM, J.Sid said:

X-Men 271 would have challenged the Secret Wars 8 result if only lazy Orzechowski had bothered to put a 'snikt' on the page.

:)

 

$360K for that page is a shocking result. Don't get me wrong, I love the page and fully expected a record price for this that would surprise some people, but, $360K?? That's more than the X-Men #268 COVER - one of the most beloved and memorable from the entire Lee/Williams X-Men collaboration - sold for just 16 months ago!! :whatthe: 

And, yes, I know a lot has changed in 16 months, but, not THAT much.

Edited by delekkerste
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tth2

tth2

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On 4/10/2022 at 8:37 AM, delekkerste said:
On 4/9/2022 at 3:21 AM, batman_fan said:

Cover I was secretly hoping to win.  No one would be very interested in it so figured $6k-$8k.  Boy was I wrong.

I think at $24K it sold at the lower-to-mid range of many peoples' expectations.

The transformation is complete.  We have seen "Rain on Your Parade Gene" become "Fanning the Fire with Gasoline Gene" in the space of 18 months. 

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tth2

tth2

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On 4/10/2022 at 8:41 AM, delekkerste said:

But this Excalibur cover? Really? 

On 4/10/2022 at 8:52 AM, delekkerste said:

And, yes, I know a lot has changed in 16 months, but, not THAT much.

Or maybe not. lol

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kbmcvay

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The only thing that changed with that Excalibur cover is it sold on Heritage. I'm not convinced that the astonishing prices for some of these recent items are completely on the level given the pattern Heritage and their cohorts have been involved in from a market manipulation perspective as discussed elsewhere on these boards.The only people that benefit from this are the sellers and Heritage (but the latter is main beneficiary as well as the dealers less directly as a new price floor is set). If somebody put the same piece on Comic Connect instead of Heritage for example, does it reach the same price? It should since the same bidders should be aware of its existence if they are willing to drop high 5 to 6 figures on it. Yet, somehow it seems like it wouldn't (especially something like that Excalibur cover). Why? 

I'm sure somebody will say that all of these auctions are totally on the level and there are is no shilling or market manipulation occurring but unless you can provide real evidence to the contrary I'm not buying it. I don't believe that any collectable goes up in price via auction 1000%+ in 12-24 months not a Super Mario Bros. video game and not that Alan Davis cover.

 

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Rick2you2

Rick2you2

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Posted (edited)
On 4/10/2022 at 6:25 AM, kbmcvay said:

The only thing that changed with that Excalibur cover is it sold on Heritage. I'm not convinced that the astonishing prices for some of these recent items are completely on the level given the pattern Heritage and their cohorts have been involved in from a market manipulation perspective as discussed elsewhere on these boards.The only people that benefit from this are the sellers and Heritage (but the latter is main beneficiary as well as the dealers less directly as a new price floor is set). If somebody put the same piece on Comic Connect instead of Heritage for example, does it reach the same price? It should since the same bidders should be aware of its existence if they are willing to drop high 5 to 6 figures on it. Yet, somehow it seems like it wouldn't (especially something like that Excalibur cover). Why? 

I'm sure somebody will say that all of these auctions are totally on the level and there are is no shilling or market manipulation occurring but unless you can provide real evidence to the contrary I'm not buying it. I don't believe that any collectable goes up in price via auction 1000%+ in 12-24 months not a Super Mario Bros. video game and not that Alan Davis cover.

 

I do think there is market manipulation, although the prices are a combination of manipulations and organic-market power driven . There is also the question of whether they are legal or not. If someone has a pile of Ross Andru Spider-man art, and one is listed for sale, they can bid it up high to create a new market price in those Heritage Auction archives. Heritage then earns 21% + on a higher base. That’s what makes that earlier comment about the importance of Heritage archives so crucial. The price driving can be innocent too. Don’t forget you can get limited access to old prices both in Comic Art Tracker and existing sale prices in CAF. Then, we all contribute to it with oohs and aahs when something sells for an astonishing amount, particularly if we own something similar.

The solution is simple: step away. Find something that might not tug at your memories, but is still great. 

Edited by Rick2you2
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Twanj

Twanj

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On 4/10/2022 at 6:25 AM, kbmcvay said:

I don't believe that any collectable goes up in price via auction 1000%+ in 12-24 months not a Super Mario Bros. video game and not that Alan Davis cover.

12-24 months?!? :roflmao:

Excalibur #24 cover sold March 12 for $13,750.

A few days later on April 8, Excalibur #16 sold for $96,000.

 

https://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/alan-davis-excalibur-vol-1-24-cover-original-art-marvel-1990-/a/7265-51193.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

https://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/alan-davis-and-paul-neary-excalibur-16-cover-nightcrawler-original-art-marvel-1989-/a/7270-94059.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

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Guest Race

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Posted (edited)

I'm a bit confused by this auction... "high end" sales are out of the park, but John Buscema not getting as much love and Kirby pages seem to be all over the place ($4K Falcon page vs $28K Demon page)... hard to tell where the floor is in the overall Bronze Age $5K-$10K market...

Edited by Race
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kbmcvay

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On 4/10/2022 at 9:28 AM, Twanj said:

12-24 months?!? :roflmao:

Excalibur #24 cover sold March 12 for $13,750.

A few days later on April 8, Excalibur #16 sold for $96,000.

 

https://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/alan-davis-excalibur-vol-1-24-cover-original-art-marvel-1990-/a/7265-51193.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

https://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/alan-davis-and-paul-neary-excalibur-16-cover-nightcrawler-original-art-marvel-1989-/a/7270-94059.s?ic4=GalleryView-ShortDescription-071515

But that Excalibur 16 cover sold about a year ago for around $9K. Gary Land was talking about it in a thread in the OA Facebook group a few days ago. You'd think somebody willing to pay $100k for it would have jumped at it a year ago but maybe they are new to the hobby or were unaware - still seems like a stretch for it to sell for 10x that amount a year later.

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Rick2you2

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On 4/10/2022 at 10:12 AM, Race said:

I'm a bit confused by this auction... "high end" sales are out of the park, but John Buscema not getting as much love and Kirby pages seem to be all over the place ($4K Falcon page vs $28K Demon page)... hard to tell where the floor is in the overall Bronze Age $5K-$10K market...

I don’t think it means anything at this stage. Just a mix of different strategies and players. But if you see that sort of pattern at the end of the auction, that could be an indication of a collapsing market (but as the auction is only one data point, a small indication). People with money want the best, but there aren’t enough of them to pick up lesser pieces. So, you begin to see a hollowing out of the market— high end does well, for now, and low end, but not so much in the middle.

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tth2

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On 4/10/2022 at 6:25 PM, kbmcvay said:

The only thing that changed with that Excalibur cover is it sold on Heritage. I'm not convinced that the astonishing prices for some of these recent items are completely on the level given the pattern Heritage and their cohorts have been involved in from a market manipulation perspective as discussed elsewhere on these boards.The only people that benefit from this are the sellers and Heritage (but the latter is main beneficiary as well as the dealers less directly as a new price floor is set). If somebody put the same piece on Comic Connect instead of Heritage for example, does it reach the same price? It should since the same bidders should be aware of its existence if they are willing to drop high 5 to 6 figures on it. Yet, somehow it seems like it wouldn't (especially something like that Excalibur cover). Why? 

I'm sure somebody will say that all of these auctions are totally on the level and there are is no shilling or market manipulation occurring but unless you can provide real evidence to the contrary I'm not buying it. I don't believe that any collectable goes up in price via auction 1000%+ in 12-24 months not a Super Mario Bros. video game and not that Alan Davis cover.

 

So if I'm reading your post correctly, then as a consignor I'm going exclusively with Heritage! 

So if this is all market manipulation by Heritage, why isn't every listing resulting in a similarly mindboggling price?  Why were there some results that not only did not blow people's minds, but actually disappointed?  For the love of god, man, why?!  Why?!?! 

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delekkerste

delekkerste

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On 4/10/2022 at 10:58 AM, tth2 said:

So if I'm reading your post correctly, then as a consignor I'm going exclusively with Heritage! 

So if this is all market manipulation by Heritage, why isn't every listing resulting in a similarly mindboggling price?  Why were there some results that not only did not blow people's minds, but actually disappointed?  For the love of god, man, why?!  Why?!?! 

There's only one thing that's for sure:  anything I consign will suck and underperform by a huge margin. It's like a law of nature or something.  

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