ASM #252 CGC 9.8 Record Sale - something fishy going on? - Holder Tampering Incident confirmed by CGC 50 50

[JC25427N]

On 1/3/2024 at 8:32 PM, COMICLINK said:

Hello Everybody,

This is what we are doing at ComicLink to protect the community. The objective is to inform those that have purchased the cert numbers in question in the past, and ensure that no future buyer on ComicLInk has to worry about buying any of the cert numbers in question unwittingly.

1) Deleting Exchange postings with these cert numbers (I believe this is done, we need to double check)

2) Reviewing any Auction listings with these cert numbers (there were only a few - sending out to CGC for review and will know this week). 

3) We have developed methods to ensure that there will be no auction listings or exchange postings with these cert numbers going forward, unless cleared by CGC.  No one should worry about bidding in the auction starting January 11th. This is already in "Beta".  None of these books will be in in the upcoming auction once it goes live unless cleared, or any other upcoming auctions.  We will inform any submitters of the issue.

4) I looked at some of the higher end books and found a bunch on the CGC list that are fine. I noticed we sold them multiple times and compared images, which match. 

These include the JIM 83 8.0 and 7.0 and some other Silver Age keys. 

I sent the list, with images to CGC as well for confirmation, received it, and they should be removed from the list.

5) Lastly, and this is the most time consuming, we will be finding all of our buyers that have ever purchased one of these cert numbers and we will reach out to them proactively to alert them to this situation pertaining to their book(s).   

We will get through this together

-Josh

You forgot to add "Which we didn't have to do...." 

Spoiler

Jokes aside, it's great what you're doing thanks

 

[s-dali]

I find it interesting that only universal and signature series labels are called out in that list. There are no qualified, restored, or conserved labels called out. I guess they're not too concerned about those being swapped out, but we know that some of them could be donor books. 

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/3/2024 at 5:41 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

Why would you assume this?

 

[mosconi]

On 1/3/2024 at 5:36 PM, WernerVonDoom said:

Holy &#!. I have a book on the list. FF #2 7.5.  I bought this in 2020 from my local comic book store in California.

It looks exactly like a 7.5, nice with a small stain. Zero red flags.

This makes no sense to me.

 

That's a beautiful looking copy.  Are there any "Qualified" CGC sales of this book with a page or pinup missing that you can identify and possibly find an image for it?   

 

 

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 1/3/2024 at 8:47 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

 

[COMICLINK]

On 1/3/2024 at 8:36 PM, WernerVonDoom said:

Holy &#!. I have a book on the list. FF #2 7.5.  I bought this in 2020 from my local comic book store in California.

It looks exactly like a 7.5, nice with a small stain. Zero red flags.

This makes no sense to me.

 

It may be just fine, like the JIMs and some other Silver Age books I've noticed are fine. CGC's list is all the books that they suspect MAY be at issue.

I would suggest you send the book to them for review. -Josh

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/3/2024 at 5:49 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

Barry Bonds and Mark McGwire always hit legitimate HR's before they started cheating. 

Suspect the same with this scumbag scammer.

Edited January 4 by NewWorldOrder

[Spawnfreak]

On 1/2/2024 at 5:49 PM, Iconic1s said:

I use Duckduckgo to search and here are the top four stories when searching “cgc reholder scandal.”  Different perspectives for sure, and IMO some not so common outlets starting to pick up the story... I had never heard of the first two.

https://www.pfadvice.com/2024/01/01/the-cgc-reholder-scam-hundreds-of-fraudulent-comics-sold-what-to-do-if-youre-affected/

https://shoppersvila.com/review/cgc-comics-reholder-scam-exposed/

https://comicbook.com/comics/news/cgc-comics-issues-statement-on-holder-tampering-controversy/

https://bleedingfool.com/blogs/fraud-by-any-other-name-the-cgc-comic-grading-scandal/

According to pMark Jeweler Inserts were four-page jewelry advertisements that were inserted into the center of certain newsstand and direct market editions of Marvel Comics sporadically from 1972 through 1986. The insert contained advertisements for jewelry and was marketed to military service members domestically and abroad.fadvice.com; First I ever heard about the domestic market editions. Can this be true? 

[Cat]

That's a lot more ASM #194s than I was expecting, too. 

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/3/2024 at 5:54 PM, Cat said:

That's a lot more ASM #194s than I was expecting, too. 

He or they loved using that book, that's for damn sure.

What scumbags this person(s) is.

[WernerVonDoom]

On 1/3/2024 at 5:51 PM, COMICLINK said:

It may be just fine, like the JIMs and some other Silver Age books I've noticed are fine. CGC's list is all the books that they suspect MAY be at issue.

I would suggest you send the book to them for review. -Josh

Ya, I think the odds are it's legit. However, I would have put the odds of this book from my LCS being on the list were close to zero. lol.

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 1/3/2024 at 9:05 PM, WernerVonDoom said:

Ya, I think the odds are it's legit. However, I would have put the odds of this book from my LCS being on the list were close to zero. lol.

Definitely send it in to check for the pin-up

[sledgehammer]

On 1/3/2024 at 7:47 PM, mosconi said:

On 1/3/2024 at 7:36 PM, WernerVonDoom said:

Holy &#!. I have a book on the list. FF #2 7.5.  I bought this in 2020 from my local comic book store in California.

It looks exactly like a 7.5, nice with a small stain. Zero red flags.

This makes no sense to me.

 

That's a beautiful looking copy.  Are there any "Qualified" CGC sales of this book with a page or pinup missing that you can identify and possibly find an image for it?

There is at least one other book from the same submission, also an FF, #12, on the list.

It may just be suspicion by association.

[Silver Surfer]

On 1/3/2024 at 6:05 PM, WernerVonDoom said:

Ya, I think the odds are it's legit. However, I would have put the odds of this book from my LCS being on the list were close to zero. lol.

Please keep us posted.

[pickycollector]

Link to the list please

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 1/3/2024 at 8:16 PM, pickycollector said:

Link to the list please

https://www.cgccomics.com/news/article/12454/

[BigLeagueCHEW]

On 1/3/2024 at 6:38 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

Yup, but that doesnt meant every single book they sold was tampered with.  I mean of course I hope all the people that own books on this list will get the clean bill of health from CGC after they send them in.  Some of these books I would assume were not at all tampered with, I of course could be wrong, but I am hoping a good majority are tamper free.

That’s what I am thinking. Assuming some of these may have been the perps personal books that were sold off, who knows though.

[BrashL]

" Ineligible books will be moved to the appropriate service and the submitter will be responsible for any fees."

So what does this mean? It's incumbent upon CGC to share how this happened and how this list was put together so folks can start looking at their books which may still need to be added and might be "eligible". This list is a good start but without any  context it's still far from adequate...

Also new cases

[BigLeagueCHEW]

On 1/3/2024 at 7:41 PM, BrashL said:

" Ineligible books will be moved to the appropriate service and the submitter will be responsible for any fees."

So what does this mean? It's incumbent upon CGC to share how this happened and how this list was put together so folks can start looking at their books which may still need to be added and might be "eligible". This list is a good start but without any  context it's still far from adequate...

Also new cases

Of someone submitted a book and it wasn’t on the list, the terms have to say they are responsible for any fees.

[pickycollector]

Fortunately I do not have any book from the list but when looking at it, I see books graded several years ago. I would have expected to see listed only books graded a few years ago but the Avengers #57 8.5, for example, was graded in 2008. Is that then just the tip of the iceberg?