HERO RESTORATION - BOOKS NOT BEING RETURNED 20 20

[skypinkblu]

On 6/21/2023 at 10:00 PM, Kamenliter said:

I submitted my books in person at a show, so didn't see the terms. It's true, I could have researched a bit more on their website, so that's on me. I had sent books in the past (just two or three in 2018) and didn't have any problems. I had read they were a reputable business and considered one of the better ones, but hadn't really delved that far into it. Folks really do need to do their due diligence, it's true. 

I'm glad you got your books back

[Moondog]

On 6/21/2023 at 9:32 AM, Steviehuv66 said:

I received my FF #5 back from Heroes Restoration yesterday after requesting the book to be returned since the end of April.

I purchased the book raw in 2015 at the NYC Big Apple Con.  The book has trim on the upper left corner which was fully disclosed to me when I purchased it.  I had the book graded by CGC and it came back in a purple label 5.5 with the only restoration being the trimmed corner.
 

In May 2022, I mailed the book to Mike at Heroes Restoration after discussing the potential of raising the grade after a he performed a full restoration to the book.  I had used Heroes Restoration twice before and found them to be professional. I paid 2k for the services upfront as is required by Heroes. 

In 2023, after reading and hearing about Mikes health issues and the financial downturn of his company,  I asked for the book and a refund to be made to me. He had not yet cracked the holder to work on the book.

I was told getting the book returned and a refund are two different matters. He referred me to the Terms of Agreement concerning a refund. 
 

I have not received a refund but I am happy to have the book back.

With the trimming and the extensive chipping, what did you hope to get back after paying $2,000 for restoration services?  How much more could this book be improved?

[Cnight]

Well heck….this explains alot

Edited June 22, 2023 by Cnight

[Steviehuv66]

On 6/21/2023 at 10:27 PM, Moondog said:

With the trimming and the extensive chipping, what did you hope to get back after paying $2,000 for restoration services?  How much more could this book be improved?

I was hoping to move the book up in grade to a possible purple label 8.0.  Mike looked at a pic of the book and felt it was doable.  I had used his company twice before and he performed a good job.  No issues prior to this. It always bothered me that the book had a trim to the upper left corner.  I realized there was no way around that so I wanted a full restoration.

[DR.X]

On 6/21/2023 at 9:50 PM, Steviehuv66 said:

On 6/21/2023 at 9:27 PM, Moondog said:

With the trimming and the extensive chipping, what did you hope to get back after paying $2,000 for restoration services?  How much more could this book be improved?

I was hoping to move the book up in grade to a possible purple label 8.0.  Mike looked at a pic of the book and felt it was doable.  I had used his company twice before and he performed a good job.  No issues prior to this. It always bothered me that the book had a trim to the upper left corner.  I realized there was no way around that so I wanted a full restoration.

8.0 with that much chipping??    Was he going to slice a 1/4" of that right edge, or add pieces to it ??  And he keeps the 2K for storage fee's?

Edited June 22, 2023 by DR.X

[Flanders82]

On 6/21/2023 at 7:50 PM, Steviehuv66 said:

I had used his company twice before and he performed a good job

I hope they at least gave you the option to send the book back if they ever turn things around with no forfeiture of what you've already paid and without losing your place in a years long line.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Flanders82

[thehumantorch]

On 6/21/2023 at 6:03 PM, Christopher Marra said:

So I brought 15 Sports Illustrated to his shop in Vernon in November 2022.  Not only did I loose the magazines and the money, but I have already been charged by CGC for the grading they were going to do.  What a loss.

Sorry, I don’t know what this means.  You’ve been charged by CGC which should mean your books have arrived at CGC and aren’t lost?

[mattn792]

Man these stories…  

Seems like this was the inevitable result of terrible business practices, the owner’s health problems just accelerated the timeline.

[onlyweaknesskryptonite]

Those that got their books back, don't forget to send a thank you card!

 

[ExNihilo]

On 6/21/2023 at 8:38 PM, thehumantorch said:

Sorry, I don’t know what this means.  You’ve been charged by CGC which should mean your books have arrived at CGC and aren’t lost?

Right?  CGC doesn't charge me until it's entered in the system.

[Lightning55]

Maybe HR collected the requisite CGC fees up front, too, for using his account to submit. Might as well keep that, too.

[wombat]

On 6/21/2023 at 11:14 PM, Flanders82 said:

I hope they at least gave you the option to send the book back if they ever turn things around with no forfeiture of what you've already paid and without losing your place in a years long line.

I mean someone sending books back to them kind of deserves what they get. You would have to be insane. 

[Beastfeast]

WTF did I just read?  Geeeeeeez

[southern cross]

 

 

Edited June 22, 2023 by southern cross
.

[Flanders82]

On 6/21/2023 at 9:45 PM, wombat said:

I mean someone sending books back to them kind of deserves what they get. You would have to be insane. 

Absolutely insane. The only way I would ever send anything to him is if he put a deposit with me down for the value of the comic I send him. Worst case scenario I get paid the FMV of the book. Best case is, I pay him when the work is complete and give his deposit back. 

[Poka]

On 6/21/2023 at 11:34 PM, CAHokie said:

Great point! No payment should have been required until work is done. It is unlikely the work would have cost more than the value of the book.

@NP_Gresham did he send you a tracking number yesterday? He was on the boards and viewing your page so fingers crossed.

you forget that manpower is also a cost to a business owner. However, I also considered using Hero Restoration but decided against it when receiving the quote, the estimated time and payment terms. I think more fairer would be an initial pay-up, at half-point and when finished. However, from the business owner I understand that one would not wish to do any work, unsure if client able to pay once started.  But will see where this all end up once all settled

[Poka]

On 6/22/2023 at 2:53 AM, wombat said:

This thing is just bonkers. So they can take as long as they want and just say this was the best we can do. If these rules would hold up he can literally just keep your books forever and hope you cancel at some point and then just keep your money. The really awesome part is he can cancel the contract at any point in time and be able to deduct costs incurred. I'm sure someone can point out this is all just legal talk, but I can't see it as anything but unethical. 

I believe the terms would be rendered invalid if the actual period is significantly different from the original estimate, especially if work has not commenced. Not that it would help a lot. If there is no money left then there is no money to refund. seems like ppl have 2 choices, 1) asking for books to returned and hope to get whatever money left back (although sounds unlikely, or 2) wait until Mike is done with there books which sounds like can take a long time. Think in this scenario ppl may need to treat the situation as if Heroes Resto is bankrupt, ie has no money to return

Edited June 22, 2023 by Poka

[manetteska]

On 6/21/2023 at 9:59 AM, DougC said:

HERE are the terms and conditions that were cut & pasted from somewhere else.

I would assume the specific if not poorly worded clause he is trying to hide behind is this:

I only have some limited paralegal experience in trademark work (this is not legal advice), but this type of language has previously been struck down and will not hold water if brought before a court. If anyone decides to pursue action on their own they should litigate not only HR but Mike individually as well through civil means.

These terms are definitely broad, but compared to other pressing companies/individuals, are they really that different (if terms exist at all)?

Do other pressers have specific legal terms saying how long a job can take (what if it takes longer?), what to do if you want to cancel, what if a book is damaged, etc. I usually only see an estimate for TAT and that's it; nothing about what happens when things go wrong (b/c that never happens).

[cbalroman]

All this "pay total up front before any work is done" is crazy.  Reminds me of a story my mother in law told me.  She lives in the mountains and her neighborhood street is dirt.  She and her neighbors have an HOA that covers road maintance, mainly for snow plowing in the winter.  One summer the HOA decided it would be a good idea to have the street graveled and then sealed.  The crew that the HOA hired started the work of laying the gravel, and the HOA went ahead and paid the full invoice before the seal was put down.  Needless to say the crew "disappeared" after the check cleared and all that loose gravel they put down eventually washed away.  

[Dr. Balls]

On 6/22/2023 at 11:44 AM, cbalroman said:

All this "pay total up front before any work is done" is crazy.  Reminds me of a story my mother in law told me.  She lives in the mountains and her neighborhood street is dirt.  She and her neighbors have an HOA that covers road maintance, mainly for snow plowing in the winter.  One summer the HOA decided it would be a good idea to have the street graveled and then sealed.  The crew that the HOA hired started the work of laying the gravel, and the HOA went ahead and paid the full invoice before the seal was put down.  Needless to say the crew "disappeared" after the check cleared and all that loose gravel they put down eventually washed away.  

Yeah, I think everyone goes through the "pay the invoice in full before the work is completed" experiences at least once in their life, and it seems like 9 times out of 10, you come away going "Whelp, I'm not doing that again."