Oh Man I Sure Hope the Comics Market Never Crashes as Bad as the Stamps Market 13 13

[NewWorldOrder]

On 3/11/2022 at 6:46 PM, D2 said:

That’s kind of my point. I want to know how many kids buy comics. I think the only person(s) that would have any close idea is a store owner. But that’s my thing, how can comic books compete to a video game? Why read Batman when you can BE Batman, lurking in the shadows, breaking peoples’ neck. Arkham Asylum is an unbelievable game… Kids either truly enjoy reading them, or not. And if not, then who is even going to care to buy them?

I don’t disagree with you. I don’t think kids much hang out around these places either, which has got me concerned. I have a small collection, and it’s not extremely valuable, but these concerns do stop me from investing in some serious books I might one day like to own. 

I also do believe that collectors will always exist, but if the demand is always met because the percentage of collectors continues to drop, then values plummet regardless. I guess my same concern still applies, and that I don’t have a solution for it, I just know the only people who will bother spending big bucks on books in the future, are the kids of today. They love Avengers… I hated Avengers growing up. 

 

My take is exactly totally the opposite of yours. 

The only reason comic books (especially vintage) are worth what they are today is because everything now besides the comic book itself. 

You can't get this kind of growth without all those other media outlets promoting the characters especially with:

internet (easier for commerce for collectors)

Billion dollar movies controlled by the evil empire that is Disney (and if they feel like not screwing up, Warner Bros)

Video games

Trading cards

TV

More local and mega comic conventions 

Clothes (Good lord in the 90's no one wore comic book t-shirts or accessories) 

auction houses

CGC boards....

and on and on etc....

Now the comic book itself?  Yes not growing, however it has just evolved to more character branches of exposure in other media avenues .

All I see is people much younger than me buying, selling, and collecting Pre-2000 comics. A lot more from when I was a teenager in the 90's I can tell you that.  I had to lie to my friends when I worked at a comic book store so they didn't make fun of me in middle school & high school.  Now???? OMG so annoying. So many girls are into it  

Unfortunately for me I grew up in the worst era in the history of comic books, the 90's!  The hobby has exploded since then!  Since then also many children with comic characters outfits on. Overall point is as long as "little Jimmy" knows who these characters are all the blue chip books will be just fine for the foreseeable future.

Spider-Man No Way Home has almost done $2 billion dollars at the box office so yeah I am pretty confident that if you buy an AF 15 today the next year you will be up.

Edited March 15, 2022 by NewWorldOrder

[William-James88]

On 3/14/2022 at 7:58 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

Overall point is as long as "little Jimmy" knows who these characters are all the blue chip books will be just fine for the foreseeable future.

I don't think we are talking about blue chips, especially not with the stamp comparison since the blue chip stamps (this case meaning rarest and highest graded) did not go down. It's everything that isn't blue chip which people are looking at. Like Teen Titans 12.

Edited March 15, 2022 by William-James88

[D2]

On 3/14/2022 at 7:58 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

My take is exactly totally the opposite of yours. 

The only reason comic books (especially vintage) are worth what they are today is because everything now besides the comic book itself. 

You can't get this kind of growth without all those other media outlets promoting the characters especially with:

internet (easier for commerce for collectors)

Billion dollar movies controlled by the evil empire that is Disney (and if they feel like not screwing up, Warner Bros)

Video games

Trading cards

TV

More local and mega comic conventions 

Clothes (Good lord in the 90's no one wore comic book t-shirts or accessories) 

auction houses

CGC boards....

and on and on etc....

Now the comic book itself?  Yes not growing, however it has just evolved to more character branches of exposure in other media avenues .

All I see is people much younger than me buying, selling, and collecting Pre-2000 comics. A lot more from when I was a teenager in the 90's I can tell you that.  I had to lie to my friends when I worked at a comic book store so they didn't make fun of me in middle school & high school.  Now???? OMG so annoying. So many girls are into it  

Unfortunately for me I grew up in the worst era in the history of comic books, the 90's!  The hobby has exploded since then!  Since then also many children with comic characters outfits on. Overall point is as long as "little Jimmy" knows who these characters are all the blue chip books will be just fine for the foreseeable future.

Spider-Man No Way Home has almost done $2 billion dollars at the box office so yeah I am pretty confident that if you buy an AF 15 today the next year you will be up.

Interesting points. And to be fair, I will say that your perspectives do focus on the bright/optimistic side of the coin. Which is not bad. No one truly knows where things will be headed, and truth be told, I want it to be a healthy market. That’s why I am here. I collect comic books too. 
 

I also think/hope that, if there was ever a downturn, it wouldn’t be a sudden halt and crash, but more like a quiet burn out. Something we could all see coming. 
 

[Bookery]

Thought this might be of interest... found an old CGC post from April, 1931 by boardie "dimesgalore":

"It's ludicrous to believe that dime novels will ever lose value.  Many of these were published 50-60 years ago, and are now more collectible than ever.  The stock market crash of 18 months ago not only didn't kill interest in these hot commodities, but despite this so-called Depression, values have actually risen.  Some "key" issues can fetch $20-$30.  Though these are out of reach for the average collector, there is still plenty of room for new young collectors to enter the market, as plenty of turn-of-the-century issues can be had for under $1.  Dime novel heroes will never go out of style.  Names like Buffalo Bill Jr., Deadwood *ick, Nick Carter, Liberty Boys, Nat Pinkerton, Frank Merriwell, Young King Brady, and Andy Grant will live on forever.  Some of these characters have reached cult status in movies, and now that we've had the new sound films for the past couple of years, one can only imagine what exciting new film features will be made from these beloved characters.  There are those who say that technology may someday reach the point where these burgeoning film icons may even be in color!"

But... more important than the fascinating stories and heroes, one must not forget the crucial importance of the cover art.  As time goes by, this style of art will only grow in appreciation.  Today's art simply doesn't compare.  Collectors will always admire and pay dearly for classic cover art like this..."

 

[theCapraAegagrus]

I like predicting The Unknown.

[onlyweaknesskryptonite]

On 3/15/2022 at 10:40 AM, theCapraAegagrus said:

I like predicting The Unknown.

[october]

On 3/15/2022 at 9:45 AM, Bookery said:

Thought this might be of interest... found an old CGC post from April, 1931 by boardie "dimesgalore":

 

Found an old CGC thread from 20 years ago. Remarkably, it's like the same thread from 2022. We should copy and paste every year to save time. 

 

[NewWorldOrder]

On 3/14/2022 at 9:08 PM, D2 said:

 

I also think/hope that, if there was ever a downturn, it wouldn’t be a sudden halt and crash, but more like a quiet burn out. Something we could all see coming. 
 

As long as my generation is alive people will be collecting.

Especially with the new selling platform "whatnot" the buying and selling of the new stuff mixed with the old in our hobby seems very strong.  

Nothing lasts forever, but since Marvel and DC got into the movie business they solidified many comics before 2000 as gold now.  

Totally agree.  If you have vintage comics in your collection those will be the last stuff to go down and you will see it coming more than likely.

 I remember having this same conversation with the comic book store owner I used to work for in the 90's.  He was worried about Marvel opening up their owns stores, Digital comic books, and kids being into video games etc.   I talked to him in 2019, and he wished stayed the course in the 90's.  He admitted he was way too pessimistic.

All of this applies to the stock market as well.  In life there are too many of these people walking around....

 

[D84]

All the different apps is starting to remind me of all the damn streaming services.

It may be time to stop collecting and just enjoy what I have.

[1Cool]

On 3/15/2022 at 12:44 PM, october said:

Found an old CGC thread from 20 years ago. Remarkably, it's like the same thread from 2022. We should copy and paste every year to save time. 

 

Other then the title I don't really get the same vibe from that thread as this one.  A lot more fighting in the 2002 thread but that was how it went back then.  Back in 2002 we would have had no idea that most younger people would stop wanting to collect comics and instead use comics as an equity.  I didn't read the whole thing but skimming through a few pages did not convince me that this discussion has been going on since 2002.

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 3/15/2022 at 12:50 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

Nothing lasts forever, but since Marvel and DC got into the movie business they solidified many comics before 2000 as gold now. 

Most people cannot afford gold, either.

[THE_BEYONDER]

[october]

On 3/15/2022 at 11:58 AM, 1Cool said:

Other then the title I don't really get the same vibe from that thread as this one.  A lot more fighting in the 2002 thread but that was how it went back then.  Back in 2002 we would have had no idea that most younger people would stop wanting to collect comics and instead use comics as an equity.  I didn't read the whole thing but skimming through a few pages did not convince me that this discussion has been going on since 2002.

Multiple posts could have been lifted from any crash thread of the last 20 years. Or the last 40 years. Same themes, over and over and over again. Prices are too high, demographics are aging, people only care about high grades, blah, blah, blah.

 

Edited March 15, 2022 by october

[Rob]

On 3/15/2022 at 11:17 AM, october said:

Multiple posts could have been lifted from any crash thread of the last 20 years. Or rhe last 40 years. Same themes, over and over and over again. Prices are too high, demographics are aging, people only care about high grades, blah, blah, blah.

 

This is way different.  When was the last time we've seen an increase in values, up to 10X, in just 18 months?

[NewWorldOrder]

On 3/15/2022 at 10:24 AM, theCapraAegagrus said:

Most people cannot afford gold, either.

Most people can if they come up with a game plan.  It's harder IMO to do nothing than be productive each day. 

Owning Gold looks pretty cheap to me.

 

 

[EastEnd1]

On 3/15/2022 at 12:58 PM, 1Cool said:

Other then the title I don't really get the same vibe from that thread as this one.  A lot more fighting in the 2002 thread but that was how it went back then.  Back in 2002 we would have had no idea that most younger people would stop wanting to collect comics and instead use comics as an equity.  I didn't read the whole thing but skimming through a few pages did not convince me that this discussion has been going on since 2002.

I've been hearing about the demise of comics since at least 1980.  By way of reference, I started collecting around 1972 and am 58 now.  Comic circulations declined throughout the 1970s and that was supposed to bring the end... it didn't.  And then the emergence of the direct market was supposed to bring the end cause comics would slowly disappear from newstands and not be as widespread to attract new readers... it didn't.  And then the black and white boom and bust of the 1980s was supposed to bring the end cause so many people lost so much money... it didn't.  In fact, shortly thereafter we had the explosion in comics of the early 1990s... but then again that was also supposed to bring the end because it was all built on superficial variants and manufactured collectibles.  The 1990s implosion may have actually brought us closest to the end... but not really.  This new grading company called CGC suddenly showed up and guess what... comics exploded again, with near ridiculous valuations (not unlike today) in the early 2000s.  That eventually led to a pullback and more talk about the end and guess what... no end.  A new technology called CGI made it possible for the major film studios to make truly realistic superhero movies... and comics exploded again with valuations reaching even more "insane" levels.  Oh, but that was supposed to bring the end too because people would tire of superhero movies... they haven't.  In fact, comic book properties have become the most valuable in Hollyowood!  And the major studios have doubled down on them by using them as catalysts for launching entire new streaming services.  And here we stand... superheros are more popular than ever and comic valuations are higher than ever, which very likely means that there are as many if not more "collectors" since I started in 1972.  And so naturally, the talk of doom emerges again. 

I'm actually pretty bullish on the future... I actually see the next catalyst to further growth just starting to merge... the accelerated digitization of commerce brought on by the pandemic.  Emerging company's like Rally are making it possible to trade comics (or "partial comics") like stocks... Ebay has apparently announced "Ebay Vault", a 40,000 sq ft "Fort Knox" facility to hold your collectibles, authenticate and potentially even GRADE them, and easily facilitate transfer of ownership... and Wall Street is slowly reaching its tentacles into our "little hobby" (along with many other collectibles).  Folks, my own view is that the next five to ten years are going to make for a very interesting, and potentially lucrative, ride. 

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 3/15/2022 at 2:39 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

Most people can if they come up with a game plan.  It's harder IMO to do nothing than be productive each day. 

Owning Gold looks pretty cheap to me.

 

 

What is that? 1 flake? I thought we were discussing practicality.

[NewWorldOrder]

On 3/15/2022 at 11:18 AM, Rob said:

This is way different.  When was the last time we've seen an increase in values, up to 10X, in just 18 months?

Oh the typical "this time it's different" thinking.

Same with stock market predictions.

 

 

CGC Boards in 2030, "This is way different.  When was the last time we've seen an increase in values, up to 10X, in just 18 months?"

 

[Rob]

On 3/15/2022 at 11:44 AM, NewWorldOrder said:

Oh the typical "this time it's different" thinking.

Same with stock market predictions.

 

 

CGC Boards in 2030, "This is way different.  When was the last time we've seen an increase in values, up to 10X, in just 18 months?"

 

Sounds like someone has pipe dreams the overnight increase in value is here to stay.  "It can't go down!"  How many times have we heard that?

[NewWorldOrder]

On 3/15/2022 at 11:44 AM, theCapraAegagrus said:

What is that? 1 flake? I thought we were discussing practicality.

Better than owning no flakes.  How you are thinking right there is honestly the problem I have with most people.  

Everyone has to start somewhere. 

This is America!  If you can afford something.  

"Make more money"